2nd Pres. Debate

[Dr. Shane]

Well,,, I must admit McCain did better this time than last time. I think I am willing to say this one was a draw. - - - Last time I thought Obama won.

Obama was on the defensive a lot which is something a candidate normally wants to avoid. But... I doubt that will hurt him in the polls.

While I think McCain held his own, I don't think he did what he needed to do. I will be very surprised if the polls change much as a result of this debate.

[Dr. Shane]

Real Clear Politics has Obama with a 5.5 lead as of today. That is a gauge to measure the polls that will come out this coming week.

[carolaa]

McCain did better than I expected in both debates. And yet, in both debates, the word "feeble" kept coming to mind.

[Dr. Shane]

McCain is old and he comes across that way. I don't think there is any getting away from that.

Obama did make it clear last night that he would fine parents that didn't carry health insurance for their children. That means me. So I wonder how big this fine is going to be. I could buy insurance through my job but that would cost about $600/month. as it is, we have a doctor in Mexico and I don't spend nearly that much including medications, e-rays, lab tests, etc. I didn't hear him talk about universal health care at all, which has been one of the big reasons I have been leaning toward voting for him. He talked about making federal health care insurance available for those without insurance. Well, for me they would probbally tell me I don't qualify because it is available through my employer. Never mind that it is $600/month with a huge deductible and co-pays.

[Woody]

McCain did better than I expected in both debates. And yet, in both debates, the word "feeble" kept coming to mind.

Why do you think he appears 'feeble'?

Some of it is because of his war wounds. Cognitively ... I think he was on par with Obama though or better. Obama kept stalling his thoughts with AAAAAND and Uhhhhhh. On contrast ... McPalin was quick with his answers without the pauses.

Also I would point out that Obama frequently would not answer the questions. For example ... the very last question of the night .... The question was 'What DON'T you know? Obama did his hmmm and uhhhh s and then said "What I DO know ...." And NEVER once said 'What I don't know'.

On contrast McPalin said immediately "What I don't know is ...." And then a few sentences later he added another "What I don't know is ...." . He gave several examples where Obama side stepped the question and NEVER gave an answer.

This just shows me he is not as direct as McPalin or is not as quick thinking perhaps? Does he just routinely avoid answering questions? I just don't know. But I found that he was just frequently not straight with the questions asked.

This was just my observation. Perhaps your's was different.

[Tom Wetmore]

...Obama did make it clear last night that he would fine parents that didn't carry health insurance for their children...

That is false. Do your fact check. Actually read Obama's plan. And it was McCain that made that false accussation last night. It is large employers will be penalized for not providing healthcare for their employees. Small employers will be exempt.

BUT under McCain's plan he would penalize us by making employer provided healthcare taxable.

[Taylor]

I watched the debate and was surprised how well McCain did. I wasn't expecting that. On the other hand, both acted quite presidential and professional. I just think that no matter who wins the presidency that we are in a world of hurt financially in the USA right now.

[carolaa]

Originally Posted By: carolaa

McCain did better than I expected in both debates. And yet, in both debates, the word "feeble" kept coming to mind.

Why do you think he appears 'feeble'?

Some of it is because of his war wounds. Cognitively ... I think he was on par with Obama though or better. Obama kept stalling his thoughts with AAAAAND and Uhhhhhh. On contrast ... McPalin was quick with his answers without the pauses.

Also I would point out that Obama frequently would not answer the questions. For example ... the very last question of the night .... The question was 'What DON'T you know? Obama did his hmmm and uhhhh s and then said "What I DO know ...." And NEVER once said 'What I don't know'.

On contrast McPalin said immediately "What I don't know is ...." And then a few sentences later he added another "What I don't know is ...." . He gave several examples where Obama side stepped the question and NEVER gave an answer.

This just shows me he is not as direct as McPalin or is not as quick thinking perhaps? Does he just routinely avoid answering questions? I just don't know. But I found that he was just frequently not straight with the questions asked.

This was just my observation. Perhaps your's was different.

Pretty much what Sarah Palin was doing on a much greater scale at her debate.

[carolaa]

McCain is old and he comes across that way. I don't think there is any getting away from that.

Obama did make it clear last night that he would fine parents that didn't carry health insurance for their children. That means me. So I wonder how big this fine is going to be. I could buy insurance through my job but that would cost about $600/month. as it is, we have a doctor in Mexico and I don't spend nearly that much including medications, e-rays, lab tests, etc. I didn't hear him talk about universal health care at all, which has been one of the big reasons I have been leaning toward voting for him. He talked about making federal health care insurance available for those without insurance. Well, for me they would probbally tell me I don't qualify because it is available through my employer. Never mind that it is $600/month with a huge deductible and co-pays.

If universal health care is a huge deal to you, maybe you should consider a 3rd party candidate.

[carolaa]

McCain is old and he comes across that way. I don't think there is any getting away from that.

Obama did make it clear last night that he would fine parents that didn't carry health insurance for their children. That means me. So I wonder how big this fine is going to be. I could buy insurance through my job but that would cost about $600/month. as it is, we have a doctor in Mexico and I don't spend nearly that much including medications, e-rays, lab tests, etc. I didn't hear him talk about universal health care at all, which has been one of the big reasons I have been leaning toward voting for him. He talked about making federal health care insurance available for those without insurance. Well, for me they would probbally tell me I don't qualify because it is available through my employer. Never mind that it is $600/month with a huge deductible and co-pays.

You may not spend $600 a month on medical. Few people do. But the premium is that high because it will cover catastrophic care - and that will cost way more than $600. That's the sad fact of it. Your family may never need catastrophic care, but all it takes is one car accident or one appendectomy, etc. (not to mention cancer, God forbid), and it could bankrupt you, and you'd wish you'd been paying the $600 a month.

My boss pays about $1200 a month for his medical premiums. It's awful, and I don't know how people can do that. We have good insurance, and we still go to the doctor rarely because it's so expensive. I don't know what the best answer is, but what we are doing in this country is not working.

[Woody]

Quote:

Pretty much what Sarah Palin was doing on a much greater scale at her debate.

Yeah. But I think it is a little more serious at the top of the ticket.

[Dr. Shane]

Originally Posted By: Shane

...Obama did make it clear last night that he would fine parents that didn't carry health insurance for their children...

That is false. Do your fact check.

McCain first accused him of having a plan to fine parents for not having insurance on their children. Obama than responded by justifying that position because insurance for children is so cheap. As a parent of uninsured children I was paying attention. Simply put, Obama plans on fining me if he becomes President. I hope that is a promise he will break.

[Dr. Shane]

You may not spend $600 a month on medical. Few people do. But the premium is that high because it will cover catastrophic care - and that will cost way more than $600.

I think I can get a major medical policy with a $10,000 deductible for about $150/month for the entire family. (Which I need to do).

[Woody]

Originally Posted By: Tom Wetmore

That is false. Do your fact check.

McCain first accused him of having a plan to fine parents for not having insurance on their children. Obama than responded by justifying that position because insurance for children is so cheap. As a parent of uninsured children I was paying attention. Simply put' date=' Obama plans on fining me if he becomes President. I hope that is a promise he will break. [/quote']

For sure ... I would not want to vote for Obama if he planned to fine ME !!! I will join you in praying that McPalin wins and not Obama.

[Neil D]

Not too long ago, our ER physcian treated an 8 year old for a broken arm. He apparently jumped up onto a quad ATV and took off on it. When he did, he got up on to the sand dunes and rolled it and broke his arm in the process.

When questioning the mother, the dr asked about how the boy got the ATV, and mom gave the answer about how the boy, when his mother's back was turned, jumped onto the ATV and took off. The Dr. asked her about the key to the ATV, and she said that they were in the ATV.

The Dr. said that the boy would have to go to a major university hospital as the fracture required skills that were not available in most hospitals. [His break occured in an area of the arm and hand in which were growth plates].

Her reply was that she didn't have insurance for that. The Dr had had enough of her excuses and asked how she was able to get the ATV. She said that her husband got a good deal for TWO ATVs and couldn't pass them up. Said the Dr., " You bought these ATVS for over $4000 each and you could'nt get insurance???"

Where is one's pryorities?

[Woody]

That is fine and dandy. I hate to 'pry' into this further ... but Neil ... were you addressing this to Shane or me? I sure hope you weren't inferring that Shane would buy ATVs but not be willing to pay Obama's fines on him.

[Dr. Shane]

If I didn't live along the border we would certainly have health insurance. However since I live here, Mexican health care is affordable. Even cancer treatments and major surgeries are not beyond what I could afford to pay. I have insurance for myself because my company provides it at no cost to me. If I wanted to add family coverage it would be quite expensive.

[Neil D]

Scenerio:

One non-insured motorist crashes into the driver side of a car, driven by a father with a wife and 2 children.

Mother and motorist is killed in crash, Father and children severely injured.

Father has insurance and children fall under medicaid...to which the state will seek compensation back for money paid for his children....

...and you say that you wanted them shipped to Mexico for treatment?

[Dr. Shane]

I support universal health care. I do not support making parents buy health insurance for their children. Along the Mexican border Mexican hospitals and medical clinics boom with business from uninsured Americans. The fact is that in most cases I can go to the doctor in Mexico and buy my medicine for less than my co-pay here with my employer-provided medical insurance.

Medical insurance shouldn't even exist because it violate the principles of insurance. Insurance is something one buys and hope they never will need to use. I buy home-owners insurance and hope I will never have to make a claim. I buy auto insurance and hope I will never have to make a claim. I buy term-life insurance and hope I live past 65. I purchase builders' risk and liability insurance and hope to never make a claim. I buy workman's compensation insurance and hope to never make a claim. However everyone that buys medical insurance does it specifically so they can make a claim.

The answer is for the government to run some kind of medical insurance program which is funded partly by a payroll deduction and partly by a corporate income tax. If the government is going to demand I carry health insurance for my children than they need to provide affordable health insurance for me to purchase for them.

[Bravus]

Heh, the Americans complain about the Mexicans coming across the border and using their medical services...

(gentle joke, not attack!)

[Neil D]

Heh, the Americans complain about the Mexicans coming across the border and using their medical services...

Yeah, I thought it rather unique as well...If only I spoke spanish as well as Shane...Shoot, if all of us spoke spanish as well as Shane, most of us on the Southern border would be there for our health care.

[carolaa]

Heh, the Americans complain about the Mexicans coming across the border and using their medical services...

(gentle joke, not attack!)

Yes, but I'm betting Shane actually pays for his family's medical care, unlike the Mexicans who cross illegally.

[carolaa]

Shane, I have a question for you. I read a while back that the medical establishment was strongly discouraging ordering prescription drugs from Canada or Mexico because the quality could not be guaranteed. Have you had any problems with that? Like placebos, or even mistakes?

The reason I'm asking is because my son's allergy meds recently went otc, and now I am paying 6 times the price (out of pocket) as I was when it was prescription. So I've been racking my brain to find some cheaper way to get them.

[carolaa]

I know --- I'm the worst at hijacking threads --- maybe it's ADD.

[Taylor]

Many of our meds come from third world countries even if they are purchased in the USA.