The Mystery of Iniquity

[skyblue888]

I don't think we should re-interpret Ellen White's statement when she said, “Somebody is to come,” and change it to say, “ I have come”, or something similar; or when she said, “...when he appears...”, and take it to mean, “she has appeared.” We just can't do that to inspired writings. We must let them teach us, rather than us making them say something that they don't say.

Johnnboy

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Nobody has done that Johnn. If we let the inspired writing teach us, we have no choice but to see that she was unassumingly stating by the Holy Spirit that her ministry was the fulfillment of that prophecy.

First you said that what she had herself written was to be treated as a "footnote"!!! but now you are saying that we should not re-interpret her statement!!!

She does say "somebody is to come" and she does say "when he appears," and she does also say that when that "somebody" appears "men may say, 'You are too earnest, you do not interpret the Scriptures in the proper way. Let me tell you how to teach your message.'"

And then she says, "There are many who cannot distinguish between the work of God and that of man. I SHALL TELL THE TRUTH AS GOD GIVES IT TO ME, AND I SAY NOW, IF YOU CONTINUE TO FIND FAULT, TO HAVE A SPIRIT OF VARIANCE, YOU WILL NEVER KNOW THE TRUTH.'" 1 S.M.412.

It is that last sentence that gives it away. How could anyone miss that? She is saying that somebody is to come in the spirit and power of Elijah and when this "somebody" appears he/she will be criticized. Then she says, "I shall tell the truth as the Lord gives it to me, and I say now, if you continue to find fault, to have a spirit of variance, you shall never know the truth."

By this last sentence the Lord could not have made it more plain to us that she was that "somebody" who was to come.

The same thing happened to John the Baptist. Jesus Himself said to the Jews that they did not know that John was the Elijah, did He not? see Matt.11:14; 17:11,12.

How many among those who call themselves adventists today truly know that Mrs. White was the Elijah? We could probably count them on our fingers. We are repeating history, to be sure.

sky

[skyblue888]

Also, it is very important to consider the words, “in the spirit and power of Elijah”. First, we must focus on the prophet Elijah's “spirit” and “power”, most clearly demonstrated at the showdown on Mt. Carmel.

Johnnboy

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But Johnn, we cannot afford to forget that both Elijah and John the Baptist did not understand the nature of Christ's kingdom. They both had looked forward for the Lord to reveal Himself as a God that answereth by fire. They both looked for the high places of human pride and power to be cast down. But Jesus was to do His work, not with the clash of arms and the overtuning of kingdoms, as Elijah and John the Baptists expected, but through speaking to the hearts of men by a life of mercy and self-sacrifice. See Desire of Ages, 215, 2nd parg and 217, last parg.

So we may be sure that this violent aspect of Elijah's ministry will not be part of the last work upon the earth.

Back to you.

sky

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sky,

What do these statements mean to you, regarding the angel of Revelation 18, who joins the 3rd angel's message?

"Concerning Babylon, the symbol of the apostate church, He says to His ministers of judgment, "Her sins have reached unto heaven, and God hath remembered her iniquities. Reward her even as she rewarded you, and double unto her double according to her works: in the cup which she hath filled fill to her double." Revelation 18:5, 6. COL 178

"Now the angel of death goes forth, represented in Ezekiel's vision by the men with the slaughtering weapons, to whom the command is given: “Slay utterly old and young, both maids, and little children, and women; but come not near any man upon whom is the mark; and begin at my sanctuary.” Says the prophet, “They began at the ancient men which were before the house.” [Ezekiel 9:1-6.] The work of destruction begins among those who have professed to be the spiritual guardians of the people. The false watchmen are the first to fall. There are none to pity or to spare. Men, women, maidens, and little children perish together.

“The Lord cometh out of his place to punish the inhabitants of the earth for their iniquity; the earth also shall disclose her blood, and shall no more cover her slain.” [isaiah 26:21.] GC 656

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Thanks for quoting these, Johnn.

The "angel of death" of Ezekiel 9 represents the slaughter that will take place at the time of the sixth plague as Mrs. White makes it very plain in the book The Great Controversy, p.636,656. It is the drying up of the River Euphrates, (Rev.16:12) the drying up of support from the multitudes upon which Babylon the Great sits (Rev.17:15) and which will bring the physical fall of Babylon the Great.

So that "angel of death" is a movement of people, the wicked themselves at the time of the sixth plague, as they will turn upon the false shepherds and afterward on each other. There will be bloodshed everywhere.

On page 636 she describes the fifth plague, thick darkness falling upon the earth,,, the wicked lose sight of the righteous whom they were just about to slay,,, then the wicked fall at the feet of the saints to acknowledge that they are truly the faithful few,,, then they begin to accuse one another but they all agree to put the blame on the false shepherds for being lost eternally and they turn upon them with the fury of demons. This is the "angel of death" of Ezekiel 9 as stated on page 656.

sky

[skyblue888]

Therefore, with this evidence, I would expect Elijah to appear 3 ½ years before the commencement of the Jubilee. (Early Writings 35) Of course, all of this occurs some unknown number of days before the second coming of Christ. God's voice gives the day and hour of the second coming at midnight when the anti-typical Jubilee begins.

One last note, the 144,000 will be echoing this same Elijah message during this last 3 ½ years.

Johnnboy

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John, the 144,000 do not even exist as a nucleous of people until after the close of probation! In order to become members of that illustrious company of people, we must take part in the giving of the latter rain and loud cry messages and during that time we must grow up into Christ until the full corn of Christ's character is in the ear, which prepares us to pass the great final test (buy-and-sell and death decrees) taking place at the end of the loud cry, coinciding with the judgment of the living moments prior to the close of general probation.

And since 1844 there has not been and never will be again any message based on time, whether prophetic or literal. See 1 S.M.188 and Bible Commentary, Vol.7A, p.415.

sky

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The statement actually says:

"This time, which the angel declares with a solemn oath, is not the end of this world's history, neither of probationary time, but of prophetic time, which should precede the advent of our Lord. That is, the people will not have another message upon definite time. After this period of time, reaching from 1842 to 1844, there can be no definite tracing of the prophetic time." 7BC 971

The ststements do not say "literal time" or there would be a contradiction with Ellen White's statement in 1897.

[Revelation 13:4-10 quoted.] "This entire chapter is a revelation of what will surely take place" [Revelation 13:11, 15-17 quoted] (MS 88, 1897). 7BC 979

This shows a future fulfillment of this whole chapter which includes 42 months when all the world wonders after the beast and power is given him to continue 40 and 2 months. This time period would not be prophetic time, it would be in literal time. Prophetic time is "time" that is a prophecy in itself--therefore, it is termed "prophetic".

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Johnn, you are only commenting upon one of the statements I mentioned, the one found in Bible Commentary which deals only with prophetic time. No more prophetic time after 1844. That is settled.

As to any prophecy relating to literal time Mrs. White is also clear. I did give you the reference for this but it would appear that you did not take the time to check it out. I am talking about 1 S.M.188:

"Again and again have I been warned in regard to time setting. There will never again be a message for the people of God that will be based on time. We are not to know the definite time either for the outpouring of the Holy Spirit or for the coming of Christ... The Lord showed me that the message must go, and that it must not be hung on time; for time will never be a test again. I saw that some were getting a false excitement, arising from preaching time, that the third angel's message can stand on its own foundation, and that it needs not time to strengthen it, and that it will go with mighty power, and do its work, and will be cut short in righteousness."

If we teach that from the time Elijah appears there will be three and half years before Jesus comes, are we not preaching time? That we cannot do.

There will never again be a message for the people of God that will be based on time, whether prophetic or literal!

sky

[skyblue888]

Back to topic.

"For the mystery of iniquity is already at work; only he who now restrains will do so until he is taken out of the way." 2 Thess.2:7.

This passage of Scripture is a description of the past and a prophecy of the future. That which has been will be.

In the first centuries it was the Roman Empire that stood in the way of the papacy but in the fifth century, when the Roman Empire fell, there was nothing any more that stood in the way of the Papacy. It was not long before she was able to establish her temporal supremacy. Then followed the Dark Ages.

The United States of America with its constitution is still the only obstacle standing in the way of the papacy stopping her short of regaining her temporal supremacy. But when Apostate Protestantism shall have made an image to the beast, the constitution of the United States' government will be taken out of the way and the child of the papacy shall be exalted one more time and the papal wound will be healed and the whole world will wonder after her.

In the meantime, through the work of the Jesuits, the Catholic Church is silently working behind the scenes to establish her former glory.

But the papacy will have to contend with an unknown and obscure force when the Lord shall finish His work and cut it short in righteousness:

"Let me tell you that the Lord will work in this last work in a manner very much out of the common order of things, and in a way that will be contrary to any human planning." T.M.300.

sky

See The Great Controversy, pp.234,235.

There are forces within the US government that have been working to undermine the Constitution of the United States just as there are forces within the Seventh-day Adventist circles that have been at work to undermine the pillars of their faith.

"The kings of the earth, and all the inhabitants of the world would not have believed that the adversary and the enemy could enter the gates of Jerusalem." Lamentations 4:12.

Seventh-day Adventism is the "Jerusalem" of these last days.

These same evil forces have been at work to bring about a change in the U.S. constitution. They have almost succeeded. It is just a matter of time before the US (represented in Holy Writ as a Lamb with two horns, symbol of innocence) shall speak as a dragon when it shall become a full-fledged democracy and no longer a Republic. No true Seventh-day Adventist should have any difficulty understanding that the aim of the Vatican has been to destroy the Constitution of the U.S. Why? Simply because the Constitution of the United States is the only remaining major obstacle in the way of the papacy from regaining her former glory, her temporal power. Once this last obstacle is out of the way, her wound will be healed, and she will rule the world again but only for a very short time.