Help me answer this lady

[John317]

For consideration only:

I’ve always had a problem with treating the ‘scapegoat as a Proper Noun – as there is no capitalization in the Hebrew script.

Azazel-as-Proper – seems to be a thing inferred by expositors taking license. For it to have been inferred would have required an interpretive bias – to begin. I mean,

two goats were selected on the Day of Atonement – one to serve, by lot (read: chance) – as representing the Lord’s redemptive sacrifice. Selection by lot would mean that both goats would have had to have been without spot or blemish. That would have had the ‘scapegoat – representing other than either Satan or the angel Azazel. Without spot or blemish is not representative of either Satan or Azazel.

Simply because both goats must be perfect should not be interpreted to mean that both goats represent perfect beings. As you point out, either goat could be selected by lot to be the Lord's goat or Azazel. The difference did not lie in the condition of the goats. Everything related to the sanctuary service was supposed to be perfect on account of God's holiness.

It makes sense that since the Lord's goat represented a person, the other goat would also represent a person rather than an abstract idea, etc. The way it is expressed, in marked antithesis between "for Azazel" and "for YHWH" does not leave any doubt that both have reference to a personal being.

It is of interest to note that both early Jewish and Christian scholars understood Azezel to refer to a personal, evil being, or demon.

Also, J. B. Rotherham, translator of the Emphasized Bible, says, "It seems impossible to dissent from the opinion that Azezel... is the name or title of an evil Being, opposed to Yahweh."

[jasd]

Consider several important points:

>>1) Azazel was not slain as a sacrifice.<<

Absolutely not. The azazel was the means by which our sins were delivered to that Far Country.

>>Why is this important? Because it is SOLELY by the shedding of blood that we have remission, or forgiveness. Heb. 9: 22.<<

Agreed, in part. I would qualify SOLELY. Consider:

Lev 16:10 But the goat, on which the lot fell to be the scapegoat, shall be presented alive before the LORD, to make an atonement with him, [and] to let him go for a scapegoat into the wilderness.

>>Therefore the "scapegoat" is not, nor ever was, a means of bringing anyone forgiveness. That only comes through the shed blood of Jesus Christ.<<

Agreed, again, in part. Re Lev 16:10.

The Atonement ritual was, by nature, duo-fold.

>>2) The sanctuary was not cleansed at all by the death of Azazel. The sanctuary was cleansed on the Day of Atonement by the blood of the Lord's goat (representing Christ), and that occurred BEFORE Azazel was brought into the ceremony. (See Lev. 16: 20).<<

Agreed. However, note that the demise of the Lord’s goat occurred BEFORE... Why?

What then may have been the function of the azazel goat?

1 Pet 3:19 By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison;

>>I believe that Satan is simply shown at the end to be the one responsible for sin, and he is finally punished as the instigator of sin.<<

And you are proposing that a goat [typifying him] delivering the sins of the congregation into the wilderness accomplishes that?

>>ONLY Christ could be a substitutionary atonement for human beings, and ONLY He bears our sins-- completely, perfectly, and once for all-- in order that we might be saved.<<

Ahh, another kettle altogether...

[jasd]

>>It makes sense that since the Lord's goat represented a person,<<

The Person, Jesus Christ.

>>...the other goat would also represent a person rather than an abstract idea, etc.<<

Again, the Person, Jesus Christ together with the “abstract idea”...

The two goats would have served a duo-fold function: one sacrificial, one bearing the sins of the congregation. The duo-fold symbology could hardly have obtained were there only the one goat – and it already sacrificed. I mean,

how then, without the ‘scapegoat, could the aspect of Jesus Christ bearing the sins of the congregation to that Far Country – have been represented?

>>The way it is expressed, in marked antithesis between "for Azazel" and "for YHWH" does not leave any doubt that both have reference to a personal being.<<

That is why I proffered for consideration...

Quote:

Quote:jasd

I’ve always had a problem with treating the ‘scapegoat as a Proper Noun – as there is no capitalization in the Hebrew script.

Azazel-as-Proper – seems to be a thing inferred by expositors taking license. For it to have been inferred would have required an interpretive bias – to begin. I mean,

two goats were selected on the Day of Atonement – one to serve, by lot (read: chance) – as representing the Lord’s redemptive sacrifice. Selection by lot would mean that both goats would have had to have been without spot or blemish. ... Without spot or blemish is not representative of either Satan or Azazel.

>>It is of interest to note that both early Jewish and Christian scholars understood Azezel to refer to a personal, evil being, or demon.<<

Jewish ‘scholars’ believe Lilith was Adam’s first wife.

Strong’s #1593 –azazel

1) entire removal, scapegoat

a) refers to the goat used for sacrifice for the sins of the people

meaning dubious

>>Also, J. B. Rotherham, translator of the Emphasized Bible, says, "It seems impossible to dissent from the opinion that Azezel... is the name or title of an evil Being, opposed to Yahweh."<<

Per Azezel: The Book of Enoch concurs. Otherwise,

the three times azazel is mentioned in Writ contributes more to numinosity than to Rotherham, et al.

[John317]

Great to see your posts on this thread, JASD. Just wondering if you want to edit out all the repetition in your post #174926. It's up to you of course. I tried to send a PM about it but couldn't.

[jasd]

Thanks. Dinner call. :-o

[John317]

>>Why is this important? Because it is SOLELY by the shedding of blood that we have remission, or forgiveness. Heb. 9: 22.<<

Agreed, in part. I would qualify SOLELY. Consider:

Lev 16:10 But the goat, on which the lot fell to be the scapegoat, shall be presented alive before the LORD, to make an atonement with him, [and] to let him go for a scapegoat into the wilderness.

The main point I would make is that it is through the shedding of Christ's blood that we have remission, not through anything that happened to either of the goats. The goats are symbolic of the plan of salvation, but by themselves, apart from the shed blood of Jesus Christ, they are incapable of resulting in forgiveness.

Lev. 16: 20 says that the scapegoat only entered into the picture after the "end of reconciling" by the Lord's goat. The latter's blood has been shed and used to cleanse the sanctuary of the uncleanness of the people (vv. 15-17).

[jasd]

>>The goats are symbolic of the plan of salvation, but by themselves, apart from the shed blood of Jesus Christ, they are incapable of resulting in forgiveness.<<

Ahh, yes, the mnemonic cursors. But what do those goats really represent then – if Forgiveness, Atonement, and Redemption occurred during the first month of Nisan, at the cross – and the Day of Atonement occurs in the seventh month Tishri? If I recall correctly,

the feasts of Trumpet, Atonement, and Tabernacles occur in the seventh month.

What’s with that!? How is it that the ‘Atonement’ has begun in the heavenlies – without there first being a fulfillment of the Feast of Trumpets? and what was its fulfillment? And,

didn’t Jesus Christ completely fulfill the [L]aw at the cross?

[Fausto]

Heeehaaa, this thread is cooking!

I am so glad, I'll soon post something for her to read from here, but she indicated that the last stuff i sent her (all from here by the way) she is still busy "digesting".

[John317]

There will be a lot more coming, as I have time. We've so far just scratched the surface. I plan to reply to JASD before I add anything more.

[Fausto]

Scratch or not, so far she has quitened down, and I think she has been given enough material to study and absorb!

[Fausto]

Now, I have a question, what happens to the veil divinding the two compartments in heaven? Is it there, or not? To me I think it is because the earthly one was a copy of the original heavenly one! Am I off track?

[John317]

>>The goats are symbolic of the plan of salvation, but by themselves, apart from the shed blood of Jesus Christ, they are incapable of resulting in forgiveness.<<

Ahh, yes, the mnemonic cursors. But what do those goats really represent then – if Forgiveness, Atonement, and Redemption occurred during the first month of Nisan, at the cross – and the Day of Atonement occurs in the seventh month Tishri?

The "Lord's goat" represented Christ and His work, and Azazel represented Satan.

I realize that the more prevalent view today is that both goats represented different aspects of the work of Christ. We can go on to discuss in more detail on a later post the pros and cons of these various understandings.

The forgiveness of God for humanity was always granted provisionally on the basis of Christ's shed blood. God sent His Son-- and His Son volunteered-- to die, because of God's love and mercy, but if Christ had not died for us, there never would have been forgiveness. God could not forgive sin without upholding His law. Therefore, it is accurate to say that forgiveness occurred when Christ died.

Quote:

If I recall correctly,

the feasts of Trumpet, Atonement, and Tabernacles occur in the seventh month.

Feast of Trumpets-- first day of the seventh month-- Tishri

Day of Atonement-- tenth day of the seventh month

Feast of Tabernacles, or Booths-- from the 15th to the 21st day of the seventh month, with a solemn assembly on the 22nd.

Quote:

What’s with that!?

These all represented various aspects in the history of the Jews as well as pointed to the future work of God in behalf of the salvation of all mankind.

Quote:

How is it that the ‘Atonement’ has begun in the heavenlies – without there first being a fulfillment of the Feast of Trumpets? and what was its fulfillment?

The feast of the trumpets put the people on notice to prepare for Yom Kippur, the Day of Atonement. In the type, it occurred on the first day of Tishri, 10 days before the Day of Atonement. About 10 years before 1844, the message went out to the world that the time of God judgment was about to happen. The call to prepare for judgment continues to be given even today. I believe we are living in the antitypical day of Atonement right now, a time for afflicting our souls in humility, repentance, and faith.

Quote:

And,

didn’t Jesus Christ completely fulfill the [L]aw at the cross?

Yes, Christ's death on the cross certainly fulfilled all the sacrifices. Christ also perfectly obeyed God's moral law. There will never need to be any more shedding of blood. That was done once and for all, never to be repeated. The Father totally accepted Christ's sacrifice. Jesus Christ fulfilled the whole law in the sense that it all pointed forwarded to His life and work, including His work that is going on now in our behalf in the heavenly sanctuary.

[Robert]

Now, I have a question, what happens to the veil divinding the two compartments in heaven? Is it there, or not? To me I think it is because the earthly one was a copy of the original heavenly one! Am I off track?

Hebrews 10:19 Therefore, brothers, since we have confidence to enter the Most Holy Place by the blood of Jesus [His life, which is our old life laid down in death], 20 by a new and living way opened for us through the curtain , that is, his flesh,....

There's no veil in heaven. Even in the earthly one it was ripped from top to bottom. Jesus is the veil. "In Christ" we stand in front of God by faith. We can go directly before God in Christ. He is the door, the veil. Jesus presents us in Himself, perfect and without blemish.

We get caught up way too much in the symbology of the sanctuary.....Christ is the living reality!!!

[Fausto]

Thanks Robert, there's nothing like the Holy Writ to educate one on doubts, specially in this case where it is explicitly written in Heb 10:20.

Further on, I have more questions, I am actually trying to develop an explicit document where the whole sanctuary service with all its symbolic meanings and the actual sequence is plainly written out so as to get one to understand it perfectly.

Right, so far I understand the sacrifices as this:

Each father/Husband will bring a spotless 3 year old lamb, or one of the substitutes as in:

"Lev 5:7 And if he be not able to bring a lamb, then he shall bring for his trespass, which he hath committed, two turtledoves, or two young pigeons, unto the LORD; one for a sin offering, and the other for a burnt offering." and "Lev 5:11 But if he be not able to bring two turtledoves, or two young pigeons, then he that sinned shall bring for his offering the tenth part of an ephah of fine flour for a sin offering; he shall put no oil upon it, neither shall he put any frankincense thereon: for it is a sin offering.

[Robert]

A lot of blood lot of blood flowed, huh? As to questions on the sanctuary I'll let someone else answer....

[Fausto]

A lot of blood flowed, huh?

You bet! Just how much? I wonder? All day?

Man...that's just short of an abatoir! To obtain mercy! Thank God for the ultimate sacrifice!

[John317]

Important truths concerning the atonement are taught by the typical service. A substitute was accepted in the sinner's stead; but the sin was not canceled by the blood of the victim. A means was thus provided by which it was transferred to the sanctuary. By the offering of blood the sinner acknowledged the authority of the law, confessed his guilt in transgression, and expressed his desire for pardon through faith in a Redeemer to come; but he was not yet entirely released from the condemnation of the law. On the Day of Atonement the high priest, having taken an offering from the congregation, went into the most holy place with the blood of this offering, and sprinkled it upon the mercy seat, directly over the law, to make satisfaction for its claims. Then, in his character of mediator, he took the sins upon himself and bore them from the sanctuary. Placing his hands upon the head of the scapegoat, he confessed over him all these sins, thus in figure transferring them from himself to the goat. The goat then bore them away, and they were regarded as forever separated from the people.

Such was the service performed "unto the example and shadow of heavenly things." And what was done in type in the ministration of the earthly sanctuary is done in reality in the ministration of the heavenly sanctuary. After His ascension our Saviour began His work as our high priest. Says Paul: "Christ is not entered into the holy places made with hands, which are the figures of the true; but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us." Hebrews 9:24.

The ministration of the priest throughout the year in the first apartment of the sanctuary, "within the veil" which formed the door and separated the holy place from the outer court, represents the work of ministration upon which Christ entered at His ascension. It was the work of the priest in the daily ministration to present before God the blood of the sin offering, also the incense which ascended with the prayers of Israel. So did Christ plead His blood before the Father in behalf of sinners, and present before Him also, with the precious fragrance of His own righteousness, the prayers of penitent believers. Such was the work of ministration in the first apartment of the sanctuary in heaven.

Thither the faith of Christ's disciples followed Him as He ascended from their sight. Here their hopes centered, "which hope we have," said Paul, "as an anchor of the soul, both sure and steadfast, and which entereth into that within the veil; whither the forerunner is for us entered, even Jesus, made an high priest forever." "Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by His own blood He entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us." Hebrews 6:19, 20; 9:12.

For eighteen centuries this work of ministration continued in the first apartment of the sanctuary. The blood of Christ, pleaded in behalf of penitent believers, secured their pardon and acceptance with the Father, yet their sins still remained upon the books of record. As in the typical service there was a work of atonement at the close of the year, so before Christ's work for the redemption of men is completed there is a work of atonement for the removal of sin from the sanctuary. This is the service which began when the 2300 days ended. At that time, as foretold by Daniel the prophet, our High Priest entered the most holy, to perform the last division of His solemn work--to cleanse the sanctuary.

As anciently the sins of the people were by faith placed upon the sin offering and through its blood transferred, in figure, to the earthly sanctuary, so in the new covenant the sins of the repentant are by faith placed upon Christ and transferred, in fact, to the heavenly sanctuary. And as the typical cleansing of the earthly was accomplished by the removal of the sins by which it had been polluted, so the actual cleansing of the heavenly is to be accomplished by the removal, or blotting out, of the sins which are there recorded. But before this can be accomplished, there must be an examination of the books of record to determine who, through repentance of sin and faith in Christ, are entitled to the benefits of His atonement. The cleansing of the sanctuary therefore involves a work of investigation--a work of judgment. This work must be performed prior to the coming of Christ to redeem His people; for when He comes, His reward is with Him to give to every man according to his works. Revelation 22:12.

Thus those who followed in the light of the prophetic word saw that, instead of coming to the earth at the termination of the 2300 days in 1844, Christ then entered the most holy place of the heavenly sanctuary to perform the closing work of atonement preparatory to His coming.

It was seen, also, that while the sin offering pointed to Christ as a sacrifice, and the high priest represented Christ as a mediator, the scapegoat typified Satan, the author of sin, upon whom the sins of the truly penitent will finally be placed. When the high priest, by virtue of the blood of the sin offering, removed the sins from the sanctuary, he placed them upon the scapegoat. When Christ, by virtue of His own blood, removes the sins of His people from the heavenly sanctuary at the close of His ministration, He will place them upon Satan, who, in the execution of the judgment, must bear the final penalty. The scapegoat was sent away into a land not inhabited, never to come again into the congregation of Israel. So will Satan be forever banished from the presence of God and His people, and he will be blotted from existence in the final destruction of sin and sinners.

The Great Controversy, pp. 420-422.

[John317]

...

Just thought of something else, surely there are still two compartments right?

The Bible plainly teaches that there are two compartments in the heavenly sanctuary, as does also Ellen White.

In Heb. 8: 2, speaking of the heavenly sanctuary, the author tells us that Jesus ministers in "the sanctuary, the true tabernacle set up by the Lord." It is important to note that the Greek word for "sanctuary" here is in the plural form, that is, "holies," meaning "holy places." It consists of two separate divisions, or rooms. Significantly, a few verses later, in verse 5, we are told that the earthly sanctuary is a "copy and shadow of what is in heaven."

Hebrews 9: 23, 24 also call the heavenly sanctuary "the heavenly things" and "holy places," respectively. These references clearly imply the existence of more than a single apartment in the heavenly sanctuary.

106 times the Greek translation of the Old Testament uses the same Greek word, ta hagia, which is plural, to refer to the entire sanctuary.

This is in complete harmony with Hebrews 8: 5 and Exodus 25: 40, that the heavenly sanctuary was the pattern for the one which Moses built.

Please study the following:

It is those who by faith follow Jesus in the great work of the atonement who receive the benefits of His mediation in their behalf, while those who reject the light which brings to view this work of ministration are not benefited thereby. The Jews who rejected the light given at Christ's first advent, and refused to believe on Him as the Saviour of the world, could not receive pardon through Him. When Jesus at His ascension entered by His own blood into the heavenly sanctuary to shed upon His disciples the blessings of His mediation, the Jews were left in total darkness to continue their useless sacrifices and offerings. The ministration of types and shadows had ceased. That door by which men had formerly found access to God was no longer open. The Jews had refused to seek Him in the only way whereby He could then be found, through the ministration in the sanctuary in heaven. Therefore they found no communion with God. To them the door was shut. They had no knowledge of Christ as the true sacrifice and the only mediator before God; hence they could not receive the benefits of His mediation.

The condition of the unbelieving Jews illustrates the condition of the careless and unbelieving among professed Christians, who are willingly ignorant of the work of our merciful High Priest. In the typical service, when the high priest entered the most holy place, all Israel were required to gather about the sanctuary and in the most solemn manner humble their souls before God, that they might receive the pardon of their sins and not be cut off from the congregation. How much more essential in this antitypical Day of Atonement that we understand the work of our High Priest and know what duties are required of us.

Men cannot with impunity reject the warning which God in mercy sends them. A message was sent from heaven to the world in Noah's day, and their salvation depended upon the manner in which they treated that message. Because they rejected the warning, the Spirit of God was withdrawn from the sinful race, and they perished in the waters of the Flood. In the time of Abraham, mercy ceased to plead with the guilty inhabitants of Sodom, and all but Lot with his wife and two daughters were consumed by the fire sent down from heaven. So in the days of Christ. The Son of God declared to the unbelieving Jews of that generation: "Your house is left unto you desolate." Matthew 23:38. Looking down to the last days, the same Infinite Power declares, concerning those who "received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved": "For this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: that they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness." 2 Thessalonians 2:10-12. As they reject the teachings of His word, God withdraws His Spirit and leaves them to the deceptions which they love.

But Christ still intercedes in man's behalf, and light will be given to those who seek it. Though this was not at first understood by Adventists, it was afterward made plain as the Scriptures which define their true position began to open before them.

The passing of the time in 1844 was followed by a period of great trial to those who still held the advent faith. Their only relief, so far as ascertaining their true position was concerned, was the light which directed their minds to the sanctuary above. Some renounced their faith in their former reckoning of the prophetic periods and ascribed to human or satanic agencies the powerful influence of the Holy Spirit which had attended the advent movement. Another class firmly held that the Lord had led them in their past experience; and as they waited and watched and prayed to know the will of God they saw that their great High Priest had entered upon another work of ministration, and, following Him by faith, they were led to see also the closing work of the church. They had a clearer understanding of the first and second angels' messages, and were prepared to receive and give to the world the solemn warning of the third angel of Revelation 14.

The Great Controversy, pp. 430-432.

[Robert]

John, you make salvation hard! All this sanctuary stuff...slavation by knowledge is what you are teaching. It's a subtle form of legalism.

[Robert]

Originally Posted By: Fausto

...

Just thought of something else, surely there are still two compartments right?

The Bible plainly teaches that there are two compartments in the heavenly sanctuary, as does also Ellen White.

The Sanctuary was where God met sinners [read Ex. 25:22; 29:42, 43].

Today He meets us in Christ [read 2 Cor. 5:19].

The Sanctuary was where God revealed Himself to sinners [read Ex. 29:46].

Today He reveals Himself to us in Christ [read John 14:7-9].

The Sanctuary was where God dwelt with sinners [read Ex. 25:8; 29:45, 46].

Today He dwells with us in Christ [read Matthew 1:23; John 14:23].

The Sanctuary was where God spoke to sinners [read Ex. 29:42; Lev. 1:1].

Today He speaks to us in Christ [read Hebrews 1:2; John 8:43, 47].

The Sanctuary was where God accepted sinners [read Lev. 1:4].

Today He accepts us in Christ [read Ephesians 1:6].

The Sanctuary was where God forgave sinners [read Lev. 4:20, 26, 31, 35].

Today He forgives us in Christ [read Ephesians 1:7].

Too often our emphasis on the sanctuary message is our own subjective experience, whereas its main purpose is to point to the truth as it is in Christ.

[Jack Sequeria}

[Woody]

John, you make salvation hard! All this sanctuary stuff...slavation by knowledge is what you are teaching. It's a subtle form of legalism.

Knowledge will not save anyone. When we get to heaven we will receive all the knowledge we need.

[Fausto]

John, you make salvation hard! All this sanctuary stuff...slavation by knowledge is what you are teaching. It's a subtle form of legalism.

Not so my friend, understanding the sanctuary is of crucial importance to understand the final work of Christ before His second coming, without it, one's left without very important knowledge. :smilewink:

Salvation does not change from what you know! It is still by acceptance and belief in the begotten Son of God and by faith and grace, the knowledge part completes and helps us grow spiritually in the understanding of doctrine!

[John317]

Originally Posted By: Robert

John, you make salvation hard! All this sanctuary stuff...slavation by knowledge is what you are teaching. It's a subtle form of legalism.

Knowledge will not save anyone. When we get to heaven we will receive all the knowledge we need.

Yes, true knowledge of Jesus Christ and of salvation will save many. On the other hand, false beliefs will lead many people to be lost. It does matter what we believe. God gave us the illustration of the earthly sanctuary for a reason. It teaches us important lessons about the heavenly sanctuary and Christ's ministry there on behalf of those who put their faith in Him. That is the central theme of the book of Hebrews.

As Ellen White has said, "Important truths concerning the atonement are taught by the typical service." Again, "It is those who by faith follow Jesus in the great work of the atonement who receive the benefits of His mediation in their behalf, while those who reject the light which brings to view this work of ministration are not benefited thereby....The condition of the unbelieving Jews illustrates the condition of the careless and unbelieving among professed Christians, who are willingly ignorant of the work of our merciful High Priest... How much more essential in this antitypical Day of Atonement that we understand the work of our High Priest and know what duties are required of us."

What important truths? What benefits? What work of our High Priest? What duties is it essential for us to understand?

"And this is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent" (John 17:3).

Knowledge of God and of Christ is important. In fact, according to 1 John 5, it is indeed everything.

"And know that you have learned from your childhood the holy scriptures which are able to make you wise to salvation through faith in Jesus Christ. All scripture [including Leviticus, Numbers, Deuteronomy, and Hebrews] written by the inspiration of the Holy Spirit is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, and for instruction in righteousness; so that God's people may become complete, thoroughly perfected for every good work." 2 Tim. 3: 15-17.

[John317]

The Sanctuary was where God met sinners [read Ex. 25:22; 29:42, 43].

Today He meets us in Christ [read 2 Cor. 5:19].

The Sanctuary was where God revealed Himself to sinners [read Ex. 29:46].

Today He reveals Himself to us in Christ [read John 14:7-9].

The Sanctuary was where God dwelt with sinners [read Ex. 25:8; 29:45, 46].

Today He dwells with us in Christ [read Matthew 1:23; John 14:23].

The Sanctuary was where God spoke to sinners [read Ex. 29:42; Lev. 1:1].

Today He speaks to us in Christ [read Hebrews 1:2; John 8:43, 47].

The Sanctuary was where God accepted sinners [read Lev. 1:4].

Today He accepts us in Christ [read Ephesians 1:6].

The Sanctuary was where God forgave sinners [read Lev. 4:20, 26, 31, 35].

Today He forgives us in Christ [read Ephesians 1:7].

[Jack Sequeria}

All of the above is quite true, but there is no contradiction between those things and the truth that we learn about Christ's High Priestly ministry today by studying the heavenly sanctuary. In fact, the things Jack Sequeira mentions are complemented and illuminated by a close study of what Christ is doing between his ascension and the Second Coming.

[John317]

Is there Bible evidence or reason to believe that Jesus went from the Holy to the Most Holy Place in 1844 as SDAs claim?

Check this out:

Notice that in Daniel 7: 9-28, the throne of God has wheels. Of course there is only one reason for wheels, and that is for movement. God's throne is in the heavenly sanctuary and if it moves prior to the judgment referred to in Daniel 7: 9, 10, it's obvious that the throne moves somewhere within the sanctuary and not outside of it.

Notice also that Rev. 11: 19 speaks of the inner sanctuary being opened and people's attention being drawn to the ark of God's covenant. The context has to do with judgment, as shown in verse 18, and by comparison of these verses and those in Daniel 7 and Rev. 14: 7, where the message goes out to the world, "The hour of His judgment is come."

You will observe in Dan 7: 9-12 that the Father has moved his throne and is waiting for the judgment to begin. What is He waiting for? Verse 13 then says that "One like the Son of Man" comes to the Father. Verse 26 also refers to "the court." This is obviously describing the time when Jesus comes to the Father prior to the commencement of the judgment before the Second Coming.

This all proves that in the context of the court or trial, the throne of God moves. Where does it move? It only makes sense that it moves within the heavenly sanctuary. Where would that be? Based on Rev. 11: 19, it would be from the holy place to the Most Holy where all eyes are focused just before the coming of Christ.

Remember that the seven last plagues come from God out of the temple in heaven. Rev. 15: 8; 16: 1, 17. God's sanctuary in heaven is the center of all of God's activity at this time. Therefore we may be sure that when the throne of God is moved on its wheels, it is moving within the sanctuary, not outside of it. And I would submit that the most sensible place for it to move is from the holy to the Most Holy where the ark of God is located.