In Arabian Desert an Adventist Church Rises

[phkrause]

http://www.adventistreview.org/article.php?id=4497

This is awesome and shows how God can work miracles.

[Gerr]

I wonder if the SDAs in the Arab world take their shoes off when they enter the church? A Muslim would never go into a mosque with shoes on.

The SS lesson the week before last touched on Moses and the burning bush. He was told to take his shoes off. Ditto Joshua. Any reason why we shouldn't do the same? Or is this just cultural?

[ClubV12]

I think culture has much to do with it. I never attended an SDA church while in Hawaii, but it was common to remove your shoes before entering someones house.

Some folks are VERY adamant about that, a major disrespect if you dare enter their house with shoes on. Not for spiritual reasons of course, just to keep down the dust and dirt from within the house.

That is not typical with a "business" or office so I would assume the churches fall into that category as well.

The point is "when in Rome", so much of this would come under cultural customs. It was common in Hawaii to wear shoes that are easily removed. Slip on's or flip flops were common. I NEVER wore shoes with laces for this reason. To much hassle removing them.

I wonder what it was like in ancient times, or in Arab countries today, as it concerns foot wear? Did, or do, most of the people wear shoes that are easily removed? Or wear special shoes when going to the mosque? I was always careful to wear shoes easily dismissed if I was going to visit someone.

[Gerr]

The reason that God gave Moses to remove his sandals had NOTHING to with culture; it was the holiness of God's presence.

[ClubV12]

Oh I understand that specific event with MOSES, I'm just not sure that carries forward to our churches today.

Consider:

Did the Priests remove their shoes in the sanctuary? Holy Place or Most Holy Place? And again, how much trouble was it for people to remove their shoes in Moses time?

Like in Hawaii, if you know your going to a friends house, say, church for instance. You WON'T be wearing a pair of high top boots with a bunch of laces! So the culture, that is the foot wear, would have an impact on how practical and reasonable it is for removing your shoes.

Michigan, dead of winter, thick socks, heavy boots. Hawaii, easy to get on and off slip on shoes year round. Culture plays a part.

[Gerr]

The priest had to wash his feet before he went into the holy place, and bathe when he entered the holy places during the day of atonement. My understanding is that he did not enter the holy places with his sandals or shoes.

Is there a church in cold areas that is not heated during the cold weather season? And how much trouble do you have taking your shoes off and putting them on? Mine just slip off and easily slipped back on.

Certainly, in our present case, culture does play a part. I ask those who come into my house to leave their shoes at the door. We have clean slippers (washable) at the door. No telling what dirt or poop their shoes have stepped on. But again, the reason God gave Moses to take his shoes off has to do with the holiness of God. Perhaps doing so would remind us that when we enter God's house, we are now on holy ground and not a market place which the church often sounds like before and after the services or between SS & the 11 o'clock service.

And why do we do footwashing during the Communion service? Many churches no longer perform that part. I have been to a Communion service in two different Baptist churches and there was no footwashing. When I asked why, the answer was - it was not convenient. So are we neglecting this part of reverence because it is not convenient?

[ClubV12]

Well if were gonna start, just let me know so I can choose my footwear accordingly.

Shoes that are easy to slip on/slip off, no laces please!

Personally, I don't think it's an important issue, but I certainly would understand if those who were convicted on it followed through. I met some folks who prefer to kneel at every prayer, sometimes thats a little ackward (requiring a bit more room on occasion). Others take seriously the issues of dress reform, (I wish more would)! We always need to find the balance between our own level of spirituality and being sensitive to others needs.

Our, as Sister White put it, when following dress reform, don't dress like you would scare the crows from the field of corn. There is always a balance to find. :)

[ClubV12]

Well, it could be, for some folks. I hesitate to declare what is and isn't a salvational issue because there are so many variables for each of us according to the light we receive and are convicted of.

It's hard to imagine the shoe thing as being a salvational issue, but I'll leave room for that possibility depending on a number of unknowns for any given person.

I would say the same about many things as it concerns salvational issues, "it depends". Recent topics: Coffee drinking, dancing, dress reform and much more. Any or all "could be", depending on the circumstances.

Salvation is available to a large group outside SDA's of course, it's all about living up to your convictions and the light received. Even nature speaks of God, some may have never seen a bible, yet, I would not rule out salvation for them.

[ClubV12]

Yes, I was talking about an S.D.A. church, right here in America, with our culture. Being vegetarian may well rise to the level of salvation for some, not to mention dancing, coffee drinking, gluttony, sweet tooth and a host of other possibilities.

I wonder if they will take their shoes off in this new Arab SDA church? Actually, I wonder what kind of shoes the Arabs wear to church! :)

[phkrause]

Some interesting thoughts Gerry. Something to think about at least. I do know that in Jewish Temples and Synogues(sp) they don't do that.

[Gerr]

There is nothing salvational about taking off the shoe in God's presence, or the washing of feet, or the communion service, but it has to do with reverence in worship and for the last two, about a memorial.

As for kneeling in prayer, I can't be in a kneeling position very long because of boney prominences on the top of my tibiae, making kneeling painful.

[ClubV12]

I understand Gerry, many people can't knell in my local church also. Perhaps, one day, I will join that group. God looks on the heart, something we cannot and should not attempt. Any issue can be a salvational issue depending on the light and circumstances God has given to us individually. For Moses to remove his shoes was certainly a "salvation issue" considering the circumstances! As was circumcision at that time. We have responsibilities today that those of old did not. They had responsibilities in their day that we do not. Time, culture, circumstances, individual light, all come into play.