Answered Prayers? Yes? No?

[Neil D]

Quote:

I search for something real but have not found it.

Hmmmmm.....I thought you had found a friend...Isn't that real?

[Planey]

Human friends are real, yes, and I am grateful for any of those that I might have.

But I find it hard to have a relationship with a "person" who may or may not be there, who may or may not be interested in me, who may or may not want a relationship with me.

So far all indications (such as they are) are that "may not" is the operative condition.

Graeme

[phkrause]

So reading the first four books of the NT and reading about the death and resurrection of our Lord and Savior doesn't indicate that he loves us? or that he is not real?

pkrause

[Woody]

Planey ... I just want you to know that I don't discount what you are saying. I can very much relate. I too am searching for better understanding in the areas you have mentioned. I think the points you raise need good study and serious answers. But since I am with you in the questioning ... I am not sure that I have the answers you seek. But when you find a good answer to the questions you have .... please tell ME also.

Unless you have traveled in anothers shoes .... you can't begin to understand their concerns and questions.

Also I would add a concern of Phillip Yancey's who wrote ...

Quote:

"Increasing, I fear, the church is viewed as an enemy of sinners" p. 259 The Jesus I Never Knew

[Woody]

I would like to share with you one thing that I try to keep in mind. Not that it is the total answer but it does help me. I figure that God has a lot on His plate and I will not be able to understand all the complexitites of the Great Controversy. But if I can in some way contribute to His Glory by MY suffering .... then I am happy to do it.

But the quote below or snippet as I like to call them .... is one thing that I try to keep in my mind ...

Quote:

"Jesus says, "What things soever ye desire, when ye pray, believe that ye receive them, and ye shall have them." Mark 11:24. There is a condition to this promise--that we pray according to the will of God." EGW - Steps TO Christ p. 51

Quote:

Ask not what God can do for you ... but what YOU can do for GOD.

[Guest truthseeker007]

Planey i really feel bad for your situation. I too am asking the same questions you ask and wonder why God doesn t work with miracles anymore just like in the old days. I think that because we are living in judgement hour he has withdrawn his explicit presence from this world and only works invisibly through the holy spirit into the heart. I have no other explanation. However once i was at church, some guy with cancer was miraculously healed so nothing is impossible. Have you already been baptised?since you have nothing to lose, if i were you i would go to church, get myself baptised and ask for people to pray together. I think that if you show the lord that you are doing things for him and seek his justice, maybe he ll heal deseases.

[Planey]

I appreciate all your answers, truly. Truthseeker, I don't wish to shock you, but I am already baptised, in fact I am 58 and the head elder at my church. I am just struggling at the moment to reconcile what is happening in my life with what I have heard should be happening. There is a vast gulf.

I am just now about to leave to go and visit my wife who is in hospital, about a 2 hour drive. She has had to have fluid drained from her lungs and is having further tests done today to ascertain the reason for the fluid being in the pleural cavity in the first place. She has had two different cases of breast cancer in the last six years so I am not hopeful. I have my own health problems and have come to largely doubt the "loving care" of God. It seems to me you get what you earn, and that things like cancer are a lottery, part of a cold, disinterested, implacable universe.

Please don't talk to me about miraculous healings, I have seen too many people die after annointings, or laying on of hands, or seasons of prayer to have any faith in such things. If God truly cares He has a funny way of showing it, but I'm nor laughing.

Graeme

[Guest truthseeker007]

Planey i feel really bad for you. If i were God I would have healed you. I know for sure that God is able to heal you and your wife. But if God would always heal his people, people could live an unhealthy lifestyle. I don t know about your lifestyle habits. Do you drink, smoke or eat meat? When you are following God s health principles and you are still becoming unhealthy i think it is God his loving duty to heal you. Don t give up. Ask for prayer meetings. Promise God you will do something good in return, use bible promises when you talk to God. Please don t give up on God, everything is possible for those that truly believe.

Again i feel very sorry for you and your wife, i wish every SDA to be healthy. If i had the gift of healing i would certainly heal both of you.

[Planey]

Thank you, truthseeker. I really do appreciate your thoughts. However I do not bargain with God. I don't believe anybody "earns" answers to prayer. I think that, like salvation itself, they are undeserved gifts. I do not believe that if I did a lifetime of good works I would deserve to be healed. It would be a gift from God.

As you see from this letter I have returned from the hospital. A test on the litre of fluid removed from the pleural cavity has confirmed that it is malignant. The big "C" has returned with a vengeance. While we don't deserve to be healed, what does anyone do to deserve cancer?

I really feel like walking out into the night here and shaking my fist against God. I no longer fear his retribution - what else could He do to us?

Graeme

[phkrause]

God's not doing this to you (read Job) Satan is, and trying very hard or not, to make you lash out at God. When it rains it rains on the good and the bad. Also read Mark 11:20-26.

pkrause

[Gail]

Quote:

I really feel like walking out into the night here and shaking my fist against God. I no longer fear his retribution - what else could He do to us?

Oh, Planey, you are so precious to us! You and your wife have suffered much in this world, and it pains me to know in your sorrow. I share in it as much as I can, being so distant.

I am one that frequently goes by intuition. Upon reading all of your posts in this thread, my first impression was this- to just surrender it all to Jesus. Give it up to Him. Death does not faze Him, if that is what this means, for He has the keys of hell and death. It is only He that can vanquish it.

And if there is healing, for He is also the Great Healer, then that will be even better! But death is not the worst thing that can happen to a person.

But it is certainly true that God is not the author of the sorrow we suffer in this world. We are all under attack. Thank God that the battle is won, even though we don't yet see the fulfilment of the promises, like those faithful ones mentioned in Hebrews 11.

May you have rest in your pain...

[Woody]

God doesn't mind if you lash out at Him. He is big enough. Go for it. I've done the same. It is healthy and a normal process. Don't feel condemned by doing so. Wrestle with Him. Cry to Him. Shake your fist at Him. Plead with Him for understanding. Then be sure to close it with ... I love you anyway God ... I just want to understand.

[Gail]

In keeping with the topic, I would like to share something that happened to me a few days ago.

I was pondering Psalm 41:3 (KJV) where it says that God would look after those languishing on their sickbed, and strengthen them. But as I considered the context, the Psalmist is saying that it is those who considers the poor who are the recipients of the blessing.

I was thinking to myself, this is a great promise but how can I claim it? I have not done anything specific for anyone poor lately. I thought about this, wondering if I needed an attitude change, or if I just needed to not be so lazy (because truthfully, I have been!)

Well, the answer soon appeared... The next day I received a message from a friend requesting some groceries. I believe she is on a pension and I would regard anyone who is not working as "poor"- certainly worthy! The request came right out of the blue, totally unexpected, and it was an honour to comply.

Now what do I think of the promises I had just finished contemplating? Well, truthfully the feeling is that the needs will be brought to my attention and not to worry, but to take them as they come. Jesus said that we will have the needs of others that we can help with always. I pray that as they are that I will not harden my heart to cries of help.

So, it does happen- God will and does answer prayer in ways that we can see. I hope that you will soon receive some assurance, Graeme, but I can't say what the Lord will do.

Hugs to you and your wife!

[Planey]

Thank you Gail and Redwood. I have had a night's sleep since my last post and I am now preparing my dialysis machine for a run. When that's over I will head down to Newcastle Hospital to see Jeanette again.

Today is Sabbath and I will try to talk with God, not that I expect any answers. My communications with Him, such as they are, are universally one-sided. It would be good (maybe) to be like Samuel and actually get some direct answers. Although when you think about it, cancer and renal failure are pretty direct.

Things are still fairly raw inside me at the moment. They say time heals all things but at this instant that is not a big comfort.

Graeme

[Woody]

Just take all the time you need to get your answers or your anger out at God. I would not rush the process. Do what you need to do. God understands. He is crying along with you. I really believe He is. And we will cry along with you also. You are in our prayers not that it will do any good ... but I hope you do not feel alone. And it does us good to be concerned for you. We have our sorrows and it is good for us to be focused on your concerns rather than ours.

[LifeHiscost]

Then be sure to close it with ... I love you anyway God ... I just want to understand.

I'm satisfied to believe, the greater the pain we experience here while maintaining our trust that God is love, sovereign, and never allows something to enter our lives except that which is needed for our best eternal interests, the more apt we are to play an important role in glorifying God and sharing with Him His reign throughout eternity.

The closer I get to death, the more precious the promises of the twenty third Psalm become,

"The LORD is my shepherd; I shall not want.

He maketh me to lie down in green pastures: he leadeth me beside the still waters.

He restoreth my soul: he leadeth me in the paths of righteousness for his name's sake.

Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil: for thou art with me; thy rod and thy staff they comfort me.

Thou preparest a table before me in the presence of mine enemies: thou anointest my head with oil; my cup runneth over.

Surely goodness and mercy shall follow me all the days of my life: and I will dwell in the house of the LORD for ever."

Psalms 23 KJV

Regards!

[LifeHiscost]

They say time heals all things but at this instant that is not a big comfort.

Graeme

From what I've seen of time.(almost 3/4s of a century, the longer it continues the worse things seem to get. Thank God for His promises.

" And sware by him that liveth for ever and ever, who created heaven, and the things that therein are, and the earth, and the things that therein are, and the sea, and the things which are therein, that there should be time no longer:" Rev 10:6 KJV

Regards!

[LifeHiscost]

Also I would add a concern of Phillip Yancey's who wrote ...

Quote:

"Increasing, I fear, the church is viewed as an enemy of sinners" p. 259 The Jesus I Never Knew

Speaking of who collaborated in writing a book/s with Dr. Paul Brand, entitled "In His Image", of which I can truthfully say I've never read any book, save the Bible itself, that has more compellingly revealed our Father's connection to His body on this earth. Another book by the same author is, "The Gift of Pain" which I'm anticipating reading, with bated breath.

I strongly encourage anyone, who will not dismiss it for its' erroneous theology, to share in the insights these books offer, under any circumstances in which you might find yourself.

Regards!

[Gail]

And, our dear Planey, light might come to you in surprising ways.

I thank God that you are able to sleep!

[Woody]

Quote:

And, our dear Planey, light might come to you in surprising ways.

Gail ... what a good thought. Let this be our prayer for Planey. That he may see some light and be blessed by it. Oh God ... may it be so.

[Nan]

I have just read all this - Graeme, you and Jeannette are in my prayers. I have not faced what you are facing, but in my own traumas, it has come to me that frequently we do not get the answers we seek, this side of heaven. At the end of all he went through, Job was only told that God is there.

I too have read the Yancy books mentioned, and they are good.

The other author I think of is Corrie ten Boom. In all she went through, losing family members to the Nazi regime, concentration camp, she somehow emerged with faith intact. She likened life to a piece of embroidery. Here we are looking at the wrong side, with its tangled threads and lack of pattern. There, we will see the finished design.

May God grant you both peace and rest this day and this night.

[puddles]

Planey I must agree with Gail. You are very precious to us here at CA and we care about you and your beloved Jeanette! Realize this, it may feel to you that your conversations with God are "one sided" but it just isn't so. God loves you Planey. Now I can't say why you've suffered in this world as you have but know, we love you and are praying for you.

Hang in there Planey! And don't sweat it that it doesn't seem like God's listening...just wait til you get to heaven and he shows you just how close he was when you "called" to him!

Be blessed! IN JESUS NAME!

{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{PLANEY}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}

[Woody]

Thinkin of you Planey .... And I would like to sing a special song for you ...

Why should I feel discouraged, why should the shadows come,

Why should my heart be lonely, and long for heav’n and home,

When Jesus is my portion? My constant Friend is He:

His eye is on the sparrow, and I know He watches me;

His eye is on the sparrow, and I know He watches me.

Refrain:

I sing because I’m happy, I sing because I’m free,

For His eye is on the sparrow, and I know He watches me.

“Let not your heart be troubled,” His tender word I hear,

And resting on His goodness, I lose my doubts and fears;

Though by the path He leadeth, but one step I may see;

His eye is on the sparrow, and I know He watches me;

His eye is on the sparrow, and I know He watches me.

Whenever I am tempted, whenever clouds arise,

When songs give place to sighing, when hope within me dies,

I draw the closer to Him, from care He sets me free;

His eye is on the sparrow, and I know He watches me;

His eye is on the sparrow, and I know He watches me.

[Planey]

Thank you so much all of you. It really means a lot to me.

I have had a long heart-to-heart with the Lord on Sabbath just gone (while dialysing - I had nothing else to do lol) and we have decided that I will leave everything to Him and accept whatever is His decision.

I am now concentrating on learning more about Him and His purposes - and His love.

Graeme

PS

Nan, I loved that idea of the two sides of the tapestry - it gave me much food for thought. Thank you!

[olger]

Good for you Graeme. Those who seek Christ in sorrow will find him with greater joy. (Jewr. 29:13; Psalm 16:11).