If you were a prophet

[Gerr]

Like in the days of the Old Testament, what sins of God's people would you rebuke today?

Would you receive rebuke from someone who walks around naked? (Isa 20:3} Or one just lying on his right side for 390 days and then on his left side for 40 days? (Eze 4).

[joeb]

Originally Posted By: Gail

Like in the days of the Old Testament, what sins of God's people would you rebuke today?

Would you receive rebuke from someone who walks around naked? (Isa 20:3} Or one just lying on his right side for 390 days and then on his left side for 40 days? (Eze 4).

LOL. By the way some people around here react to Ellen White that's what a person would think she had done.

[BobRyan]

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For you can all prophesy in turn so that everyone may be instructed and encouraged. The spirits of prophets are subject to the control of prophets.(1Cor. 14:31-32)

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But the one who prophesies speaks to people for their strengthening, encouraging and comfort.(1Cor.14:3

I didn't go through the whole bible; but from these 2 quotes it appears that the NT gift of prophecy is to be used for encouragement and comfort; not for rebuke.

In the NT - they insisted the the OT text be called "Scripture" and "The Word of God" and that all doctrine be tested by it.

They never said "pay no attention to what you find in scripture all that stuff is ended - now just listen to whatever we say".

And I think we all see that point clearly.

So that means that there is only 1 gift of prophecy in all of scripture and Peter had it right when he said "Holy men of old moved by the Holy Spirit - spoke from God".

That is exactly how it works and it is how John said it was still working in Rev 1:1 and in 2 John and in 3 John where he was doing all that rebuking through the work of the Holy Spirit.

in Christ,

Bob

[ClubV12]

Every prophet I've looked at from the OT had only two things to say:

Blessing if you follow the counsel, curse if you don't. "Rebuke" was pretty high on their list of things to do. In the NT, I see Paul continuing that trend. He wouldn't hesitate to call sin by it's right name. He rebuked Peter to his face and many other people as well as Churches.

[joeb]

I agree that reproof and warning were a primary task for the OT office of prophet, but I see no evidence of that in the NT. Again, refer to the verses I quoted. Of course, you are free to believe as you see fit.

Would you mind showing your evidence for this statement? I don't see it anywhere in the NT. The entire NT is composed of the "blessing if you follow the counsel given and rebuke if you don't" theme. All NT writers, and Christ, gave rebukes/warnings for sinful behavior in any of its forms. They, in fact, gave expanded definitions of sin, for the OT writings had been so perverted by the man-made traditions followed by the Jews of Christ's day.

[JoeMo]

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Would you mind showing your evidence for this statement?

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But he that prophesieth speaketh unto men to edification, and exhortation, and comfort 1Cor. 14:3.

Satan comes to accuse and condemn us for our sins. He would tell you "You lied; therefore you are a liar"! "You drank alcohol; therefore you are a drunk"! "You had a lustful thought about a woman other than your wife; therefore you are an adulterer"! "Pigs like you are not worthy of salvation - why even try?"

God would convict us of our sins. In the same circumstances, He might say "With my Spirit, I want to bring you to a higher level of honesty and truthfulness! Accept my Spirit, which I offer you in grace and out of love to do so!" "Why dull your mind with artificial substances? Come to me, if you are weary and heavy laden - I will give you rest! Live life more abundantly through the true permanent joy that I offer rather than the temprary joy of poison!" "I want to bring you to a new level of purity which only I can give you through My Spirit! Come - sit at my feet and learn of me!"

Do you see the difference? The devil condemns (rebukes)our spirits; thus encouraging us to "give up" on God. God shows us our shortcoming; but then woos us back to relationship, thus encouraging a more fulfilling and sactified life; encouraging us to give up on Satan.

Does that make sense?

[Ted Oplinger]

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Would you mind showing your evidence for this statement?

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But he that prophesieth speaketh unto men to edification, and exhortation, and comfort 1Cor. 14:3.

Satan comes to accuse and condemn us for our sins. He would tell you "You lied; therefore you are a liar"! "You drank alcohol; therefore you are a drunk"! "You had a lustful thought about a woman other than your wife; therefore you are an adulterer"! "Pigs like you are not worthy of salvation - why even try?"

God would convict us of our sins. In the same circumstances, He might say "With my Spirit, I want to bring you to a higher level of honesty and truthfulness! Accept my Spirit, which I offer you in grace and out of love to do so!" "Why dull your mind with artificial substances? Come to me, if you are weary and heavy laden - I will give you rest! Live life more abundantly through the true permanent joy that I offer rather than the temprary joy of poison!" "I want to bring you to a new level of purity which only I can give you through My Spirit! Come - sit at my feet and learn of me!"

Do you see the difference? The devil condemns (rebukes)our spirits; thus encouraging us to "give up" on God. God shows us our shortcoming; but then woos us back to relationship, thus encouraging a more fulfilling and sactified life; encouraging us to give up on Satan.

Does that make sense?

Makes a lot of sense, Joe.

Blessings,

[joeb]

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Would you mind showing your evidence for this statement?

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But he that prophesieth speaketh unto men to edification, and exhortation, and comfort 1Cor. 14:3.

Satan comes to accuse and condemn us for our sins. He would tell you "You lied; therefore you are a liar"! "You drank alcohol; therefore you are a drunk"! "You had a lustful thought about a woman other than your wife; therefore you are an adulterer"! "Pigs like you are not worthy of salvation - why even try?"

God would convict us of our sins. In the same circumstances, He might say "With my Spirit, I want to bring you to a higher level of honesty and truthfulness! Accept my Spirit, which I offer you in grace and out of love to do so!" "Why dull your mind with artificial substances? Come to me, if you are weary and heavy laden - I will give you rest! Live life more abundantly through the true permanent joy that I offer rather than the temprary joy of poison!" "I want to bring you to a new level of purity which only I can give you through My Spirit! Come - sit at my feet and learn of me!"

Do you see the difference? The devil condemns (rebukes)our spirits; thus encouraging us to "give up" on God. God shows us our shortcoming; but then woos us back to relationship, thus encouraging a more fulfilling and sactified life; encouraging us to give up on Satan.

Does that make sense?

I don't understand your notion that rebuke equals personal condemnation. It doesn't. Look at all of Paul's condemnation of sin. Look at all of Christ's condemnation of sin. That's rebuke of sin.

Satan condemns the sinner and ladles out the guilt saying you'll never be good enough, you're lost. Rebuke condemns the sin and points out the consequences of continued sinning. Satan condemns the sinner. There's a huge difference.

[JoeMo]

That is a view you (and many others here)are entitled to. I'll keep my view. Taking the gentler, more uplifting approach works well for my interaction with others. Whatever turns people away from evil and towards good. Do unto others as you would have them do unto you. I like taking the carrots some people offer more than taking the beating from the stick that others offer.

The same thing works with my self-talk. Hopefully, without sounding conceited, I trust myself more than anyone else. When I continually tell myself what evil, unworthy scum I am, I start belieiving it and act thusly. When I tell myself I am a child of God and a brother of Jesus; therefore I should act that way, I feel much better about myself; and tend to act thusly.

[ClubV12]

JoeMo, the difference is this:

When the evil doer comes to me and says, "Your a sinner. You did this, and that, and didn't do this or that that you should have done. You fell to hard, you are to unworthy to approach the throne."

He's not lying, he's telling the truth, it is true, I have slipped. I have fallen. I am not worthy of Gods love. What then shall I do? It's OK to recognize this fact of salvation, but only for a moment please!

Stand up, rebke the evil doer. I will cling to Jesus, my only hope. I will acknowledge my imperfections and accept His robe of righteousness to cover me. By faith I will hold onto Him and not let go. By faith I understand that I AM worthy because I consider the price paid that I might live. I am of inestimatble value to the Father and the Son. How I thank God that He has made provision to save me from myself at the cost of emptying all of heaven!

Worthy indeed, beyond measure!

[JoeMo]

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Stand up, rebke the evil doer. I will cling to Jesus, my only hope. I will acknowledge my imperfections and accept His robe of righteousness to cover me. By faith I will hold onto Him and not let go. By faith I understand that I AM worthy because I consider the price paid that I might live. I am of inestimatble value to the Father and the Son. How I thank God that He has made provision to save me from myself at the cost of emptying all of heaven!

Worthy indeed, beyond measure

Love it, Club! That post helped to make my day! Great balance!

[joeb]

That is a view you (and many others here)are entitled to. I'll keep my view. Taking the gentler, more uplifting approach works well for my interaction with others. Whatever turns people away from evil and towards good. Do unto others as you would have them do unto you. I like taking the carrots some people offer more than taking the beating from the stick that others offer.

The same thing works with my self-talk. Hopefully, without sounding conceited, I trust myself more than anyone else. When I continually tell myself what evil, unworthy scum I am, I start belieiving it and act thusly. When I tell myself I am a child of God and a brother of Jesus; therefore I should act that way, I feel much better about myself; and tend to act thusly.

I thought the point of Christianity is to trust Christ more than anyone, and that includes self. I wouldn't do that if I trusted to myself. I don't see how anyone can trust Christ if they trust to themselves. Why? Because the Bible tells us that our hearts are deceitful above all things and desperately wicked. Does that sound like self is trustworthy? Isn't God a better judge of how sinful we are than you and I are?

Accepting the rebuking sin doesn't mean we don't acknowledge Christ is greater than sin. To me, it's actually the first step in realizing we need Him. Why? Because if we didn't know sin, and sinful behavior, is condemned we wouldn't know we needed a Savior. Period. That's how I know I need Him on a daily basis, because I need His life, His power, live a life of anything but depravity. I know what's inside me, and it's nothing good. My entire history without Him tells me that. Isn't that what your history without Him tells you?

It's a balance of seeing how evil we really are and understanding the value God has placed upon us that He spent such a great price to redeem us. I'm of value, because Christ died to redeem me, not because I'm such a great person without Him. Christ in me is all that makes me of value. He's the entire enchilada when it comes to self-worth, for me.

[JoeMo]

Hey Joe,

I don't know if we communicate poorly with each other or we just have to agree to disagree.

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I thought the point of Christianity is to trust Christ more than anyone, and that includes self.

Agreed. I'm not attempting to split hairs here (and I hope you're not, either). When I say that we trust ourselves more than anyone else, I'm referring to created people - like friends, parents, bosses, pastors, and other created humans on CA. I was not referring to deities or other spiritual beings, who generally talk in your hesd. Most people can't tell the difference between the self talk that originates in your brain and the self-talk that originates from spiritual "high places".

Psychology has stated that people speak about 1,200 per minute to themselves in their heads; and about 1,100 of those words are negative. Where do those negative words come from? Who is it that accuses us of sin and unworthiness constantly?

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for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.(Rev. 12:10)

If 90% of your self-talk is negative, what will you believe?

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A good man out of the good treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is good; and an evil man out of the evil treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is evil: for of the abundance of the heart his mouth speaketh.(Luke 6:45)

If I am constantly listening to my self-talk (which could come from either my own brain or a spiritual entity), telling my heart how incurably evil I am, guess what I become? EVIL!

If, on the other hand, I force myself to listen to a voice (which could come from either my own brain or a spiritual entity), that tells me I am a child of God; and am covered by the grace and blood of His Son; and that I am created for good works, what do I become? SAVED! (I will NEVER be good enough in my own merit to be saved - it is only by Christ's goodness that I am saved)

One difference I think I see between you and me is that you choose to remain bound by the doctines (both written and unwritten)of a man-made religion; I choose to be bound strictly by the word of God and the input of His Spirit (although I admit that sometimes I'm not sure it is the S[pirit until I check it in scripture), regardless of what "the club" is feeding me. I'm not saying who's right or wrong here. I am saying that my mind will not be easily changed by anything you have said thus far. I think you feel the same way about what I say.

[joeb]

Hey Joe,

I don't know if we communicate poorly with each other or we just have to agree to disagree.

One difference I think I see between you and me is that you choose to remain bound by the doctines (both written and unwritten)of a man-made religion; I choose to be bound strictly by the word of God and the input of His Spirit (although I admit that sometimes I'm not sure it is the S[pirit until I check it in scripture), regardless of what "the club" is feeding me. I'm not saying who's right or wrong here. I am saying that my mind will not be easily changed by anything you have said thus far. I think you feel the same way about what I say.

Hey JoeMo,

We probably just communicate poorly in this form of communication. It's one of the worst ways there is to communicate for there's no body language to read, no tone of voice to hear, etc....

I did misunderstand at least a part of your post. I thought when you said you trusted to yourself more than anyone else you knew that included Christ. How did I get that take? He's someone I know. A friend, my best friend. The only human I trust in all things. Anyway, that's where that misunderstanding originated from.

So, you think that by me taking the Bible as the word of God, and that believing God is able to protect His communication to us through it so that His ideas, His concepts, His message that gets through, rather than any messages the unsanctified human heart might add on its own that I'm accepting a man-made religion? I look at the SOP in the same light. Either it's God's messages through and through, or it's completely worthless. It's one or the other. There is no middle ground in the spiritual warfare between Christ and Satan. There can't be.

Do you accept Christ's word as a good judge of who we are?