A thought I had

[M. T. Cross]

When we hear the following in a relationship we call it abusive.

"Without me you are nothing, do as I say and follow my command and I will be good to you. Disobey me and I will destroy you. Its easy mind you, just submit your will to me, follow all my requests no matter how unreasonable they may be and I will make your life good"

Oddly enough though, if one reads 3/4's of the threads here its called salvation.........

[Gibs]

What request of His though EC would you consider unreasonable? As for me I have never seen one.

The Greek for when Jesus used "commandment",

entole en-tol-ay'

from 1781; injunction, i.e. an authoritative prescription:--commandment, precept.

Really in His love for us, His requests are actually for our own good.

They are actually requests, as all are made free to disobey them if they wish.

There is one away back who did not think His requests were fair and his name was Lucifer in the beginning.

I suppose a command or request of yours to your young child who hadn't gotten burned by fire or a hot burner on the stove, and you'd say, "do not touch that burner or strike a match and put your finger in the flame"! It will hurt you badly! Was that an unreasonable request? The child didn't think so after he/she got burned!

Well you turned away and the next day the child had a badly burned hand.

I understand you have unbelief in the God of the Bible but I find it absolutely true as it proves out.

Yes He tells us IF you would have LIFE follow me and do my will. ( my paraphrase )

How come I have faith that He is and His Word is true. His prophecy proves Him and His Word. I can't prove Yahweh/Yahshua, God to you but His prophecy can if understood.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[CoAspen]

Ah, but you are reading them from the words/interpretation of posters! Things/ideas can be slanted to support most any position. I like to take the whole of the Bible, not isolated texts, and then put it all together for a true picture of what God is saying. I see the words of God, in context, as quite life affirming!! I see God as a guide up a treacherous mountain trail, He has been over it many times and knows the safest way to negotiate it.

[M. T. Cross]

Ah CoA, I am not actually saying the Divine/God/Whatever IS actually that way. You are right I am saying how it is often presented. Here and by many Christians I have met and spoken with.

Now of course if one wants to it is really easy to find a demanding and abusive God in the Bible and other religious writings. I think that too many people spend to much time dwelling on being saved or damned and not enough time enjoying the beauty of that sometimes treacherous trail and enjoying the company of the divine while they are walking on it.

[Gail]

It depends on who you talk to.

I see salvation as a fix to a problem that was not God's intention but came about via the use of free will on the part of man.

When Christ came, He showed the true nature of His Father. He said that if we see Him (Jesus) we have seen the Father.

He wasn't soft on the hypocrites (religious leaders and those who didn't love) but open toward the suffering and accepting of sinners. For that, He suffered abuse, too.

Notice I said, sinners. To clarify, I mean those who admitted the fact. He said also that the whole need not a Physician, but they that are sick. The ones that the religious people of the day shunned, He welcomed and blessed and forgave and healed.

It makes me wonder how much suffering in the Pharisee families could have been remedied had they come to Jesus, too.

[Textus Receptus]

Actually, it is a misinterpretation of the character of God. Frankly, it is down-right Luciferic. According to the bible in Isaiah, Lucifer had convinced 1/3 of the angelic host that God was unjust and that His heavenly government was tantamount to oppression which consequently was the cause of their rebellion. To believe in an oppressive God, is to have a Pagan mindset., Paganism gave birth to the idea that God needed to be pacified, generally through a required sacrifice. Although there are many methods to this effect, the concept is the same. God does not require for us to sacrifice. He promised the world a savior to be sacrificed in our stead. He wants nothing more than for us to be with Him.

If you understand the character of God, you realize that we chose who we will serve. And, if your name is removed from the book of life, it is not a consequence to God being displeased, but a decision that was consciously made by you. You decide to remove your name. God wants nothing more than for it to remain. Indeed, God does require us to follow His Moral law, but this is not to be oppressive, but as a way of judging the heart. God, as the King of the Universe needs to rule and a method to do so, and as with any ruler needs to weigh the evidence. The law is not there to be a chain but take care of us. They are good laws as they reveal the character of God.

Though scripture does note that God will destroy those who chose wrongly, it is only out of love that this act will be done. Of course this sound contradictory, but the reality is that God will once again purify His universe of sin, and those who have a sinful nature will be destroyed. However, before this act is carried out, their hearts will be weighed. Unfortunately, even if those who are condemned were given an eon of opportunities to change, their hearts would have chosen the same fate. IT is out of mercy that God destroys the wicked. They would be miserable as part of the heavenly body.

As for their demise, or destruction, we cannot define destruction using human understanding. Scripture and the spirit of prophecy both clearly state that this will not be a joyful act for God, but one of great sadness. He loves us and knew us before we were born; it will be with a tremendous heavy heart that this event will happen - for God is love.

God and sin cannot co-exist. Sin will be destroyed by the sheer purity of God. As scripture states, sin is destroyed by the brightness of His coming. As you can see, God cannot change for this act not to happen- we must. He is the great I AM. And, if we draw this situation to its logical conclusion, we ulitimately destroy ourselves.

[M. T. Cross]

Actually, it is a misinterpretation of the character of God. Frankly, it is down-right Luciferic. According to the bible in Isaiah, Lucifer had convinced 1/3 of the angelic host that God was unjust and that His heavenly government was tantamount to oppression which consequently was the cause of their rebellion.