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KJV Matthew 5:48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect. For me, perfection is getting all the items correct, as in 100/100, 25/25 or 5/5. In spiritual life, the Holy Spirit teaches what God determines a person needed to know and understand. If A learned 100 truths, he is accountable with his 100. If B has learned 5 truths, he is accountable with his 5. If A lived his life in accordance with 99 of his 100, while B lived his life in accordance with all of his 5, then A is NOT perfect while B is. A cannot resort to claiming his 99 is far greater than B's 5 and therefore he is better off than B. No sir. The spiritual norm is perfection, and 99/100 is not perfect while 5/5 is. And In Him Who is our Strength, we have His Power for perfection being part of His body. In fact, God has already made us perfect in His sight (Heb 10:10, 14). It is not because of INABILITY that one is not perfect, it is because of REFUSAL. KJV Luke 12:48 . . . For unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be much required: and to whom men have committed much, of him they will ask the more.

The Wanderer has asked that I give an example of what I mean by a standard that is relative to what the Holy Spirit has accomplished in one's life: Example # 1: a) X is a 11 year old child living in the slums of NYC. X is the child of a Father who fences stolen goods and is being trained to fill a part this system of earning income. X has been given no spiritual training, other than to think of God as powerless and a fable just like Santa Claus. One day X sees an advertisement for a program at a near-by church that interests him due to the fact that it promises him some free pizza. So, X attends and is impressed by what he is told at the program. X has never seen a Bible. X has never prayed. But, deep in his heart, X wants to know more about this God. X is willing to learn. 'b) Y is an 11 year old child living in the suburbs of Southern California. Y is the child of a church leader who is a professor at a near-by seminary, who both develops materials to teach Christian concepts to pre-teen children and teaches students how to minister to pre-teen children. Y understands 28 concepts of Christian belief and can explain them in terms that children her age can understand. Y has read the Bible through twice. She begins each day with prayer and an invitation for Christ to lead her that day. Y has recently been impressed that she has more to learn about God and the life that lies ahead of her in eternity. Y is willing to learn. I believe that we can agree that X and Y are not at the same level of spiritual understanding. We can likely agree that Y is greatly advantaged over X. The Bible teaches us that the Holy Spirit is responsible for one's spiritual education and conviction of a need to change. While the two are at very different levels of understanding of God and eternity, they both stand before God on the same level. The HS is leading both. At every point in time they are making choices at to what they want to do about eternity and God accepts their choice in relation to what the HS has taught them. The standard is relative. Example # 2: a) A is a developmentally disabled 35 year old adult. A can only live independently with assistance. A has never learned to read. A loves to attend church services each week because people there are kind to him. They tell him of a God who loves him. They tell him that God values him. A wants to spend eternity with such a God. 'B) is a high-functioning 35 year old adult. She holds a PhD. in Biblical languages. She is the senior pastor of a 10,000 member of a mega-congregation. But, deep in her heart she has questions about God. Those are honest questions. But, she is uncertain as to why anyone would want to spend eternity with the God that she pictures in her mind. Both A and B are honest in their understandings of God and eternity. But, they are at different places in their spiritual life. But, the HS is in charge of the spiritual development of both. Both are in the process of making choices as to whether or not they want to spend eternity with God. God is accepting their choices in relation to what the HS has taught them.

This has been for me the BEST video EVER! It's been unconsciously lurking in the deep recesses of my mind that the 'this generation' of kids are just a 'me-me-me' generation of self-seeking egoists. The v-clip taught me one-better in the world of true reality going on in this world of rough dysfunctional family relationships. The method of touching the core value in the kids of the v-clip was well executed. I unexpectedly teared over as each (not just one or two) chose the present for their parent over their own desire. The video helped me see in a concrete way the fruit of true LOVE in practice.

It does not cut it if you believe that there is a standard of information that all must reach. Rachel has an answer to this. My answer is that standard is relative to what the Holy Spirit has accomplished in the individual.

[I really like the response that Rachel made to me, below. I want to respond to it. So, I intend to place my responses in brackets [ ] as I have done here and then to initial it at the end, as I am doing now--GM.] 1) My view Gregory, concerns the JUSTICE of God. [Rachel is correct here. There is a fundamental issue as to the justice of God, and in addition how God can remove sin at the same time allow people who have sinned to live with Him in eternity--GM.] 2) I think it NOT RIGHT or JUST that God would require something of half the people who have ever lived, but not require it of the rest. In my view, God MUST require the same things of ALL MANKIND. Every person must believe in order to be "saved". They must CHOOSE whom they will BELIEVE and serve. [I agree with Rachel in regard to God needing to have the same standard for all. The question, as I see it is: What is a standard that can be fairly applied to all. I would say that the level of belief that one must have is conditioned upon the level of knowledge that he Holy Spirit has given to each individual. This is also the level upon which they must chose. Some may have more knowledge than do others. But all of humanity will have a very limited knowledge due to their humanity and that level of knowledge and their response to it with a consequent choice will be the standard by which they will be admitted to an eternity with God--GM.] 3) Because salvation is NOT ABOUT whether you have sinned, or how many times you have sinned. God can erase that. It's NOT ABOUT our carnal nature. God can transform that. [Rachel: I agree--GM.] 4) Salvation is ABOUT your CHOICE - to believe God and serve Him, or to resist His spirit (and His son). [Rachel, I believe that our choice is the issue. While I would state it differently, I do not want to get into mere semantics, even if such are important-- GM.] 5) The ONLY way to give persons who died in ignorance, and children who died in immaturity, the opportunity to CHOOSE - to fulfill God's requirement for salvation - is to resurrect them and then teach them. The 8th millennium provides this time. [This is where we disagree, the most--GM.] 6) What a case the relatives of lost persons could make, for God's injustice - if He left their relatives dead forever (like animals), simply because they died without ever hearing of Yahweh or the Gospel. [On the surface, you may have a valid point. I would say that people are judged on the basis of what the Holy Spirit has brought to their attention. I would say that neither you nor I can be certain as to what the HS has been able do with people that seem unreachable to us. Then, in the end, I would say that there are some aspects/questions for which I do not have an answer and I simply have to trust God. But, I do not believe that your teachings in regard to the 8th millennium provide a valid answer--GM.] 7) And how can God save young children of saints, and leave children of criminals and terrorists unsaved, SIMPLY BECAUSE they died when too young to CHOOSE. We have no idea what their choice might be, if they had lived into adulthood. [I do not believe that is what God will do. Where did you get that idea, although I think that I know. Regardless, I do not believe it. In any case, God does, I will suggest know what their choice would be. However, I do not suggest that what I have said is a complete answer. So, this may be part of that which we will simply have to trust to God--GM.] 8) To transport a child into Heaven, is to BYPASS his FREE WILL. That child never made his CHOICE. God will have to manipulate the mind of that child (without his consent) to guarantee the child's continued harmony with the will of God. THAT is NOT God's way! [I do not believe that such is a bypass of free will and I do not believe that such is manipulation. Again I will suggest that God does know what the choice would be. Also, as I have said, each judged within the context of what the HS has been able to accomplish in working for them--GM.]

Gerry, the problem with what you cited is that it makes salvation to complex. 1) Salvation was achieved on the Cross. See Romans 5:12-19. Here we are told that just as the sin of one person (Adam) brought sin to all of humanity, so also did the work of Christ on the Cross bring the gift of salvation to all. Gerry, the salvation of the human race has already been accomplished. 2) Now that salvation has been accomplished each human faces a choice. The is the conflict that began in heaven many years ago when Satan challenged God and said: Your creation would chose me, if they were free to chose between you and I. 3) Each person Earth must make a decision as to whether to spend eternity with God or to join Satan in his life and future. For those who chose not to spend eternity with God, God will grant them their desired choice along with its consequences.

I have in my hand a small pamphlet telling me that there are only 4 steps to obtaining eternal life - 1) THE GIFT - Believe that God loves you and wants to give you eternal life, Jn 3:16, 1 Jn 5:11 2) SEPARATION - Recognize that you are sinful and separated from eternal life, Rom 3:23, Gal 3:23, Isa 59:2, Rom 6:23, and although man tries to reach out to God with his works, this is impossible except through grace, Eph 2:8-9 3) PROVISION - Believe that Jesus is the only provision for your sin, Act 4:12, 1 Jn 5:12, Jn 14:6 4) ACCEPTANCE - in order to have eternal lifewe must receive Jesus Christ as our personal Savior and Lord, Jn 1:12, Rev 3:20, Is salvation really this simple?

It just seemed like that was to cold for this time of year, but was listening to NPR. They were talking about the people protesting in North Dakota and it was 0, so I thought, I guess it could be much colder up in Canada for sure!!

Four times in the Book of Revelation, Jesus calls himself "the Alpha and the Omega". Revelation 22:13 "I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End." (NIV) In the Hebrew that's Aleph/Tav - the first and last letter of the Hebrew alphabet. There are passages all thru the Old Testament, where those two Hebrew letters Aleph/Tav are found right in the middle of sentences. Those two letters are never translated, and carry no meaning on their own. They are not read aloud. The Rabbi's considered it a mystery. I believe the Son of God was telling John, "I'm THAT GUY" - the one identified by those two letters. Find the letters, and you can know that verse is speaking of ME. We today don't see those identifier letters, because we read translations of the words. There is a translation, WITH those identifying letters. It's called "The Aleph-Tav Old Testament" compiled by Gregory T. Riether. I found it great fun to look thru all the verses with that two letter identifier, to see if I had already marked those verses in my regular study Bible as being about the Son of God. It starts right with Genesis 1:1 "In the beginning God [Aleph/Tav] created the heavens and the earth." And what does the New Testament say? It says the Son of God created all things - that all things were created "through Him and for Him".

Samie, there is a lot to be positively said about your post on perfection. There is a sense that in this life, no human will ever reach perfection in an absolute sense and no human will in this life understand God in full totality. But, God does not charge us with sin when we have not been convicted of a sin and are not in rebellion against God on that point. In that sense, god counts us as perfect.

…8If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 9If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.... 1 John 1:9 God is Love!~Jesus saves!

My view Gregory, concerns the JUSTICE of God. I think it NOT RIGHT or JUST that God would require something of half the people who have ever lived, but not require it of the rest. In my view, God MUST require the same things of ALL MANKIND. Every person must believe in order to be "saved". They must CHOOSE whom they will BELIEVE and serve. Because salvation is NOT ABOUT whether you have sinned, or how many times you have sinned. God can erase that. It's NOT ABOUT our carnal nature. God can transform that. Salvation is ABOUT your CHOICE - to believe God and serve Him, or to resist His spirit (and His son). The ONLY way to give persons who died in ignorance, and children who died in immaturity, the opportunity to CHOOSE - to fulfill God's requirement for salvation - is to resurrect them and then teach them. The 8th millennium provides this time. What a case the relatives of lost persons could make, for God's injustice - if He left their relatives dead forever (like animals), simply because they died without ever hearing of Yahweh or the Gospel. And how can God save young children of saints, and leave children of criminals and terrorists unsaved, SIMPLY BECAUSE they died when too young to CHOOSE. We have no idea what their choice might be, if they had lived into adulthood. To transport a child into Heaven, is to BYPASS his FREE WILL. That child never made his CHOICE. God will have to manipulate the mind of that child (without his consent) to guarantee the child's continued harmony with the will of God. THAT is NOT God's way!

Rachel: As is usual for you, you have raised a valid point that should be considered. Clearly my comments do apply to people with the cognition needed to make a choice. Such short statements as I made can not cover every aspect of what I believe on the subject. I believe that when God considers the boundaries of the personal choices that each person makes, God considers the limits of the information that the Holy Spirit had brought to the mind of the person. As I understand your position, you believe that people may not in this life have all of the information that they need. Therefore, as I understand you, there will be a future time in which their incomplete information will be supplemented with additional information that will help them to make a choice. If I am correct, we do differ on that point. Yes, what you called my formula does not address some of the people who have lived on this planet. This would include children who have not reached a specific level of cognition and others. while it is true that my formula does not address them, I do not exclude them from salvation. I simply do not provide an answer to that aspect of the issue.

Gregory, you don't really mean each and every person. You mean each and every mature person, with the mental capacity (and supplied with enough information) to choose. Your formula exempts a large portion of mankind.

Believe. Believe in Jesus (which includes believing that He can transform you, into one who is fit for Heaven). True belief will result in changed behavior, because Jesus will come into you, to transform you.

I think it is quite simple myself. Believe, go to the cross and confess that your a sinner. Use the law as a mirror, constantly showing you that you don't, and can't ever match up, drawing you ever closer to Christ. The Bible says, "our righteousness is as filthy rags"! Even when we don't sin, or when we do good, it's nothing like the righteousness Jesus gives us. But through us, the spirit works wonders, pointing the alcoholic to sobriety, the junk food eater to a vegetarian (maybe lol). But it makes us wonder and dig and wanna know more. Hence leading us even closer. Jesus gives us his robe no matter where we are in the walk to heaven. But the fight of sin is true, we constantly have to make those decisions, "will I accept him today?" Paul said that he, "dies daily". He puts to death the sinfulness (choosing wrong) every day.

Yesterday I spent time with david Permut the lead producer. It was epic Also with my buddy the co-producer Gregory Crosby

thanks... Am meeting with David Permut in three hours to discuss other Adventist Projects, and another producer tomorrow.. Meet with with one last Friday... Am excited, am scared...