A little puzzle on a EGW's six thousand years statement

[DanielMunoz]

Ellen G. White has many statements where she mentions the six thousand years. It can be proven that she uses it as a round number, not as an exact period for anything.

Having said that, I want to analyze this statement (in fact, I've already analyzed it, but I want to share my conclusion as a puzzle for you to solve):

Quote:

Satan's work of ruin is forever ended. For six thousand years he has wrought his will, filling the earth with woe and causing grief throughout the universe. The whole creation has groaned and travailed together in pain. Now God's creatures are forever delivered from his presence and temptations...{GC 673.2}

The question is: What is the span period covered by those six thousand years of this specific statement?

Let's suppose that the period begins at the man's fall. But when exactly it ends? Note that the quote is in the context of Satan's destruction. Just after he has been destroyed.

An Ellen White's critic told me once that she commited a mistake there because at that time it would be seven thousand years already, not six thousand.

What would have you told him in my place? It's a little different in my case because our conversation was in spanish (not a regular conversation, it was in a internet forum), and it seems that the traslator didn't get the original meaning of the statement, so I had to go to the English version to explain that.

The spanish version renders something like this (different verb tenses):

Quote:

Satan's work of ruin is forever ended. For six thousand years he worked at is will, filling the earth with woe and causing grief throughout the universe. The whole creation groaned and travailed together in pain. Now God's creatures are forever delivered from his presence and temptations...

So, when the time span ends? What you say?

[Gerr]

1. Since Satan's ability to tempt anyone to sin ends at or just before the Second Coming, I tend to think that that six thousand year span covers from the Fall to the Second Advent.

2. The six thousand year figure can be understood in two ways for me:

a) That she was just using a commonly accepted age of the earth during her time in the same way she would have accepted the commonly accepted number of planets known in her time. And that the important point about her message was the certainty of Satan's demise and the end of his evil work.

That both the central message and the 6k yr figure were equally inspired. I tend to believe the first.

[DanielMunoz]

1. Since Satan's ability to tempt anyone to sin ends at or just before the Second Coming, I tend to think that that six thousand year span covers from the Fall to the Second Advent.

2. The six thousand year figure can be understood in two ways for me:

a) That she was just using a commonly accepted age of the earth during her time in the same way she would have accepted the commonly accepted number of planets known in her time. And that the important point about her message was the certainty of Satan's demise and the end of his evil work.

That both the central message and the 6k yr figure were equally inspired. I tend to believe the first.

Hi Gerry,

Let's put aside the earth's age in this discussion, and let's take it as if it were around 6k, which is the age she gave it (round number).

Then, according to her own thougth, the second comming would be at about 6k (as you said, from fall to second advent), and Satan's destruction afther the 1k millenium would be around 7k.

But now focus again on the statement. The statement does not include any reference to Satan's ability to tempt.

And, as a hint, or maybe to complicate it even more, note that the verbal tense (present perfect) of "he has wrought his will" means that he must still being working his will, when he has just been destroyed! (She just said "Satan's work of ruin is forever ended").

And, please, don't get annoyed by my insistence. Remember that I had to "prove" what she excactly meant by this statement to a critic!

[Gerr]

I re-read the paragraph including a few paragraphs before and after the quote. I think the context of the statement is at the end of the millennium, when Satan is finally destroyed. So one can also understand the statement to mean then that the 6k yrs includes the millennium itself, which would mean then that the time span from the Fall to the Second Advent is only 5k yrs! I doubt you would find too many SDAs that would believe such a short time. Even if we allow no gaps in the genesis genealogy, Ussher's chronology adds up to a minimum of 6k yrs.

[skyblue888]

This statement from p.673 of The Great Controversy, though it is written in the context of after the thousand years, when Satan will be destroyed at the hand of those whom he had deceived (p. 672 first parg, last sentence) does not mean that there were 6,000 years up to that time. Mrs. White is merely reflecting upon the work that Satan during the thousand years that he was active on this earth, from the fall of Adam to the second coming of Christ.

sky

[DanielMunoz]

Thank you guys for your answers. I'll tell you now what I think.

I first considered the following possibilities (I think that all of them are wrong):

• The period ended at Satan's destruction.

  I think this is wrong, because: Ellen White said in the same book, talking about the start of the millenium, that:

  Quote:

  "Here is to be the home of Satan with his evil angels for a thousand years... He is wholly cut off from the work of deception and ruin which for so many centuries has been his sole delight.

  For six thousand years, Satan's work of rebellion has "made the earth to tremble"... For a thousand years, Satan will wander to and fro in the desolate earth to behold the results of his rebellion against the law of God." (GC 659-660)

  So it is clear that she considered that the second coming would happen around the 6000 years. And she also knew that the millenium would last 1000 years. So she knew that the destruction of Satan at the end of the millenium would be around the year 7000, not 6000. So this can't be the answer.

• The period ends at the destruction of Satan but the millenium does not count, because Satan was "wholly cut off from the work of deception and ruin".

  But it cannot be the answer either, because the present perfect of the statement (For six thousand years he has wrought his will) does not allows that period to be a sum of years that could have been interrupted. The present perfect construction requires that this time period must be continual and uninterrupted until the present.

• That she is talking about Satan's work before the millenium, not counting his post-millenium activity.

  But it cannot be the answer either, because the present perfect means that the action still continues uninterrupted up to the present time.

So, what is the answer then?

If we follow the text, it says that "Satan's work of ruin is forever ended", meaning that at this point Satan is already destroyed. Actually, two paragraphs before she already says that "Fire comes down from God out of heaven", and one paragraph before she says that "In the cleansing flames the wicked are at last destroyed, root and branch--Satan the root, his followers the branches".

So we have that at the point when she says "Satan's work of ruin is forever ended", Satan is already dead. But then she says: "For six thousand years he has wrought his will, filling the earth with woe and causing grief throughout the universe. The whole creation has groaned and travailed together in pain". Note the present perfect. It means that Satan is still alive, that he is still working his will like in the uninterrupted 6k years.

The only explanation that I found is this:

• First she writes about Satan's death after the millenium, up to this sentence: "Satan's work of ruin is forever ended".
• Then she goes back to the time when she is writing, and from her chair, when she is sitting writting the statement, she adds her own commentary about Satan's work up to the time she is writting, saying: "For six thousand years he has wrought his will, filling the earth with woe and causing grief throughout the universe. The whole creation has groaned and travailed together in pain". Meaning that at the time that she is writing (at around 6k, always around), Satan has been working is will for 6k years, and he is still doing it (present perfect).
• Then, after commenting that, she goes to the scene after Satan's destruction again, and says that "Now God's creatures are forever delivered from his presence and temptations".

Summarizing: She describes Satan's destruction at the end of the 7k. Then she comments, from he chair at 6k, the work of ruin that Satan had been continually doing up to her time, and then she goes back to the 7k, after Satan's destruction, and says that "now" (at the end of 7k, in contraposition to what was happening at her time at 6k) God's creatures are forever delivered.

The Spanish traslation.

It seems that the spanish traslator took the option 3 (That she is talking about Satan's work before the millenium, not counting his post-millenium activity). So he rendered the verbs in past, instead of present perfect like in english.

[BobRyan]

[color:#3333FF]1. Since Satan's ability to tempt anyone to sin ends at or just before the Second Coming, I tend to think that that six thousand year span covers from the Fall to the Second Advent.

Agreed - I think that is the right answer.

The world was about 6,000 years old in Ellen White's day (within 150 years or so).

Her statement about "sin" is clearly a reference to mankind on earth in sin.

It is not a referenc to Satan in heaven in sin, or Satan alone on earth during the millennium in sin.

in Christ,

Bob

[skyblue888]

So we agree then.

Great!

sky

[DanielMunoz]

Hi Bob.

Have you noticed that this statement does not mention "sin"? And, have you read the reason I gave of why that couldn't be the right answer?

Regards.

[BobRyan]

Quote:

"Here is to be the home of Satan with his evil angels for a thousand years... He is wholly cut off from the work of deception and ruin which for so many centuries has been his sole delight.

For six thousand years, Satan's work of rebellion has "made the earth to tremble"... For a thousand years, Satan will wander to and fro in the desolate earth to behold the results of his rebellion against the law of God." (GC 659-660)

So it is clear that she considered that the second coming would happen around the 6000 years. And she also knew that the millenium would last 1000 years. So she knew that the destruction of Satan at the end of the millenium would be around the year 7000, not 6000. So this can't be the answer.

Agreed.

in Christ,

Bob