Faith and the Brain

[D. Allan]

Quote:

DR. NEWBERG: We’ve learned that being religious or spiritual has a very profound effect on who we are, has a very profound effect on our biology and on our brain, and what we’ve found more recently is that not only does it have a profound influence on who we are, but it actually can change our brain and to change ourselves over time.

Faith and the Brain at PBS

[Neil D]

I have always said that if Christianity can not make you into a better person, go back to your pagan ways......

[D. Allan]

It's important to be open-minded about other peoples' beliefs that may be different than ours; otherwise, anger and hatred has an adverse effect on the brain.

Quote:

SEVERSON: But Newberg has made another discovery, a controversial one, that our belief system, how we view God, can make a huge difference in how it affects our well being. If we believe in a loving God it can have a positive effect, even prolong our lives. But believing in a judgmental, authoritarian God can produce fear, anger, and stress, and that’s not healthy.

Dr. NEWBERG: When it ultimately turns towards hatred, and whether it’s people who believe in abortion versus those who don’t, whether it’s just one religion versus another, when you hear rhetoric which is hateful, filled with anger, that turns on the different parts of the brain that are involved in our stress response and our anger response.

[Bravus]

I believe it works the other way too: religious feelings and sensations of God's presence arise in the brain, and since we all have different brains, different people experience these things in dramatically different ways.

[D. Allan]

And at different times in our lives we may have different experiences of these religious feelings and sensations. I think I used to have more faith than now. I sorta had an "Anne Rice" experience which damaged my faith somewhat.

[Neil D]

And at different times in our lives we may have different experiences of these religious feelings and sensations. I think I used to have more faith than now. I sorta had an "Anne Rice" experience which damaged my faith somewhat.

That is why know who God is and what He is about is also important...He can bridge that damaged faith and restore the broken/damaged relationship....

[D. Allan]

I belive that is true, Neil. It helps to have a church family, but I haven't gone since one of the conservative members from their pew began aruging with and shouting at the preacher during the sermon.

[Outta Here]

Neurotheology is a fascinating subject to me. I can't find the original article that I'd saved for years, but this sort of alludes to the whole idea of the God-spot in the brain, and how Ellen White may or may not have been affected:

[quote name="Neurotheology - With God In Mind"]More contemporary examples may be noted in two specific cases. Ellen White, founder of the ‘Seventh Day Adventist’ movement suffered a brain injury at the age of 9, in 1836, which completely altered her personality. Subsequent to the event, it is stated that White began to receive ‘powerful religious images’, akin to those of Paul on the road to Damascus. This inspired the formulation of the secular group. (BBC 2002).

[D. Allan]

hmmm. very interesting

[rudywoofs (Pam)]

Neurotheology is a fascinating subject to me. I can't find the original article that I'd saved for years, but this sort of alludes to the whole idea of the God-spot in the brain, and how Ellen White may or may not have been affected:

Originally Posted By: Neurotheology - With God In Mind

More contemporary examples may be noted in two specific cases. Ellen White, founder of the ‘Seventh Day Adventist’ movement suffered a brain injury at the age of 9, in 1836, which completely altered her personality. Subsequent to the event, it is stated that White began to receive ‘powerful religious images’, akin to those of Paul on the road to Damascus. This inspired the formulation of the secular group. (BBC 2002).

Quote:

“There is a clinical impression that some patients with right hemispheric temporal lobe lesions undergo an increased in religiousness, sometimes to the extent that the term ’Hyper religiosity’ is applicable”. This statement is upheld by Joseph (1997) who notes that development of epilepsy in the temporal lobe and limbic hyper-activation often cause the patient to obsess over religious characters, texts and ideals. Many patients claim to ‘meet’ God during seizures and subsequently begin to act in ‘religiously significant’ ways, for example obsessive preaching or evangelising. Ramachandran noted that temporal lobe epileptics tend to have “a heightened response to religious language, specifically religious terms and icons”, along with obsession over ‘religious matters’ (Newberg et al 2001, p32 & 185).

It would have been interesting to do a scan and see if EGW had temporal lobe damage.

[Keira Logan]

Hi Dr. Allan,

Thanks for your original post, which is fascinating and the subsequent quotations from Severson and Newberg. I look forward to reading the entire dialogue. I am sorry to hear of the incident with the person yelling at the pastor. I don't know why ultra-conservative people throw civility out the window before anything else. It can be difficult to find an adequate church family in certain communities. I am fascinated by the ideas you present here of the belief system affecting our well being. It seems to correspond with the ideas presented in Tony Perri's film "Serotonin Rising," about how charitable acts have an effect on levels of serotonin in the brain. This is true of the person giving, the person receiving and even affects a third party watching the interaction. <http://www.serotoninrising.com/home/index.aspx>

[D. Allan]

Hi Dr. Logan,

The "D." in my name is for "David". I'm not a Dr. although I think that would have been a wonderful life to have in an intellectual community.

The link was great and I liked hearing the comments of Depak Chopra and the Dali Lama and others. Thank you!

[Tom Wetmore]

Quote:

Dr. NEWBERG: You know, if we get a brain scan of somebody while they’re experiencing being in God’s presence, as I’ve always said that doesn’t prove that God was in the room. It doesn’t prove that God wasn’t in the room. What it proves is that when the person had the experience of interacting with God this is what change was going on in their brain.

I saw a program not to long ago about an experiment testing the specific brain activity and the perceived presence of God. The subject was placed in a dark silent room which reduced external sensory impute to near zero level. There is a specific region of the brain that shows increased activity when a person is experiencing the presence of God. While in this stimulation free environment that region of the brain was stimulated. The subject was asked to describe their experience. A common experience was a perception of a presence of something or someone in the room with them.

[abelisle]

Here are two interesting links that speak about her head injury and possible effects on her consciousness:

"Visions or Epileptic Seizures" http://www.whiteestate.org/issues/visions.html

and another more skeptical view

http://www.ellenwhiteexposed.com/headinjury.htm

Getting back to the topic of neurotheology, from my studies into mysticism, this seems like a modern version of what has been around for a long time - the attempt of man to gain "oneness" with God through any means possible. Drugs of course in our modern day and age being the preferable agents.

The chemical conduit seems to make the most sense, since we as Christians believe in the very real existence of preternatural beings we call angels and in so doing by the use of drugs we allow our brains access to "other" electromagnetic portions of the spectrum whereby we might sense the presence of other invisible beings?

I'm a believer in heavenly presences, just only in a part of the EMS (electromagnetic spectrum) we can't access. Maybe neurotheologians should start a dialogue with neuropharmacologists?

Alex (NOT suggesting we use drugs!)

[John317]

It should come as no surprise that as long ago as the 1860s, Ellen White said some similar things about the brain:

Great wisdom is needed in dealing with diseases caused through the mind. A sore, sick heart, a discouraged mind, needs mild treatment. Many times some living home trouble is, like a canker, eating to the very soul and weakening the life force. And sometimes it is the case that remorse for sin undermines the constitution and unbalances the mind. It is through tender sympathy that this class of invalids can be benefited. The physician should first gain their confidence and then point them to the Great Healer. If their faith can be directed to the True Physician, and they can have confidence that He has undertaken their case, this will bring relief to the mind and often give health to the body. MH 244

... The brain is the capital of the body, the seat of all the nervous forces and of mental action. The nerves proceeding from the brain control the body. By the brain nerves, mental impressions are conveyed to all the nerves of the body as by telegraph wires; and they control the vital action of every part of the system. All the organs of motion are governed by the communications they receive from the brain.

3 T 69, 70

In order to render to God perfect service, you must have clear conceptions of His requirements. You should use the most simple food, prepared in the most simple manner, that the fine nerves of the brain be not weakened, benumbed, or paralyzed, making it impossible for you to discern sacred things, and to value the atonement, the cleansing blood of Christ, as of priceless worth. 2 T 46

I frequently sit down to the tables of the brethren and sisters, and see that they use a great amount of milk and sugar. These clog the system, irritate the digestive organs, and affect the brain. Anything that hinders the active motion of the living machinery affects the brain very directly. And from the light given me, sugar, when largely used, is more injurious than meat. 2 T 370

Stimulating drinks have been used freely, which have confused the brain and brought down man to the level of the brute creation. While intoxicated, every degree of crime has been committed, and yet the perpetrators have been excused in many instances, because they knew not what they were doing. This does not lessen the guilt of the criminal. If by his own hand he puts the glass to his lips, and deliberately takes that which he knows will destroy his reasoning faculties, he becomes responsible for all the injury he does while intoxicated, at the very moment he lets his appetite control him, and he barters away his reasoning faculties for intoxicating drinks. It was his own act which brought him even below the brutes, and crimes committed when he is in a state of intoxication should be punished as severely as though the person had all the power of his reasoning faculties.

Nadab and Abihu, by drinking wine, beclouded their reasoning faculties, and so lost their sense of sacred things, that they thought they could as well offer common fire as sacred. God did not excuse them because the brain was confused. Fire from his presence destroyed them in their sin. Some look with horror upon men who have been overcome with liquor, and are seen reeling and staggering in the street, while at the same time they are gratifying their appetite for things differing in their nature from spirituous liquor, but which injure the health, affect the brain, and destroy their high sense of spiritual things. The liquor-drinker has an appetite for strong drink which he gratifies, while another has no appetite for intoxicating drinks to restrain, but he desires some other hurtful indulgence, and does not practice self-denial any more than the drunkard. Spiritual Gifts. Volume 4a, Page 125

The young generally conduct themselves as though the precious hours of probation, while mercy lingers, were one grand holiday, and they were placed in this world merely for their own amusement, to be gratified with a continued round of excitement. Satan has been making special efforts to lead them to find happiness in worldly amusements and to justify themselves by endeavoring to show that these amusements are harmless, innocent, and even important for health. The impression has been given by some physicians that spirituality and devotion to God are detrimental to health. This suits the adversary of souls. There are persons with diseased imaginations who do not rightly represent the religion of Christ; such have not the pure religion of the Bible. Some are scourging themselves all through life because of their sins; all they can see is an offended God of justice. Christ and His redeeming power through the merits of His blood they fail to see. Such have not faith. This class are generally those who have not well-balanced minds. Through disease transmitted to them from their parents, and an erroneous education in youth, they have contracted wrong habits which injure the constitution and the brain, causing the moral organs to become diseased and making it impossible for them to think and act rationally upon all points. They have not well-balanced minds. Godliness and righteousness are not destructive to health, but are health to the body and strength to the soul. ...

The consciousness of rightdoing is the best medicine for diseased bodies and minds. The special blessing of God resting upon the receiver is health and strength. A person whose mind is quiet and satisfied in God is in the pathway to health. To have a consciousness that the eyes of the Lord are upon us and His ears open to our prayers is a satisfaction indeed. To know that we have a never-failing Friend in whom we can confide all the secrets of the soul is a privilege which words can never express. Those whose moral faculties are beclouded by disease are not the ones to rightly represent the Christian life or the beauties of holiness. They are too often in the fire of fanaticism or the water of cold indifference or stolid gloom. The words of Christ are of more worth than the opinions of all the physicians in the universe: “Seek ye first the kingdom of God, and His righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you.” This is the first great object—the kingdom of heaven, the righteousness of Christ. Other objects to be attained should be secondary to these.

...The young urge that they need something to enliven and divert the mind. I saw that there is pleasure in industry, a satisfaction in pursuing a life of usefulness. Some still urge that they must have something to interest the mind when business ceases, some mental occupation or amusement to which the mind can turn for relief and refreshment amid cares and wearing labor. The Christian’s hope is just what is needed. Religion will prove to the believer a comforter, a sure guide to the Fountain of true happiness. The young should study the word of God and give themselves to meditation and prayer, and they will find that their spare moments cannot be better employed. Young friends, you should take time to prove your own selves, whether you are in the love of God. Be diligent to make your calling and election sure. It depends upon your own course of action whether you secure to yourselves the better life. Testimonies for the Church Volume 1, Page 501,502, 503

When we have tried to present the health reform to our brethren and sisters, and have spoken to them of the importance of eating and drinking and doing all that they do to the glory of God, many by their actions have said: “It is nobody’s business whether I eat this or that. Whatever we do we are to bear the consequences ourselves.” Dear friends, you are greatly mistaken. You are not the only sufferers from a wrong course. The society you are in bears the consequences of your wrongs, in a great degree, as well as yourselves. If you suffer from your intemperance in eating or drinking, we that are around you or associated with you are also affected by your infirmities. We have to suffer on account of your wrong course. If it has an influence to lessen your powers of mind or body, we feel it when in your society, and are affected by it. If, instead of having a buoyancy of spirit, you are gloomy, you cast a shadow upon the spirits of all around you. If we are sad and depressed, and in trouble, you could, if in a right condition of health, have a clear brain to show us the way out and speak a comforting word to us. But if your brain is so benumbed by your wrong course of living that you cannot give us the right counsel, do we not meet with a loss? Does not your influence seriously affect us? We may have a good degree of confidence in our own judgment, yet we want to have counselors; for “in the multitude of counselors there is safety.” We desire that our course should look consistent to those we love, and we wish to seek their counsel and have them able to give it with a clear brain. But what care we for your judgment, if your brain nerve power has been taxed to the utmost, and the vitality withdrawn from the brain to take care of the improper food placed in your stomachs, or of an enormous quantity of even healthful food? What care we for the judgment of such persons? They see through a mass of undigested food. Therefore your course of living affects us. It is impossible for you to pursue any wrong course without causing others to suffer. 2 T 356, 357

Ignorance is no excuse now for the transgression of law. The light shines clearly, and none need be ignorant, for the great God Himself is man’s instructor. All are bound by the most sacred obligations to God to heed the sound philosophy and genuine experience which He is now giving them in reference to health reform. He designs that the great subject of health reform shall be agitated and the public mind deeply stirred to investigate; for it is impossible for men and women, with all their sinful, health-destroying, brain-enervating habits, to discern sacred truth, through which they are to be sanctified, refined, elevated, and made fit for the society of heavenly angels in the kingdom of glory.

The inhabitants of the Noachian world were destroyed because they were corrupted through the indulgence of perverted appetite. Sodom and Gomorrah were destroyed through the gratification of unnatural appetite, which so benumbed the intellect that they could not discern the difference between the sacred claims of God and the clamor of appetite. The latter enslaved them, and they became so ferocious and bold in their detestable abominations that God would not tolerate them upon the earth. God ascribes the wickedness of Babylon to her gluttony and drunkenness.

The apostle Paul exhorts the church: I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.” Men, then, can make their bodies unholy by sinful indulgences. If unholy, they are unfitted to be spiritual worshipers and are not worthy of heaven. If man will cherish the light that God in mercy gives him upon health reform, he may be sanctified through the truth and fitted for immortality. But if he disregards that light and lives in violation of natural law he must pay the penalty. 3 T 162

To become acquainted with the wonderful human organism, the bones, muscles, stomach, liver, bowels, heart, and pores of the skin, and to understand the dependence of one organ upon another for the healthful action of all, is a study in which most mothers take no interest. They know nothing of the influence of the body upon the mind and of the mind upon the body. The mind, which allies finite to the infinite, they do not seem to understand. Every organ of the body was made to be servant to the mind. The mind is the capital of the body. Children are allowed to eat flesh meats, spices, butter, cheese, pork, rich pastry, and condiments generally. They are also allowed to eat irregularly and between meals of unhealthful food. These things do their work of deranging the stomach, exciting the nerves to unnatural action, and enfeebling the intellect. 3 T 136

[Guest]

Great quotes John, thanks!

[John317]

What's amazing to me is that she said those things about the brain in the middle of the 19th century.

[Dr. Shane]

Quote:

SEVERSON: But Newberg has made another discovery, a controversial one, that our belief system, how we view God, can make a huge difference in how it affects our well being. If we believe in a loving God it can have a positive effect, even prolong our lives. But believing in a judgmental, authoritarian God can produce fear, anger, and stress, and that’s not healthy.

So not all religions are created equal.

[Dr. Shane]

I sorta had an "Anne Rice" experience which damaged my faith somewhat.

12 years ago I had a bad experience with a pastor that damaged my faith experience. I am just now getting back to where I was. I knew all along that this pastor was not representative of the entire church. Eight months after they innocent his lover sent a video tape of them having adulterous sex to the conference and the pastor lost his credentials. But that did not repair the damage to my faith experience. Intellectually I knew it wasn't the fault of the church and I did not stop believing what the Adventist beliefs. However something changed in my mind that was beyond my control.

[Gerr]

It would be interesting to see if there's a difference between meditating on God's word like Ps 23 vs a mantra like SATAN - a - ma!

Some years ago my wife went to a yoga class. They were chanting some Hindu words (mantra?) Later she found out the words they were chanting were in praise to Krishna, maker of heaven and earth!

[D. Allan]

Quote:

However something changed in my mind that was beyond my control.

I know what you mean. It is sad. However my faith is not based as much on feelings and sensations as it was before but on more of an assent, a yea-saying, to the idea of God, and a wish for a more spiritual life.

[D. Allan]

Quote:

charitable acts have an effect on levels of serotonin in the brain. This is true of the person giving, the person receiving and even affects a third party watching the interaction.

It always gives one a good feeling to be helpful to others. And one's faith can augment the experience when one believes "in as much as you have done it unto one of these...you have done it unto me."

[Woody]

I belive that is true, Neil. It helps to have a church family, but I haven't gone since one of the conservative members from their pew began aruging with and shouting at the preacher during the sermon.

You wouldn't want to attend my church then. It is not infrequent that this happens. Actually, it is getting less over the last year. But it still happens.

Not sure what one can do about it. I just chalk it up to being that each church .... has ALL kinds of people. And I refuse to let just ONE of them get in the way of my spiritual experience.

I suppose that's what you have done dAb. You just don't want that person to hurt your experience ... so you have left. That would be one way of doing it. But then I think the con member wins .

[D. Allan]

Sorry to hear you have to put up with the argueing and shouting at your church.

I'm not the only one who left. There were a lot of new converts who seemed to just melt away.

One couple who had just been baptized recently- never came again.

[Woody]

I'm very sorry to hear this dAb.

Has the church changed or is it different now?

I'm sure our church isn't as bad as your's. It IS annoying. But then so is communicating here on CA with some of the xzqwkmbo's who shout and pontificate when I'm trying to speak. (No names supplied)

I just find that when any group of people (humans) get together .... there is much to be patient and tolerant and forgiving about. I've had over a half century of trying to do this .... and yet it remains 'trying'.