Truth Files Posted July 29, 2011 Posted July 29, 2011 The time lapse of the Lord’s coming hour of trial and judgment upon the earth is presented in the book of Daniel and the book of Revelation The significant events of this future time frame are recorded in the unfulfilled portions of the visions of the following prophets [isaiah, Jeremiah, Ezekiel, Daniel, Joel, Obadiah; Micah; Zechariah]; the Lord’s discourse [Matthew 24; Mark 13; Luke 21]; and the book of Revelation The composition: 1260 days + 1260 days + 30 for a total of 2550 days [the expression time, times, 1/2 time is equal to 3.5 prophetic years .... or 1260 days] The first 2520 days are the same as the 70th week decreed for Israel which is separated into two equal parts [Daniel 9:24-27]; specifically [9:27] [1 week of years [heptad] is equal to 7 years of 360 prophetic days counted for each year] Further definition of this time lapse is recorded in Daniel 12:7-8 Daniel 12:7-8 defines the first 1260 days of the 70th week [the rise of Satan’s beast in the little horn, his conquering of all of the Middle East including Israel, and his victories over other nations who will oppose his ambition to rule the earth] [Daniel 7:7-25; 8:9-12; 8:23-25; 11:36-45; 12:7; Revelation 9:1; 9:11; 13:1-4; 17:8-14] Daniel 12:11 defines the second 1260 days of the 70th week [the rule of Satan’s beast in the little horn over the Middle East and the land of Israel unopposed for 42 months of 30 prophetic days each] [Zechariah 14:3-5; Matthew 24:15-16; Revelation 11:2; 11:7; 12:6; 12:14; 13:5] The additional 30 days added [Daniel 12:11] will involve the Lord’s turning upon Satan’s beast in the little horn and his followers and destroying them at Armageddon [the beast and his false prophet will be burned in the Lord’s lake of fire, the little horn and his followers will become bird food with their remains buried for cleansing the land by Israel, and Satan will be captured and imprisoned in the abyss so that he cannot deceive the mortal nations of the Lord’s coming millennial kingdom] [Psalms 83; Isaiah 63:1-4; Jeremiah 30:7-11; Ezekiel 38; 39; Daniel 7:11; 7:26; 9:27; [the other prince/desolater] 11:45; Joel 2; 3; Obadiah 1:1-8; Micah 5:5-15; Zechariah 12:1-9; 14:1-5; 14:12-14; Revelation; 14:14-20; 16:1-16; 19:11-21; 20:1-3] There are an additional 45 days added which will take place just after the tribulation of the 2550 days [the Lord’s gathering and selective separation of the mortal survivors of the period for populating His millennial kingdom on the earth] [[of Israel] Isaiah 11; 37:13; Matthew 24:29-31] [[of the nations] Matthew 25:31-46] Quote Stephen - Author - Truth Files
Lysimachus Posted July 29, 2011 Posted July 29, 2011 Those 45 days were from 1798 to 1843. 'nuff said. There are too many layers upon layers upon layers of false premises you have setup, and I don't have the time nor the energy to keep up with your agenda on this board. Quote ~Lysimachus (Marcos S.) Author of article, Vindicating the Year-Day Principle of Prophetic Interpretation (see attachment for article) Currently writing a book, Vindicating the Historical School of Prophetic Interpretation Founder of the largest and fastest SDA Apologetics Group on Facebook, Seventh-Day Adventism - Defending the Pillars of the Faith Writer and apologetics contributor at Adventist Defense League Vindicating the Year-Day Principle of Prophetic Interpretation.pdf
Truth Files Posted July 29, 2011 Author Posted July 29, 2011 No you don't have the energy .... the time? .... I would say more like a ploy of defensive avoidance If you cannot make a better response than what you have given you should have not made one in the first place This is a pathetic statement: "Those 45 days were from 1798 to 1843. 'nuff said." Hardly enough .... prove your dating by the historical record .... and I am still waiting for you to render Zechariah 14 verse by verse using your method of historical allegory Looks like you may be doing the same thing with the 45 days, but you need to verify by the historical record Quote Stephen - Author - Truth Files
Lysimachus Posted July 29, 2011 Posted July 29, 2011 I'll get to Zechariah 14 in due season. And my response was accurate. I do lack the time, and do not have the energy. It is not easy to keep up with the posts you create. I don't have as much time as you do. Quote ~Lysimachus (Marcos S.) Author of article, Vindicating the Year-Day Principle of Prophetic Interpretation (see attachment for article) Currently writing a book, Vindicating the Historical School of Prophetic Interpretation Founder of the largest and fastest SDA Apologetics Group on Facebook, Seventh-Day Adventism - Defending the Pillars of the Faith Writer and apologetics contributor at Adventist Defense League Vindicating the Year-Day Principle of Prophetic Interpretation.pdf
ClubV12 Posted July 29, 2011 Posted July 29, 2011 No, I think there is indeed a "time element" that needs to be considered in trying to keep up with the truth file agenda. To what avail? He's been studying the bible for 40 years, I'd say the die has been cast. Moving on... Might be time for a moderator to consider some kind of reasonable limit on the number of threads started by one person in an hour, a day, a week, a month? SOMETHING to limit the constant flow of spam from one person. Enough is enough. Maybe give the guy his own forum or something (accessible only to members)!!!!! Quote
Truth Files Posted July 29, 2011 Author Posted July 29, 2011 I was asked by John317 to post this information [#464007] Quote Stephen - Author - Truth Files
ClubV12 Posted July 29, 2011 Posted July 29, 2011 TF, I don't care WHO asked you. LOOK at the this forum! You have competetly taken over ALL the threads. Get a life, away from here. I don't care WHO a person or WHAT he has to say, your dominance of this forum is ridiculous. Quote
Moderators John317 Posted July 29, 2011 Moderators Posted July 29, 2011 .... consider some kind of reasonable limit on the number of threads started by one person .... Yes, I think it would be reasonable to have some kind of limit. It would be best to deal with one or two subjects before moving on to several more within a short period of time. Let's try doing that, Truth Files. Quote John 3:16-17 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. [17] For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him.
Moderators John317 Posted July 29, 2011 Moderators Posted July 29, 2011 The time lapse of the Lord’s coming hour of trial and judgment upon the earth is presented in the book of Daniel and the book of Revelation Please explain what you mean by "the time lapse" and what is its biblical foundation? Originally Posted By: Truth Files The significant events of this future time frame are recorded in the unfulfilled portions of the visions of the following prophets [isaiah, Jeremiah, Ezekiel, Daniel, Joel, Obadiah; Micah; Zechariah]; the Lord’s discourse [Matthew 24; Mark 13; Luke 21]; and the book of Revelation Could you be specific? Quote the verses or give biblical references and show their relationships. Originally Posted By: Truth Files The composition: 1260 days + 1260 days + 30 for a total of 2550 days [the expression time, times, 1/2 time is equal to 3.5 prophetic years .... or 1260 days] The first 2520 days are the same as the 70th week decreed for Israel which is separated into two equal parts [Daniel 9:24-27]; specifically [9:27] [1 week of years [heptad] is equal to 7 years of 360 prophetic days counted for each year] Can you show the biblical principle of interpretation that causes you to believe these time periods are related in the way that you have arranged them? How does their context show that they should all be added together to make up 2550 days? Quote John 3:16-17 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. [17] For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him.
Moderators John317 Posted July 29, 2011 Moderators Posted July 29, 2011 It would be best-- that is, more people will actually read your texts-- if you quote two or three verses, rather that merely refer to a long string of unquoted passages. When you do this, it's also more effective when you add a comment with the verses so that people understand how you're relating the verses together. Remember that not everyone will see the verse in the same light as you do when they read it, so it is always good to let them know what you want them to notice in a particular text. I know this takes more time but it will be worth it. Quote John 3:16-17 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. [17] For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him.
Lysimachus Posted July 29, 2011 Posted July 29, 2011 Whatever Bible TF has been studying the last 40 years, it isn't the same Bible I'm reading, that's for sure. lol. Or perhaps it is the same Bible, just with pseudepigraphal and Jesuit paint splattered all over it. Eh? Quote ~Lysimachus (Marcos S.) Author of article, Vindicating the Year-Day Principle of Prophetic Interpretation (see attachment for article) Currently writing a book, Vindicating the Historical School of Prophetic Interpretation Founder of the largest and fastest SDA Apologetics Group on Facebook, Seventh-Day Adventism - Defending the Pillars of the Faith Writer and apologetics contributor at Adventist Defense League Vindicating the Year-Day Principle of Prophetic Interpretation.pdf
Truth Files Posted July 29, 2011 Author Posted July 29, 2011 "Please explain what you mean by "the time lapse" and what is its biblical foundation?" >The ordinary time measurement of time passing on the earth .... the biblical view of the same is no different "Could you be specific? Quote the verses or give biblical references and show their relationships." >I can, and very specifically .... all of the visions have both fulfilled and unfulfilled portions and not necessarily in cronological order within a prophet's wriring .... there are repeats and parantheticals >This rendering process is somewhat detailed and can be demonstrated by example and I would prefer to deal with it on a separate posting "The Literary Structure of the Prophets" >Can you show the biblical principle of interpretation that causes you to believe these time periods are related in the way that you have arranged them? How does their context show that they should all be added together to make up 2550 days? >The book of Daniel and Revelation's unfolding provide the order and arrangment .... I would suggest that you study the following [Daniel 9; 12; Revelation 11; 12; 13 .... these are the only passages of scripture that contain the information] and then ask more specific questions ... the patterns are there and anyone can discover and apply them Quote Stephen - Author - Truth Files
Lysimachus Posted July 29, 2011 Posted July 29, 2011 "Please explain what you mean by "the time lapse" and what is its biblical foundation?" >The ordinary time measurement of time passing on the earth .... the biblical view of the same is no different "Could you be specific? Quote the verses or give biblical references and show their relationships." >I can, and very specifically .... all of the visions have both fulfilled and unfulfilled portions and not necessarily in cronological order within a prophet's wriring .... there are repeats and parantheticals >This rendering process is somewhat detailed and can be demonstrated by example and I would prefer to deal with it on a separate posting "The Literary Structure of the Prophets" >Can you show the biblical principle of interpretation that causes you to believe these time periods are related in the way that you have arranged them? How does their context show that they should all be added together to make up 2550 days? >The book of Daniel and Revelation's unfolding provide the order and arrangment .... I would suggest that you study the following [Daniel 9; 12; Revelation 11; 12; 13 .... these are the only passages of scripture that contain the information] and then ask more specific questions ... the patterns are there and anyone can discover and apply them First we need to deal with why you reject the day-year principle of Ezekiel 4:6, Numbers 14:34, and about 80 other day-year parallels in Scripture. You are building your entire theology on the premise that the days being spoken of are literal days, and not prophetic days. So we can argue these points until we are blue in the face, but will never get anywhere as we believe Scriptures are consistent: - 70 weeks = 490 days = 490 years (Daniel 9:24-27) - 42 months = 1260 days = 1260 years (Revelation 13) - 2300 evening-mornings = 2300 days = 2300 years (Daniel 8) We believe consistent hermeneutics demands this interpretation. Unless we get past this hurdle, we will never get anywhere. Also, nowhere in Scriptures is there spoken of a separate "1260" days. There is only one period of 1260 days. All those periods mentioned in Revelation 11, 12, 13, and Daniel 7 are all speaking of the same period. In not one of those passages will you ever read of another 1260 attached to any of them. To create an additional 1260 simply because 2 of these make 7 years is to concoct your 7 years out of thin air. There is no future 70th week, therefore, none of this 2550 means anything. We're talking 70 CONSECUTIVE weeks. From 457 B.C. to 34 A.D. Quote ~Lysimachus (Marcos S.) Author of article, Vindicating the Year-Day Principle of Prophetic Interpretation (see attachment for article) Currently writing a book, Vindicating the Historical School of Prophetic Interpretation Founder of the largest and fastest SDA Apologetics Group on Facebook, Seventh-Day Adventism - Defending the Pillars of the Faith Writer and apologetics contributor at Adventist Defense League Vindicating the Year-Day Principle of Prophetic Interpretation.pdf
Lysimachus Posted July 29, 2011 Posted July 29, 2011 There is also nothing in Daniel 12:7-8 and 11 that indicates the 1290 and 1335 are distinct from the 1260. The contextual language demands that the 1260 in verse 7 is a "part of" the 1290 and 1335 of verses 11 and 12. Quote ~Lysimachus (Marcos S.) Author of article, Vindicating the Year-Day Principle of Prophetic Interpretation (see attachment for article) Currently writing a book, Vindicating the Historical School of Prophetic Interpretation Founder of the largest and fastest SDA Apologetics Group on Facebook, Seventh-Day Adventism - Defending the Pillars of the Faith Writer and apologetics contributor at Adventist Defense League Vindicating the Year-Day Principle of Prophetic Interpretation.pdf
Truth Files Posted July 29, 2011 Author Posted July 29, 2011 Daniel 8 plainly tells of 2300 days .... evenings and mornings are the cycle of temple worship This caclculation returns 1150 24 hour days There is no indicatuion of 2300 years in the vision This is SDA theology which EGW and her associates used to cover Miller's failed predictions So I don't buy it .... and there is no scriptural support Quote Stephen - Author - Truth Files
Lysimachus Posted July 29, 2011 Posted July 29, 2011 Daniel 8 plainly tells of 2300 days .... evenings and mornings are the cycle of temple worship This caclculation returns 1150 24 hour days There is no indicatuion of 2300 years in the vision This is SDA theology which EGW and her associates used to cover Miller's failed predictions So I don't buy it .... and there is no scriptural support Hundreds of expositors prior to Ellen White, or any Adventist, consistently interpreted the 2300 days as years. Even numerous Jewish expositors. I could quote you dozens and dozens. You do not appear to be knowledgeable about the interpretations of these passages prior to Adventism. An evening [ereb] and a morning [boqer] according to Genesis 1 is = to 1 day. In Hebrew, the phrase "evening-mornings [ereb-boqer]" is fused into one word, proving that the messenger giving the answer is referring to "full days". Therefore, it is impossible to divide 2300 into 1150. There is nothing in prophetic writ that matches any 1150 day time frame. I challenge you to identify one historical event by which the 1150 are tied to and meet exact fulfillment. Quote ~Lysimachus (Marcos S.) Author of article, Vindicating the Year-Day Principle of Prophetic Interpretation (see attachment for article) Currently writing a book, Vindicating the Historical School of Prophetic Interpretation Founder of the largest and fastest SDA Apologetics Group on Facebook, Seventh-Day Adventism - Defending the Pillars of the Faith Writer and apologetics contributor at Adventist Defense League Vindicating the Year-Day Principle of Prophetic Interpretation.pdf
Lysimachus Posted July 29, 2011 Posted July 29, 2011 Question for you Truth Files: Do you believe that the "1150" are future or past? If they are past, I'm assuming you believe they belong to the desecration of the Jewish Temple by Antiochus. Please show me the years and dates when this 1150 commenced and terminated, and please explain what happened at the beginning and terminating of this time frame. Quote ~Lysimachus (Marcos S.) Author of article, Vindicating the Year-Day Principle of Prophetic Interpretation (see attachment for article) Currently writing a book, Vindicating the Historical School of Prophetic Interpretation Founder of the largest and fastest SDA Apologetics Group on Facebook, Seventh-Day Adventism - Defending the Pillars of the Faith Writer and apologetics contributor at Adventist Defense League Vindicating the Year-Day Principle of Prophetic Interpretation.pdf
miz3 Posted July 30, 2011 Posted July 30, 2011 TF, I don't care WHO asked you. LOOK at the this forum! You have competetly taken over ALL the threads. Get a life, away from here. I don't care WHO a person or WHAT he has to say, your dominance of this forum is ridiculous. I don't think so! As a member he has the right to post as many subjects as he desires. I dare say that if the "subjects" were to your liking and spouted your cherished views that you would be creating such a fuss as this! In fact you have stated that this is an SDA forum and that this is "our forum", Meaning this forum is for SDA Orthodox (ClubV12's orthodoxy) views. At least that is the general gist of your expressions. I think you need to "lighten up" my friend. If you are not interested in what Truth Files is saying or posting IGNORE THEM! START YOUR OWN DISCUSSIONS! POST TEN OR TWELVE AT A TIME IF YOU LIKE. See what response you get from the membership! If members are interested they will read and they will post! If not then the "thread" dies on the vine! No one is forcing you ClubV12 so don't try your "Gestapo" tactics on other people! Quote
Lysimachus Posted July 30, 2011 Posted July 30, 2011 If I ever create my own forum some day in the future, at least I've gained plenty of experience of exactly how my rules will be written out, lol. ClubV12 would be my chief moderator. *how'd you like that Club?* I'm actually a member of a forum where each thread has to be approved by a team of moderators, as they vote to decide whether it will contribute to the forum. I might not do that with my forum, but I'll definitely set a limit to how many new topics they can create. Quote ~Lysimachus (Marcos S.) Author of article, Vindicating the Year-Day Principle of Prophetic Interpretation (see attachment for article) Currently writing a book, Vindicating the Historical School of Prophetic Interpretation Founder of the largest and fastest SDA Apologetics Group on Facebook, Seventh-Day Adventism - Defending the Pillars of the Faith Writer and apologetics contributor at Adventist Defense League Vindicating the Year-Day Principle of Prophetic Interpretation.pdf
miz3 Posted July 30, 2011 Posted July 30, 2011 Very revealing! Gestapo tactics continue to live even the Church! This is the very disease which will and is currently sinking the SDA Church! Quote
miz3 Posted July 30, 2011 Posted July 30, 2011 Also sounds like the RCC Inquisition! Are SDA's fulfilling their own prophecy! "mark of the beast"! Quote
Lysimachus Posted July 30, 2011 Posted July 30, 2011 Very revealing! Gestapo tactics continue to live even the Church! This is the very disease which will and is currently sinking the SDA Church! Adventism is not sinking. Buildings and corrupt people might be sinking, but not true Adventism. It will go on to the end triumphantly! :) Quote ~Lysimachus (Marcos S.) Author of article, Vindicating the Year-Day Principle of Prophetic Interpretation (see attachment for article) Currently writing a book, Vindicating the Historical School of Prophetic Interpretation Founder of the largest and fastest SDA Apologetics Group on Facebook, Seventh-Day Adventism - Defending the Pillars of the Faith Writer and apologetics contributor at Adventist Defense League Vindicating the Year-Day Principle of Prophetic Interpretation.pdf
Truth Files Posted July 30, 2011 Author Posted July 30, 2011 "There is nothing in prophetic writ that matches any 1150 day time frame." >Yes there is [Daniel 8:14; 8:26] .... the Hebrew translation reads "evening and morning 2300" .... 2300 sacrifices .... an 1150 day lapse time >This is the lapse time given from when the abomination of desolation will be completely set up on the temple mount to the end of the second 1260 days of the coming 70th week decreed for Israel [Daniel 12:11, Matthew 24:15-16] >It will take 110 days from the middle of the 70th week to complete the setting up of the abomination of desolation on the temple mount >The little horn and his followers will invade and occupy Israel at the middle of the 70th week decreed [Daniel 9:27 [the other prince who will come to desecrate]].... then 110 days will transpire to complete the setting up of the abomination of desolation .... the occupation of Israel will continue for another 1150 days to the end of the 70th week for a total of 1260 days [42 months] [Revelation 11:2; 13:5] >Then the Lord will come and rout the little horn and his followers, force them to battle at Armageddon, and destroy them [in the next 30 days] [isaiah 63:1-4; Ezekiel 38; 39; Daniel 9:27 [the desolators]; 11:46; Joel 2:20; 3:9-21; Micah 5:5-6; Zechariah 14:3; 14:12-14; Revelation 14:14-20; 16:1-16; 19:11-21] .... from the middle of the 70th week until destruction of the little horn and his followers will be 1290 days [Daniel 12:1] "I challenge you to identify one historical event by which the 1150 are tied to and meet exact fulfillment" >Read above .... and these things are not historical events .... all are future [Antiochus IV was involved in similar activities, but the little horn is a future king of the north] >Here is why: >Antiochus IV is the subject of Daniel 11:21-35 .... the little horn is the subject of the following [Daniel 7:7-25; 8:9-12; 8:23-25; 9:27 [the other prince]; 11:36-45; 12:7] >And know this .... Antiochus IV never conquered Egypt [a king of the south]; and he died in Persia on a military campaign >The little horn will conquer Egypt [a king of the south]; and he will die when the Lord comes to rout him from his occupation of Israel [Daniel 11:45] Quote Stephen - Author - Truth Files
Lysimachus Posted July 30, 2011 Posted July 30, 2011 You changed your position Truth Files! First you said the 1150 belong to Antiochus, now you say they are in the future! Wow, this is beyond words. Now I have to take out time to deal with another monkey wrench you are throwing to confuse your opponents. Quote ~Lysimachus (Marcos S.) Author of article, Vindicating the Year-Day Principle of Prophetic Interpretation (see attachment for article) Currently writing a book, Vindicating the Historical School of Prophetic Interpretation Founder of the largest and fastest SDA Apologetics Group on Facebook, Seventh-Day Adventism - Defending the Pillars of the Faith Writer and apologetics contributor at Adventist Defense League Vindicating the Year-Day Principle of Prophetic Interpretation.pdf
Truth Files Posted July 30, 2011 Author Posted July 30, 2011 "You changed your position Truth Files! First you said the 1150 belong to Antiochus" >I would never say this because it is not true .... you prove your comment .... do not mis-quote me >In fact all of my related postings tell just opposite of what you say .... all of them >I should be suspicious of your intent Quote Stephen - Author - Truth Files
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.