The ‘Sign of Jonah’ mystery explained!

[jamesonofthunder]

“For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale’s belly, so shall the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.”-Matthew 12:40.

With all of the controversy circling the interpretation of Matthew 12, it would be appropriate that we first see what the founders of our faith believed on this subject to discern the truth.

About Matthew 12, James White said;

“The ‘earth’ in this case must mean the powers of earth, or the power and control of wicked men, and the Devil… Thus, Jesus was in the heart of the earth, or controlled and held by the powers of earth and hell, from the time that he was betrayed into the hands of sinners, until he arose from the dead, in triumph and victory. Jesus was as much in the heart of the earth when before Pilate, and on the cross, as he was while in Joseph’s tomb. With this view, all the Scripture testimony will harmonize.” {PTJW December, 1849, Art. 5, p. 39.5}

In my vision, I could see Jesus willingly accept my sins and they were what were causing His shame. So innocent, He was being pressed by immense pressure, like Jonah in the belly of the great fish at the bottom of the deepest ocean, and I was permitted to view this. The pressure was so immense, that it forced “great drops of blood falling down to the ground.” (Luke 22:44)

The evening of His last supper, when He left the Eastern Gate and crossed the Brook Kidron, begins the three days and three nights ‘sign of Jonah’. This view gives a more perfect comprehension of the spiritual and physical death that Jesus suffered. Only when counting the days from the time Jesus entered the Garden on Thursday evening, does it come fully to three days and three nights. Perfectly fulfilled, this is the true understanding of the sign of Jonah. It is a sign that would be rediscovered in the last days, showing the people who discover it and the world, it is from God.

Thursday Evening (Last supper/ Gethsemane) ~ Friday Morning; the first day

Friday Evening (The Cross) ~ Saturday Morning; the Second day

Saturday Evening (the tomb) ~ Sunday Morning; the third day

When I later heard a sermon and learned that the name ‘Jonah’ means ‘Dove’, the Spirit of remembrance led my mind immediately to the Great Controversy, where it is said that in the Garden of Gethsemane, after the Messiah’s hour of torment, after the angel strengthened Him, “a dove-like form overshadowed Him.” {DA 694.5} Just as it did at his baptism of water in the Jordan! I knew God had proven to me this great truth, Jesus had His baptism of fire (blood) in the Garden of Gethsemane, and this begins the 3 days and nights sign of Jonah..

[jamesonofthunder]

Jameson, never have you spoken purer words of truth, "... Jesus had His baptism of fire (blood) in the Garden of Gethsemane, and this begins the 3 days and nights sign of Jonah."

I believe as you do about that, and praise God for it.

You will notice that James White's analysis is a bit different. He places the goings in of Chrisat into his final conflict with evil, in the morning of daylight when He was delivered over to be crucified.

That is one whole night TOO LATE.

It is true, "The _EVENING_ (emphasis mine) of His last supper ... begins the three days and three nights ‘sign of Jonah’".

Very good Seventh Day, you are correct. But I'm sure he meant when Jesus was handed over to the mob in Gethsemane after Jesus had his hour of Darkness.

"No traces of His recent agony were visible as Jesus stepped forth to meet His betrayer. Standing in advance of His disciples He said, “Whom seek ye?” They answered, “Jesus of Nazareth.” Jesus replied, “I am He.” As these words were spoken, the angel who had lately ministered to Jesus moved between Him and the mob. A divine light illuminated the Saviour’s face, and a dovelike form overshadowed Him. In the presence of this divine glory, the murderous throng could not stand for a moment. They staggered back. Priests, elders, soldiers, and even Judas, fell as dead men to the ground. {DA 694.5}

The use of Mr. White quote was to illustrate that the beginning of this comprehension started even in the days of our church's founding. I'm sure James White himself would be pleased with the progress of the knowledge of the sign of Jonah.

We are in a time when all imperfect beliefs will be refined to completion. We need to faithfully fulfill the prophecy.

“And beside this, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue knowledge; and to knowledge temperance; and to temperance patience; and to patience godliness; and to godliness brotherly kindness; and to brotherly kindness charity. For if these things be in you, and abound, they make you that ye shall neither be barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.” These words are full of instruction, and strike the keynote of victory. The apostle presents before the believers the ladder of Christian progress, every step of which represents advancement in the knowledge of God, and in the climbing of which there is to be no standstill. Faith, virtue, knowledge, temperance, patience, godliness, brotherly kindness, and charity are the rounds of the ladder. We are saved by climbing round after round, mounting step after step, to the height of Christ’s ideal for us. Thus He is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption. {AA 530.1}

[jamesonofthunder]

When the sign of the dove over shadowed Jesus in Gethsemane this is the sign of Jonah...

The word Jonah literally means 'Dove'.

"No traces of His recent agony were visible as Jesus stepped forth to meet His betrayer. Standing in advance of His disciples He said, “Whom seek ye?” They answered, “Jesus of Nazareth.” Jesus replied, “I am He.” As these words were spoken, the angel who had lately ministered to Jesus moved between Him and the mob. A divine light illuminated the Saviour’s face, and a dovelike form overshadowed Him. In the presence of this divine glory, the murderous throng could not stand for a moment. They staggered back. Priests, elders, soldiers, and even Judas, fell as dead men to the ground. {DA 694.5}

So like James White said, when betrayed into the hands of sinners Jesus was as much in the heart of the earth as when in the Grave.

In the upper room at sundown Jesus said "now is the hour of the powers of darkness" Then He left the upper room and headed to Gethsemane and each Coptic gospel records that He crossed the brook Kidron, which literally means darkness.

The point that was so greatly illustrated to my heart was the fact that no one could have touched Jesus if He hadn't received the sins of the world yet.

[jamesonofthunder]

The bible and SOP records that the walk to the Mount of Olives was a Sabbath days journey. Gethsemane was on that side of the Brook Kidron. So when Jesus left the upper room it was still evening...on His way to Gethsemane three chapters were recorded by John of things Jesus said on His way there, so He wasn't in a hurry. By the time Jesus entered Gethsemane it was dark/ dark and the city was quiet and Jesus was already stumbling under the weight.

I believe when Jesus left the eastern Gate of Jerusalem He was showing the universe that He had decided to go through it. He did it in His own strength. By the time He was praying for the cup to pass from Him, the Father already wasn't talking with him.

The brook Kidron is outside of the Holy Precinct. It is where Jesus crossed over, leaving the security of heaven.

That was on the bridge Mrs. White saw in vision with the stream under it with the secret spring of healing water that cures all manner of diseases.

[Twilight II]

Originally Posted By: jamesonofthunder

......................

The evening of His last supper, when He left the Eastern Gate and crossed the Brook Kidron, begins the three days and three nights ‘sign of Jonah’. This view gives a more perfect comprehension of the spiritual and physical death that Jesus suffered. Only when counting the days from the time Jesus entered the Garden on Thursday evening, does it come fully to three days and three nights. Perfectly fulfilled, this is the true understanding of the sign of Jonah. It is a sign that would be rediscovered in the last days, showing the people who discover it and the world, it is from God.

Thursday Evening (Last supper/ Gethsemane) ~ Friday Morning; the first day

Friday Evening (The Cross) ~ Saturday Morning; the Second day

Saturday Evening (the tomb) ~ Sunday Morning; the third day

When I later heard a sermon and learned that the name ‘Jonah’ means ‘Dove’, the Spirit of remembrance led my mind immediately to the Great Controversy, where it is said that in the Garden of Gethsemane, after the Messiah’s hour of torment, after the angel strengthened Him, “a dove-like form overshadowed Him.” {DA 694.5} Just as it did at his baptism of water in the Jordan! I knew God had proven to me this great truth, Jesus had His baptism of fire (blood) in the Garden of Gethsemane, and this begins the 3 days and nights sign of Jonah..

SD:

The evening of His last supper, begins the three days and three nights ‘sign of Jonah’ that Jesus The Sinless suffered the spiritual and physical death sinners’ due, to make atonement for their sins and bring about reconciliation between God and them.

The “three days” count from the “EVENING” that Jesus “sat down with the twelve” and declared, “My hour is come”, and later entered the Garden of the Place of the Winepress and ‘tread the winepress by Himself’. Next morning sunrise “it was six-o-clock”) when He was delivered over to be crucified; the third hour they crucified Him; He died the same day, after He had announced with great Voice of God: “It is Finished”,

“MID-AFTERNOON – THE NINTH HOUR”,

“and there was a great earthquake … and

the graves of many saints opened”.

“AND EVERYBODY LEFT!”

How many people pay attention to this statement in Luke 23:48?

Why do they not heed this Word of God?

Why do they lie against it and say, No, “everybody stayed and watched” … as Joseph allegedly buried Him there and then?

Because it is satan’s servants who ‘translated’ this text so, to suit their BIG LIE of a Friday crucifixion, and to DESTROY THE BONE-DAY of the Passover of Yahweh.

The second of the “three days” began JUST LIKE the first!

With “it having been EVENING

and it was The Preparation which is the Fore-Sabbath”

the Sixth Day of the week …” already”, having BEGUN!!!!

“BONE-DAY” / “THAT DAY” / “THE SELFSAME DAY”, had begun. Not was ending!

“Suddenly now there came Joseph” Luke 23:50 and he STARTED to negotiate in order to obtain the body of Jesus in order to bury Him. Not had finished to bury Him!

THEREFORE, it is written, when Joseph had CLOSED the grave,

“And THAT DAY, was The Preparation as it began to dawn towards the Sabbath Day MID-AFTERNOON—

… JUST LIKE on the day before when Jesus had died, it is written, “it was the ninth hour” “mid-afternoon”!

So both the first and the second of the “three days” of the Passover of Yahweh BEGAN exactly the same, and ENDED exactly the same.

And so it was with “the third day” of the “three days”, “the third day ,,, Christ … according to the Scriptures …” the PASSOVER-Scriptures … “ROSE FROM THE DEAD AGAIN” 1Corinthians 15:3,4.

EVENING was it when “the women began to rest the Sabbath according to the (Fourth) Commandment” Luke 23:56b …

… and “MID-AFTERNOON” was it “as it SABBATH’S began to dawn towards the First Day of the week when suddenly there was a great earthquake and the angel of the Lord descending from heaven hurled away the stone from the grave.”

All the mistakes of the traditional misconceptions are put right through abiding to truth as it is written with respect to TWO factors …

One… the CORRECT, LITERAL AND IDIOMATIC TRUE meanings of the words, rendered;

Two… giving account as it should of the BONE-day according to the passover-type of Jesus’ “three days” of “three days and three nights in the HEART of the earth”.

There is nothing complicated in all this; it requires no special enlightenment or above average intellect to grasp; but it does require …

First… preparedness to review one’s own ossified stereotype ideas about the “three days” of Jesus’ Last Passover.

Two… boldness to enter into unknown territory of Biblical research and soul-searching.

Three… the honesty of a conscience made free by the Truth as it is in Jesus Christ WITHOUT RESPECT to the wisdom of the world or of self-professed prophets.

Because this (my view) you won’t find anywhere else. Does that make it wrong, or false?

You have all the right to think so. Only supply your Scriptures against it. Only supply your Scriptures for your own view; and I shall do the same from my side; so that the different views may be weighed against one another justly.

Some interesting points in here and your logic seems sound, I will keep reading and following. :-)

[jamesonofthunder]

Yes exactly, it's like the spark plug of Christianity.

Think on this, When Jesus went through His 40 days in the wilderness He was tempted and sinned not, so He could not be killed. 40 days no water? He was not Not like Moses 40 days in the Garden of Eden before the Lord, but He was in the flesh in the wilderness of sin.

But when He was tempted again by Satan at the end of His ministry, this time He vicariously accepted our sins upon His head being counted amongst the transgressors. Satan had full sway in tormenting His mind with fear. He feared that He would never again stand in the presence of His Holy Father. But He accepted our sins upon His head and willingly went to hell for us anyway, so we don't have to sweat drops of blood in the second resurrection at the second death.

After receiving our sins, THEN and only then could He be killed.

[jamesonofthunder]

“Then returned they unto Jerusalem from the mount called Olivet, which is from Jerusalem a Sabbath day’s journey. And when they were come in, they went up into an upper room, where abode both Peter, and James, and John, and Andrew, Philip, and Thomas, Bartholomew, and Matthew, James the son of Alpheus, and Simon Zelotes, and Judas the brother of James. These all continued with one accord in prayer and supplication, with the women, and Mary the mother of Jesus, and with his brethren.” {GH March 1, 1904, par. 13}

[jamesonofthunder]

Acts 1:12

King James Version (KJV)

12Then returned they unto Jerusalem from the mount called Olivet, which is from Jerusalem a sabbath day's journey.

[skyblue888]

So like James White said, when betrayed into the hands of sinners Jesus was as much in the heart of the earth as when in the Grave.

______________

I agree with this wholeheartedly. I believe it is the right understanding and it makes perfect sense.

The first time I heard this teaching "the heart of the earth" was in the early eighties. As far as I am concerned F.T. Wright from Australia was the first one to teach this. He taught this in the seventies.

When did u come up with this understanding james?

sky

[jamesonofthunder]

I agree with this wholeheartedly. I believe it is the right understanding and it makes perfect sense.

The first time I heard this teaching "the heart of the earth" was in the early eighties. As far as I am concerned F.T. Wright from Australia was the first one to teach this. He taught this in the seventies.

When did u come up with this understanding james?

sky

I was lead to this understanding during a Holy Spirit moment in support of my vision of Jesus as the Red Heifer in Gethsemane, close to a year after the vision.

I saw Jesus covered in Blood and the Red Heifer super imposed over him in the Garden.

Then I found all sorts of supporting evidence which led me to this understanding and many other proofs so I wouldn't become discourage after the church tried to beat the vision out of me.

I also was shown that the understanding that came from the vision explained many many other undiscovered truths.

Have you ever wondered why it was a serpent raised on the pole in the wilderness? It was because Jesus had already become sin in the Garden of Gethsemane, and by looking at Him there we transfer our sins upon Him. Then He takes them to the Cross to die with them, like the ultimate super hero.

If you read that vision now, I know you will be blessed. Amen.

With illustrations...

http://redheifersbloodysweat.blogspot.com/2011/12/red-heifer.html

[jamesonofthunder]

Quote:

"The first time I heard this teaching "the heart of the earth" was in the early eighties. As far as I am concerned F.T. Wright from Australia was the first one to teach this. He taught this in the seventies."

Thank you very much for giving me another proof of the vision.

This is how God works for me. I see a vision or hear His voice teach me something then I have the privilege of proving it to myself through the bible and the Spirit of Prophecy and after by hearing a sermon that someone else usually has heard and tells me about, then I get to glorify God for His proof in front of witnesses.

He NEVER fails to answer my prayers.

This exactly how I found the Sabbath and the SDA church. No man taught me, the Holy Spirit did.

I was quietly led by the voice to fast and pray while reading the word of God. Then on the seventh day of my fast I came to Matthew 12 were it says "the Son of Man is Lord also of the Sabbath day" and a light went on in my mind and I could feel neural pathways connect and then I could really hear that voice say "this will lead you home to me".

It was like hearing my Fathers voice for the first time as a baby, imprinting that vocal signature on my heart.

[jasd]

Not attempting to be adversarial but observant...

Quote:

“The ‘earth’ in this case must mean the powers of earth, or the power and control of wicked men, and the Devil… Thus, Jesus was in the heart of the earth, or controlled and held by the powers of earth and hell, from the time that he was betrayed into the hands of sinners, until he arose from the dead, in triumph and victory. Jesus was as much in the heart of the earth when before Pilate, and on the cross, as he was while in Joseph’s tomb. With this view, all the Scripture testimony will harmonize.” {PTJW December, 1849, Art. 5, p. 39.5}

jasd 12:12 Verily, verily say I unto thee, hither dogmatology! for though man, since Adam and his wife trod the earth of its god – there is he who teacheth that all men since have dwelt in the heart of this same earth. Nay, say I unto thee – thine eyes, thine touch, thine hearing – and yea! with some, even thine smell – teach otherwise. Is it not so that it is the Great Gd who hath given thee thine senses?—that thou mightest not be taken snare?

jasd 12:12 Yea, even thine master sense - to discern whither lieth the middens.

>>we first see what the founders of our faith believed on this subject to discern the truth.

About Matthew 12, James White said;<<

Is this the same James White who is recorded as saying,

"Our financial matters stand well, and there is wealth yet in our pens." (–James White)?

If so, one might suppose that it was that sort of venal recognition that would lead to such as;

>>that it forced “great drops of blood falling down to the ground.” (Luke 22:44)<<

that is, the literalization of a simile (or, in other instances, arcanery of the literal). Note, the following text:

KJV Lu 22:44 And being in an agony he prayed more earnestly: and his sweat was as it were great drops of blood falling down to the ground.

YLT Lu 22:44 and having been in agony, he was more earnestly praying, and his sweat became, as it were, great drops of blood falling upon the ground.

"...’ware" sayeth the prophet, "of the extraBiblical as it were ex Cathedra."

Matt 12:40 For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.

Searching..., searching..., searching... nada, zilch, zed. Nothing extraneous in the text. No need to read any extraniety into the text. Belly is belly. Belly means belly. No briny waters, no above the waves or below, no mention of a ninth wave or otherwise in view – just belly of the whale – or, as it were in the instance of Jesus Christ’s burial, in the heart of the earth. No extraneous dogmatological ‘jots and tittles’ needed or in view.

It is a simple, clear, and concise text with no indication that Jesus Christ spoke parabolically.

Being that Matthew 12:40 was given as a sign of proof required certain comprehensibility with no need or caveat – for a Doctor of Exposition to grump and harumph about its 'light'.

Dreams are of the busyness of the day.

>> no one could have touched Jesus if He hadn't received the sins of the world yet.<<

Sounds like an argument that Jesus Christ was already a blemished lamb when He went to the cross for our atonement.

Ex 12:5 Your lamb shall be without blemish, a male of the first year: ye shall take it out from the sheep, or from the goats:

Writ must harmonize. The extraBiblical may go wherever it wanders.

[jasd]

>>Have you ever wondered why it was a serpent raised on the pole in the wilderness?<<

Might it have been Biblical science?—y’know, like floating an axe head upon watter...

Describing a ‘carbon’ rod with a coil upon it may have proved difficult for the OT writer to convey... but that is how radios were tuned in our day. The carbon rod is moved through the coil to effect frequency reception and transmission. Even electrical energy is transmitted by that same rod and coil.

It has been demonstrated that a jolt of electricity will break down the protein enzymes of snake venom as to render it innocuous...

Nothing definite is being proposed, just sayin’... holy Writ is full of Biblical science.

[jamesonofthunder]

>>Have you ever wondered why it was a serpent raised on the pole in the wilderness?<<

Might it have been Biblical science?—y’know, like floating an axe head upon watter...

Describing a ‘carbon’ rod with a coil upon it may have proved difficult for the OT writer to convey... but that is how radios were tuned in our day. The carbon rod is moved through the coil to effect frequency reception and transmission. Even electrical energy is transmitted by that same rod and coil.

It has been demonstrated that a jolt of electricity will break down the protein enzymes of snake venom as to render it innocuous...

Nothing definite is being proposed, just sayin’... holy Writ is full of Biblical science.

That is interesting but I would prefer to see what it means through scripture, since it is our defining test.

John 3:14 "And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up".

The event in the wilderness when Moses lifted up the serpent was symbolic of Jesus dying the second death in the Garden of Gethsemane, then being raised on the pole to die with our sins.

More proof of my vision of Jesus dying the second death for us, "cut off" {Dan 9:26} from the Father but not because of His own sins.

Then continue in John 3:15 "That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life".

16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

The brazen serpent comes before the most quoted scripture in the bible.

[jasd]

Quote:

Might it have been Biblical science?—y’know, like floating an axe head upon watter...

>>That is interesting but I would prefer to see what it means through scripture, since it is our defining test.<<

Ahh, yes, good. Our defining test. Seems many have forgotten that. However, that does not necessarily negate my proffer as much of text is now being substantiated by historical, as well immediate fact. (note: the capacitor implications of the stone circle Gilgal vis-à-vis the leprosy of Namaan - and the banding of tree stumps to preserve them unto life anew)

>>John 3:14 "And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up".

The event in the wilderness when Moses lifted up the serpent was symbolic of Jesus dying the second death in the Garden of Gethsemane,<<

The brazen serpent signified the “second death in the Garden of Gethsemane”? Texts?

>>then being raised on the pole to die with our sins.<<

I’d thought that the defining act; that is, the act of Atonement... was being hung on a tree.

>>More proof of my vision of Jesus dying the second death for us, "cut off" {Dan 9:26} from the Father but not because of His own sins.<<

Forgive me, but I’m perplexed – I mean, He died the second death in Gethsemane even before He died the Death of Redemption upon the cross?

>>Then continue in John 3:15 "That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life".

16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.<<

Yes, I agree that Jesus Christ purchased life eternal for those who believe in him. But,

Quote:

The brazen serpent comes before the most quoted scripture in the bible.

are you arguing for textual sequentiality or proximity?—and what does either say to you?

Quote:

I would prefer to see what it means through scripture

Indeed, however, as symbology – wouldn’t it mean salvation both by Biblical science and test of faith?—Old Testamentally and New Testamentally?

[jamesonofthunder]

AS Moses lifted up the serpent...so shall the Son of man be lifted up.

This is drawing an obvious conclusion based off of the parallel.

First Moses needed to form the brazen serpent from bronze, while snakes where biting at the heals of everyone around them, piles and piles of snakes falling from the sky.

"Even the manner of His death had been shadowed forth. As the brazen serpent had been uplifted in the wilderness, so was the coming Redeemer to be lifted up, “that whosoever believeth in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life.” John 3:16. {AA 226.3}

“One shall say unto Him, What are these wounds in Thine hands? Then He shall answer, Those with which I was wounded in the house of My friends.” Zechariah 13:6. {AA 226.4}

(Jesus dying the death we, His friends deserve)

“He made His grave with the wicked, and with the rich in His death; because He had done no violence, neither was any deceit in His mouth. Yet it pleased the Lord to bruise Him; He hath put Him to grief.” Isaiah 53:9, 10. {AA 226.5}

But He who was to suffer death at the hands of evil men was to rise again as a conqueror over sin and the grave. Under the inspiration of the Almighty the Sweet Singer of Israel had testified of the glories of the resurrection morn. “My flesh also,” he joyously proclaimed, “shall rest in hope. For Thou wilt not leave My soul in hell [the grave]; neither wilt Thou suffer Thine Holy One to see corruption.” Psalm 16:9, 10. {AA 227.1}