college cost, *^^**%**&&&, and it hurts!

[Neil D]

On another thread, the following occured.....

Restin said[:"green"]What's the use of preparing for college level work when you can't afford to go. Forget your loans and grants when you don't have a prayer of landing them and the Gov loan will skin you alive if something happens you can't make the $50,000 to pay them back! Only the RICH can afford college now, and it goes up every year. Nobody seems to care about gifted kids from dirt-poor families. Even in Russia, smart kids were assured of a college education. Here in the richest, most advanced nation ever on earth we don't care if a qualifying kid gets a higher education, or not. [/]

Nico said

Quote:

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Say nothing of late bloomer adults who had to work for a living at 19, 20 and would like to return to school in later years. We're all but invisible, written off half a lifetime ago.

But I'm still going to try. That's all I can do. God said He'd make a way. Either He will or He won't; it's up to Him.

The costs can't be helped much -- those people (faculty, staff, administrators, janitors, etc.) all have to earn a living somehow, buildings must be kept up, heat, A/C, water, all furnished, etc. Unless I'm mistaken only the long-term tenured professors are making handsome salaries. The younger or more junior profs and grad-student profs earn rather humble sums.

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to which Bevin replied-[:"blue"]

Go to your local state college.

Get all the scholarships you can.

Get a part-time job and summer internships.

Take out student loans.

Take a path that will led to a reasonable income degree.

If a kid from a poverity-striken family does these things, there is no doubt that they can get through university in the USA.

It is simply not true that you have to be rich to go to college. [/]

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Well OK Bevin ... you only have to be rich to go to an SDA college!

Sorry about the

Neil, I'll shuddup now.

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No! No! No! This is obviously something that needs to be talked about...So, I am starting this thread for you all to talk about it...

Just tryin' to be pro-active, here, folks....

[Bravus]

I'm seriously considering switching universities (that I work at) because many offer free or reduced tuition for the dependents of faculty but ours doesn't. Having said that, the eldest at least plans to go back to Australia to Avondale for college, so we'll probably still have to figure out how to pony up 7 grand a year or so (not counting airfares back here if we're still living here).

I think it can be done by anyone who has the will but:

(a) it's a lot harder than it has to be and

( young people start their working lives with an insane burden of debt

[californiagirl]

But it's SO worth the investment!

I know Andrews U. in Michigan gives scholarships to incoming first-year students under certain conditions; if they stay for all 4 years it amounts to a sizable sum each year. Not sure what GPA requirements there are attached.

And be careful if you attend a trade school or -some- junior colleges, because their credits sometimes are not transferable later.

But the latest Valuegenesis study shows Adventist schools, tho not immune to -some- drug use and sex among students, have less than one-FOURTH as much of those things as do public schools. If we want to keep our kids in the church, have them marry within the faith, the answer is clear: SDA schools are worth the cost.

[Michelle]

I have very mixed emotions about this topic. First off, I am a former SDA teacher. Second, I attended AU for two years. Third, I quit after two years so that my brother could afford to attend UC after he graduated from academy (our family couldn't afford 2 kids in Adventist schools at the same time). Fourth, I met my DH while at AU. Fifth, my brother met his wife 9 years after graduating from UC, at his church. Sixth, when I transfered to public university, I was unprepared for the godlessness I encountered and was very shaken.

As you can see, I can see pros and cons. It is terribly expensive (though I can't find the thread this originally started in--can someone post it here?). In many ways I feel it is worth it. In some cases, maybe not.

More later.

M

[Neil D]

Quote:

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(though I can't find the thread this originally started in--can someone post it here?)

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Regarding the cost of eduction, this thread is the origional....It was started because we did not want it to become confused with the "no child left behind" thread, which is more about elementary and secondary eduction standard of the federal goverment.

So, this is the place to talk about the cost of education...both SDA and public education....

[Nicodema]

Quote:

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I have very mixed emotions about this topic. .... Sixth, when I transfered to public university, I was unprepared for the godlessness I encountered and was very shaken.

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WOW. Just to compare two diverse experiences: Michelle, when I attended CUC as a brand new Christian and brand new Adventist at the age of 16, I was totally unprepared for the godlessness *I* encountered *there* -- and was VERY shaken myself. Maybe even moreso than I would have been at public, for with public, I would not have expected otherwise. There were SDA peers doing drugs, offering drugs to me once they heard I was a former druggie, even. There were SDA peers who ran me into the ground at the instigation of SDA faculty as someone who "got my kicks reliving my sordid past" because I was so on - fire for Jesus I'd tell my testimony to anyone who would sit still for it. There were SDA peers and faculty who literally rolled their eyes at me and groaned and laughed behind my back because I took the religion and the faith seriously at all. And then there was the college president, who introduced me (and the rest of the class, on the pretense of teaching "religious experience") to a basic version of occult techniques after mocking me in class and telling me "how do you THINK you communicate with God? It's in your imagination," when I tried to tell him the God I knew was REAL. (Don't get me started.)

Wow. Just ... wow.

[Michelle]

Nico--gotcha. What got me the most at university was the Old Testament Literature class taught by a "former" Baptist minister. THe "former" should have been a clue to me, but I was so naive. I bought this guy's teachings hook, line, and sinker (he was an incredible thinker, great teacher, grad-level classes to undergrads). I was very shaken. The devil can use any means to shake us!

M

[Nicodema]

Michelle, I had a college prof who was a shaker like that. He stated at the beginning of his class that his purpose was to completely destroy our faith and rebuild it along different lines. Had this man not consistently exhibited Christian character and the concerns of the Master I would have written him off as a servant of Satan for he ruffled my very black & white literal thinking at the time. But I learned more from this guy than from most of the others put together. It's hard to learn what scholars out there say about the Bible and its authors, it can really shake faith up. We're so used to the simplified contrivances, the assumptions of whom wrote what, that the suggestion that four different people might have written Isaiah, or that Paul's letters were not all by Paul, can throw us for a loop. Once we get past that, though, it really doesn't need to wreck our faith. Our hope and faith is still in Christ and Him alone.

[Bravus]

It's interesting - I'm going to a seminar, run by one of my grad students (in a public university) today on whether religion has any place in science courses. As science educators, I try to convince my students that our role is to get students to *understand* the science - they don't have to 'believe in' it. In fact, I think teachers in any field, including theology, whose stated goal is to actually change students' core beliefs are in great danger of perpetrating indoctrination. As long as our students *understand* what we teach them, for me that's as far as we can and should legitimately require.

[David_McQueen]

It costs about £3000 a year (all inc) for students to go to a standard university here a year. This will rise with the top up fees next year.

Personally I hope my kids can run their own business and sack the idea of going to univ. I went to uni once and have been tempted to go back twice but in the end the debt burden would not have been worth it for me, and I would prefer not to go to an Adventist one.

having said that if we are still on this earth I am more than willing to support my kids whatever route they take.

[Restin]

I side with Nicodema because I'm one who went to college as an adult, years after graduating from Forest Lake Academy, a Florida SDA school. I went to UCF in Orlando, a state university. First two years, I paid with profits from my art career. Then I got a gov loan when sufficient art $$ didn't come for third year. Every semester, the tuition increased. Books were $50 each, and most courses couldn't take used books. I got a Pell grant for $3000, which is nothing but a tease. Speaking of cars, i had to drive 60 miles round trip in an old Nash Rambler. Gasoline prices doubled.

I made 3.9 GPA but never could have if I had to hold down a job,even part time. It nearly ran me into the ground as it was. In college it isn't how smart you are but that you recall the very same answer that's in the text book, for all multiple choice questions are right answers, but only one was the exact same answer in the textbook. So, you must have the needed time to memorize every little fact of each chapter. Miss one question and you get a B...miss two questions and it's a C...three wrong and it's a D. It's nothing at all like highschool!

I get frustrated with people who have pat answers for how to pay for college if only you want to go bad enough! They just assume people are lazy if they can't do it, when nothing's farther from the truth! In such a rich nation there's no excuse for college being so financially difficult for anyone of low income. We arn't all the bubbly Avon Lady types, or extravert, nervy fund-raiser types who can just go around begging money off of people, you know? It wasn't long before a year of college amounted to a whole year of full time wages, leaving nothing for a mortgage or rent, food, and light bill. That's really true...figure it up.

Would you believe one of my philosophy textbooks was "On The Road" by Jack Keroac? That's how worldly UCF is. Anyhow, my marriage got on shakey ground and I was concerned I couldn't pay back a loan if I applied again. I had to drop out after my third year. So, it's water under the bridge now, but when someone brings up the subject, I just have to put in my two-cents worth.

[Bravus]

Restin - I hope not all colleges do their teaching and testing as you describe: that memorization of the text stuff was just depressing to read!

[_david]

agree college is way too expensive. i think i started Southern it was like 18k, it seems to go up about 1.5k per year.

[Jeannieb43]

poor teaching methods, i'll agree.

but praise God, He kept you under His wing all during that time... and now you're still [again?] part of His family. and what's more, your interest in and study of Jungian influences on life might never have been aroused, without that education.

you're able to contribute to and enjoy the benefits of cultured society on a much higher level now because of your education.

education isn't what we learn from books; it's in teaching us how to learn... throughout the rest of our lives.