Have Troops replaced Missionaries?

[ClubV12]

It was recently mentioned in church we should pray for the troops in Afganhistan. A list of things we could send them was offered. Shaving cream, CD's, candy, etc. Great, wonderful, OK then.... but what about the missionairies?

What about the christian converts facing certain death under Sharia law if they are discovered? Like the most recent case, a 23 year old ADVENTIST who was turned in by someone he gave a bible too! And there have been other, ADVENTISTS!!! Who knows how many Christians there are in general.

These Christians are the "black op's" of the word of God in that country. We don't know who they are, how they work, what they do and if we did we would be risking their life. We can't send them "care packages" and Christmas cards, or letters of encouragement, like we can our troops.

Have the troops become Americas "missionaries"? If so, the new "crusades" are now under way and I think that is a fitting paralell. I'm not real interested in politics, I don't know why we there, what our goals are, what we expect to "win" when the smoke clears. As a Christian, I don't really care. I DO care, a lot, about what other Christians are facing in that country!!

I can't send them a care package, but they are now at the top of my list of prayer requests. God help them to stay strong in the Lord.

[Gail]

Amen!

[John317]

It was recently mentioned in church we should pray for the troops in Afganhistan. A list of things we could send them was offered. Shaving cream, CD's, candy, etc. Great, wonderful, OK then.... but what about the missionairies?

....Have the troops become Americas "missionaries"?

....I can't send them a care package, but they are now at the top of my list of prayer requests. God help them to stay strong in the Lord.

No, the troops certainly are not America's missionaries.

It's OK to pray both for our American troops, though, as well as for the Afghan people and for their leaders. We should pray that the Taliban will learn the truth about God and the Bible.

[ClubV12]

I don't know John317, I wonder how the troops were considered during the crusades? As "missionairies", with the blessing of the religious powers of those days? I hear from many of my nominal Christian friends comments and attitudes that suggest the troops are on a mission from God,,, and Country of course.

Does God support our troops? Of course the Islams feel the same way (but I discount the heathens). I wonder if God is in any of this, on either side?

It's a difficult subject because who wants to be seen as having a negative attitude toward our troops? Not me!! And yet, I wonder if the USA isn't waging it's own little "Jihad", that troops have replaced missionairies as the object of our affection, even in church.

It's the crusades I tell ya, all over again! I'm not sure we are going to get through this one. The Arab spring may well see Islam growing in power and control. If were going to do the crusade thing, were gonna need a LOT more troops in a lot more countries before this is over.

Imagine,,, we send in massive numbers of missionairies armed to the teeth, with bibles. :)

[John317]

I understand your points, but I have friends from Afghanistan who couldn't see their parents or other family members while the Taliban were in power. So their parents died without their being able to talk to them on the phone even. These friends of our came over here during the time when the USSR was in their country. They were brutal occupiers who regularly raped their women.

Our friends flew over to see their families this last summer. It was the first time they saw them since the 1980s.

Once the US went into Afghanistan and threw out the Taliban, the government asked the Seventh-day Adventist Church for assistence in setting up their hospital in Kabal. I believe SDAs are still helping to run that hospital.

I don't see it as the crusades. The American troops aren't interfering in the religious freedom of the people. Some individual soldiers do give out Bibles if the people ask for them, but no one is being told they must change religions. I believe God can use any circumstances to bring people to a knowledge of the truth if they are seeking for it.

I believe God will use Christians who are over there to introduce Christianity to people who are hungry for truth. It was illegal for a long time for anyone to talk to the people about Christ or the Bible. As soon as Americans are gone, it will probably be illegal again. So I think we should pray that God will use this time to get Bibles and the Adventist message into the country before it closes back up.

God is good at defeating evil with good. Maybe that is what He is doing now.

[ClubV12]

Whew, I don't even want to get into why we are there or what good we are doing, or not. But justifying it so families can get together or women/men won't be sexually assaulted or so that the people can get bibles, that could apply to a 1,000 hot spots around the globe. Somalia, Iran, many more come to mind.

My sympathies of course to those you know personall John317, but I'm sure you see my point. Where does it stop if thats the logic we employ for country building? We can't take on the whole world and we know conditions will continue to deteriorate globally to unimaginable horror on a scale the world has not yet seen.

Christians, Adventists, are being persecuted and killed for their faith all over the world. No doubt, like Afgahaistan, we are largely ignorant of whats going on behind the scenes. The Lord may well be shielding us from the horrors unfolding right now where communication is all but impossible. As Christians wait in jails unbeknownest to the world, awaiting execution for their faith. We catch only a small glimpse from time to time in some remote location of what might be going on. Often, little more than rumor.

While we worry about whats for dinner....

Siste White has quite a lot to say about the Civil War, the grievous sins on both sides. The North being punished. The Corrupt Generals (both sides) sending thousands to their death for political gain, with no respect for life. How Satan loved to see the poor solidiers mowed down. Angels intervening at times to limit the slaughter of troops. I'm not sure God takes sides on a war, it's just man showing his true colors and clothing it in "honor" and justifying it as "good". The poor soldiers getting maimed and killed, for what real purpose we will not know on this side of heaven.

There is no earthly solution, the Governments will wrestle with these problems in vain. Let the dead bury their dead, pray for the Christians, that their flight not be in the winter or on the Sabbath day. Soon, it's coming to America!

[BobRyan]

It was recently mentioned in church we should pray for the troops in Afganhistan. A list of things we could send them was offered. Shaving cream, CD's, candy, etc. Great, wonderful, OK then.... but what about the missionairies?

What about the christian converts facing certain death under Sharia law if they are discovered? Like the most recent case, a 23 year old ADVENTIST who was turned in by someone he gave a bible too! And there have been other, ADVENTISTS!!! Who knows how many Christians there are in general.

These Christians are the "black op's" of the word of God in that country. We don't know who they are, how they work, what they do and if we did we would be risking their life. We can't send them "care packages" and Christmas cards, or letters of encouragement, like we can our troops.

Have the troops become Americas "missionaries"? If so, the new "crusades" are now under way

I was right there with you ... until that last sentence.

Seems like a nonsequitter. Apples vs oranges.

Our work as Christians whether in Afganistan or America is not limited to "where are there troops" and that is pretty much the case world wide.

Not sure how you are making that connection - except that when we urge our people to pray - we must never forget the work of Christians in the many countries where the Gospel is being proclaimed (regardless of troops present).

in Christ,

Bob

[aldona]

It was recently mentioned in church we should pray for the troops in Afganhistan. A list of things we could send them was offered. Shaving cream, CD's, candy, etc. Great, wonderful, OK then.... but what about the missionairies?

What about the christian converts facing certain death under Sharia law if they are discovered? Like the most recent case, a 23 year old ADVENTIST who was turned in by someone he gave a bible too! And there have been other, ADVENTISTS!!! Who knows how many Christians there are in general.

These Christians are the "black op's" of the word of God in that country. We don't know who they are, how they work, what they do and if we did we would be risking their life. We can't send them "care packages" and Christmas cards, or letters of encouragement, like we can our troops.

Have the troops become Americas "missionaries"? If so, the new "crusades" are now under way and I think that is a fitting paralell. I'm not real interested in politics, I don't know why we there, what our goals are, what we expect to "win" when the smoke clears. As a Christian, I don't really care. I DO care, a lot, about what other Christians are facing in that country!!

I can't send them a care package, but they are now at the top of my list of prayer requests. God help them to stay strong in the Lord.

[olger]

Salient !!

[phkrause]

Club I'm in agreement with John and Bob. We have SDA missionaries in many countries, including the middle east. So I would say that our support in whatever way possible would be great. Did you know that while Iraq was very hostile to many other church groups, Sadam actually held the SDA church in high regard. That can also be said of quite a few middle eastern countries, like Jordan, Israel, I believe Eygpt, but am not sure.

[Dottie]

A little off topic, but I remember as a child, we were always told to pray for the "colporteurs and the missionaries."

[John317]

.... justifying it so families can get together or women/men won't be sexually assaulted or so that the people can get bibles, that could apply to a 1,000 hot spots around the globe. Somalia, Iran, many more come to mind.

I'm not justifying the war but only showing the results of our presence there in comparison with what was happening before.

[John317]

I'm not sure God takes sides on a war, it's just man showing his true colors and clothing it in "honor" and justifying it as "good". The poor soldiers getting maimed and killed, for what real purpose we will not know on this side of heaven.

I have no doubt that Providence was involved in the final outcome of the American Revolutionary War, the Civil War, World War II, as well as the Cold War.

That certainly doesn't mean everything that happened in those wars was good. There's always a lot of evil that occurs in war, but if we look at what would have happened if the other side in those wars had won, we can see that God had his hand in the events.

For instance, what would have happened in terms of spreading the gospel if the Nazis and the Japanese had won WWII? What would it have meant for the Jews and for many millions of other people who would have been destroyed by the Nazis?

What would have happened if the USSR and the other communists had won the Cold War?

[ClubV12]

Point well taken on who wins the war! Sometimes, Israel lost....

Anyway, for every family that got to make a phone call of get reunited or what ever, there's a child who's Daddy was KIA. Or came home without any legs.

Some wars need to be fought, like WW2. Some wars are just good business and advance political careers. I don't know that I can place the "troops" on any higher level than anyone else in America! Police, fireman, doctors, teachers, my nieghbors. Maybe I can, but I'm saying I don't KNOW if I can, I don't know if I SHOULD. I don't KNOW what is God's will in this war or what His plan is.

We typically pray for anyone that asks us to. The sick and hurt and troubled in our church. Sister White didn't always pray for someone when she was asked. She didn't always pray for healing or even their life when she did. Maybe we take prayer for granted at times and it becomes presumption, not faith?

Like the guy who asked for prayer to stop drinking and then later declared prayer doesn't work, because he still drinks! Or the person who is sick and OBVIOUSLY is ignoring basic health rules! My brother severed in 'Nam, twice. He LIKED killing, it was all he wanted to do. He to was one of the "troops".