Why was Simon's name changed to Peter?

[Bob Root]

I'm re-reading Luke and wondered why Jesus changed Simon's name to Peter? luke 6-14, Any thoughts?

Bob R

[Gibs]

I think it is because Siman, Peter was made an Apostle,

Petros pet'-ros

apparently a primary word; a (piece of) rock (larger than 3037); as a name, Petrus, an apostle:--Peter, rock. Compare 2786.

Each of the Apostles were counted as a piece of the "ROCK" Himself is what I've come to understand.

Mt 16:18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock ( myself ) I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[Dr. Rich]

I like that Gibs!

[miz3]

So Peter could be the first Pope.

[Gibs]

Miz3,

No way, Peter his new name indicated he was a piece of the Rock, an Apostle as all of them then are the same. Peter took some special attention it seems as we too need.

The way the verse reads is a little confusing until one reason's it out.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[miz3]

Miz3,

No way, Peter his new name indicated he was a piece of the Rock, an Apostle as all of them then are the same. Peter took some special attention it seems as we too need.

The way the verse reads is a little confusing until one reason's it out.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

The Bible needs no human reasoning. It means exactly what it says.

[Bob Root]

I thought that the "Rock" that Jesus built his church on is the Gospel, the Good News Christ came to present his sheep?

[Gibs]

Bob, the Catholic church uses this verse to give them the pope system,

Mt 16:18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock ( myself ) I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

Jesus gave him the name "Peter" and it means,

Petros pet'-ros

apparently a primary word; a (piece of) rock (larger than 3037); as a name, Petrus, an apostle:--Peter, rock. Compare 2786.

He never infered He built His Church upon Peter but Himself, the Rock, He alone is the Head and organizer and ordainer and sender. Peter a piece of rock but not THE ROCK.

When we hear preachers speak we must discern if he is ordained of God. Ordination by men is but a recognition service of ordination, usually by some of the higher men in the church organization.

Like the Bereans we go to the Word to see if those things are true, it is our right and descision.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[miz3]

Bob, the Catholic church uses this verse to give them the pope system,

Mt 16:18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock ( myself ) I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

Jesus gave him the name "Peter" and it means,

Petros pet'-ros

apparently a primary word; a (piece of) rock (larger than 3037); as a name, Petrus, an apostle:--Peter, rock. Compare 2786.

He never infered He built His Church upon Peter but Himself, the Rock, He alone is the Head and organizer and ordainer and sender. Peter a piece of rock but not THE ROCK.

When we hear preachers speak we must discern if he is ordained of God. Ordination by men is but a recognition service of ordination, usually by some of the higher men in the church organization.

Like the Bereans we go to the Word to see if those things are true, it is our right and descision.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

You inserted the word "myself" in the text. The text does not say "myself" at all.

Quote the text just as it is:

"And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it."

Matthew 16:18.

This is the correct way to quote the Bible with no human words inserted anywhere in the text.

[Gibs]

Miz3, I inserted it because that is the way it is. Just reckon with what Peter's name mean's as Jesus Himself gave it to Him.

Petros pet'-ros

apparently a primary word; a (piece of) rock (larger than 3037); as a name, Petrus, an apostle:--Peter, rock. Compare 2786.

Jesus had just ask Peter who He was and Peter did answer correctly, then Jesus made this comment to him. He just informed Peter His Church was His own and it would be built upon Himself the rock not a piece of the Rock.

If you be Catholic run with it how you like it but Jesus Christ Only can be the One His Church is built upon and NO man. His Church is His Flock, His Sheep and we all want to be one of them.

We don't belong to Peter or no pope, but to Jesus Christ Only! He Bought us we are His and we are His Church, each a Spiritual Member of His Spiritual Body, the Church.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[ClubV12]

Gib's, thanks for including the word "myself" in that verse as it brings more clairity to the word.

Thats one reason I like to compare various and different versions as well as consider the interlinear when seeking a deeper understanding of a verse. I typically ignore the comments folks make about they DON'T like this or that version for whatever reason, fine, don't use a version you don't like.

I have a particular version I prefer, but won't turn my nose up at someone who prefers a different one.

[Bob Root]

I'm a little confused. 1st thank you for admitting that the insertion of "Myself" was not my doing.

I did think, and have not been un-convinced, yet that my understanding is this"

"I thought that the "Rock" that Jesus built his church on is the Gospel, the Good News Christ came to present his sheep?"

Is not the Good News of Salvation the rock of which Jesus is speaking of.

I've no understanding that each of the twelve apostoles are small rocks contributing to the whole. If that is the case then the church seems to be fractured by the acts of Judas, and maybe Peter as well; for his denial of Jesus.

I am not a scholar, just on a journey, seeking God. I seek no argument, just understanding.

In case there is some confusion, I'm attending the local SDA, and have never been associated with the Catholic religion. I have been baptized, by immersion, and when the time is right will ask for membership at our local Church.

Thank you for your understanding and assistance.

Bob R

[Bob Root]

I, since my last post, have done a little research, and believe I am now satisfied. The word "peter" means "rock". It was FAITH that Jesus built the Church on, not a rock, but Peter's (Christians) faith.

It is because of Matt. 16:15 & Mat 16:16 Simon Peter replied, "You are the Christ, the Son of the living God."

This is the faith Christ speaks of. Once more I've learned to read before and after for understanding.

God Bless each of you

Bob Root

[miz3]

Miz3, I inserted it because that is the way it is. Just reckon with what Peter's name mean's as Jesus Himself gave it to Him.

Petros pet'-ros

apparently a primary word; a (piece of) rock (larger than 3037); as a name, Petrus, an apostle:--Peter, rock. Compare 2786.

Jesus had just ask Peter who He was and Peter did answer correctly, then Jesus made this comment to him. He just informed Peter His Church was His own and it would be built upon Himself the rock not a piece of the Rock.

If you be Catholic run with it how you like it but Jesus Christ Only can be the One His Church is built upon and NO man. His Church is His Flock, His Sheep and we all want to be one of them.

We don't belong to Peter or no pope, but to Jesus Christ Only! He Bought us we are His and we are His Church, each a Spiritual Member of His Spiritual Body, the Church.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

All I am saying is that that text does not say what you are "inferring". Read the text without any additions, subtractions, or any other kind of attachments, including human reasoning.

You are free to use other Scripture within correct context that supports your contention but you cannot do what you are doing with that particular text.

[miz3]

I, since my last post, have done a little research, and believe I am now satisfied. The word "peter" means "rock". It was FAITH that Jesus built the Church on, not a rock, but Peter's (Christians) faith.

It is because of Matt. 16:15 & Mat 16:16 Simon Peter replied, "You are the Christ, the Son of the living God."

This is the faith Christ speaks of. Once more I've learned to read before and after for understanding.

God Bless each of you

Bob Root

Good for you. The others are trying to add to the text to make their point instead of using "context" and/or other Scripture that is about the same point to clarify.

You never ever should clarify by using your own human words to substitute for what God has already done.

[ClubV12]

Human words, which is exactly what the biblical authors used and then those words were translated, not always perfectly, into various languages and versions of the bible. The message will get through, God is in control, but the "human words" we will have to deal with in some capacity, always.

To add clairification to a verse in a way that may make it more understandable remains a challenge. It was a challenge the King James authors had to deal with as well, they didn't always "nail it" perfectly. I'm not sure there exists today ANY version that could be considered perfect in every way. Which is why it is such a blessing to have at our disposal so many different ways to investigate the bible, see and come to the truth.

[Gibs]

Resoning has to be applied in many cases from the text and sometimes clues from another prophet.

In this case here if the church was built on Peter and Jesus had of appointed it that way, then when Peter died then what? No His Church He built upon the infinite and not the finite. All can see the result of finite heads as we have in history see many popes come and die and all apostate.

All surely believe Jesus's Words when He stated the gates of hell would not prevail against His Church. Folks I don't know how many can see it, but is true, the True Ones came out of her. That is His Church today, those who like the Bereans will not imbibe error.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[miz3]

Resoning has to be applied in many cases from the text and sometimes clues from another prophet.

In this case here if the church was built on Peter and Jesus had of appointed it that way, then when Peter died then what? No His Church He built upon the infinite and not the finite. All can see the result of finite heads as we have in history see many popes come and die and all apostate.

All surely believe Jesus's Words when He stated the gates of hell would not prevail against His Church. Folks I don't know how many can see it, but is true, the True Ones came out of her. That is His Church today, those who like the Bereans will not imbibe error.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

Human reason is polluted plain and simple. The Bible says that the human cannot understand the "infinite" as you put it without the help of the "infinite" (see Cor. chapter two). When we add our human "words"/"reasoning" to the Bible we pollute God's Sacred Word. Again plain and simple.

You must read the text without any additions and/or takeaways.

When human reasoning is applied to the Bible we can be sure that the result will be "WRONG".

You may not like the RCC/Pope and that is your privilege. However, you cannot twist the text with human reason/takeaways/additions in order to prove that the RCC/Pope are wrong in their use of this text.

[Gibs]

Miz3, You need to render your version of the verse, I for one would like your view.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[miz3]

Miz3, You need to render your version of the verse, I for one would like your view.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

I have no version of the verse.

The Bible speaks for itself. The text says what it says and that is all that we can accept.

We are not free to "tamper" with God's Word.

[Gibs]

But Miz3, what is the verse telling you? If you have no view how can you fault another for theirs?

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[miz3]

But Miz3, what is the verse telling you? If you have no view how can you fault another for theirs?

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

I fault you because you added a word that was not in the Scripture. That means you added something that God did not put there. You cannot derive meaning by adding/takeaway. That is always true.

I can fault you because your method was wrong plain and simple. I don't have to have a view if your methodology is wrong. Your wrong method makes you wrong in the way you understand the text. Plain and simple.

[Gibs]

Miz3, it is the context that makes one realize it must be understood that way. There is other verses in the Bible the same must be done to get it straight.

Question for you, do you believe Jesus built HIS Church on Peter? Tell me how that can be true?

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[ClubV12]

Looks like Miz3 missed the point concerning translation. The original words were translated. We KNOW for a certainty that there are some errors in the translation of the KJV and essentially ALL the versions of the bible. Therefore, we cannot get to hung up on the EXACT wording of any given text. We have to look at the chapter, the book, other books, the lifestyle of the people at the time (time and place), the original text where possible.

Until we have done that, I don't have a problem adding a word we commonly understand in todays language to ENHANCE the meaning of any given text. It's not a problem when done correctly and it meets scrutiny, miz3.

Not YOUR scrutiny, the typical man on the street, reasonable, logical scrutiny that most biblical scholars wouldn't have a problem with. You have virtually no credentials or authority, with me, to even suggest an interpretation because you don't often agree with ANYTHING no matter how it's worded!

Gibs, caution, your fixing to chase a rabbit down an endless hole where the outcome will only result in frustration. A place were logic and reason have no substance, a black hole. :)

[Windsor]

miz3, the verse says "THIS". It is up to YOU to decide who/what THIS refers to as "THIS" is not a proper noun.