US gives up WMD hunt in Iraq

[bevin]

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=st...us_iraq_weapons

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Intelligence and congressional officials say they have not seen any information — never "a piece," said one — indicating that WMD or significant amounts of components and equipment were transferred from Iraq to neighboring Syria, Jordan or elsewhere.

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/Bevin

[bevin]

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=st...aboutpreemption

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"There is no doubt he is amassing them to use against our friends, against our allies and against us," Vice President Cheney said in August 2002. Six months later, Secretary of State Colin Powell (news - web sites) made the case, including satellite photos, to the United Nations (news - web sites). Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld scoffed that even "a trained ape" knew it was true.

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This week, The Washington Post reported that the U.S. has quietly ended its search for the weapons. Inspectors scoured Iraq and interviewed Iraqi scientists for months. They spent millions of dollars - the amount remains classified. The result was unchanged from the searchers' previous reports: They found nothing. No nuclear program. No stockpiles of biological or chemical weapons.

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Polls show that the administration's pre-war campaign was so effective that about 40% of Americans still believe Saddam had weapons of mass destruction when the U.S. invaded.

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Including, apparently, about 40% of contributors to this thread...

/Bevin

[Dr. Shane]

</font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />

No, no, no, no, no, no no,no, no,no,no....Not even close, Shane. Our main contribution to the Christian world is the balance between Law and Grace.

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A statement like that really makes one wonder what criteria some pastors use for baptising people. The Adventist's believe in the balance between law and grace didn't even come from us. It came from John Wesley who founded the Methodist church. Many of our original members were Methodists.

Adventism is all about creationism. We are vegetarians because that was the original diet given man at creation and we keep the seventh-day Sabbath because it is a memorial of creation.

Sometimes, Brother Neil, it seems you just want to disagree for the sake of disagreeing. You ought to know better. God's authority comes from the fact that He is our Creator. God has called forth the Advent movement to prepare the way for His second coming. We are to sound the Three Angels' Message which begins with a call to worship the Creator, then warns against false worship and finally warns against recieving the mark of the beast.

God's signature to His law is found in its center. It takes up 55 Hebrew words. There are 67 Hebrew words before it and 41 Hebrew words after it. The only reason for honoring the seventh-day of the week is that it marks the end of Creation which is the mark of God's authority. That is why the Sunday substitute is so objectionable. It is not just about changing a day. It is about not recognising the mark of God's authority - which is Creation. You cannot seperate Adventism from Creation.

And Brother Bevin doesn't believe in Creation.

[Neil D]

Shane,

This thread is for this forum. I suggest that you go to the "What Adventists believe" forum where you will find this subject taken up....I think you will find the appropriate thread there

[Dr. Shane]

It goes to credibility, Brother Neil. We are on an Adventist forum and when someone who isn't Adventist comes in with an extreame position it is legitimate to point out that the person doesn't believe as we do. You, Brother Neil, and I both believe in the Three Angels' Message and within that context we disagree politically - but we are of the same mindset religiously. Brother Bevin is outside of that mindset. Using him to support your arguement would be no different than using Jesse Jackson who is also a Christian but not Adventist.

[Neil D]

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It goes to credibility, Brother Neil. We are on an Adventist forum and when someone who isn't Adventist comes in with an extreame position it is legitimate to point out that the person doesn't believe as we do. You, Brother Neil, and I both believe in the Three Angels' Message and within that context we disagree politically - but we are of the same mindset religiously. Brother Bevin is outside of that mindset. Using him to support your arguement would be no different than using Jesse Jackson who is also a Christian but not Adventist.

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Let's see...When I question Bush's Christianity because of behavior that I see that is not Christian, and YOU tell me that I MUST accept him and believe him because he is a Christian, yet you won't accept Bevin when you can see where he comes from and from all the talks you have had with him, .....don't you think that you are ...uh,..doing the "John Kerry" and being a bit "wishy washy"?

The honest truth is that Bevin's observations match my own. And while I did NOT use him to support my arguements, you lamblast him because he is an 'outsider'....You forgit that there are others who may not hold to our beliefs, but who arrive at the same political conclusions.

[bevin]

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The only reason for honoring the seventh-day of the week is that it marks the end of Creation which is the mark of God's authority

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The Bible disagrees with you...

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Deu 5:12. Keep the sabbath day to hallow it, as Jehovah thy God hath commanded thee.

13. Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work;

14. but the seventh day is the sabbath of Jehovah thy God: thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, nor thy bondman, nor thy handmaid, nor thine ox, nor thine ass, nor any of thy cattle, nor thy sojourner that is within thy gates; that thy bondman and thy handmaid may rest as well as thou.

15. [:"red"] And thou shalt remember that thou wast a bondman in the land of Egypt, and that Jehovah thy God brought thee out thence with a powerful hand and with a stretched-out arm; therefore Jehovah thy God hath commanded thee to observe the sabbath day. [/]

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/Bevin

[Dr. Shane]

Ahhhhhhhhhh, Brother Neil, I don't question Brother Bevin's Christianity. I accept him and refer to him as a brother in Christ. However, just as his recent post shows here, he does not believe as Adventists.

The Sabbath in itself, as a day of rest, is to remind us of our salvation as per Deuteronomy however the fact that it is the seventh day is what Adventists focus on and that is due to Creation as per Exodus 20 and Genesis 2. One can disagree if they want however in so doing they seperate themselves from the basis of Adventism.

There are plenty of paranoid people on both the Left and Right that believe all kinds of goofy conspiracy theories. Brother Bevin has shown us that he buys into some of the wacky left ones. If you wish to buy into them too you are free to do so. I prefer not to ride on the Titanic.

[Neil D]

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Ahhhhhhhhhh, Brother Neil, I don't question Brother Bevin's Christianity. I accept him and refer to him as a brother in Christ. However, just as his recent post shows here, he does not believe as Adventists.

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[sigh] You implore me to accept the honesty of Bush as a Christian, but you will not accept Bevin's honesty....What does that make you, Shane? decieved at the very least....

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If you wish to buy into them too you are free to do so. I prefer not to ride on the Titanic.

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But for me to believe as you do, would make me dishonest....That I can not do...

[Dr. Shane]

I have never doubted Brother Bevin's honesty. I wonder sometimes if you are smoking pot, Brother Neil. I mean your comments are just off the wall. Are we in the same world?

And what do you mean, "if you believed as I do"? In context it seems you are refering to conspiracy theories. I don't believe conspiracy theories. Being a fan of the liberal media you may have not even heard all the conspiracy theories during Clinton's term in office. Wheww, some of them were really off the wall. Vince Foster didn't commit suicide rather Bill had him killed when he found out Vince was having an affair with Hiliary. The story goes that Vince Foster was Hiliary's lover that she brought with her from Arkanasaw. There are many more. They are just fanatical. Oh and Hiliary is a lesbian too. Have you heard that one?

[Neil D]

Ah, like many sinners, Shane, when confronted with the truth, you want to kill the messenger....

[Dr. Shane]

Sounds very judgmental, Brother Neil. I am not shooting any messenger. I am putting the conspiracy theories in prespective. Would you like a list of all the Clinton conspiracy theories? They are as crazy as the Bush conspiracy theories but I am not so filled with hatred to believe such foolishness.

[Neil D]

I am not doing anything that you have not done, Shane. Don't like it...Then stop doing it.

[Dr. Shane]

Now you sound like an 8 year old on the playground. Are you going to stick your tounge out at me too?

[Neil D]

You don't like it when we play like you do....

So stop doing it. <- There's your tongue for you.

[Dr. Shane]

I thought so. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />