"The Lord took the urge away completely."

[Woody]

Quote:

The Lord took the urge away completely.

What does it mean when you pray and this is NOT the answer you get?

Now - I should preface this by saying that the person IS sincere. She has tried very hard on her own. She has sincerely prayed and trusted. She believes that God will answer her prayer.

But God doesn't.

Who is at fault here?

OR ---

Does God in His wisdom just not feel this is the right time. A thorn in the flesh?

[Kevin H]

God uses the natural and supernatural. God works as we work with his natural laws.

I don't know what the craving is, but say tobacco or drugs, occasionally there is something in a person that just clicks and they loose the urge. But for most it will always be a part of their quality world and need to go into either a stop smoking program (they have made some fantastic breakthroughts since the 1900s) or other drug or alcohol programs or what ever the addiction is.

God is not going to break his natural laws , but he will cooperate with them. Working with the thinking, diet, health etc.

As we work with God's laws of health while the issue will remain in the person's quality world, it will move from the center of the quality world over towards the edges of it.

[Woody]

Why does God "break his natural laws" with the person who says "The Lord took the urge away completely." But not with others?

OR - is the person who makes this statement - not telling us the truth?

[Dr. Rich]

Quote:

The Lord took the urge away completely.

What does it mean when you pray and this is NOT the answer you get?

Now - I should preface this by saying that the person IS sincere. She has tried very hard on her own. She has sincerely prayed and trusted. She believes that God will answer her prayer.

But God doesn't.

Who is at fault here?

OR ---

Does God in His wisdom just not feel this is the right time. A thorn in the flesh?

No Woody, God does not have a demon as did Paul (a thorn in the flesh=angle of Satan or messenger of Satan) (See 2nd Cor. 12:7-9)

The fault lies with the one praying, not with God. Problem is, God can only be the God of those who love Him and show it by keeping all of the ten commandments and following the words of Jesus.

By the way, this is probably the reason why EGW was not healed, because she refused to repent and follow the words of Jesus (see Rev. 2:18-26)

[Woody]

Quote:

The fault lies with the one praying, not with God. Problem is, God can only be the God of those who love Him and show it by keeping all of the ten commandments and following the words of Jesus.

By the way, this is probably the reason why EGW was not healed, because she refused to repent and follow the words of Jesus (see Rev. 2:18-26)

Well then EGW is not alone. For I too do not follow all the words of Jesus - nor the 10 Commandments.

If that is what is required to get my prayers answered - I might as well stop praying.

[Dr. Rich]

Suit yourself...

[Woody]

Suit yourself...

That's exactly what I will do.

[OzarkWoman]

No Woody, God does not have a demon as did Paul (a thorn in the flesh=angle of Satan or messenger of Satan) (See 2nd Cor. 12:7-9)

The fault lies with the one praying, not with God. Problem is, God can only be the God of those who love Him and show it by keeping all of the ten commandments and following the words of Jesus.

By the way, this is probably the reason why EGW was not healed, because she refused to repent and follow the words of Jesus (see Rev. 2:18-26)

I so totally Do Not agree with you about this. In fact, I totally think you are absolutely wrong concerning it!!!!

God does answer the prayers of the sinful. if you have had any prayers answered then you know that I am telling the truth. I have to say though, you really need to get over this, "I am holier than thou" attitude of yours. It does not become you at all.

I have had prayers answered and I haven't even been baptized yet.

[Dr. Rich]

Ok, but who answered the prayer? Ever watch Benny Hinn?

[Woody]

Originally Posted By: Dr. Rich

No Woody, God does not have a demon as did Paul (a thorn in the flesh=angle of Satan or messenger of Satan) (See 2nd Cor. 12:7-9)

The fault lies with the one praying, not with God. Problem is, God can only be the God of those who love Him and show it by keeping all of the ten commandments and following the words of Jesus.

By the way, this is probably the reason why EGW was not healed, because she refused to repent and follow the words of Jesus (see Rev. 2:18-26)

I so totally Do Not agree with you about this. In fact, I totally think you are absolutely wrong concerning it!!!!

God does answer the prayers of the sinful. if you have had any prayers answered then you know that I am telling the truth. I have to say though, you really need to get over this, "I am holier than thou" attitude of yours. It does not become you at all.

I have had prayers answered and I haven't even been baptized yet.

THanks OzarkWoman. I appreciate what you said. Just let me add that not only am I a baptized member but I am a baptized sinner - and I've had prayers answered.

[OzarkWoman]

Ok, but who answered the prayer? Ever watch Benny Hinn?

GOD ansered the prayers. Don't even go with the Benny Hinn idiot. Yes, I have seen him and I find him to be a totally terrible human that would treat people the way he does all for money. Can you tell I don't like him?

I am telling you that you are wrong about this. God does answer prayers of the sinful. You have to realize that there is not one human being on the face of this earth that is not sinful and will always be sinful until the day they die. Facts are facts. It even says that in the Bible.

[Woody]

Quote:

I am telling you that you are wrong about this. God does answer prayers of the sinful.

Very True sister. In fact - IF you keep all the words of Jesus and the 10 commandments - you will NOT have your prayers answered. Why you ask? Because you are a liar and the Truth is not in you.

[OzarkWoman]

Quote:

I am telling you that you are wrong about this. God does answer prayers of the sinful.

Very True sister. In fact - IF you keep all the words of Jesus and the 10 commandments - you will NOT have your prayers answered. Why you ask? Because you are a liar and the Truth is not in you.

Now that, I do agree with. We are all sinners. I have been taught that we are to continually strive toward being more like Jesus and work at not breaking the commandments, but Jesus said that is we even think of something that is against the commandment that we have still comitted a sin.

[miz3]

The answer is God knows everything and God has a plan. It is God's Plan. Man has nothing to do one way or the other about whether God's Plan does or does not. God says in the Bible that He makes Plans and then He carries them out exactly as He wants them to be.

How does this fit into the OP?

God commands us to pray for Victory over sin. God says that He will give us the Victory by His own Power. It is not the human's power because humans only can sin. It is God's Power that brings us humans Victory every single time.

Sometimes we ask God for things, even things God told us to ask for, like overcoming sin, but God does not give us "instant" victory while some do get "instant" Victory.

Its not about whether God will give us Victory, but it is about "WHEN" will God give us Victory.

God has an agenda, God's agenda is absolutely Perfect in every way. God does not always reveal to us that agenda.

God expects only that we humans TRUST HIM and never ever give up TRUSTING HIM no matter what actually happens.

Yes, there are humans that pray with bad motives and that is why their prayers are not answered (see James 4:1-17).

However, just because it seems that prayers are not answered does not mean that the person automatically has bad motives.

Only God knows the heart. We humans, Dr. Rich do not know the heart, even our own heart, unless God reveals the innerness of the human being.

Many humans don't even know and/or see that their motives are bad. They may think they have good motives when in Truth they have very evil motives. Only God can reveal the True motives of the heart.

This is why we should constantly pray that God will reveal our true motives and that God will also get rid of our evil motives and replace them with Godly Motives.

The bottom line is to continue to pray "without ceasing".

[Woody]

Well Dr. RIch - I assume you would not agree with the following - but "I" do.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=eRnFKbrviCM

[phkrause]

I so totally Do Not agree with you about this. In fact, I totally think you are absolutely wrong concerning it!!!!

God does answer the prayers of the sinful. if you have had any prayers answered then you know that I am telling the truth. I have to say though, you really need to get over this, "I am holier than thou" attitude of yours. It does not become you at all.

I have had prayers answered and I haven't even been baptized yet.

I have had prays answered as well. I think what most might not like, is God might not answer our prays to our liking! But in my opinion I believe he answers all prays. It might not be right now away, it might not be tomorrow or the next day! It could be in a week, two weeks or not for years. And again it might not be at all what we were expecting. One pray that I got answered was how it came about that we moved to Florida. I've always prayed that as my Mom got older, that I wished that some how I could move down to Florida to help her out. And to say that I prayed for years would be really an understatement. Anyway I got laid off ran through all my unemployment benefits, applied to so many printers all up and down the east coast and especially Florida. Every time I'd take my walk I would plead with God why he hasn't convinced my wife to what to go to Florida. Well she had a great job, etc., etc., I could go on! Why would she what to move period. Well the way God answered the pray was he broke her back, literially(sp). Now that is not at all what I would've expected. Neither did my wife. Anyway we're here at exactly on time, just before my Mom broke her hip. So many times his answer to us is "my way not yours."

[Woody]

Good Points pk.

OzarkWoman just may have to wait till Jesus comes to get her prayer answered for victory over Smoking. And that is fine. All in God's time.

[OzarkWoman]

It has been 72 hours so far!

[olger]

Good girl Freedom and blessings to you !!

[phkrause]

It has been 72 hours so far!

Amen OW

[Kevin H]

Good points PK and Miz3!

We have to remember that on earth we are playing roles in the Great Controversy. Although Jesus would do the instant healings, in his day illness was seen not as the indirect judgement for sin, but that it was God directly punishing specific acts of sin, I've heard that some Rabbis has a very specific list where if you get this disease that it meant that you comitted that particular sin. For Jesus to do the instant healings he was giving a message that the person's sins are forgiven.

But God does not want us to stay imature children. He wants us to mature and grow. I don't know if I'm overly convinced at this point but I lean towards believing it unless I see more evidence that will change me one way or another, but I've heard it said in a lecture that when Jesus talked about how some demons can only leave by fasting and prayer, that fasting and prayer means something that takes long prayerful study. Jesus loves us and even knows with our failures and our options. How would God teach us the dangers of alcohol if we start drinking, ok, things go wrong so I say a prayer and suddenly it's all hunky dorry. God wants us to learn and grow, and some of the steps may not be perfect, but that we fall forward. God would rather work with say A.A. or Teen Challenge or other similar groups. To just drink and pray, or smoke and pray etc. would not help us develope a character of wanting to trust in him and help each other. And if AA or Teen Challenge worked perfectly where we could not complain about them, then God cannot encourage us to search for even better methods. And God sees the difference between someone who is struggling and falling with Alcohol who was alive before AA (or lives where he does not have access to AA) or someone who AA does not reach his needs, or if they are someone who likes to whine and complain and have a spirit of "poor me, poor me. pour me a drink"

While there are things in common, there are still differences in our chemistry in our neuro transmitters and and our diets. Some people can find what meets their need to have their craving leave, but others need something else or may have a stronger attraction. But I assure you that God is not answering the one prayer but not the other. God is only letting us know that we need to cooperate with his laws of health, what to eat, proper rest and exercise and thinking about the correct things. It is this struggle which has given us things such as AA, Teen Challenge, Ucchi Pines, The Ultramind Solution, Common Sense Psychology, Aesthetic Realism, Cognative Therapy, Choice Theory/Reality Therapy, etc. None perfect yet all a lot better than had they not been here and can help us grow to even better ways God can bless us.

God is not spoon feeding us, but giving us the ability to think and to do, and to choose and develop the will so that when Jesus comes we will be mature and stand in his love and grace instead of being scared to death of him.

[Naomi]

It has been 72 hours so far!

Very happy for you. YOU can do it!!!

[Gail]

I agree with Naomi! You're doing GREAT!

Back to the Lord taking the urge away-

I had that happen to me when I was 18. I was good and lost and had just gotten pregnant. On drugs, too. But one day I lit up and it was the most horrible, disgusting taste I could imagine. So I threw the cigarettes out and never went back (been smoking since 12).

Very soon after that I sought the Lord and renounced the life I had led. I remember thinking that all I wanted was to be right with God, to be a Christian, especially now that I was going to have a child.

But yeah, all without a prayer, too- the Lord works in mysterious ways, doesn't He? But I give Him the credit for that little miracle and I cherish that memory as a one-on-one between Him and me. It was a gift! I remember that as how He has led me and it helps my faith on days when I feel far from Him.

So much for the testimony. Apart from that I have no wisdom as to the where or the why of small miracles like this. Can we know God but the Spirit that is in Him? But I would not venture to cause a person to doubt if his or her prayer is not answered in a way such as that. Each has a different journey and God has reasons for that. Whatever our walk we need to depend on His strength and power for success.

[Woody]

Quote:

and God has reasons for that

And a big AMEN to that Gail. We can be sure that God knows best. ANd that the end result is that HIS name is Glorified.

[JoeMo]

I have no idea why God answers some prayers for healing and deliverance and not others. I hesitate to blame the people praying for those in need - they seem to be praying for the will of God which is that we all should be physically and spiritually healthy.

I hesitate to blame those in need of healing and deliverance by accusing them of not having sufficient faith or not loving God enough.

I refuse to blame God, saying He is weak, vindictive, or arbitrary.

The only reasons I can see those already mentioned - that sometimes God doesn't answer our prayers in the way we expect them to be answered. I think of a young friend of mine who recently died of pancreatic cancer. He was a saint by most people's standards - following both health and spiritual laws vigorously until the day he died. Hundreds (if not thousands) of people were praying for David to be healed by a miracle (he was in hospice by now and all attempts at medical mitigation had ceased). He died anyways. We all wondered why our prayers weren't answered. David maintained a strong faith in God throughout his demise. He would sing Hymns and read his bible whenever the pain meds would allow him to be coherent. He died peacefully; and after his funeral all of his children were baptized. Could it be that His suffering and death while praising and trusing God during the whole process "saved" his family? Could it be that his faithfulness was the fertilizer for the salvation of many? Only God knows.

Another possible reason that all requests for miracles are not granted is because if they were, miracles would cease to be amazing; and could be taken for granted. God would be expected to perform; and supernatural manifestations would be taken for granted instead of being the overwhelmingly incredible experience that they are now. We would be expecting the gift and not the Giver. Can you imagine how crowded the world would be if every request for healing and extended life were granted?

I don't pretend to know the mind of God. I only hope that I can always state along with with Job and the three worthies in the book of Daniel:

"15 Though he slay me, yet will I trust in him: but I will maintain mine own ways before him. 16 He also shall be my salvation" (Job 13: 15-16)

"If we are thrown into the blazing furnace, the God we serve is able to deliver us from it, and he will deliver us[c] from Your Majesty’s hand. 18 But even if he does not, we want you to know, Your Majesty, that we will not serve your gods or worship the image of gold you have set up." (Dan. 3: 17-18)