A Catholic's Witness To Adventists: Team Tiber 2012

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The Roman Catholic Sanctuary Message

When witnessing to Adventists, point out this unique common ground. Again, this teaching is central to Adventist theology, and quite frankly, to Catholic sacramental theology. Then, proceed to point out how the Catholic "sanctuary message" is more profound than that found in Adventist theology:

1. What occurs in the Heavenly Sanctuary is made mystically present in the Eucharistic Sacrifice. By the power of the Holy Spirit, the Church is one with her High Priest.

2. We partake of the Sacrifice in the Eucharist, as the Israelites ate the Passover. Adventists stress the sanctuary and sacrifice, but have no concept of what it means to partake of the Sacrifice of Christ. Yet, the notion of eating the sacrifice was central to the Old Testament ritual system.

Protestant "discoveries" can never equal the eternity of Catholic dogma. Catholic theology is the fullness of Christianity... ever more profound, ever more beautiful, ever more personal.

When witnessing to your Adventist friends, be sure to use words such as "sanctuary, once-for-all sacrifice, High priest".. this will ring a deep resonant chord with many Adventists (in short, speak the lingo). Also, never present this as a challenge, but in a spirit of sincere comparison between the two doctrines. Impress them with your concern to learn more of their perspective on something considered profound in Adventism, and engage in thoughtful exploration of the Catholic perspective.

- by one of my Catholic friends

[Woody]

Good Stuff Overaged.

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Lutheran Leader Seeks Communion Agreement With Pope

BY LUIGI SANDRI ©2010 Religion News Service

The president of the Lutheran World Federation is calling on Lutherans and Catholics to issue a common statement on Holy Communion to mark the 500th anniversary of the Protestant Reformation in 2017.

"Our intention is to arrive at 2017 with a common Roman Catholic-Lutheran declaration on Eucharistic hospitality," Bishop Munib Younan told the Italian Protestant news agency NEV before meeting with Pope Benedict XVI on December 16.

"Eucharistic hospitality," means that Catholics would be able to receive Communion at Lutheran worship services, and Lutherans would be able to do the same at a Catholic Mass.

In a speech during his meeting with Younan, Benedict praised progress in Catholic-Lutheran dialogue but did not make any reference to the bishop's Eucharist proposal.

"It is my hope that these ecumenical activities will provide fresh opportunities for Catholics and Lutherans to grow closer in their lives, their witness to the gospel, and their efforts to bring the light of Christ to all dimensions of society" the pope said.

Catholic doctrine forbids such bilateral Communion acceptance. The Second Vatican Council, held from 1962 to 1965, said that Protestants "did not keep the genuine and integral substance of the Eucharistic mystery."

Read Entire Article Here

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Roman Catholics say that they were the "first Church." Is this correct? Can that be supported by the Bible? This is an important question to know the answer to, for they are using this idea to advance the doctrine of their "infallible authority over all other churches/religions.

I have gotten up the ire of some Catholic friends by saying that Jesus was the first Protestant, and that a true church should be able to trace their doctrines (not their leaders) all the way back to Eden; not just back to the time of Jesus and the NT, as the Roman Catholics are now taught to do.

Adventists can trace their core doctrines all the way to Eden, making them the "first" as well as the remnant Church. IMHO. No other church on earth can make this claim.

[Tom Wetmore]

I think their point is that through the Protestant Reformation all current Christian churches came out of the Catholic Church which traces its origins to the 2nd Century before Christianity became fragmented. The first real splintering of Christianity was between the Roman Catholic and Eastern Orthodox both of which trace to the very same roots.

Let's be realistic, all of Christianity traces its roots though Judaism back to Eden. Even Islam does that.

Regarding the op, it is interesting that seeking common ground, like this, is something that EGW repeatedly advocated. The truth is that we do have far more in common, even with Catholics, than we have by way of differences.

[Overaged]

Let's be realistic, all of Christianity traces its roots though Judaism back to Eden. Even Islam does that.

Regarding the op, it is interesting that seeking common ground, like this, is something that EGW repeatedly advocated. The truth is that we do have far more in common, even with Catholics, than we have by way of differences.

I'd like to see you prove this first paragraph re "all of Christianity traces their roots back to eden." It simply isn't true.

As far as this "common ground;" that is definitely not true; although there are many who would like us to think so. When Catholics say something as basic, even, like "Bible;" they do not mean anything close to the same as we do.

[Overaged]

I think their point is that through the Protestant Reformation all current Christian churches came out of the Catholic Church which traces its origins to the 2nd Century before Christianity became fragmented. The first real splintering of Christianity was between the Roman Catholic and Eastern Orthodox both of which trace to the very same roots.

Correct. That is one of their points. However, the first "split" happened well before a Catholic came into the picture...

[Tom Wetmore]

I'd like to see you prove this first paragraph re "all of Christianity traces their roots back to eden." It simply isn't true.

I'm not arguing the point. It seems you are. I am really not so sure why you see it as so important. I think the burden is on you to "prove" your point tha only Adventists can and in doing so prove the lack of roots in Eden of all of the rest of Christianity.

Originally Posted By: Overaged

As far as this "common ground;" that is definitely not true; although there are many who would like us to think so. When Catholics say something as basic, even, like "Bible;" they do not mean anything close to the same as we do.

Well, apparently EGW thought so and wanted us to think so too:

"...the object of their mission,--to call the attention of the people to the truths of God's Word. There are many of these which are dear to all Christians. Here is common ground, upon which we can meet people of other denominations; and in becoming acquainted with them, we should dwell mostly upon topics in which all feel an interest, and which will not lead directly and pointedly to the subjects of disagreement.

On entering a new place to labor, we should be careful not to create prejudice in the minds of the Catholics, or do anything to lead them to think us their enemies. The Lord has shown me that there are many among them who will be saved. God will just as surely test this people as he is testing us; and according to their willingness to accept the light he gives them, will be their standing before him. We should sow the seed beside all waters, for it is God that gives the increase. - RH, June 13, 1912.

[Overaged]

Originally Posted By: Overaged

I'd like to see you prove this first paragraph re "all of Christianity traces their roots back to eden." It simply isn't true.

I'm not arguing the point. It seems you are. I am really not so sure why you see it as so important. I think the burden is on you to "prove" your point tha only Adventists can and in doing so prove the lack of roots in Eden of all of the rest of Christianity.

Originally Posted By: Overaged

As far as this "common ground;" that is definitely not true; although there are many who would like us to think so. When Catholics say something as basic, even, like "Bible;" they do not mean anything close to the same as we do.

Well, apparently EGW thought so and wanted us to think so too:

"...the object of their mission,--to call the attention of the people to the truths of God's Word. There are many of these which are dear to all Christians. Here is common ground, upon which we can meet people of other denominations; and in becoming acquainted with them, we should dwell mostly upon topics in which all feel an interest, and which will not lead directly and pointedly to the subjects of disagreement.

On entering a new place to labor, we should be careful not to create prejudice in the minds of the Catholics, or do anything to lead them to think us their enemies. The Lord has shown me that there are many among them who will be saved. God will just as surely test this people as he is testing us; and according to their willingness to accept the light he gives them, will be their standing before him. We should sow the seed beside all waters, for it is God that gives the increase. - RH, June 13, 1912.

Well Tommy, once again you are on another trip to who knows where. I have a lot of friends and acquaintances who are Roman Catholic, and they call me their favorite Protestant.. .You have missed the boat entirely here.