No one dies and goes to heaven...

[Scuba]

Today’s belief is that when saved people die they go right to heaven to praise God and experience joy but when an unsaved person dies they go right to a place called hell where they hate God and experience pain from burning fire.

 

But is this what the Bible teaches? Here are just a few verses to speak contrary to what people believe today.

 

Ecclesiastes 9:5-6 For the living know that they will die; but the dead know nothing, and they have no more reward, for the memory of them is forgotten. Also their love, their hatred, and their envy have now perished; nevermore will they have a share in anything done under the sun. 

 

Psalms 115:17 The dead do not praise the Lord, Nor any who go down into silence. 

 

Ecclesiastes 9:10 Whatever your hand finds to do, do it with your might; for there is no work or device or knowledge or wisdom in the grave where you are going. 

 

Psalms 146:3-4 Do not trust in princes, in mortal man, in whom there is no salvation. His spirit departs, he returns to the earth; In that very day his thoughts perish.

 

Psalms 6:4-5 Return, O Lord, deliver me! Oh, save me for Your mercies' sake! For in death there is no remembrance of You; In the grave who will give You thanks?

 

Dying and going to heaven or hell has its roots in Babylon and was passed down to holy Rome and then Christianized.

 

The Bible clearly teaches that the dead, whether saved or lost, do not praise, love, or hate nor is there any remembrance of God in the grave. The Bible is clear when it says there is only silence in the grave.

 

And ye, in putting them [the departed souls] in heaven, hell and purgatory, destroy the arguments wherewith Christ and Paul prove the resurrection...And again, if the souls be in heaven, tell me why they be not in as good a case as the angels be? And then what cause is there of the resurrection?" William Tyndale, (1494-1536) martyr, First English Bible Translator 

 

"It is indeed generally supposed that the souls of good men as soon as dislodged from the body, go directly to heaven, but this opinion has not the least foundation in the oracles of God. " John Wesley, (1662 - 1735) Founder of the Methodist Church

 

"We are influenced always more or less by the Greek, Platonic idea that the body dies, yet the soul is immortal. Such an idea is utterly contrary to the Israelite consciousness and is nowhere found in the Old Testament"  The International Standard Bible Encyclopedia 1960, Vol. 2, p. 812, "Death"

 

You might be asking yourself, but what about Moses, Elijah and Enoch, aren’t they in heaven right now? The answer is, No.

 

People have been led to believe, through delusion that these men have died and gone into heaven. But we will soon see that this is not true and is totally against God’s word and God’s plan.

 

The Bible is clear regarding who has gone to heaven and who was the first to be raised from the dead never to die again.

 

John 3:13 No one has ever gone into heaven except the one who came from heaven, the Son of Man.

 

Colossians 1:18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.

 

No one, except for Jesus, has ever ascended into heaven to where the Father dwells. The Bible is also clear when it says that Jesus was the first one to be born from the dead never to die again. These statements lead us to believe that neither Moses, Enoch, Elijah or anyone else has ever received immortality or has physical and literally gone into heaven, except for Jesus.

 

With this, let’s see what the Bible says, as a whole, regarding Moses, Enoch and Elijah. In doing this it will take some time to untie all the knots of confusion that Satan has tied over the years.

 

Many people have been taught to believe that Enoch, Elijah and Moses went to heaven where the Father dwells. But we have seen how this belief contradicts God's plan, the Bible as a whole, as well as, the words of Jesus Himself. 

Let's start with Enoch.

 

Hebrews 11:1-12 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. For by it the elders obtained a good testimony. By faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that the things which are seen were not made of things which are visible. By faith Abel offered to God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain, through which he obtained witness that he was righteous, God testifying of his gifts; and through it he being dead still speaks. By faith Enoch was translated so that he did not see death, "and was not found because God had translated him''; for before his translation he had this testimony, that he pleased God. But without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God must believe that He is, and that He is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him. By faith Noah, being divinely warned of things not yet seen, moved with godly fear, prepared an ark for the saving of his household, by which he condemned the world and became heir of the righteousness which is according to faith. By faith Abraham obeyed when he was called to go out to the place which he would afterward receive as an inheritance. And he went out, not knowing where he was going. By faith he sojourned in the land of promise as in a foreign country, dwelling in tents with Isaac and Jacob, the heirs with him of the same promise; for he waited for the city which has foundations, whose builder and maker is God. By faith Sarah herself also received strength to conceive seed, and she bore a child when she was past the age, because she judged Him faithful who had promised. Therefore from one man, and him as good as dead, were born as many as the stars of the sky in multitude innumerable as the sand which is by the seashore. These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off were assured of them, embraced them, and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth.

 

Here in the book of Hebrews we have a whole list of faithful people. At the end of this list it says they all died without receiving the promise, including Enoch. We know that the promise was something in the future because they all looked forward to it, in the same way we look forward to it. The promise was the coming kingdom of God in the new earth.

 

So how do we understand the fact that all these faithful people died without receiving the promise, yet, it seems to be saying that Enoch did not die? Is this a contradiction of Scripture? No, it’s an illusion used to support a false belief. If we study it more closely we will see that it’s not saying what some people are making it say.

 

As we carefully read the words in these verses we will see they say nothing of Enoch going to heaven. The teaching that says Enoch went to heaven is a conclusion that man has come to based on a delusion. Nowhere in these verses does it say Enoch went to heaven. All it says is that God translated him so that he should not see death.

 

When these verses speak of what happened to Enoch they use some strange words. Because these are strange we will have to use the Bible to interpret them.

 

Hebrews 11:5 By faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had translated him: for before his translation he had this testimony, that he pleased God.

 

The NT translators chose to use the word, (translated) probably because of their preconceived theological mind set of believing that the dead are alive somewhere else, which contradicts the whole Bible and God’s plan for a resurrection of the dead.

 

When looking at the word, translated, used by the New Testament translators, we have to keep in mind that these verses in the New Testament are explaining what happened to Enoch in the Old Testament. So let’s go back to the Old Testament and see what it says regarding Enoch.

 

Genesis 5:23-24 And all the days of Enoch were three hundred sixty and five years: And Enoch walked with God: and he was not; for God took him.

 

The word, (translated) is the word used by the New Testament translators to describe what happen to Enoch in the Old Testament but it’s not the same word being used in the Old Testament. The words used in the Old Testament for what happened to Enoch are the words, "and he was not; for God took him" . The New Testament word, (translated) is a wrong translation which opens our mind for all kinds of misinterpretations and illusions.

 

Illusions: a false perception, conception, or interpretation of what one sees .

 

We also see from the Old Testament how God says "ALL THE DAYS OF ENOCH WERE 365 YEARS". So why were Enoch’s days only 365 years? Because God took him and he was not. These are the words being used in the Old Testament to describe what happened to Enoch. 

 

So what does this all mean?

 

We know from the Bible that when God says, "All the days of ______ were ______" it means the person died.

 

Genesis 5:8 And all the days of Seth were nine hundred and twelve years: and he died.

 

Genesis 5:5 So all the days that Adam lived were nine hundred and thirty years; and he died. 

 

Genesis 5:11 So all the days of Enosh were nine hundred and five years; and he died. 

 

Genesis 5:17 So all the days of Mahalaleel were eight hundred and ninety-five years; and he died.

 

What does it mean when God says someone (is not - because God took him)? These are some strange words.

 

So we don't come to our own conclusion in understanding what God meant when He says a person, (is not) because God (took him) we will have to go to the Bible and learn how God uses these phrases in other verses. In doing this we will not come to a false conclusion or misinterpret what God was saying. 

 

The first verse is found in Genesis 42:13.

 

Genesis 42:13 And they said, Thy servants are twelve brethren, the sons of one man in the land of Canaan; and, behold, the youngest is this day with our father, and one is not.

 

The question we need to answer in this above verse is, who is this one, who is not?

 

The one, who is not, in the above verse, is the son who died. A couple verses ahead in Genesis 44:20 tells us who the one (who is not) is and what happened to him. Listen.

 

Genesis 44:20 And we said unto my lord, We have a father, an old man, and a child of his old age, a little one; and his brother is dead, and he alone is left of his mother, and his father loveth him.

 

The one (who is not) was the son who died. So when God uses the phrase, "was not" He is referring to someone who has died.

 

Let’s look at another verse that speaks of someone who (was not).

 

Matthew 2:18 In Rama was there a voice heard, lamentation, and weeping, and great mourning, Rachel weeping for her children, and would not be comforted, because they are not.

 

Rachel was crying for her children because, THEY ARE NOT, in other words, they died.

 

Let’s look at another verse that gives us a very clear picture of what God means when He says someone is not.

 

Psalms 37:36 Yet he passed away, and, lo, he was not: yea, I sought him, but he could not be found.

 

This person died and was not. The words, "They looked for him but he could not be found" are very important to keep in mind because it’s referring to this person who died. Now read Hebrews again and pay close attention to similar wording when referring to what happened to Enoch.

 

Hebrews 11:5 By faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had translated him: for before his translation he had this testimony, that he pleased God.

 

Because Enoch obeyed God's word, by living a life pleasing to God, God took him so that he should not see death. 

 

God took Enoch so that he SHOULD not see death. 

 

Which death is God referring to here? Is it the death that we all have to face or is it the second death that He is referring to here?

 

I believe God was referring to the second death because He makes it clear that Enoch walked with God and pleased God.

 

Revelation 2:11 "He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. He who overcomes shall not be hurt by the second death.'' '

 

Revelation 20:6 Blessed and holy is he who has part in the first resurrection. Over such the second death has no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with Him a thousand years.

 

Enoch lived to the ripe old age of 365 years and then God took Him. The fact that Enoch obeyed God's word makes him a righteous man. Are righteous and merciful men ever taken away, in other words, do they die? Yes, God does take them away but they too won't see death, the second death because they obeyed God and overcame.

 

Isaiah 57:1 The righteous perishes, and no man takes it to heart; merciful men are taken away, while no one considers that the righteous is taken away from evil.

 

God says the same thing about us. He tells us that if we obey His word we too will not see death, referring to the second death.

 

John 8:51 "Most assuredly, I say to you, if anyone keeps My word he shall never see death.''

 

Sometimes the translator’s use of words in the New Testament can cause confusion. But if we let the Bible speak as a whole, according to God’s plan, we can clear up all these confusions.

 

I want to look at Psalms 37-36 a little more closely because I believe it will help us even more to understand what happened to Enoch.

 

Psalms 37:36 Yet he passed away, and, lo, he was not: yea, I sought him, but he could not be found.

 

This word, (passed away) is a word being used to speak of someone dying. This person died and was not and he could not be found. 

 

These are the same words being used in Hebrews when speaking of what happened to Enoch.

 

The use of this word, (passed away) has led to the confusion in Hebrews. Let’s look at the thoughts and meanings these words bring out of Scripture.

 

This word, (passed away) are the Strong's number #5674 and is found in Job 33:18.

 

Job 33:18 He keeps back his soul from the pit, and his life from perishing by the sword.

 

The word, (perishing) in Job is the Strong's number #5674.

 

Now let’s see how Strong's defines this word. Pay close attention the KJV wording found in Hebrews when referring to Enoch's translation.

 

Strong's Ref. # 5674

Romanized `abar

Pronounced aw-bar'

 

a primitive root; to cross over; used very widely of any transition (literal or figurative; transitive, intransitive, intensive, causative); specifically, to cover (in copulation): 

 

KJV--alienate, alter, X at all, beyond, bring (over, through), carry over, (over-)come (on, over), conduct (over), convey over, current, deliver, do away, enter, escape, fail, gender, get over, (make) go (away, beyond, by, forth, his way, in, on, over, through), have away (more), lay, meddle, overrun, make partition, (cause to, give, make to, over) pass(-age, along, away, beyond, by, -enger, on, out, over, through), (cause to, make) + proclaim(-amation),  perish , provoke to anger, put away, rage, + raiser of taxes,  remove , send over, set apart, + shave, cause to (make) sound, X speedily, X sweet smelling,  take(away) , (make to) transgress(-or),  translate , turn away, [way-]faring man, be wrath.

 

Did you notice how the King James translators could have used the words, translate, take away, perish or remove in Hebrews 11:5, in place of the word, translated. These words would better help us understand that Enoch did in fact die and would line up with the rest of the Bible.

 

The words, took him or taken away, means the person died as seen with Enoch. 

 

Let’s look at another verse that uses the word, taken away, when referring to someone who has died.

 

Ezekiel 33:6 But if the watchman sees the sword coming and does not blow the trumpet, and the people are not warned, and the sword comes and takes any person from among them, he is taken away in his iniquity; but his blood I will require at the watchman's hand.

 

Knowing that Enoch lived 365 years and was not because God took him tells us that Enoch died. But because Enoch had the testimony that he walked with God, before God took him, tells us that he should not see death, which is referring to the second death. The King James translators either struggled with trying to translate these Old Testament words based on their own preconceived theology of the dead living on after death or it was purposely done by the Antichrist Beast kingdom to set the stage for the end time delusions of sorceries, contacting the dead and the appearing of Mary to deceive the world.

 

Now, what about Elijah?

 

It says that Elijah was taken up by a whirlwind into heaven.

 

Again we have to keep in mind Jesus' statement that no one has literally ascended into heaven, the Father’s dwelling place, except for Jesus.

 

So what does it mean when it says Elijah was taken up to heaven?

 

2 Kings 2:1 And it came to pass, when the Lord was about to take up Elijah into heaven by a whirlwind, that Elijah went with Elisha from Gilgal. 

 

The KJV uses the word, (heaven), which can be misleading. The clearer word that should be used is the word, sky. The reason for this is because the word (sky) and (heaven) are interchangeable depending on which heaven is being referred to. God took Elijah to a different location by way of the sky. As a matter of fact, the people knew that God was going to do this even before it happened.

 

2 Kings 2:5 Then the students at Jericho came to Elisha and asked him, "Do you know that the Lord is going to take away your master today?'' "Will you please be quiet?'' he commanded. "Of course I know it!''

 

They knew that God was going to take Elijah from them and move him to another location on earth. They even offered to look for him when it happened.

 

2 Kings 2:16 "Elisha,'' they said, "just say the word and fifty of our best men will search the wilderness for your master (Elijah); perhaps the Spirit of the Lord has left him on some mountain or in some ravine.'' "No,'' Elisha said, "don't bother.''

 

Elijah was taken somewhere else on earth. The fact that Elijah wrote a letter to the king years after he was caught up to the sky by God tells us that Elijah was still on earth even years later.

 

2 Chronicles 21:12 Then Elijah the prophet wrote him this letter: "The Lord God of your ancestor David says that because you have not followed in the good ways of your father Jehoshaphat, nor the good ways of King Asa.

 

God caught up Elijah to a different location on earth. This was not uncommon for God to do with Elijah. Listen.

 

1 Kings 18:8-12 “Yes, it is,” Elijah replied. “Now go and tell your master, ‘Elijah is here.’” “Oh, sir,” Obadiah protested, “what harm have I done to you that you are sending me to my death at the hands of Ahab? For I swear by the Lord your God that the king has searched every nation and kingdom on earth from end to end to find you. And each time he was told, ‘Elijah isn’t here,’ King Ahab forced the king of that nation to swear to the truth of his claim. And now you say, ‘Go and tell your master, “Elijah is here.”’ But as soon as I leave you, the Spirit of the Lord will carry you away to who knows where. 

 

God did the same thing with Phillip. Listen.

 

Acts 8:39 Now when they came up out of the water, the Spirit of the Lord caught Philip away, so that the eunuch saw him no more; and he went on his way rejoicing.

 

Did God take Phillip to heaven? No. God took Phillip to another location on earth, which was a place called, Azotus.

 

Acts 8:40 Philip was found at Azotus. And passing through, he preached in all the cities till he came to Caesare.

 

Now, in the transfiguration we have Moses and Elijah standing with Jesus. 

 

Matthew 17:1-5 Now after six days Jesus took Peter, James, and John his brother, led them up on a high mountain by themselves; and He was transfigured before them. His face shone like the sun, and His clothes became as white as the light. And behold, Moses and Elijah appeared to them, talking with Him. Then Peter answered and said to Jesus, “Lord, it is good for us to be here; if You wish, let us make here three tabernacles: one for You, one for Moses, and one for Elijah.” While he was still speaking, behold, a bright cloud overshadowed them; and suddenly a voice came out of the cloud, saying, “This is My beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased. Hear Him!” 

 

According to Jesus’ own words, this appearing of Moses and Elijah was only a vision. 

 

Matthew 17:9 Now as they came down from the mountain, Jesus commanded them, saying, "Tell the vision to no one until the Son of Man is risen from the dead.''

 

What we know from other Biblical accounts of visions is that they don’t have to be a literal reality. Because of this, we should not use visions to form a doctrine, especially if the doctrine contradicts the rest of Scripture. Even if this was a literal reality it gives no indication of whether or not they came up from their grave for this appearing or came down from heaven. We know that the Bible tells us that Jesus is the first one raised from death to immortality and the only one who has ascended into heaven. So according to Scripture they could not have come down from heaven.

 

Peter refers to the vision and makes a statement of how prophecy is a more sure word. In other words, it was awesome to witness the vision but it was still only a vision. Bible prophecy must override visions when trying to form doctrines.

 

2 Peter 1:16-19 For we have not followed cunningly devised fables when we made known unto you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but were eyewitnesses of His majesty. For He received from God the Father honor and glory when there came such a voice to Him from the Excellent Glory: “This is My beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.” And this voice, which came from Heaven, we heard when we were with Him on the holy mount. We have also a more sure word of prophecy, unto which ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn and the day star arise in your hearts.

 

In the last days people will be deceived through visions.

 

1 Thessalonians 2:9-10 The coming of the lawless one will be in accordance with the work of Satan displayed in all kinds of counterfeit miracles, signs and wonders, and in every sort of evil that deceives those who are perishing. They perish because they refused to love the truth and so be saved.

 

Now what about the belief that says Moses' was resurrected?

 

We have been taught to believe that Moses was resurrected prior to the second coming of Jesus. But this is a contradiction of Jesus’ own words. Not only that, nowhere throughout the entire Bible do we find Moses being resurrected.

 

So what happened to Moses? 

 

The Bible is clear, he died at the ripe old age of 120 years and was buried and to this day we don't know where he was buried.

 

Deuteronomy 34:5-6 So Moses the servant of the Lord died there in the land of Moab, according to the word of the Lord. Moses was one hundred and twenty years old when he died. His eyes were not dim nor his natural vigor abated. And He buried him in a valley in the land of Moab, opposite Beth Peor; but no one knows his grave to this day. Moses was one hundred and twenty years old when he died. His eyes were not dim nor his natural vigorabated.

 

But some people believe and teach that Moses was raised from the dead to immortality and is now in heaven. Those who believe this use Jude as their proof text.

 

Jude 1:9 Yet Michael the archangel, in contending with the devil, when he disputed about the body of Moses...

 

Again, nowhere in the Old Testament do we find Moses being resurrected nor do we find a dispute over Moses' body. 

 

Second, to believe that Moses was raised from the dead is biblically unsound and comes against God's resurrection plan for the last day. It also makes void Jesus' first born from the dead status.

 

Colossians 1:18 And Jesus is the head of the body, the church, who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead, that in all things He may have the preeminence.

 

Revelation 1:5 Jesus Christ, the faithful witness, the firstborn from the dead, and the ruler over the kings of the earth. To Him who loved us and washed us from our sins in His own blood.

 

If Moses was raised from the dead and given immortality then that would make him the firstborn from the dead. This is a complete contradiction of Scripture. The Bible is very clear when it says, Jesus is the firstborn from the dead and He is the only one who has ascended into heaven.

 

So what is Jude really saying?

 

When Jude speaks of the dispute between Michael and the devil, over Moses' body, Jude was not referring to Moses' literal body. The King James Version used the word (body) but this word is not accurate. The word that should have been used is the word (slave or servant). Refer to Strong's number #4983.

 

Strong's Ref. # 4983

Romanized soma

Pronounced so'-mah

 

from GSN4982; the body (as a sound whole), used in a very wide application, literally or figuratively: 

 

KJV--bodily, body, slave.

 

Now notice how the word (soma #4983) is used in Revelation 18:13.

 

Revelation 18:13 And cinnamon, and odours, and ointments, and frankincense, and wine, and oil, and fine flour, and wheat, and beasts, and sheep, and horses, and chariots, and slaves (#4983), and souls of men.

 

The dispute taking place in the Old Testament was over Moses' servant. Where in the Bible do we find a dispute between an angel and the devil over Moses' servant? 

 

We find it word for word in Zechariah 3 where the angel of Lord (Michael) disputed with Satan (Devil) over the high priest Joshua. The priesthood came through Moses, which makes Joshua a servant to Moses.

 

Numbers 11:28 And Joshua the son of Nun, the servant of Moses, one of his young men, answered and said, My lord Moses, forbid them.

 

This Joshua in the above verse is not the same Joshua in Zechariah 3:1-5 but you can see how they were called Moses' servants.

 

If you read Zechariah 3:1-5 you will find the same exact wording being used in Jude leading us to believe that this was the dispute Jude was referring to. 

 

Let’s compare the verses in both these books.

 

Zechariah 3:1-2 Then he showed me Joshua the high priest standing before the Angel of the Lord, and Satan standing at his right hand to oppose him. And the Lord said to Satan, "The Lord rebuke you, Satan! The Lord who has chosen Jerusalem rebuke you! Is this not a brand plucked from the fire?'' 

 

Jude 1:9 Yet Michael the archangel, in contending with the devil, when he disputed about the body (servant) of Moses, dared not bring against him a reviling accusation, but said, "The Lord rebuke you!'' 

 

Jude 1:23 but others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire, hating even the garment defiled by the flesh.

 

Zechariah 3:4-5 Then He answered and spoke to those who stood before Him, saying, "Take away the filthy garments from him.'' And to him He said, "See, I have removed your iniquity from you, and I will clothe you with rich robes.'' And I said, "Let them put a clean turban on his head.'' So they put a clean turban on his head, and they put the clothes on him. And the Angel of the Lord stood by. 

 

Jude 1:24 Now to Him who is able to keep you from stumbling, and to present you faultless before the presence of His glory with exceeding joy.

 

The angel of the Lord and Satan in Zechariah 3 is Michael and the Devil in Jude 1. The high priest Joshua was the servant of Moses, through the priesthood, and is the same person in both Zechariah and Jude. He was the one pulled from the fire and was given clean robes. 

 

You can see these verses are not referring to Moses’ body because Moses died and was buried and to this day we know not where.

 

When we use the Bible to interpret the Bible we will have no contradictions and our faith can be biblically sound.

 

God has a plan to resurrect His people on the last day. Until that day we all wait in the grave until we hear the voice of the Savior.

 

John 6:39-40 This is the will of the Father who sent Me, that of all He has given Me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up at the last day. And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that everyone who sees the Son and believes in Him may have everlasting life; and I will raise him up at the last day.”

 

John 6:44 No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him; and I will raise him up at the last day.

 

John 6:54 Whoever eats My flesh and drinks My blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day.

 

John 11:24 Martha said to Him, “I know that he will rise again in the resurrection at the last day.”

 

Daniel 12:2-3 And many of those who sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, some to shame and everlasting contempt. Those who are wise shall shine like the brightness of the firmament, and those who turn many to righteousness like the stars forever and ever. 

 

1 Thessalonians 4:15-18 For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord. Therefore comfort one another with these words. 

 

At this point we enter into the 1000 year millennium.

[rudywoofs (Pam)]

Scuba, it might work better if you divided your OP into 4 or more posts.  5400+ words in one post is not likely to get read by very many people, and might render moot your efforts in posting the topic..  (just a suggestion) 

[Scuba]

Scuba, it might work better if you divided your OP into 4 or more posts.  5400+ words in one post is not likely to get read by very many people, and might render moot your efforts in posting the topic..  (just a suggestion)

The problem with that is the thought can be broken up when people reply.

[8thdaypriest]

Scuba,

I agree that the person (soul) sleeps in death.

 

I believe that the LORD uses the heavenly equivalent of a memory stick to download individual memory (mind) at the moment of death. 

At the resurrection, we get a new "spiritual body" and the LORD "uploads" the memory into that new "computer" (brain). 

 

At the Tower of Babel, the LORD uploaded a language program into the brains of the workers.

At Pentecost, He uploaded a heavenly version of a language translator. 

 

I just edited my study on "Where Are the Dead" at my website. 

There is a video, which shows my computer screen with the notes, while you hear my voice doing the teaching.

I've been told that it's a great tool for sharing the unconscious state of the dead.

[Scuba]

Scuba,

I agree that the person (soul) sleeps in death.

 

I believe that the LORD uses the heavenly equivalent of a memory stick to download individual memory (mind) at the moment of death. 

At the resurrection, we get a new "spiritual body" and the LORD "uploads" the memory into that new "computer" (brain). 

 

At the Tower of Babel, the LORD uploaded a language program into the brains of the workers.

At Pentecost, He uploaded a heavenly version of a language translator. 

 

I just edited my study on "Where Are the Dead" at my website. 

There is a video, which shows my computer screen with the notes, while you hear my voice doing the teaching.

I've been told that it's a great tool for sharing the unconscious state of the dead.

 

 

You have a great website packed with golden nuggets of truth. Thanks for all the hard work and study you put into it.

 

Was my study helpful?

[8thdaypriest]

Yes - it was a good review.

[Scuba]

Yes - it was a good review.

Thanks

[LifeHiscost]

Thanks

A good sign for ClubAdventist is a mutual admiration society.

 

…13For you were called to freedom, brethren; only do not turn your freedom into an opportunity for the flesh, but through love serve one another. 14For the whole Law is fulfilled in one word, in the statement, "YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF."....Galatians 5

 

God is Love!  Jesus saves! 

[Scuba]

A good sign for ClubAdventist is a mutual admiration society.

 

…13For you were called to freedom, brethren; only do not turn your freedom into an opportunity for the flesh, but through love serve one another. 14For the whole Law is fulfilled in one word, in the statement, "YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF."....Galatians 5

 

God is Love!  Jesus saves! 

 

[Sojourner]

The problem that you have Scuba is the chronology of your Bible verses, 

 

See Matthew 27 50-53 "and when Jesus had cried out again in a loud voice, he gave up his spirit. At that moment the curtain of the temple was torn in top to bottom. The earth shook, the rocks split and the tombs broke open. The bodies of many holy people who had died were raised to life. They came out of the tombs after Jesus resurrection and went into the holy city and appeared to many people".

 

This event clearly fulfils the prophecy in Isaiah 26 18-19 "We have been with child, we have been in pain. We have, as it were, brought forth wind; We have not accomplished any deliverance in the earth, Nor have the inhabitants of the world fallen. Your dead shall live; Together with my dead body they shall arise. Awake and sing, you who dwell in dust; For your dew is like the dew of herbs, And the earth shall cast out the dead.

 

Gods promise was fulfilled to these saints, they no longer are in the earth for they have been given up from it and are with G-d as promised. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[8thdaypriest]

Sojourner,

 

The "twenty four elders" are described as "around the throne.:  They were "clothed in white robes; and they had crowns on their heads."  (Rev. 4:4).

 

These 24 Elders seem to have an intercessory work.  They have "golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers of the saints."  They sing that they have been "redeemed to God" by the blood of the lamb, out of every tribe and tongue and people and nation."  "And they have been made (or are being made to be) priests to God.  They will "reign on the earth".  (Rev. 5:9)

 

So - these are NOT just Israelites.  They are certainly NOT all Levites. 

 

Yet they are prepared to serve as "kings and priests" ON THE EARTH.

 

King David divided the priesthood of Israel into 24 courses.  They came up at scheduled intervals of 2 weeks, to serve at the Temple.  This schedule was still followed in the time of Christ.

 

It is very likely that the vision of John - and the 24 Elders, was using this division of the priesthood to represent those serving in Heaven.

There are probably far more than just 24 Elders.  Most likely 24 "Courses".

So - yes - I believe there ARE human beings in Heaven now.  But I don't believe that EVERY human being who dies, goes straight to heaven.

 

Does this mean that EVERY saint from the Old Testament period was resurrected just after Christ was raised from the dead. 

It's possible, but there are clues that suggest this was a representative group - NOT EVERY saint. 

 

Daniel was told that he would "rest and will arise to your inheritance at the end of the days" - the DAYS being the 1260/1290/1335. 

Daniel is told that "many of those who sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake to everlasting life" after a great time of trouble. 

In other words there will be a resurrection of redeemed people at the END of this age. 

 

The ancient man Job said, “So man lies down and does not rise. Till the heavens are no more, they will not awake nor be roused from their sleep” (Job 14:12).

    NOTE:  The heavens pass away at the second coming of Christ (2 Peter 3:10).

 

        I Thessalonians 4:16-17  “For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet of God.  And the dead in Christ will rise first.  Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air.”  And thus we shall always be with the Lord.”  

        Some folks read just verse 15, and then say that the dead go to heaven before the living, but that’s not what the rest of the passage is saying.  Paul is describing one event.

 

John 14:1-3  “I will come again, and receive you unto myself;”     

    We are not received as disembodied spirits, prior to His coming.

    I Corinthians 15:23  “But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the first fruits of them that slept . . .  But every man in his own order: Christ the first fruits; afterward they that are Christ’s at his coming.”

 

Respectfully,

Rachel Cory

Prophecy Viewpoint

[Scuba]

The problem that you have Scuba is the chronology of your Bible verses, 

 

See Matthew 27 50-53 "and when Jesus had cried out again in a loud voice, he gave up his spirit. At that moment the curtain of the temple was torn in top to bottom. The earth shook, the rocks split and the tombs broke open. The bodies of many holy people who had died were raised to life. They came out of the tombs after Jesus resurrection and went into the holy city and appeared to many people".

 

This event clearly fulfils the prophecy in Isaiah 26 18-19 "We have been with child, we have been in pain. We have, as it were, brought forth wind; We have not accomplished any deliverance in the earth, Nor have the inhabitants of the world fallen. Your dead shall live; Together with my dead body they shall arise. Awake and sing, you who dwell in dust; For your dew is like the dew of herbs, And the earth shall cast out the dead.

 

Gods promise was fulfilled to these saints, they no longer are in the earth for they have been given up from it and are with G-d as promised. 

 

There are at least three problems with your reply. Remember, many things were changed by the Beast in order to fit and promote what they teach.

 

1. The verse you quoted in Isaiah 26 has been tweaked to say, "Together with my dead body they shall arise. Awake and sing, you who dwell in dust." The verse should actually say, "But your dead will live, Lord; their bodies will rise let those who dwell in the dust wake up and shout for joy." This is actually referring to the resurrection at the second coming of Jesus.

 

Daniel 12:2 And many of those who sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, some to shame and everlasting contempt. 

 

2. The so called, resurrection in Matthew 27 is suspicious to say the least due to the fact that nowhere else in the entire NT is there a mention of this most awesome pre-resurrection. If this really happened don't you think the other Gospels would have mentioned it? This would not be the first added verse to Matthew to support a preconceived doctrine. Matthew 28:19 is just like it.

 

Matthew 28:19 Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit.

The Catholic Encyclopedia, II, page 263:

"The baptismal formula was changed from the name of Jesus Christ to the words Father, Son, and Holy Spirit by the Catholic Church in the second century."

The Encyclopedia of Religion and Ethics:

As to Matthew 28:19, it says: "It is the central piece of evidence for the traditional (Trinitarian) view. If it were undisputed, this would, of course, be decisive, but its trustworthiness is impugned on grounds of textual criticism, literary criticism and historical criticism."

 

The same Encyclopedia further states that: "The obvious explanation of the silence of the New Testament on the triune name, and the use of another (JESUS NAME) formula in Acts and Paul, is that this other formula was the earlier, and the triune formula is a later addition."

Edmund Schlink, The Doctrine of Baptism, page 28:

"The baptismal command in its Matthew 28:19 form can not be the historical origin of Christian baptism. At the very least, it must be assumed that the text has been transmitted in a form expanded by the [Catholic] church."

 

The Tyndale New Testament Commentaries, I, 275:

"It is often affirmed that the words in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost are not the ipsissima verba [exact words] of Jesus, but...a later liturgical addition."

 

James Moffett's New Testament Translation:

In a footnote on page 64 about Matthew 28:19 he makes this statement: "It may be that this (Trinitarian) formula, so far as the fullness of its expression is concerned, is a reflection of the (Catholic) liturgical usage established later in the primitive (Catholic) community, It will be remembered that Acts speaks of baptizing "in the name of Jesus, cf. Acts 1:5"

 

3. If the pre-resurrection in Matthew 27 is real it would still not confirm anyone went to heaven. It says they rose from their graves and entered the city and witnessed. This does not mean they went to heaven and it also means they would have to die again just like many others who came back to life such as Lazarus.

[Scuba]

Sojourner,

 

The "twenty four elders" are described as "around the throne.:  They were "clothed in white robes; and they had crowns on their heads."  (Rev. 4:4).

 

These 24 Elders seem to have an intercessory work.  They have "golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers of the saints."  They sing that they have been "redeemed to God" by the blood of the lamb, out of every tribe and tongue and people and nation."  "And they have been made (or are being made to be) priests to God.  They will "reign on the earth".  (Rev. 5:9)

 

So - these are NOT just Israelites.  They are certainly NOT all Levites. 

 

Yet they are prepared to serve as "kings and priests" ON THE EARTH.

 

King David divided the priesthood of Israel into 24 courses.  They came up at scheduled intervals of 2 weeks, to serve at the Temple.  This schedule was still followed in the time of Christ.

 

It is very likely that the vision of John - and the 24 Elders, was using this division of the priesthood to represent those serving in Heaven.

There are probably far more than just 24 Elders.  Most likely 24 "Courses".

So - yes - I believe there ARE human beings in Heaven now.  But I don't believe that EVERY human being who dies, goes straight to heaven.

 

Does this mean that EVERY saint from the Old Testament period was resurrected just after Christ was raised from the dead. 

It's possible, but there are clues that suggest this was a representative group - NOT EVERY saint. 

 

Daniel was told that he would "rest and will arise to your inheritance at the end of the days" - the DAYS being the 1260/1290/1335. 

Daniel is told that "many of those who sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake to everlasting life" after a great time of trouble. 

In other words there will be a resurrection of redeemed people at the END of this age. 

 

The ancient man Job said, “So man lies down and does not rise. Till the heavens are no more, they will not awake nor be roused from their sleep” (Job 14:12).

    NOTE:  The heavens pass away at the second coming of Christ (2 Peter 3:10).

 

        I Thessalonians 4:16-17  “For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet of God.  And the dead in Christ will rise first.  Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air.”  And thus we shall always be with the Lord.”  

        Some folks read just verse 15, and then say that the dead go to heaven before the living, but that’s not what the rest of the passage is saying.  Paul is describing one event.

 

John 14:1-3  “I will come again, and receive you unto myself;”     

    We are not received as disembodied spirits, prior to His coming.

    I Corinthians 15:23  “But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the first fruits of them that slept . . .  But every man in his own order: Christ the first fruits; afterward they that are Christ’s at his coming.”

 

Respectfully,

Rachel Cory

Prophecy Viewpoint

 

The Bible says no one has ascended into heaven or received immortality until Jesus comes back so this means the 24 elders in Rev.5 are not human beings. You have to read human beings into the verses because the verses don't say they are. It's like when people read Sabbath in Romans 14:5 when it's not there. Remember, God does have an authoritative structure in His heavenly court that we mimic here on earth. If we have elders in the church why wouldn't God have elders in His heavenly court.

[Sojourner]

Scuba, you claim not to be a Christadelphian, yet you repeatedly emphasise their theology and any time the Bible disagrees with your theology you attack the translation of the Bible and state that those areas that disagree with you are incorrect as they teach also.... 

 

If like the Christadelphians, Watchtower Society, Chrislam or whoever else you need to change the wording of Scripture to make it fit your theology, I would suggest that you have placed yourself in a vicious circle. People that go to colleges like Fuller and get theological degrees to study and translate the Bible are not idiots. If you doubt the veracity of the Scripture, Lee Strobel's "The Case for Christ" is a very good place to start from to understand how we got the Bible and how it is translated and what the criteria is for a Primary Document.. 

 

 

[Scuba]

Scuba, you claim not to be a Christadelphian, yet you repeatedly emphasise their theology and any time the Bible disagrees with your theology you attack the translation of the Bible and state that those areas that disagree with you are incorrect as they teach also.... 

 

If like the Christadelphians, Watchtower Society, Chrislam or whoever else you need to change the wording of Scripture to make it fit your theology, I would suggest that you have placed yourself in a vicious circle. People that go to colleges like Fuller and get theological degrees to study and translate the Bible are not idiots. If you doubt the veracity of the Scripture, Lee Strobel's "The Case for Christ" is a very good place to start from to understand how we got the Bible and how it is translated and what the criteria is for a Primary Document.. 

 

 

 

Why don't you call Christians, Jewish, when they keep the Sabbath? Why don't you call people, Watchtower Society, when they believe Jesus is Michael? So why do you call me Christadelphian? Is it because I study and do my research? Don't get mad when your proven wrong, just make the changes to be right, that's what I had to do so many times in my walk. I can't help it if our modern day Bibles have been tweaked to fit a preconceived mindset. Do your research on Isaiah 26:19 and get back to me.

[8thdaypriest]

The Bible says no one has ascended into heaven or received immortality until Jesus comes back so this means the 24 elders in Rev.5 are not human beings. You have to read human beings into the verses because the verses don't say they are. It's like when people read Sabbath in Romans 14:5 when it's not there. Remember, God does have an authoritative structure in His heavenly court that we mimic here on earth. If we have elders in the church why wouldn't God have elders in His heavenly court.

The 24 Elders "sang a new song, saying: 

"You were slain,

and have redeemed us to God by Your blood

Out of every tribe and tongue and people and nation."  (Rev. 5:9-10)

 

Sure sounds like human beings to me.

[8thdaypriest]

May I recommend another good book?

"The Journey from Texts to Translations - The Origin and Development of the Bible" by Paul D. Wegner.

 

This book has lots of tables, and diagrams. 

It lists all apocryphal books and lists the reasons why each one was NOT included in the Canon.

I had not realized that the Catholic Church accepted as Canon, a couple of the apocryphal books, and THAT is where she got the doctrine of purgatory. 

[8thdaypriest]

Scuba,

You've been posting here for some time, so I assume you've read thru the thread on John 3:13 ("No one has ascended"). 

 

I finally had to accept that Enoch, Moses, and Elijah WERE taken to heaven.  If NOT - then Jesus was talking "with the dead" on the Mount of Translation. 

 

Jesus disciples were devout Jewish men.  They would have forsaken Him, if they thought He was conversing "with the dead". 

 

And NO - I do not believe it was a "vision".  There is no other vision in the whole of Scripture, in which someone was talking with specific dead persons. 

[Scuba]

The 24 Elders "sang a new song, saying: 

"You were slain,

and have redeemed us to God by Your blood

Out of every tribe and tongue and people and nation."  (Rev. 5:9-10)

 

Sure sounds like human beings to me.

 

Again, we have to remember the power of the Beast and his plan to distort the word and plan of God. The entire plan of God is to have a people He can call His own who would dwell on a renewed earth but Satan has distorted that plan and has distorted the word of God to help promote his distortion. For example, Easter, is not a Christian holiday yet the word Easter was placed in the Bible to promote it as a Christian holiday.

 

You quote Rev.5:9-10 and it seems to say the 24 elders are people but it's all smoke and mirrors used by the Beast to promote his plan. Rev.5:9-10 has been tweaked to fit the Beast's theology. Listen to how Rev.5:9-10 should read and you will find that the living creatures and the 24 elders are talking about the redeemed people, they are not the redeemed people. Listen.

 

Revelation 5:9-10 (NIV) And they sang a new song, saying: “You are worthy to take the scroll and to open its seals, because you were slain, and with your blood you purchased for God persons from every tribe and language and people and nation. You have made them to be a kingdom and priests to serve our God, and they will reign on the earth.”

 

Revelation 5:9-10 (NASB) And they sang a new song, saying, “Worthy are You to take the book and to break its seals; for You were slain, and purchased for God with Your blood men from every tribe and tongue and people and nation. “You have made them to be a kingdom and priests to our God; and they will reign upon the earth.”

[8thdaypriest]

Scuba,

Here in the book of Hebrews we have a whole list of faithful people. At the end of this list it says they all died without receiving the promise, including Enoch. We know that the promise was something in the future because they all looked forward to it, in the same way we look forward to it. The promise was the coming kingdom of God in the new earth.

 

Enoch is specifically EXCLUDED from those who DIED, because the passage says "translated so that he did not see death." 

 

He is NOT EXCLUDED from those who have not yet "received the promise". 

The "promise" was "the land", and peace. 

NO ONE has received THAT PROMISE - not yet. 

 

Going to heaven - was NOT THE PROMISE. 

Living peacefully, and healthfully in "the land" - THAT was the promise. 

[8thdaypriest]

Scuba,

I agree with you that death is a state of unconsciousness.

I do NOT agree with you that no human being has yet been translated or raised to heaven. 

[Scuba]

Scuba,

You've been posting here for some time, so I assume you've read thru the thread on John 3:13 ("No one has ascended"). 

 

I finally had to accept that Enoch, Moses, and Elijah WERE taken to heaven.  If NOT - then Jesus was talking "with the dead" on the Mount of Translation. 

 

Jesus disciples were devout Jewish men.  They would have forsaken Him, if they thought He was conversing "with the dead". 

 

And NO - I do not believe it was a "vision".  There is no other vision in the whole of Scripture, in which someone was talking with specific dead persons. 

 

Jesus Himself called it a vision and we now visions don't have to be a literal reality.

 

Matthew 17:9 Now as they came down from the mountain, Jesus commanded them, saying, “Tell the vision to no one until the Son of Man is risen from the dead.”

 

Peter, when referring to that vision says, we have a more sure word found in prophecy, which means we should not use visions to build doctrines. Also, notice how Peter makes no mention of Moses or Elijah.

 

2 Peter 1:17-19 For He received from God the Father honor and glory when there came such a voice to Him from the Excellent Glory: “This is My beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.” And this voice, which came from Heaven, we heard when we were with Him on the holy mount. We have also a more sure word of prophecy, unto which ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn and the day star arise in your hearts.

 

Even if you believe Moses and Elijah were real it does not say they came down from heaven or up from the grave so you have to read into the verse what you want it to say. Now if you believe the dead are in their grave then you would say they came up for the vision but if you believe they are already in heaven then you would say they came down for the vision. We know from the Bible that Moses died and was buried and we know Elijah was still one earth after he was transported by the Spirit of God to another location on earth and we know the dead, such as King David, are in their graves awaiting the resurrection so the vision is just what it was, a vision. Revelation 13:1 is also a vision but we don't say or believe there is a literal beast in a zoo somewhere with ten heads, ten horns and ten crowns.

 

Revelation 13:1 Then I stood on the sand of the sea. And I saw a beast rising up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and on his horns ten crowns, and on his heads a blasphemous name.

[8thdaypriest]

Matthew 27:52-53 

 

CJB:  "Also the graves were opened, and the bodies of many holy people who had died were raised to life; and after Yeshua rose, they came out of the graves and went into the holy city, where many people saw them. "

 

KJV:   "And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose, And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many."

 

NAU:  "The tombs were opened, and many bodies of the 1saints who had afallen asleep were raised; and coming out of the tombs after His resurrection they entered athe holy city and appeared to many."

 

NIV:  "and the tombs broke open. The bodies of many holy people who had died were raised to life.  They came out of the tombs after Jesus' resurrection and1 went into the holy city and appeared to many people."

 

NRS:  "The tombs also were opened, and many bodies of the saints who had fallen asleep were raised. After his resurrection they came out of the tombs and entered the holy city and appeared to many."

 

First: You would need to show me the evidence for tampering with THIS PASSAGE.

I already agree that I John 5:7, and the baptismal formula in Matthew 28:19 WERE "tampered with", because evidence for a Trinity was lacking.  We have evidence of that. 

 

It is POSSIBLE that these were people of that time period, who were known to many of those living in Jerusalem.  They could POSSIBLY have been raised to continue their physical lives, only to die again later.  There are many examples of resurrections of this type.  Those individuals were not mentioned AGAIN either.

 

You believe that NO HUMAN BEING, other than Christ Himself is in Heaven now. 

I believe that - at the very least - Enoch, Moses, and Elijah are there.

[8thdaypriest]

Jesus Himself called it a vision and we now visions don't have to be a literal reality.

 

Matthew 17:9 Now as they came down from the mountain, Jesus commanded them, saying, “Tell the vision to no one until the Son of Man is risen from the dead.”

 

Peter, when referring to that vision says, we have a more sure word found in prophecy, which means we should not use visions to build doctrines. Also, notice how Peter makes no mention of Moses or Elijah.

 

2 Peter 1:17-19 For He received from God the Father honor and glory when there came such a voice to Him from the Excellent Glory: “This is My beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.” And this voice, which came from Heaven, we heard when we were with Him on the holy mount. We have also a more sure word of prophecy, unto which ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn and the day star arise in your hearts.

 

Even if you believe Moses and Elijah were real it does not say they came down from heaven or up from the grave so you have to read into the verse what you want it to say. Now if you believe the dead are in their grave then you would say they came up for the vision but if you believe they are already in heaven then you would say they came down for the vision. We know from the Bible that Moses died and was buried and we know Elijah was still one earth after he was transported by the Spirit of God to another location on earth and we know the dead, such as King David, are in their graves awaiting the resurrection so the vision is just what it was, a vision. Revelation 13:1 is also a vision but we don't say or believe there is a literal beast in a zoo somewhere with ten heads, ten horns and ten crowns.

 

Revelation 13:1 Then I stood on the sand of the sea. And I saw a beast rising up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and on his horns ten crowns, and on his heads a blasphemous name.

CJB and NIV quote Jesus as saying, "Tell no man what you have seen."  They don't use the word "vision" in their translation.

 

After He was raised, Jesus simply "appeared" in the upper room.  He didn't come "up" or "down". 

He also simply "vanished from their sight". 

It seems persons with "spiritual bodies" can move between the spiritual dimension, and the physical dimension. 

[Scuba]

Scuba,

Here in the book of Hebrews we have a whole list of faithful people. At the end of this list it says they all died without receiving the promise, including Enoch. We know that the promise was something in the future because they all looked forward to it, in the same way we look forward to it. The promise was the coming kingdom of God in the new earth.

 

Enoch is specifically EXCLUDED from those who DIED, because the passage says "translated so that he did not see death." 

 

He is NOT EXCLUDED from those who have not yet "received the promise". 

The "promise" was "the land", and peace. 

NO ONE has received THAT PROMISE - not yet. 

 

Going to heaven - was NOT THE PROMISE. 

Living peacefully, and healthfully in "the land" - THAT was the promise. 

 

It was never about dying and going to heaven. The promise is that God's people would inherit the whole earth renewed, not just a piece of land in Israel. 

 

Psalm 25:13 He himself shall dwell in prosperity, and his descendants shall inherit the earth.

 

Psalm 37:9 For evildoers shall be cut off; but those who wait on the Lord, they shall inherit the earth.  

 

Psalm 37:11 But the meek shall inherit the earth, and shall delight themselves in the abundance of peace.

 

Psalm 37:22 For those blessed by Him shall inherit the earth, but those cursed by Him shall be cut off.

 

Matthew 5:5 Blessed are the meek, for they shall inherit the earth.

 

All the days of Enoch were 365 years and then God took him, in other words, he died. 

 

Genesis 5:23-24 And all the days of Enoch were three hundred sixty and five years: And Enoch walked with God: and he was not; for God took him.

 

This means that when Hebrews says all the faithful people mentioned died without receiving the promise it means they all died without receiving the promise. Remember, the first death is called, sleep. The second death is total death or the absence of life. If we obey God we wont see death either, even though we will fall asleep.

 

John 8:51 Most assuredly, I say to you, if anyone keeps My word he shall never see death.”