Woody Posted June 30, 2012 Posted June 30, 2012 If one is sick and suffering - is it a sign that the person is a sinner? If our parents have sinned - can their children suffer for their parents sins. (And I am not talking about genetics or the passing on of disease such as from drug use of parents etc.) Does God punish us for our sins by withholding health? Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology.
cricket Posted June 30, 2012 Posted June 30, 2012 [quote name=" Romans 3:21-26 New American Standard Bible (NASB) Justification by Faith"]21 But now apart [a]from the Law the righteousness of God has been manifested, being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets, 22 even the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all those who believe; for there is no distinction; 23 for all [c] have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, 24 being justified as a gift by His grace through the redemption which is in Christ Jesus; 25 whom God displayed publicly as a [d]propitiation [e] in His blood through faith. This was to demonstrate His righteousness, [f]because in the forbearance of God He passed over the sins previously committed; 26 for the demonstration, I say, of His righteousness at the present time, so that He would be just and the justifier of the one who [g]has faith in Jesus. Quote
Moderators Gerr Posted June 30, 2012 Moderators Posted June 30, 2012 Yes, we suffer because we are sinners. There is only one sinless person in the whole universe who ever suffered, and that's only because He became sin for us. Quote
Woody Posted June 30, 2012 Author Posted June 30, 2012 Yes, we suffer because we are sinners. There is only one sinless person in the whole universe who ever suffered, and that's only because He became sin for us. You certainly qualify as a liberal Gerry. Good Comment. Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology.
Woody Posted June 30, 2012 Author Posted June 30, 2012 How about this question: "Does God punish us for our sins by withholding health?" Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology.
Woody Posted June 30, 2012 Author Posted June 30, 2012 Let me ask you another question - Was Jesus healthy? Did he ever suffer from a cold or disease? Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology.
Gibs Posted June 30, 2012 Posted June 30, 2012 No He was obedient, Ex 15:26 And said, If thou wilt diligently hearken to the voice of the LORD thy God, and wilt do that which is right in his sight, and wilt give ear to his commandments, and keep all his statutes, I will put none of these diseases upon thee, which I have brought upon the Egyptians: for I am the LORD that healeth thee. Sickness and disease is so prevelant today even the most health conscious are brought down at times. But is not that verse somewhat of a promise for us today as well? 1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world. Quote A Freeman In Jesus Christ
Woody Posted June 30, 2012 Author Posted June 30, 2012 No He was obedient, Ex 15:26 And said, If thou wilt diligently hearken to the voice of the LORD thy God, and wilt do that which is right in his sight, and wilt give ear to his commandments, and keep all his statutes, I will put none of these diseases upon thee, which I have brought upon the Egyptians: for I am the LORD that healeth thee. Sickness and disease is so prevelant today even the most health conscious are brought down at times. But is not that verse somewhat of a promise for us today as well? 1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world. That is fine and dandy - but your quotes are not talking about Jesus. Where do you read that Jesus was never sick? Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology.
Woody Posted June 30, 2012 Author Posted June 30, 2012 BTW - If Jesus was never sick - then he can't relate to me. And he can't know the struggles and temptations I go through. In short - He was not tempted as I. Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology.
CoAspen Posted June 30, 2012 Posted June 30, 2012 BTW - If Jesus was never sick - then he can't relate to me. And he can't know the struggles and temptations I go through. In short - He was not tempted as I. Me thinks we often get the 'tempting of Christ' misconstrued! What was the temptation of Christ, to follow His human will or to follow the divine will of God? Some think that Christs overcoming of temptation was to prove humans could do it instead of proving that Adam and Eve could have overcome Satan by sticking with God. To me, that is the real battle that continues to be bandied about on theses forums, faith vs works. One is trust in God, the other is trust in self. By the way, I don't know if Christs human side ever experienced all that we do, I have tendency to doubt that. But it doesn't change anything for me.He can relate in ways we do not understand, after all, He is the designer and creator.......right? Quote
Members phkrause Posted June 30, 2012 Members Posted June 30, 2012 Originally Posted By: Woody BTW - If Jesus was never sick - then he can't relate to me. And he can't know the struggles and temptations I go through. In short - He was not tempted as I. Me thinks we often get the 'tempting of Christ' misconstrued! What was the temptation of Christ, to follow His human will or to follow the divine will of God? Some think that Christs overcoming of temptation was to prove humans could do it instead of proving that Adam and Eve could have overcome Satan by sticking with God. To me, that is the real battle that continues to be bandied about on theses forums, faith vs works. One is trust in God, the other is trust in self. By the way, I don't know if Christs human side ever experienced all that we do, I have tendency to doubt that. But it doesn't change anything for me.He can relate in ways we do not understand, after all, He is the designer and creator.......right? Quote phkrause When the righteous are in authority, the people rejoice; But when a wicked man rules, the people groan. Proverbs 29;2
Woody Posted June 30, 2012 Author Posted June 30, 2012 Originally Posted By: Woody BTW - If Jesus was never sick - then he can't relate to me. And he can't know the struggles and temptations I go through. In short - He was not tempted as I. Me thinks we often get the 'tempting of Christ' misconstrued! What was the temptation of Christ, to follow His human will or to follow the divine will of God? Some think that Christs overcoming of temptation was to prove humans could do it instead of proving that Adam and Eve could have overcome Satan by sticking with God. To me, that is the real battle that continues to be bandied about on theses forums, faith vs works. One is trust in God, the other is trust in self. By the way, I don't know if Christs human side ever experienced all that we do, I have tendency to doubt that. But it doesn't change anything for me.He can relate in ways we do not understand, after all, He is the designer and creator.......right? s 2 Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology.
Gibs Posted July 1, 2012 Posted July 1, 2012 Originally Posted By: Gibs No He was obedient, Ex 15:26 And said, If thou wilt diligently hearken to the voice of the LORD thy God, and wilt do that which is right in his sight, and wilt give ear to his commandments, and keep all his statutes, I will put none of these diseases upon thee, which I have brought upon the Egyptians: for I am the LORD that healeth thee. Sickness and disease is so prevelant today even the most health conscious are brought down at times. But is not that verse somewhat of a promise for us today as well? 1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world. That is fine and dandy - but your quotes are not talking about Jesus. Where do you read that Jesus was never sick? Gee Woody, you mean you didn't get it? That verse explained why Christ didn't get sick. He was obedient in all things and of keeping his health. He wrote the first on health through John and the Essenes. "The Essene Gospel of Peace" or the "Gospel of Peace by His Servant John. Probably available from Amazon.com. 1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world. Quote A Freeman In Jesus Christ
Woody Posted July 1, 2012 Author Posted July 1, 2012 I see no scriptural evidence that Jesus as man did not suffer the afflictions of man. Are you suggesting that when Jesus stubbed his toe that he did not experience humanly pain? Or did Jesus never make a humanly error such as stubbing his toe. Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology.
cricket Posted July 1, 2012 Posted July 1, 2012 I bet it hurt a lot when He was nailed to the cross! In Hebrews it says that Jesus was made like man in all things, not just "some things". I, personally, believe that Jesus did suffer many of the same afflictions we suffer today. I further believe that He can relate to all of our sufferings.[quote name=" Hebrews 2:9-18 New American Standard Bible (NASB)"]Jesus Briefly Humbled 9 But we do see Him who was made [j]for a little while lower than the angels, namely, Jesus, because of the suffering of death crowned with glory and honor, so that by the grace of God He might taste death for everyone. 10 For it was fitting for Him, for whom are all things, and through whom are all things, in bringing many sons to glory, to perfect the [k] author of their salvation through sufferings. 11 For both He who sanctifies and those who are [l]sanctified are all from one Father; for which reason He is not ashamed to call them brethren, 12 saying, “ I will proclaim Your name to My brethren, In the midst of the congregation I will sing Your praise.” 13 And again, “ I will put My trust in Him.” And again, “ Behold, I and the children whom God has given Me.” 14 Therefore, since the children share in [m] flesh and blood, He Himself likewise also partook of the same, that through death He might render powerless him who had the power of death, that is, the devil, 15 and might free those who through fear of death were subject to slavery all their lives. 16 For assuredly He does not [n]give help to angels, but He gives help to the [o]descendant of Abraham. 17 Therefore, He [p]had to be made like His brethren in all things, so that He might become a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make propitiation for the sins of the people. 18 For since He Himself was tempted in that which He has suffered, He is able to come to the aid of those who are tempted. Quote
Woody Posted July 1, 2012 Author Posted July 1, 2012 Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology.
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