Praying for others and the question of free will.

[Seektruth]

My question is a simple one, does God cause people to do something because you are praying for it? Can God influence a persons thoughts? Please use Biblical examples.

Thanks!

[Gibs]

Col 1:8 Who also declared unto us your love in the Spirit.

Col 1:9 ¶ For this cause we also, since the day we heard it, do not cease to pray for you, and to desire that ye might be filled with the knowledge of his will in all wisdom and spiritual understanding;

1Co 2:10 But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.

Joh 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

Joh 16:13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.

1Jo 2:20 ¶ But ye have an unction from the Holy One, and ye know all things.

1Jo 2:27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[earl40]

I assure you God does not do anything "because" of anything outside of Himself. Our wills are totally free to do whatever they want. It is only by His grace we can want anything good. His will is never thwarted. "For who hath resisted His will?" (Rom. 9:19)...PS. the answer is nobody. :)

[12tribes]

My question is a simple one, does God cause people to do something because you are praying for it? Can God influence a persons thoughts? Please use Biblical examples.

Thanks!

We know that God does influence a persons thoughts but He does not force the will.

[earl40]

Originally Posted By: Seektruth

My question is a simple one, does God cause people to do something because you are praying for it? Can God influence a persons thoughts? Please use Biblical examples.

Thanks!

We know that God does influence a persons thoughts but He does not force the will.

He does not force the will. He changes it with regeneration. Most do not understand that regeneration (IOW becoming born again) happens before one believes.

[Gibs]

There is no direct statements that man has free will that come to mind but the fact that Satan chose to rebel and Adam and Eve chose to be disobedient proves God gave free will.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[earl40]

Adam before the fall had the ability to sin or not to sin,

Adam after the fall lost the ability to not not sin.

Adam, after his redemption, (or people today with faith) have the ability to sin or not to sin.

People without faith can only sin and have no ability to not not sin.

[12tribes]

He does not force the will. He changes it with regeneration. Most do not understand that regeneration (IOW becoming born again) happens before one believes.

Acts 16:30-31 KJV

(30) And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?

(31) And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.

[12tribes]

He does not force the will. He changes it with regeneration. Most do not understand that regeneration (IOW becoming born again) happens before one believes.

Sounds like teaching from a reformed theologists.

[earl40]

Originally Posted By: earl40

He does not force the will. He changes it with regeneration. Most do not understand that regeneration (IOW becoming born again) happens before one believes.

Sounds like teaching from a reformed theologists.

This is the teaching of John and of which the reformed theologians and many who are not theologians should believe.

13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.

[12tribes]

This is the teaching of John and of which the reformed theologians and many who are not theologians should believe.

13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.

[earl40]

Originally Posted By: earl40

This is the teaching of John and of which the reformed theologians and many who are not theologians should believe.

13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.

Does that mean you are reformed theologist? I agree that we are born again by the Spirit. Those verses you quoted do not say we are born again before we believe.

Quote:

John 3:15 KJV

(15) That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.

I will let you explain how a dead or non born again person can believe. Dead men can't believe. We are all born dead in trespass and sin

3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

[12tribes]

God has given us the power of choice and if we chose God gives power. When Israel crossed the Jordan river after the 40 years the water did not part until they touched the brim of the water. They made a choice and God opened the way.

Quote:

Joshua 3:15-16 KJV

(15) And as they that bare the ark were come unto Jordan, and the feet of the priests that bare the ark were dipped in the brim of the water, (for Jordan overfloweth all his banks all the time of harvest,)

(16) That the waters which came down from above stood and rose up upon an heap very far from the city Adam, that is beside Zaretan: and those that came down toward the sea of the plain, even the salt sea, failed, and were cut off: and the people passed over right against Jericho.

[earl40]

God has given us the power of choice and if we chose God gives power. When Israel crossed the Jordan river after the 40 years the water did not part until they touched the brim of the water. They made a choice and God opened the way.

So you must think men are pretty powerful. For to believe such entails men's wills are more powerful than God's will. I assure you this idea of men being able to believe before regeneration denies the fall of mankind in Adam.

John 6:44: "[Jesus said,] 'No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him. And I will raise him up on the last day.'

[Gerr]

So you must think men are pretty powerful. For to believe such entails men's wills are more powerful than God's will. I assure you this idea of men being able to believe before regeneration denies the fall of mankind in Adam.

John 6:44: "[Jesus said,] 'No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him. And I will raise him up on the last day.'

The Father can try to draw, but man can thumb his nose and say, "NO!" Lucifer & his host resisted God. Did that make them more powerful than God? When Adam took the fruit, did that make him more powerful than God? When Cain refused and offered his OWN chosen sacrifice, did that make him more powerful than God?

[12tribes]

Originally Posted By: 12tribes

God has given us the power of choice and if we chose God gives power. When Israel crossed the Jordan river after the 40 years the water did not part until they touched the brim of the water. They made a choice and God opened the way.

So you must think men are pretty powerful. For to believe such entails men's wills are more powerful than God's will. I assure you this idea of men being able to believe before regeneration denies the fall of mankind in Adam.

John 6:44: "[Jesus said,] 'No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him. And I will raise him up on the last day.'

Joshua 24:15 KJV

(15) And if it seem evil unto you to serve the LORD, choose you this day whom ye will serve; whether the gods which your fathers served that were on the other side of the flood, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land ye dwell: but as for me and my house, we will serve the LORD.

[12tribes]

Originally Posted By: earl40

So you must think men are pretty powerful. For to believe such entails men's wills are more powerful than God's will. I assure you this idea of men being able to believe before regeneration denies the fall of mankind in Adam.

John 6:44: "[Jesus said,] 'No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him. And I will raise him up on the last day.'

The Father can try to draw, but man can thumb his nose and say, "NO!" Lucifer & his host resisted God. Did that make them more powerful than God? When Adam took the fruit, did that make him more powerful than God? When Cain refused and offered his OWN chosen sacrifice, did that make him more powerful than God?

[earl40]

The Father can try to draw, but man can thumb his nose and say, "NO!" Lucifer & his host resisted God. Did that make them more powerful than God? When Adam took the fruit, did that make him more powerful than God? When Cain refused and offered his OWN chosen sacrifice, did that make him more powerful than God?

So you really think that God did not allow Adam to sin?

[Guest]

And Elisha sent a messenger unto him, saying, Go and wash in the Jordan seven times, and your flesh shall come again to you, and you shall be clean.

But Naaman was angry, and went away, and said, Behold, I thought, He will surely come out to me, and stand, and call on the name of the LORD his God, and strike his hand over the place, and cure the leprosy.

Are not Abana and Pharpar, rivers of Damascus, better than all the waters of Israel? may I not wash in them, and be clean? So he turned and went away in a rage.

And his servants came near, and spoke unto him, and said, My father, if the prophet had bid you do some great thing, would you not have done it? how much rather then, when he says to you, Wash, and be clean?

Then he went down, and dipped himself seven times in the Jordan, according to the saying of the man of God: and his flesh was restored again like unto the flesh of a little child, and he was clean.

And he returned to the man of God, he and all his company, and came, and stood before him: and he said, Behold, now I know that there is no God in all the earth, but in Israel: now therefore, I pray you, take a blessing from your servant. 2Kings 5:10-15