Who Art Thou? He Was Asked.

[Gibs]

Of a certainty all Christians should believe Yahshua/Jesus is THE only WAY the TRUTH and the LIFE. But not all as when He was here as one of us know for sure who He is. He was asked “Who Art Thou”. This time we will look at the scriptures that reveal Who He is and the Father and the Holy Spirit.

I don't think it is hard to clear up this issue. The Father, 1, the Son, 2, Holy Spirit, 3, are one in Truth. The Son was brought out of Himself, the Father before anything and the Father sent Him the Son to do all the creation, all of the hosts and everything. His name though was LORD, YHWH, of Hosts before Bethlehem. First lets read -

Col 1:16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

Col 1:17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist. (Then --)

Isa 44:6 Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and his redeemer the LORD of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God.

Isa 44:8 Fear ye not, neither be afraid: have not I told thee from that time, and have declared it? ye are even my witnesses. Is there a God beside me? yea, there is no God; I know not any.

All the Gods there are is brought out in Isa 44:6 above and notice "I am the first, and I am the last". Now read -

Re 22:13 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last. - - now I ask how many firsts can you have? Just one, it means before any other.

OK now let's see who the Holy Spirit is. - -

Joh 4:24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

Since we know the Father and the Son are God and above Jesus tells us what He is plus the Father.

People all get it wrong with our Lord's statement here - -

Joh 10:30 I and my Father are one. Truly yes Truly one substance.

Now another verse - -

2Co 5:19 To wit, that God ( the Father ) was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

Then the Lord's statement to Philip - -

Joh 14:9 Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father?

You should see that Jesus the son has revealed who He and the Father are

Mt 11:27 All things are delivered unto me of my Father: and no man knoweth the Son, but the Father; neither knoweth any man the Father, save the Son, and he to whomsoever the Son will reveal him.

To sum it up He has told us He and the Father ARE ONE and that they are Spirit, The Holy Spirit. He came to us in the form of His Son and now abides in us by Spirit. He is not limited that He can not be what He needs to be for the salvation of man and that plan was laid before anything. And so hence, the Father, Son and Holy Spirit ARE ONE and so 1 John is correct, -

-

1Jo 5:7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.

When He Jesus has finished all He is brought fourth out of the Father to do, as He says, I was sent, - -

Joh 17:21 That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.

Then when it is finished. - -

1Co 15:24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.

1Co 15:25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet. ( Yet reigning )

1Co 15:26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.

1Co 15:27 For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith, all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him.

( Only the Father is excepted )

1Co 15:28 And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.

The Son then becomes subject to the Father and so now the Father is as He was before bringing forth an equal from Himself to take care of the rebellion He knew would happen.

Also now the Son is just that, His Son the Prince and also at the same time one of us. He no longer is the ruling Deity He had been to accomplish the Redemption plan. The father gave of Himself and dwelt in the Body prepared Him and so knows us as He was one of us, for remember the father was in Christ.

2 Cor 5:19 above. The Body prepared verse is, - -

Heb 10:5 Wherefore when he cometh into the world, he saith, Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, but a body hast thou prepared me:

Col 1:19 For it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell;

Col 2:9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

A body was prepared that He would have blood to shed as the blood of animals etc. could not suffice.

Heb 10:4 For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins.

Heb 10:5 Wherefore when he cometh into the world, he saith, Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, but a body hast thou prepared me:

Notice this verse very carefully,

Ac 20:28 Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood.

We sing “How Great Thou Art” in much awe realizing this.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

Gibs

[BibleOnly]

"Joh 4:24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth."

But what does this mean ?

Phl 3:3 For we are the circumcision, which worship God in the spirit, and rejoice in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh.

Jhn 4:23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.

It's worth reading the verse before and noting that people did not do what God required, in the OT, nor could they.

Eph 6:18 Praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, and watching thereunto with all perseverance and supplication for all saints;

Jud 1:20 ¶ But ye, beloved, building up yourselves on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Ghost,

Jud 1:21 Keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life.

Rom 8:26 Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.

1Cr 14:14 For if I pray in an [unknown] tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful.

1Cr 14:15 What is it then? I will pray with the spirit, and I will pray with the understanding also: I will sing with the spirit, and I will sing with the understanding also.

1 Cor 14-15 defines 'prayer in the Spirit' as tongues. Romans explains why we pray in the Spirit. Many verses tell us to pray in the Spirit. Why does the bible keep talking about this, if it doesn't mean anything ? How do you pray in the Spirit ? How do you not pray in the Spirit ? Paul says the difference is that prayer not in the Spirit is prayer we can understand.

[Gibs]

He must be worshiped in Spirit because He is Spirit, and in Truth or it is not accepeable. Our prayers don't have to ascend nowhere as if you are one truly in Him and He in you His Spirit dwells in you and tongues of no kind is needed. No audible prayer is needed. We communicate continually and He is our guide.

No one can have the excuse they are not able to do what He wants them to do. What keeps those of the OT or the new from it is rebellion, plain and simple.

When all it ever took and takes now is full and complete surrender and not one tittle bit withheld and your will becomes His will and your love the same as His Love. It's what one loves to do and whether one is willing. Whose are you if you are not willing to do His will? Answer, you are his whom you do the will of.

Most have a "pet" thing that is too precious for them to give up. He, Jesus Christ is the most precious and all must be given, a falling on that Rock and being broken. Like a wild mustang horse, when you finally get him broke to allow you to ride or work he is of value. Until that is done he is just a useless hay burner.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[BibleOnly]

He must be worshiped in Spirit because He is Spirit, and in Truth or it is not accepeable.

[Gibs]

I pray in the Spirit a lot and that is my communicating with Him as my best friend. His Spirit is my guide and I listen for His speaking to me. I worship Him the same in Spirit and give Him all the praise and worship of my heart.

No I don't need to speak in tongues to worship Him or talk to Him as He is the author of all the tongues there is and anyone of them he understands perfectly well.

Speaking another tongue is not a gift He has given me at this time and when He does then I would want to put it to good use as He does nothing in vain.

Whatever He chooses to give me I have nothing to bragg of. He who has the most and greatest gifts has the most work to do.

Lu 12:48 But he that knew not, and did commit things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few stripes. For unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be much required: and to whom men have committed much, of him they will ask the more.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[BibleOnly]

I pray in the Spirit a lot

I am sorry, but, given that you don't 'pray in the Spirit' in accordance with the Bible definition, how do you know when your prayer is 'in the Spirit' and when it is not ? Why are you free to define what this means for yourself ?

[Gibs]

What I ask is your definition? Must I do it in a tongue? I have a tongue that is native to me, Hillbilly English, but not a foriegn one. What tongue do you have or do you have it identified? Just curious.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[BibleOnly]

I don't think it's right for us to seek to define anything without using the Bible to do it. I've posted the verses already:

1Cr 14:14 For if I pray in an [unknown] tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful.

1Cr 14:15 What is it then? I will pray with the spirit, and I will pray with the understanding also: I will sing with the spirit, and I will sing with the understanding also.

Prayer in tongues is prayer in the Spirit. It is different to prayer that we understand. Hence also the dichotomy between worship in Spirit and in truth. We need to do both, we need to be able to pray in the Spirit ( with the Spirit giving us the words ) and also in truth ( that is, through an understanding of the will of God and what we should pray for ). We need to worship in Spirit ( that is, tongues ) and in truth ( that is, praising God in our language, and understanding what the Bible says and what God's plan is ).

[12tribes]

I don't think it's right for us to seek to define anything without using the Bible to do it. I've posted the verses already:

1Cr 14:14 For if I pray in an [unknown] tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful.

1Cr 14:15 What is it then? I will pray with the spirit, and I will pray with the understanding also: I will sing with the spirit, and I will sing with the understanding also.

Prayer in tongues is prayer in the Spirit. It is different to prayer that we understand. Hence also the dichotomy between worship in Spirit and in truth. We need to do both, we need to be able to pray in the Spirit ( with the Spirit giving us the words ) and also in truth ( that is, through an understanding of the will of God and what we should pray for ). We need to worship in Spirit ( that is, tongues ) and in truth ( that is, praising God in our language, and understanding what the Bible says and what God's plan is ).

According to the verse you quoted 1 Cor 14:15 to pray with the spirit is to pray with the understanding

[BibleOnly]

Wow.

1Cr 14:14 For if I pray in an [unknown] tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful.

1Cr 14:15 What is it then? I will pray with the spirit, and I will pray with the understanding also: I will sing with the spirit, and I will sing with the understanding also.

When I pray in the Spirit, my understanding is unfruitful. So, v 15 says that Paul does both. I can't even begin to see how it says that prayer in the understanding, is prayer in the Spirit, especially as verse 14 says that it is not. If v 15 says 'I pray in the Spirit in ways I can understand', then this is a forced reading, in context, because it would mean Paul was saying he does not pray in tongues, yet he says several times in chapter 14 that he does. In addition, it would mean that the only definition of 'prayer in the Spirit' we have in the Bible, is one telling us how NOT to do it, and by implication, telling us that God gives a gift we should not use.

I'm sorry, but you're clutching at straws. Look at all the verses, in context with one another. Where does the Bible tell you how to pray in the Spirit ? Why does God require this ? Why does it 'keep us in God's love', if we are not told how it is done ? If we do it by default, why tell us we need to do it at all ?

[Gibs]

Well then I am with you there except I don't put so much into tongues. I don't condemn tongues as some do but do recognize many do in a false tongue that God or noone could know as it is not of any understanding. We know the Spirit maketh groanings for us as He knows better than we our actual need and prayer.

Ro 8:26 Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.

Eph 1:6 To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world. the beloved.

[BibleOnly]

" do recognize many do in a false tongue that God or noone could know as it is not of any understanding"

That is why 1 Cor 12 says both that no-one speaking by the Spirit can curse Jesus ( because they had people who claimed the same thing ) and no-one can call Jesus Lord unless they can pray in the Spirit. There is not one verse in the bible that says there's any such thing as 'false tongues' or that satan can answer people calling on God.

"Eph 1:6 To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in"

It's important to remember that Paul's letters were written to churches and assume everyone reading them is a Christian

[12tribes]

Wow.

1Cr 14:14 For if I pray in an [unknown] tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful.

1Cr 14:15 What is it then? I will pray with the spirit, and I will pray with the understanding also: I will sing with the spirit, and I will sing with the understanding also.

When I pray in the Spirit, my understanding is unfruitful. So, v 15 says that Paul does both. I can't even begin to see how it says that prayer in the understanding, is prayer in the Spirit, especially as verse 14 says that it is not. If v 15 says 'I pray in the Spirit in ways I can understand', then this is a forced reading, in context, because it would mean Paul was saying he does not pray in tongues, yet he says several times in chapter 14 that he does. In addition, it would mean that the only definition of 'prayer in the Spirit' we have in the Bible, is one telling us how NOT to do it, and by implication, telling us that God gives a gift we should not use.

I'm sorry, but you're clutching at straws. Look at all the verses, in context with one another. Where does the Bible tell you how to pray in the Spirit ? Why does God require this ? Why does it 'keep us in God's love', if we are not told how it is done ? If we do it by default, why tell us we need to do it at all ?

1 Corinthians 14:15

(15) What is it then? I will pray with the spirit, and I will pray with the understanding also: I will sing with the spirit, and I will sing with the understanding also.

[BibleOnly]

Exactly. So, I will pray in the Spirit ( tongues ) and I will also pray in the understanding. He does both, but they are different. The language is a bit forced, if it means 'I do both at the same time'. It also contradicts the rest of the chapter.

[12tribes]

Exactly. So, I will pray in the Spirit ( tongues ) and I will also pray in the understanding. He does both, but they are different. The language is a bit forced, if it means 'I do both at the same time'. It also contradicts the rest of the chapter.

If we do not pray with understanding we do not pray with the spirit

[Gibs]

This tongues understanding needs to be handled with caution today as many are making it a test and a proof that they are of God and yet may not have the fruits.

It used to be done a lot in some "holy roller" pentecostal churches and the old people all frowned on it. I never have been in such a gathering myself.

I think I witnessed several years ago, can't remember if it was Benny Hinn show or some other but I wasn't of that I can tell you.

I stand to be cautious on that issue.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[BibleOnly]

Originally Posted By: BibleOnly

Exactly. So, I will pray in the Spirit ( tongues ) and I will also pray in the understanding. He does both, but they are different. The language is a bit forced, if it means 'I do both at the same time'. It also contradicts the rest of the chapter.

If we do not pray with understanding we do not pray with the spirit

I am sorry, but that is insane. You just called Paul a liar. Let's revisit what the Bible says, instead of pushing our own ideas:

1Cr 14:14 For if I pray in an [unknown] tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful.

When Paul speaks in tongues, he prays in the Spirit, but does not understand.

Either way, the Bible says we need to pray in the Spirit. You're saying there's basically no such thing, because you don't think there's any way to choose to pray in the Spirit. Why do you think the Bible tells us over and over to do something that we cannot choose to do or not do ?

[BibleOnly]

This tongues understanding needs to be handled with caution today as many are making it a test and a proof that they are of God and yet may not have the fruits.

It used to be done a lot in some "holy roller" pentecostal churches and the old people all frowned on it. I never have been in such a gathering myself.

I think I witnessed several years ago, can't remember if it was Benny Hinn show or some other but I wasn't of that I can tell you.

I stand to be cautious on that issue.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

Benny Hinn is a moron, I say that every time he's brought up. The NT makes clear there will be backsliders. People who correctly state that tongues is the proof of the Spirit, but do not show the fruits of the Spirit, are backsliders. Their failing does not change what the Bible says, any more than knowing someone who talks about Jesus and seems a nice person, proves that what they say is correct.

[Gibs]

It is good you see that and Benny is not the only one to pass by.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[BibleOnly]

No, the path to salvation is narrow and few find it, even amongst those who speak in tongues.

[Gibs]

For sure as that strait gate is narrow also and few get through it to begin with and Jesus said it and it is for sure a truth to stand.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.