Most of our sinning...

[Gail]

Quote:

We do most if not all of our sinning when we are right- Clarence Schilt

[phkrause]

Ain't that the truth.

[Tom Wetmore]

Clarence Schilt alway makes you think... And I think he may be on to something there.

I sort brings me back to a similar thought I have had rattling around in my head lately.

In becoming a Christian some folk transition from being worldly obnoxious people to obnoxious Christians, quite pleased to have put all those worldly vices behind them. Maybe it was more the obnoxious part that God really wanted to be left behind most.

[Naomi]

Quote:

Maybe it was more the obnoxious part that God really wanted to be left behind most.

Yes, I would say he is definitely on to something. Those thoughts rattling around in your head seem to agree. :)

[olger]

Sin bad.

God good.

[Neil D]

In becoming a Christian some folk transition from being worldly obnoxious people to obnoxious Christians, quite pleased to have put all those worldly vices behind them. Maybe it was more the obnoxious part that God really wanted to be left behind most.

Many years ago, a loving friend of mine told me that he became a Christian and became the most obnoxious person and one that he resented. He became an agnostic because he felt that on becomeing a Christian, one needed to 'go all out'....and he said that he became obnoxious and hated himself for being a Christian...

I told him that he didn't have the correct picture of God...

And on more than one occasion here on C/A, I have always said that if you are a better person being a pagan than you are if you are a Christian, give up your "christianity" and just be the best person you can be...

Nice to see you, Tom.

[JoeMo]

Most obnoxious Christians become that way because they are trying to please God rather than trusting God. Although our good intentions are honorable,in our increasing self-righteousness at successfully overcoming some sins by our own power (so we imagine), we develop a "holier than thou" attitude towards those who are less successful at overcoming than ourselves; we compare ourselves with others thinking "I may have issues; but at least I'm better than so-and-so" (a sin of pride). In addition, we tend to put on "masks" to hide our remaining flaws, and pretend to be who the "saints" want us to be, rather than who we really are. That gets complicated, because we need to wear different masks in front of different groups of saints. The masks not only make us obnoxious, they make us inconsistent hypocrites. Whenever we make a vain attempt at personal "sin management" to break down the perceived barrier of sin between us and God, we sometimes damage our personal relationships with each other because of the perceived sin barrier between us and others. In thinking of ourselves as righteous, we compare our righteousness to that of other people rather than comparing it to God's righteousness.

I have found that trusting God to work with me in overcoming sin,taking off my masks, and just being myself - sins, flaws, and all - makes life more simple and makes me more real - hence less obnoxious (but still kind of obnoxious) - to others. My witness seems much more effective being a saint who still admits to his issues rather than a sinner hiding my issues in order to appear more saintly. Some of the God-pleasers may shun me; but that's OK. I have more fun with real people when I don't have to pretend to be holier than those around me. I think God is OK with that.

[Gail]

Most obnoxious Christians become that way because they are trying to please God rather than trusting God.

I liked your whole comment but especially this part.

Jesus said:

Quote:

And he that sent me is with me: the Father hath not left me alone; for I do always those things that please him- John 8:29-KJV

He actually DID those things that please God. What makes the difference?

[Gail]

I like the verse that I have in my signature about the effects of righteousness on a person. If you or I are not experiencing what the Bible says are the effects of righteousness, I think it would be time for a deeper look at that.

[JoeMo]

Hi Gail,

Thanks for the feedback. I like your signature verse as well. In my opinion, the righteousness that Isaiah is talking about is Christ's righteousness (even though He had not yet been born). Revelation says we overcome "by the blood of the Lamb"; not our own efforts. As far as your quote from John 8, that is a quote by Jesus about Himself. Everything He did pleased God; and if we believe in (i.e., "trust") Jesus for our salvation, His righteousness covers us; and when God looks at us, He sees Jesus.

"9If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness." (1 John 1:9)

If I read this verse correctly, it is Jesus who removes our unrighteousness, we do not remove it from ourselves. Jesus is much better than me at managing my sin problem. Sin and Satan are way too powerful for me to manage on my own. I need a Savior (and I have One) that will work with me to overcome! Overcoming sin by myself is impossible; but with Christ all things are possible. Another advantage in trust (vs. performance) is that I can be assured of salvation rather than constantly worrying if I'm being "good enough" to save. Does that make sense?

[Gail]

Exactly- that is the work- in us- that Christ did by His work. His righteousness subdues the heart and brings peace.

One would think.

[Bravus]

I like the point raised in the OP, and have enjoyed the discussion.

The thread title got me thinking, though, and something else that might be interesting is "Most of our sinning... is by omission". A little more thought about the good things we fail to do, rather than the bad things we do, might be interesting.

[Gail]

I like the point raised in the OP, and have enjoyed the discussion.

The thread title got me thinking, though, and something else that might be interesting is "Most of our sinning... is by omission". A little more thought about the good things we fail to do, rather than the bad things we do, might be interesting.