Obama Is Leveling the Playing Field Again

[bonnie]

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Health insurance is itself a mixed bag. Before health insurance existed, people had to pay the doctor just like they pay a car mechanic or any other repairman. Of course, under that system, a lot of people didn't go to the doctor when they needed to, and doctors and other medical professions didn't earn nearly the amount of money that they do today. A lot of doctors ended up not getting paid or working for a bag of apples. So health insurance came along and solved a lot of problem while creating a whole bunch more.

Health insurance is great. PAY YOUR OWN WAY

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An employee looking to his or her employer for health-care insurance isn't "mooching". The worker is providing some sort of good or service for the employer and is thus deserving of fair compensation. As society and the health-care industry has changed, the definition of "fair compensation" has changed too.

The employee provides or should a hours work for a hours wage.

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The employer plays a lot of roles. The employer has to withhold taxes from the workers payroll check. That makes every employer a tax collector. Most have to collect sales tax for the state too. They employer has to check the legal status of its employees. That makes every employer a Border Patrol agent. Providing health-care insurance is an added role that employers now must take on - many already have.

Most have and now with Obama care many will not.Either closing their doors or dumping them on Obama's tender mercies. But it will pave the way for national government health care.Something that Obama has said he wants but it may take 10 0r 15 years.Enough time to beat down the citizen so that they rely on government for almost everything

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Employer mandates does level the playing field. Let's consider two glass companies that sell windows. One provides health-care insurance for its employees and the other doesn't. How can the one that does compete with the one that doesn't? The only way it can is to lower its profit margin. So the company that provides health-care insurance can only mark up their jobs by 12% while the company that doesn't provide health-care insurance is able to mark up its jobs 15%. Employer mandates will mean the company only marking up jobs 12% can start marking them up 15% like his competitor.

Employer mandates either will end up like McDonalds and the 29 others,waivers that let them opt out,higher premiums to most,reduced services and more fun stuff.

That is okay tho as the green eyed monster gets apeased a little more.Get the dirty,selfish,uncaring employer.That works almost everytime. The attitude of as "long as they get what is coming to them" is alive and well.

The employer mandates will level the playing field somewhat by bringing the most successful down to their level

[olger]

I am told that unions were the channel through which healthcare demands flowed to business owners. That makes sense.

Your analogy about 12-15% PM's is a common law of business. Each company differs in it's overhead and efficiency. That's ok. It makes us survivors, and teaches us how to hone our efficiency.

The company who pays health care should do so on a voluntary basis - not by compulsion. That should allow them to hire slightly better quality workers, and they need to spend more time explaining why their product is worth 3% more.

A fundamental flaw in government intrusion - they don't have any competition to hone their efficiency.

[Dr. Shane]

Obama-care has a lot of problems. The employer mandates are not one of them. In fact, employer mandates are perhaps the best thing about Obama-care. The employer-mandates were not the issue with McDonald's and the other companies receiving a waiver. The issue there was the type of insurance which is required. I am confident that if the Republicans win control, they are going to change a number of those things and Obama-care is going to be great.

The problem with the health-care reform law is that the Democrats left the Republicans out. The Democrats just jammed their ideas through. Once the Republicans gain some power and can have their say, we are going to get some bi-partisan legislation that will be really good for America.

Telling an individual to take his pay check and buy his own insurance is rather disingenuous. A health-care policy purchased by a group is going to get cheaper premiums and better coverage. One of the Republican ideas was to allow small businesses to group together so they could get better rates. Giving an individual a pay check and telling them they are on their own is not a viable option.

[bonnie]

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Obama-care has a lot of problems. The employer mandates are not one of them. In fact, employer mandates are perhaps the best thing about Obama-care. The employer-mandates were not the issue with McDonald's and the other companies receiving a waiver. The issue there was the type of insurance which is required. I am confident that if the Republicans win control, they are going to change a number of those things and Obama-care is going to be great.

Those that actually have to pay the increase know better.Tell me the difference,if I require you to do something,the carrying out of which you have no choice in the matter or mandating you do something,the carrying out of which you have no choice.

When the small businessman has his CPA crunch the numbers for his business,That small business man or woman would do well to listen to the CPA,not Shane who has never met a dependent or victim he doesn't like.Isn't that wonderful,Obama decrees and the republicans have to come in and wipe up behind him.If this man or any of his advisers had ever worked a day in a real job it might help

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The problem with the health-care reform law is that the Democrats left the Republicans out. The Democrats just jammed their ideas through. Once the Republicans gain some power and can have their say, we are going to get some bi-partisan legislation that will be really good for America.

The only thing worse than having Obama and friends in power is to have a great bi-partisan love fest. I hope if the republicans get into power they fight a verbal duel to the death.When the love fest begins you know you had better hang onto your wallet a little tighter

Forced government health care is not good for america.

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Telling an individual to take his pay check and buy his own insurance is rather disingenuous. A health-care policy purchased by a group is going to get cheaper premiums and better coverage.

Are you trying to tell me a adult that is in the workforce is incapable of running his own affairs?

I have little sympathy for those that whine about "I can't pay for insurance".

Sorry, we did it for years and yes it was good coverage. We didn't feel the need to cover the everyday DR visits of which we had very few

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One of the Republican ideas was to allow small businesses to group together so they could get better rates. Giving an individual a pay check and telling them they are on their own is not a viable option.

Heaven help us that individual should be on his own.

[bonnie]

You seem to turn a deaf ear to all the business closing and cutting back on employee's.Obama and his wonder bill are the cause.

You seem to have this notion that someone wakes up in the morning with a desire to start a business to see how many he can employ and how many benefits he can hand out. That is Obama's silly world.Those that can afford to quit are doing so,Thank you Obama. Those that are still doing well and have crunched Obama's numbers will keep the doors open and scale back till Obama is nothing but a bad nightmare.Will follow the route of cutting back to under 30 hours per woeek. Or dump them on Obama care. Great idea.

Those that were not firmly established will simply close the door.

But never forget Obama leveled the playing field and fed the green eyed monster for everyone that wants Obama to take care of them

[Dr. Shane]

I have a college degree in Construction Management with a minor in Business Administration and 12 years of working in upper management. I think I have a grasp of how business works. Business are closing because we are in a severe recession. One can make the case that this is a bad time to start Obama-care but certainly not that Obama-care is causing the recession.

I am confident that if the Republicans win control in Congress, they will make Obama-care the greatest things since sliced bread.

[bonnie]

I have a college degree in Construction Management with a minor in Business Administration and 12 years of working in upper management. I think I have a grasp of how business works. Business are closing because we are in a severe recession. One can make the case that this is a bad time to start Obama-care but certainly not that Obama-care is causing the recession.

I am confident that if the Republicans win control in Congress, they will make Obama-care the greatest things since sliced bread.

It really doesn't make any difference what your educational background is. Nor how many years you have worked in upper management.

Not until you lay it all on the line.Not until you have to meet payroll and operating costs and hope there is enough left to feed your family till next payday.You are playing with the money of others,not your own.

I doubt in your management position you have gone three months without a paycheck while figuring out how to pay employee's.You have not mortgaged your home to be in a management position.Knowing how business works in theory is a far cry from the experience of having your own business with all the pitfalls.Yes, the recession has caused some businesses to fail,many more are clsoing because of the handwriting on the wall.

Your confidence really would do little to reassure those that had the numbers crunched and looked at the many thousands in health care costs they would be dishing out.The increase in taxes included in the health care bill that have nothing to do with health care,the taxes looming in 2011.

Many just like my brother look at the numbers from the CPA and ask the same question,"You think I am nuts Obama,have at it".

Most of us have weathered a severe recession or two. I well remember the carter years in construction.But I don't remember to many willingly hanging it up.But after Carter we did not have someone willing to destroy the small business man.Not only willing but eager.

He hasn't a clue.Small business does not want Obama to meddle in the banking business. They want customers thru the door, not a loan to add to their debt burden

[Dr. Shane]

I am not a small-business owner by choice. If I wanted to be a small-business owner I would be by this point in my life. It is erring to think that one needs to be a small business owner to understand how a business works. That is like saying I need to be a tight-rope walker to understand the risks tight-rope walking. Now, I will agree that I probably understand business better than President Obama does. He is a great man, we can't expect him to know everything. I am confident that with a few more Republicans on the hill, Obama will shine.

I think Obama's greatest error has been not opening up the off shore areas for oil exploration. That would pull us out of this recession in a hurry.

[bonnie]

I am not a small-business owner by choice. If I wanted to be a small-business owner I would be by this point in my life. It is erring to think that one needs to be a small business owner to understand how a business works.

[Dr. Shane]

Not only do I have a four-year degree of "book learning" but I have 12 years of in-the-trenches upper management experience. I subcontract out 80% of my work. I have seen subs be very successful while I have seen others go bankrupt. I have made subcontractors meet their contractual obligations to the point where I am sure they did have to mortgage their home and starve their children. I like my weekly paycheck. I understand the feast and famine of a small businessman and decided against that. I have a full grasp on what it takes to make a business work.

In this thread, we are discussing health-care policy as it relates to business. I am fully qualified to participate in the discussion. Just because I haven't had to starve my children and pawn my television to keep a business going doesn't mean my opinion in the matter is invalid.

[olger]

ok

[bonnie]

ok

??????

[Dr. Shane]

I do see small-business owners as unsung heroes. They are the backbone of our economy. I also see firefighters as heroes but I wouldn't want to be one of them either.

[bonnie]

Not only do I have a four-year degree of "book learning" but I have 12 years of in-the-trenches upper management experience. I subcontract out 80% of my work. I have seen subs be very successful while I have seen others go bankrupt. I have made subcontractors meet their contractual obligations to the point where I am sure they did have to mortgage their home and starve their children. I like my weekly paycheck. I understand the feast and famine of a small businessman and decided against that. I have a full grasp on what it takes to make a business work.

[bonnie]

I do see small-business owners as unsung heroes. They are the backbone of our economy. I also see firefighters as heroes but I wouldn't want to be one of them either.

The word hero gets used a lot and generallyis not warrented.

Hero's put their lives on the line for others.Being a small business owner is not a hero

[Dr. Shane]

I disagree. Small-business owners put their livelihood on the line. They create jobs and produce goods and services that people need or want. Farmers were once the backbone of America. That was when they were small business owners. Today most farms are owned by large corporations. Today it is the small-business owners that make America's backbone. They run printing shops, beauty salons, convenience stores, mechanic garages, restaurants, computer repair services, welding shops, landscaping services, laundry mats and hundreds of more businesses.

[olger]

Originally Posted By: olger

ok

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Friend Bonnie:

It was a reply to Friend Shane.

sorry,

g

[bonnie]

I disagree. Small-business owners put their livelihood on the line. They create jobs and produce goods and services that people need or want. Farmers were once the backbone of America. That was when they were small business owners. Today most farms are owned by large corporations. Today it is the small-business owners that make America's backbone. They run printing shops, beauty salons, convenience stores, mechanic garages, restaurants, computer repair services, welding shops, landscaping services, laundry mats and hundreds of more businesses.

Small business owners become small business owners for their own sake.They do not get up one morning and put on their crusader cape and employ as many as they possibly can. Nor can they afford like Obama said,"This is not time for profits" Small business owners are small business owners hoping to provide better for their families. Looking to maiximize profits as much as possible.In that process they employ.

That man understands nothing concerning this.

My dad was a great proponent of higher education,was always so happy when the grands went. He had one reservation about higher education. And that was towards those that in his mind were in danger of becoming educated fools. Knowing what the book says but not having a clue. Not a one of those you mentioned are heros for opening a business.........

It was capitalism pure and simple.Obama is doing all he can to break the back of capitalism in this country and he very well may succeed as the ever shrinking masses continue to fawn with their hand out

[Dr. Shane]

Few people live without selfish motives. Regardless what a person does for a living, in most every case, he or she has a selfish motive for doing it. Perhaps the greatest heroes of all are those that have no or nearly no selfish motive for what they do. Those folks are few and far between. Those are the war hero types that receive the metal of honor for going above and beyond the call of duty.

However a person doesn't have to receive the metal of honor to be a hero. Firemen and policemen are heroes - even though they do what they do for a paycheck. Teachers that motivate and inspire children to learn are heroes. Parents that provide a positive role model for their children are heroes. In this same way, small-business owners are heroes.

The reason a person decides to go into business is not always completely selfish. Perhaps most do believe they can make more money on their own than working for someone else. Some people actually make less money on their own but have a higher job satisfaction. Many self-employed people do feel a sense of satisfaction when they can give someone a job and keep them employed. Likewise they feel satisfied when the company profits enough that they can give to the community by sponsoring a little league team or something similar. They feel satisfied when they provide a product or service that is greatly desired or needed. For many business owners, owning a business isn't all about making money.

[bonnie]

However a person doesn't have to receive the metal of honor to be a hero. Firemen and policemen are heroes - even though they do what they do for a paycheck. Teachers that motivate and inspire children to learn are heroes. Parents that provide a positive role model for their children are heroes. In this same way, small-business owners are heroes.

[Dr. Shane]

Dictionary.com defines hero as:

1. a man who is known for his brave or noble qualities.

2. a person who, in the opinion of others, is regarded as a model or ideal.

Bonnie, you can only speak of your experience and the handful of people you know - which is limited. You by no means speak for all small-business owners. There are many reasons people go into business for themselves. I have known some that have started a business just to support a local church school. Legend has it that McKee Foods was started to create jobs for students at Southern College.

Like I stated before, I probably do know more about business than Obama. If the Republicans hadn't put up such a pathetic candidate, maybe a Republican would have won. If given the opportunity again, I would still vote for Obama if McCain was my only other option. However Obama isn't all bad. Those that can't see any good in him really need to ask themselves why. No one is all bad. When I can't see any good in someone, it is because something is wrong with me, my attitude and my way of looking at the person.

[bonnie]

Bonnie, you can only speak of your experience and the handful of people you know - which is limited. You by no means speak for all small-business owners. There are many reasons people go into business for themselves. I have known some that have started a business just to support a local church school. Legend has it that McKee Foods was started to create jobs for students at Southern College.