M. T. Cross Posted April 12, 2015 Posted April 12, 2015 Someone I know the other day made a comment on how much they dislike Jesus. When I asked them why, they started listing of a great list of Christian behaviour, most of which I could not disagree with. So I asked them to tell me some things about Jesus. Again they listed of a bunch of stuff relating to Christians, again most of which was undeniable. But yet never did they actually say anything about Jesus himself, just about the religions that have adopted his name as their title. It got me thinking, is Jesus a captive of Christianity? Is his message, his ideals, his whole persona held back and hidden by Christianity? Kevin H and Stan 2 Quote
Moderators Gregory Matthews Posted April 12, 2015 Moderators Posted April 12, 2015 Sometimes yes. Sometimes no. Quote Gregory
Administrators Gail Posted April 12, 2015 Administrators Posted April 12, 2015 Good to see you back! It is a pretty sobering thought, that our actions result in people's opinion of our Master. But it is true, that to some we are the only Bible they ever have. And many times we just don't rightly represent Jesus in our lives. I don't know what I can say. I know that what I know about Christ from the Bible makes me hungry for more. He was radical then and He is radical now. I wish that His compassion and merciful attitude would be more shown by the lives of His followers than it is. Not to say that those aren't there at all. It's just that it takes 10 positives to every negative to make a balance. Stewart (SDA) 1 Quote Isaiah 32:17 And the work of righteousness shall be peace; and the effect of righteousness quietness and assurance for ever.
Administrators Gail Posted April 12, 2015 Administrators Posted April 12, 2015 i am glad that you are able to make a difference between Jesus and His followers. I hope that your conversation created some curiosity in the heart of your friend :) Quote Isaiah 32:17 And the work of righteousness shall be peace; and the effect of righteousness quietness and assurance for ever.
Stewart (SDA) Posted April 13, 2015 Posted April 13, 2015 ...It got me thinking, is Jesus a captive of Christianity? Is his message, his ideals, his whole persona held back and hidden by Christianity? In my view, Jesus' message (and yes, His whole persona,) is held back and hidden by Christianity. But there has always been a few that have represented Jesus well -- the light of Christianity has been kept alive in every generation since the very beginning... It has never completely gone out. An example of the problem, is the story of the High Priest's two sons, Hophni and Phinehas. These young men were managing the day to day affairs at the tabernacle, and they were treating the people that came to make an offering, very badly. It was a horrendous mis-representation of God. (1Samuel 2). To a greater or lesser extent, this has been a constant problem. We teach that those that have "known" the things of God, but have continued to misrepresent Him, will, in the end, be much better off if they had never known -- their guilt will be so much greater, because they "knew" [at least theoretically] what the standard of conduct/ behaviour was. I believe that, as a people we need to mourn (or as the Bible says, "afflict our souls",) over our misrepresentations of God, and to understand "what manner of persons" we really need to be. Yet we believe that, despite the "falling away", God will eventually have a group of people that will represent Him well. "So will I make My holy name known in the midst of my people Israel; and I will not let them pollute My holy name any more: and the heathen shall know that I am the LORD, the Holy One in Israel." (Eze 39:7) Gail 1 Quote
Stewart (SDA) Posted April 14, 2015 Posted April 14, 2015 ... is Jesus a captive of Christianity? Is his message, his ideals, his whole persona held back and hidden by Christianity? M.T., if I might add another little thought on this... Jesus knew what He was getting in to, when He committed Himself to working for us. He knew that His name would suffer as a result of misrepresentations by Satan and misrepresentations by His own people. But it strikes me that Jesus' willingness to go through with this, really says a lot about Him and His "persona". He was willing to be an object of ridicule and jest, willing to be made out to be a "crutch for weak-minded people"... but He went into it with His eyes open. Having sat down and "counted the cost", He committed Himself to the work of recovering us. In the end His name will be more honourable than ever for His willingness to be "dragged down" in the estimation of worldly wise-men and mockers. LifeHiscost 1 Quote
LifeHiscost Posted April 14, 2015 Posted April 14, 2015 In the end His name will be more honourable than ever for His willingness to be "dragged down" in the estimation of worldly wise-men and mockers. 11For it is written, "AS I LIVE, SAYS THE LORD, EVERY KNEE SHALL BOW TO ME, AND EVERY TONGUE SHALL GIVE PRAISE TO GOD." 12So then each one of us will give an account of himself to God.....Romans 14 God is Love! Jesus saves! Quote Lift Jesus up!!
pnattmbtc Posted April 22, 2015 Posted April 22, 2015 "But it strikes me that Jesus' willingness to go through with this, really says a lot about Him and His "persona". He was willing to be an object of ridicule and jest, willing to be made out to be a "crutch for weak-minded people"... but He went into it with His eyes open. Having sat down and "counted the cost", He committed Himself to the work of recovering us." Very nice thought. Quote Christ exalted the character of God, attributing to him the praise, and giving to him the credit, of the whole purpose of his own mission on earth,--to set men right through the revelation of God.
JoeMo Posted April 22, 2015 Posted April 22, 2015 Hey MT, The question you raise can well be said of any religion. Is the true nature of Allah hidden by some Muslims? Is the true nature of Buddha hidden by some Buddhists (I realize Buddha is not considered to be a god)? Is the true nature of some pagan gods hidden by their less knowledgeable (or less devout) followers? I think many people emulate and obey/trust their dieties on their worship days and as a last resort when they are in a bind. It is the minority of believers who emulate and trust/obey their dieties as a routine first priority. Welcome back, man! Quote
LifeHiscost Posted April 23, 2015 Posted April 23, 2015 I think many people emulate and obey/trust their dieties on their worship days and as a last resort when they are in a bind. It is the minority of believers who emulate and trust/obey their dieties as a routine first priority. I'm just wondering what it is that causes you to draw those conclusions? God is Love! Jesus saves! Quote Lift Jesus up!!
JoeMo Posted April 23, 2015 Posted April 23, 2015 "what it is that causes you to draw those conclusions?" Life experiences - my own and that of others'. How many times have you heard when people are going through crises that "I think God is trying to get my attention". Or I wish that I was closer to God". I pray more intensely when I am in crisis than when everything is good. Also, I see many people behave differently at church than they do elsewhere. Quote
Administrators Gail Posted April 23, 2015 Administrators Posted April 23, 2015 I like your comments, Stewart. Thanks! Quote Isaiah 32:17 And the work of righteousness shall be peace; and the effect of righteousness quietness and assurance for ever.
LifeHiscost Posted April 23, 2015 Posted April 23, 2015 Also, I see many people behave differently at church than they do elsewhere. I guess I just have to admit I lead a sheltered life. I've never met one of my brothers or sisters in the body of Christ who shows that much difference when someplace other than the sanctuary except maybe a new convert who hasn't gained the victory over smoking yet. God is Love! Jesus saves! Quote Lift Jesus up!!
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