Marijuana Legalisation

[David_McQueen]

One of the most interesting conversation in the Western world has been with regards to the legalisation of marijuana. In a perfect world I believe that it should be kept illegal, but as we dont live in a perfect world I think it should be made legal and be controlled especially for harm minimisation, medical reasons and to take the burden of policing the trafficking of it.

What are your thoughts?

[K]

David,

I can remember this as a debate topic in the late 70's while I was in public high school.

I have mixed feelings. It would be less of a burden on law enforcement. I think it would cut into the profits of the big boys who produce and distribute it. You could tax it, and regulate it like alcohol.

I just hate to have to worry about someone else in a car driving under the influence. I guess there are people already doing it (dui), but maybe because it is easier to access those problems would increase.

K

[cricket]

I was just reading an article yesterday that was talking about the harmful effects of marijuana. It is no longer the "harmless" drug once a generation or two ago. There is a greater potency to the drug in use now. Also, marijuana use in teenage years has been linked to the onset of schizophrenia in later years.

Legalizing it would minimize these dangers in teenagers' eyes. Just as legalization of alcohol and smoking tobacco does.

[Nicodema]

I used to be in favor of decriminalizing marijuana but now I tend to agree with Chrys. It is not the (relatively) harmless drug it was in the '60s. "Pot" today is much stronger, much more psychotropic, much more concentrated than it was during the hippie era.

What I am in favor of, however, is changing the structure of the justice system from the punitive model to the rehabilitative model for the casual user. Rather than slapping a young person into hardcore federal prison for years on end for possession of an ounce of marijuana, more rehabilitative measures should be applied. The hardcore penalties should be reserved for dealers and pushers, who frequently don't use it themselves but simply make it available for others and pocket the profits. The justice system should deal with the end user, however, from a rehabilitative standpoint instead.

[Morning Glory]

I agree with your statement, Nico.

[GreatLakesGramma]

It has been shown to have some medical benefits for some conditions, and in that respect it porbably isn't any more harmful than other drugs. I feel it is reasonable to legalize it as a prescription drug, used strictly under a doctor's supervision. Then the penalties would still be there for those using it without prescription, but people wouldn't end up going to jail for resorting to it in desperation to end their pain.

[David_McQueen]

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"Pot" today is much stronger, much more psychotropic, much more concentrated than it was during the hippie era.

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Is this not an argument for intrroducing a legal control as we do for other drugs, both recreational and medicinal?

[David_McQueen]

Whilst I am not advocating the use of it, I am against it, the reality is that people do use it. Peddlers are mixing all kind of strange concotions to kids at the vunerable ages of under 19. The present war on drugs and criminilization is not working, so what other alternatives do we have, especially in a world that does not think the same way we do?

[K]

I am thinking along your lines. My thoughts are that if the government got their noses in it, then it would have to meet standards. They can tax it. It has the same rules as alcohol use has today. It immediately puts drug cartels out of business or it effectively takes the money out of production.

I too am not interested in the use, but realize that what we have been doing since the 60's is not working.

K

[Nicodema]

David, I see your point, but what do you do about the "slippery slope" idea, then? -- which would say if that's the case, what's to stop heroin, cocaine, and LSD from being next? Indeed why not decriminalize ALL controlled substances and make them available to adults with the same laws and responsibilities that attend alcohol (the one LEGAL recreational drug)?

Some people believe pot is a "gateway drug" -- using it leads to use of other drugs. I don't fully believe that, but would not decriminalization of marijuana be a "gateway" to the decriminalization of much more powerful controlled substances such as heroin, cocaine/crack, or LSD?

[Bravus]

Decriminalisation rather than legalisation is being looked at in Canada - that is, it's still not a legal product that can be sold in shops, but it's not illegal to possess the quantities a user would have, or to use it. This is similar to the approach in Holland, I think, although I think it can be sold there. This focuses police resources more at the producer/large scale dealer level rather than at the user level, which does have some benefits, but it still leaves it that (a) the pot and what's in it and its strength are unregulated, ( it's creating 9or recognising) a demand which is illegal to supply and © one of the reasons the 'gateway drug' thing is controversial is that it might be the dealers in some cases who offer other drugs to marijuana users.

I really don't know where I stand on this one - prohibition isn't working, but we already have enough trouble in society with our two legal drugs, alcohol and tobacco, and really don't need another one. In terms of impaired driving, marijuana has a much longer decay curve in the body than alcohol, so someone who smokes up the previous night will still be significantly impaired the following day.

[Nicodema]

Granted, I know alcohol has to be made through the process of fermentation, but God is the one who invented the chemistry of those processes and made it possible for alcohol to be made from fruit or grain. Therefore I ask: If it is a sin to use alcohol, tobacco, and marijuana, why did God create them?

[Clio]

I have been struggling with this topic ever since marijuana was able to control my mother's nausea and give her some measure of relief as she was dying of cancer.

After much prayer and struggle, the impression I was left with is this: "Just because it's illegal, doesn't make it sin".

And the parallel heart conviction was "When the Sabbath becomes illegal, keeping it won't be sin."

So I am faced with the verse in Genesis, and seeking the knowledge of the purpose of the seed bearing herb marijuana.

So far I am undecided, but have to agree that what we have currently just isn't working.

I think, marijuana use, as with many things comes down to a question of intent, moderation in all things, and whether or not the use takes the place of Abba Father and Jesus in your life. And by moderation, I am including in that the proper use and application of the herb as drug, not the herb as recreational activity.

[Neil D]

While I do see the medical arguments of hemp, I also need to look at other reasons to legalize the plant. Concider other reason to legalize it.

[:"blue"]Hemp (Cannabis Sativa) is one of the most intriguing plants humans have come into continued contact since and before the advent of agriculture. For thousands of years, right up until the 1900s, hemp was of critical value because it is a rapidly renewable resource that is capable of being grown all over the earth in varying climates and soil conditions. It is grown for textiles & fabrics, fuel, fiber, food, paper, medicine and more, making hemp one of the most valuable and beneficial crops humanity has been wise enough to take full advantage of...until now.

Although hemp sails brought Columbus to this country and although hemp cloth was used to make the first American flag, hemp has been illegal for American farmers to grow and profit from for the last 70 years. In the past 70 years we have seen our forests destroyed for paper, our soil and water contaminated with chemicals, our air polluted with carcinogens, and we have burned enough fossil fuels to cause global warming. Instead of using a healthy alternative to avoid this toxication of our environment and thus our own bodies, we have actually spent hundreds of billions of dollars trying to eradicate a plant from the face of the earth.

This is a highly unhealthy and counterproductive policy based on fear and ignorance rather than fact and common sense. At The Hempest, we believe that hemp is an integral part of reversing the current unsustainable pattern toward ecological ruin and that we must allow American farmers to once again grow the most profitable crop that can be grown: Hemp. [/]

[Neil D]

Bump this post up....

[Naomi]

</font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />

It is grown for textiles & fabrics, fuel, fiber, food, paper, medicine and more, making hemp one of the most valuable and beneficial crops humanity has been wise enough to take full advantage of...until now.

<hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

Neil, I believe the operative words here are until now

I have no facts concerning the rest of the world, however it's amazing that in the US our prison per person ratio is the highest ever; all overcrowded. We have more laws against the use of marijuana than ever in history. Yet, street sale and usage continues to increase. IMO, this is indicative of, one more time, passing laws to prevent something doesn't appear to eliminate the problem. One would wonder if it makes doing the drug more exciting, therefore making the problem worse. The more you push an issue underground the darker and more deadly it becomes. Not to mention the fact that at the top, it is "big business" ... however, won't go there!

BTW, when hemp is grown for the benefit of humanity as outlined in your post, isn't it a somewhat different plant than what is cultured for "commercial-street" use?

[Bravus]

Yes, there are varieties of the hemp plant with very low concentrations of the 'active ingredient', THC [1], that are grown for industrial purposes. I'm not sure, but I believe this happens in Canada: anyone wanna confirm or deny?

(OK, as someone with a mis-spent youth (as a chemist!), I can't resist telling you that THC is short for delta-9-tetrahydrocannabinol)

[Clio]

http://www.world-mysteries.com/marijuana1.htm

The Marijuana Conspiracy

THE REAL REASON HEMP IS ILLEGAL

by Doug Yurchey

And I will raise up for them a plant of renown, and they shall be no more consumed with hunger in the land.

-- Ezekiel 34/2

THE REAL REASON CANNABIS HAS BEEN OUTLAWED HAS NOTHING

TO DO WITH ITS EFFECTS ON THE MIND AND BODY.

MARIJUANA is DANGEROUS. Pot is NOT harmful to the human body or mind. Marijuana does NOT pose a threat to the general public. Marijuana is very much a danger to the oil companies, alcohol, tobacco industries and a large number of chemical corporations. Various big businesses, with plenty of dollars and influence, have suppressed the truth from the people.

The truth is if marijuana was utilized for its vast array of commercial products, it would create an industrial atomic bomb! Entrepreneurs have not been educated on the product potential of pot. The super rich have conspired to spread misinformation about an extremely versatile plant that, if used properly, would ruin their companies.

Where did the word 'marijuana' come from? In the mid 1930s, the M-word was created to tarnish the good image and phenomenal history of the hemp plant...as you will read. The facts cited here, with references, are generally verifiable in the Encyclopedia Britannica which was printed on hemp paper for 150 years:

* All schoolbooks were made from hemp or flax paper until the 1880s; Hemp Paper Reconsidered, Jack Frazier, 1974.

* It was LEGAL TO PAY TAXES WITH HEMP in America from 1631 until the early 1800s; LA Times, Aug. 12, 1981.

* REFUSING TO GROW HEMP in America during the 17th and 18th Centuries WAS AGAINST THE LAW! You could be jailed in Virginia for refusing to grow hemp from 1763 to 1769; Hemp in Colonial Virginia, G. M. Herdon.

* George Washington, Thomas Jefferson and other founding fathers GREW HEMP; Washington and Jefferson Diaries. Jefferson smuggled hemp seeds from China to France then to America.

* Benjamin Franklin owned one of the first paper mills in America and it processed hemp. Also, the War of 1812 was fought over hemp. Napoleon wanted to cut off Moscow's export to England; Emperor Wears No Clothes, Jack Herer.

* For thousands of years, 90% of all ships' sails and rope were made from hemp. The word 'canvas' is Dutch for cannabis; Webster's New World Dictionary.

* 80% of all textiles, fabrics, clothes, linen, drapes, bed sheets, etc. were made from hemp until the 1820s with the introduction of the cotton gin.

* The first Bibles, maps, charts, Betsy Ross's flag, the first drafts of the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution were made from hemp; U.S. Government Archives.

* The first crop grown in many states was hemp. 1850 was a peak year for Kentucky producing 40,000 tons. Hemp was the largest cash crop until the 20th Century; State Archives.

* Oldest known records of hemp farming go back 5000 years in China, although hemp industrialization probably goes back to ancient Egypt.

* Rembrants, Gainsboroughs, Van Goghs as well as most early canvas paintings were principally painted on hemp linen.

* In 1916, the U.S. Government predicted that by the 1940s all paper would come from hemp and that no more trees need to be cut down. Government studies report that 1 acre of hemp equals 4.1 acres of trees. Plans were in the works to implement such programs; Department of Agriculture

* Quality paints and varnishes were made from hemp seed oil until 1937. 58,000 tons of hemp seeds were used in America for paint products in 1935; Sherman Williams Paint Co. testimony before Congress against the 1937 Marijuana Tax Act.

* Henry Ford's first Model-T was built to run on hemp gasoline and the CAR ITSELF WAS CONTRUCTED FROM HEMP! On his large estate, Ford was photographed among his hemp fields. The car, 'grown from the soil,' had hemp plastic panels whose impact strength was 10 times stronger than steel; Popular Mechanics, 1941.

* Hemp called 'Billion Dollar Crop.' It was the first time a cash crop had a business potential to exceed a billion dollars; Popular Mechanics, Feb., 1938.

* Mechanical Engineering Magazine (Feb. 1938) published an article entitled 'The Most Profitable and Desirable Crop that Can be Grown.' It stated that if hemp was cultivated using 20th Century technology, it would be the single largest agricultural crop in the U.S. and the rest of the world.

The following information comes directly from the United States Department of Agriculture's 1942 14-minute film encouraging and instructing 'patriotic American farmers' to grow 350,000 acres of hemp each year for the war effort:

'...(When) Grecian temples were new, hemp was already old in the service of mankind. For thousands of years, even then, this plant had been grown for cordage and cloth in China and elsewhere in the East. For centuries prior to about 1850, all the ships that sailed the western seas were rigged with hempen rope and sails. For the sailor, no less than the hangman, hemp was indispensable...

...Now with Philippine and East Indian sources of hemp in the hands of the Japanese...American hemp must meet the needs of our Army and Navy as well as of our industries...

...the Navy's rapidly dwindling reserves. When that is gone, American hemp will go on duty again; hemp for mooring ships; hemp for tow lines; hemp for tackle and gear; hemp for countless naval uses both on ship and shore. Just as in the days when Old Ironsides sailed the seas victorious with her hempen shrouds and hempen sails. Hemp for victory!'

Certified proof from the Library of Congress; found by the research of Jack Herer, refuting claims of other government agencies that the 1942 USDA film 'Hemp for Victory' did not exist.

Hemp cultivation and production do not harm the environment. The USDA Bulletin #404 concluded that hemp produces 4 times as much pulp with at least 4 to 7 times less pollution. From Popular Mechanics, Feb. 1938:

'It has a short growing season...It can be grown in any state...The long roots penetrate and break the soil to leave it in perfect condition for the next year's crop. The dense shock of leaves, 8 to 12 feet above the ground, chokes out weeds.

...hemp, this new crop can add immeasurably to American agriculture and industry.'

In the 1930s, innovations in farm machinery would have caused an industrial revolution when applied to hemp. This single resource could have created millions of new jobs generating thousands of quality products. Hemp, if not made illegal, would have brought America out of the Great Depression.

William Randolph Hearst (Citizen Kane) and the Hearst Paper Manufacturing Division of Kimberly Clark owned vast acreage of timberlands. The Hearst Company supplied most paper products. Patty Hearst's grandfather, a destroyer of nature for his own personal profit, stood to lose billions because of hemp.

In 1937, Dupont patented the processes to make plastics from oil and coal. Dupont's Annual Report urged stockholders to invest in its new petrochemical division. Synthetics such as plastics, cellophane, celluloid, methanol, nylon, rayon, Dacron, etc., could now be made from oil. Natural hemp industrialization would have ruined over 80% of Dupont's business.

[David_McQueen]

Hemp and Marijuana are both products of the Cannabis plant.

Hemp is harmless and has mainly industrial uses, it is the extract used for marijuana that is harmful when specific carbinoids which are useful for medicinal purposes are used for smoking, ingestion to get high.

May I add AGAIN I do not advocate the use of cannabis for anything other than meidicinal pain relief. But am still at a loss as to how we deal with or control the recreational use of it.

[Clio]

Oh Yes, I know. And I agree with you completely on medicinal uses... but like you, am at a loss of what to do about recreational use.

I do not believe that morality or personal activity in the privacy of the home is something the government should be legislating... with the exception of strict punishment for those who hurt children or others and then try to pull the "sanctity of the right to privacy" over their crime.

Clio

[LifeHiscost]

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Natural hemp industrialization would have ruined over 80% of.......

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[:"red"] "For the love of money is a root of all kinds of evil" [/] 1 Tim 6:10 NKJV

[Dr. Shane]

I have been asked to refrain from political discussions for 30 days and am going to respect that request.