We Must Humble Ourselves!

[Gibs]

This will be a little read from Sister White, I couldn't state it better.

"The Lord is coming, and we must be ready! Every moment I want His grace—I want the robe of Christ’s righteousness. We must humble our souls before God as never before, come low to the foot of the cross, and He will put a word in our mouths to speak for Him, even praise unto our God. He will teach us a strain from the song of the angels, even thanksgiving to our heavenly Father. We can do nothing of ourselves, but God wants to touch our lips with a living coal from off the altar. He wants to sanctify our tongues—to sanctify our whole being. {OFC 129.2}

The word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. Hebrews 4:12. {OFC 129.3}

The truths of the Bible, treasured in the heart and mind and obeyed in the life, convince and convert the soul, transform the character, and comfort and uplift the heart. . . . The Word makes the proud humble, the perverse meek and contrite, the disobedient obedient. The sinful habits natural to man are interwoven with the daily practice. But the Word cuts away the fleshly lusts. It is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the mind. It divides the joints and marrow, cutting away the lusts of the flesh, making men willing to suffer for their Lord. {OFC 129.4}

The service of Christ is a heavenly and holy and blessed thing. The Word is to be diligently searched, for the ministry of the Word discovers the imperfections in our characters and teaches us that the sanctification of the Spirit is a work of heavenly devising, presenting in Christ Jesus the true perfection that if maintained will become a perfect whole in behalf of every soul. We are educated in Bible lines to become complete in Christlikeness and to see His Father’s face in Him who gave His own life for the saving of the soul. {OFC 129.5}

If you are an intelligent Christian you will maintain religious vitality and will not be deterred by difficulties. . . . You will work the works of God in gloom as well as in glory, in shade as well as in sunshine, in trial as well as in peace. The truth must be treasured up in your heart as well as incorporated in your being, so that no temptation and no argument can induce you to yield to Satan’s suggestions or devices. The truth is precious. It has wrought important changes upon the life and upon the character, exerting a masterly influence over words, deportment, thoughts, and experience. The soul who appreciates the truth lives under its influence and senses the tremendous realities of eternal things. He lives not to himself, but to Jesus Christ who died for him. To him, God lives and is very cognizant of all his words and actions. {OFC 129.6}

Really, now are we His "little" children? Little children are eager to learn, are we?

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[Gibs]

Self is one of the hardest to Conquer and this must be done. Self MUST NOT be the ruler in the Soul Temple, Yahshua must be. We must be humbled to accomplish that feat and keep self crucified.

1Pe 5:5 Likewise, ye younger, submit yourselves unto the elder. Yea, all of you be subject one to another, and be clothed with humility: for God resisteth the proud, and giveth grace to the humble.

Then we with Paul can be as he states here, "with self crucified",

Ro 6:2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[Gibs]

Pride rises up in us all! It is really self and must be put in subordination to the Indwelling of the Master we must have in us and be as a little child, eager to learn of Him.

Pride and self must be humbled, kept crucified, being then continually modest!

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[ClubV12]

I see the Lord using subission to one another as a major tool to combat pride. I have seen in my experience where I have brought many times to the point of realizing that I need to put aside my "cherished" position. To promote unity, learn to trust Him and accept at times even a bitter pill to be in harmony with my brethren.

Sister White has a great deal to say about the need for unity and she set a find example in that regard. Her call to Australia serves as an example. There has been much talk of how the brethren just wanted to get rid of her, send her away. Did SHE ever say anything like that? Nope! She was not sure of what path she should take, it was not revealed to her yes or no. So she applied the principle of being in harmony with her brethren and trusting in Him. She submitted herself to their request, packed her bags and considered their call to Australia as her call from the Lord.

What about if you don't agree with the Pastor, the Church Board, the Conference and on up? I see the same principle should be applied. One needs to find a way to come into harmony, honor and respect those appointed by the Lord in leadership positions, even when you dead sure they are wrong!

The G.C. is considering ordination of women Ministers, as you know. I oppose that myself. BUT, I will support, honor and respect whatever decision the G.C. makes on that issue, even though I may disagree. I will not gossip, rumor, attack the character of those appointed as leaders and condem them or the Church for a position I don't like. I will find a way to encourage a change of view in ways that are compatible with the principles of unity.

Some say, those leaders were appointed by man, not God. Not so!!! What is bound on earth is bound in heaven. Our Father IS in control, when it is time, He will do what needs to be done to correct whatever problems may arise. It won't be on MY timetable, but His. Perhaps He will allow error and apostasy to continue for decades as a lesson for us and for our children and even our childrens children? We see this over and over with the Children of Israel. Blessing and curse, He, always in control. Patiently guiding, waiting, teaching. His schedule, not mine.

[Gibs]

Yes, I agree, unity is great and wonderful, but only in the truth.

I am not aagainst ordination of any, but the ordination of men mean nothing. What must be deterined is, who is this one ordained of?

The best we could do at an ordination service is recognize any known to be ordained from above.

Same with the leadership in the church today, it is by the truth we can know who they are of.

Your comment ClubV12 has lighted the fire in me to realize the TRUTH of anything is utmost these days when deceptons is the norm in about all things and places.

I love the truth and that is what my Saviour is, the TRUTH and the WAY.

Our modest and humble one who was the Highest with us.

May all be blessed in Him and by Him!

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[ClubV12]

It has been my experience that safety in interpretation of scripture and the work of Ellen White is best found with a multitude of counselors. People see different facets of the gems of truth. It helps one to stay balanced while in pursuit of truth, lest they find error and call it truth. The two paths, truth and error, lay very close to one another.

I reject this idea that all a person needs is the bible and to be led of the Holy Spirit and they can find all the truth. The Father and the Spirit don't work that way. After Pauls encounter of the road, he was sent to the Church for his first instruction. The visible, organized Church is the predominant method our Father uses to instruct, reproof and polish our characters. He is the one that brings us into close contact with one another that we may see our defects and learn of Him.

[Ted Oplinger]

Yes, I agree, unity is great and wonderful, but only in the truth.

Yes, Gibs, but many interpret that unity to be with respect to one's own understanding to what "truth" is - which is not unity, but uniformity, a different creature all together.

Blessings,

[Gail]

I see the Lord using subission to one another as a major tool to combat pride. I have seen in my experience where I have brought many times to the point of realizing that I need to put aside my "cherished" position. To promote unity, learn to trust Him and accept at times even a bitter pill to be in harmony with my brethren.

Sister White has a great deal to say about the need for unity and she set a find example in that regard. Her call to Australia serves as an example. There has been much talk of how the brethren just wanted to get rid of her, send her away. Did SHE ever say anything like that? Nope! She was not sure of what path she should take, it was not revealed to her yes or no. So she applied the principle of being in harmony with her brethren and trusting in Him. She submitted herself to their request, packed her bags and considered their call to Australia as her call from the Lord.

What about if you don't agree with the Pastor, the Church Board, the Conference and on up? I see the same principle should be applied. One needs to find a way to come into harmony, honor and respect those appointed by the Lord in leadership positions, even when you dead sure they are wrong!

The G.C. is considering ordination of women Ministers, as you know. I oppose that myself. BUT, I will support, honor and respect whatever decision the G.C. makes on that issue, even though I may disagree. I will not gossip, rumor, attack the character of those appointed as leaders and condem them or the Church for a position I don't like. I will find a way to encourage a change of view in ways that are compatible with the principles of unity.

Some say, those leaders were appointed by man, not God. Not so!!! What is bound on earth is bound in heaven. Our Father IS in control, when it is time, He will do what needs to be done to correct whatever problems may arise. It won't be on MY timetable, but His. Perhaps He will allow error and apostasy to continue for decades as a lesson for us and for our children and even our childrens children? We see this over and over with the Children of Israel. Blessing and curse, He, always in control. Patiently guiding, waiting, teaching. His schedule, not mine.

Amen, Club! God IS still in control, we have faith that nothing is impossible for Him. I SO appreciate your words here. Well said!

[Gibs]

Your best counselor is not to look unto men for the truth! The wisdom of men is foolishness.

For proof of that look at the condition of our country and where protestant Christian religion has fell to.

Here is your only counselor to trust and with it a wonderful promise!

Joh 16:13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.

That is wonderful, not only guides into all truth but will shew us things to come.

Ah, to be forewarned is to be forearmed.

Ah, and again we must be humble and sit at His Feet the one and only faithful and true teacher that can be trusted.

Ps 2:12 Kiss the Son, lest he be angry, and ye perish from the way, when his wrath is kindled but a little. Blessed are all they that put their trust in him

Ps 118:8 It is better to trust in the LORD than to put confidence in man.

1Co 3:19 For the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God. For it is written, He taketh the wise in their own craftiness.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[JoeMo]

Quote:

Yes, Gibs, but many interpret that unity to be with respect to one's own understanding to what "truth" is - which is not unity, but uniformity, a different creature all together.

Very well said, Ted!

[Gibs]

True unity remains to be in the Truth as it is in His Word. Oh yes there is unity of this evil world against the truth and that is what Christians are to be fighting.

In most all so call Christian churches of today it is being put forth we can and must be saved in sin as none can overcome it.

It is now a small minority that support the fact we must be overcomers.

Which unity will you take hold of?

We must humble ourselves and know of ourselves we can do nothing, but we with Christ within can do all things and walk as He walked.

How so? It is a fact He took no power but what is ours to overcome the devil and the world!

Do you think you will escape the second death not being an overcomer? Better think again, pleae read,

Re 2:11 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; He that overcometh shall not be hurt of the second death.

Or are you going to believe the lie being foisted in most churches today?

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[JoeMo]

Quote:

Re 2:11 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; He that overcometh shall not be hurt of the second death.

And how do we overcome? The same book tells us:

Quote:

These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. (Rev. 7:14

Quote:

And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.(Rev 12:11)

I don't read anything in there that says our salvation is based on abject submission to the law. We are saved by grace through the blood of Christ. Period. That grace will give us power to overcome; but overcoming is the RESULT of grace; not the PREREQUISITE. I feel like a broken record I've said that so many times. Not that anyone has to agree with me...

[Gibs]

Jesus says we must be an overcomer and we have no excuse to not. He gives all the power He took to do it.

Re 2:7 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the tree of life, which is in the midst of the paradise of God.

Re 2:11 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; He that overcometh shall not be hurt of the second death.

Re 2:17 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the hidden manna, and will give him a white stone, and in the stone a new name written, which no man knoweth saving he that receiveth it.

Re 2:26 And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations:

Re 3:5 He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels.

Re 3:12 Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name.

Re 3:21 To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.

Christ in you is the only hope of Glory for the simple reason, you of yourself can overcome nothing and the prize will not be yours!

Millions will be lost believeing they are saved and yet continuing in their sins.

Ro 6:1 ¶ What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?

Ro 6:2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?

Ro 6:3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?

Ro 6:4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.

Ro 6:5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:

Ro 6:6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.

Ro 6:7 For he that is dead is freed from sin.

Eze 3:20 Again, When a righteous man doth turn from his righteousness, and commit iniquity, and I lay a stumblingblock before him, he shall die: because thou hast not given him warning, he shall die in his sin, and his righteousness which he hath done shall not be remembered; but his blood will I require at thine hand.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[JoeMo]

Gibs,

You have quoted those verses so often, you sound like a broken record too!

[Gibs]

JoeMoe, I must also state besides what I did above that God is not in the business of saving any in sin. If that was the case He would have made us all humaniods, robots.

It has been made of Him that it falls on us as He has made us free to choose as to what we will be of, Him or Satan.

So the case is this, if and when we come and repent and die of the old man, then we are born again, a new creature with our desire to please Him and not Satan.

When dead of self and he is no longer the master in us, then He can come in and be the Master in the soul temple. Then we fully have His strength to walk as He did, no excuse is valid!

Now it centers on how much do you love Him, enought to give all? Yes we must lay all on the alter, and when we do truly love Him with all our hearts, this is our desire to do.

Many will not surrender all and so they forfeit all. We need to ask ourselves, how much do we love our cherished sin? If you can't put it away you have proven to yourself that you have a master you love more than Him. Proves one is not dead to sin!

He will not in the least take any into Heaven that haven't put away sin from them as He will not have it to rise up again and destroy all as it has done.

Just look and see the tremendous cost of sin. Since He is truly Love, He must not allow it to be taken in His kingdom. All taken in abhor it as they see the horror of it all and it is embeded in the hearts and souls of all the redeemed to for all eternity to be obedient to His Love.

Re 2:11 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; He that overcometh shall not be hurt of the second death.

Still sinning? Then that is proof one has not overcome!

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[ClubV12]

I know of a couple of groups that preach this false doctrine of "perfection" and "you can stop sinning RIGHT NOW". Like all false doctrine it contains just enough truth to confuse folks into believing it.

The fact is, as we grow closer to Jesus we see and understand more and more concerning our weakness and short comings. The closer you get, the more pronounced becomes your need of His righteousness to cover your fithly rags. It is in that sense that perfection becomes an impossible goal.

[Gail]

Does "perfect" and "overcome" mean exactly the same thing?

[Gibs]

I don't think exactly the same Gail but is the goal of overcoming I believe.

And to all who don't find we can walk as our Saviour, you have no valid excuse, none have.

Mt 5:48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

Joh 5:14 Afterward Jesus findeth him in the temple, and said unto him, Behold, thou art made whole: sin no more, lest a worse thing come unto thee.

Jesus never told one, nary a one to go do something not possible.

Col 1:27 To whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory:

Col 1:28 Whom we preach, warning every man, and teaching every man in all wisdom; that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus:

Php 4:13 I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[joeb]

Gail,

Here are some quotes that I find very relevant to this topic. Please read these quotes with the other promises I have quoted around here in mind.

Quote:

As we discern the perfection of our Saviour’s character we shall desire to become wholly transformed and renewed in the image of His purity. The more we know of God, the higher will be our ideal of character and the more earnest our longing to reflect His likeness. A divine element combines with the human when the soul reaches out after God and the longing heart can say, “My soul, wait thou only upon God; for my expectation is from Him.” Psalm 62:5. TFMB p.19

Quote:

If you have a sense of need in your soul, if you hunger and thirst after righteousness, this is an evidence that Christ has wrought upon your heart, in order that He may be sought unto to do for you, through the endowment of the Holy Spirit, those things which it is impossible for you to do for yourself. We need not seek to quench our thirst at shallow streams; for the great fountain is just above us, of whose abundant waters we may freely drink, if we will rise a little higher in the pathway of faith. TFMB p.19

Quote:

The conditions of eternal life, under grace, are just what they were in Eden—perfect righteousness, harmony with God, perfect conformity to the principles of His law. The standard of character presented in the Old Testament is the same that is presented in the New Testament. This standard is not one to which we cannot attain. In every command or injunction that God gives there is a promise, the most positive, underlying the command. God has made provision that we may become like unto Him, and He will accomplish this for all who do not interpose a perverse will and thus frustrate His grace. TFMB p.76

I leave you to draw your own conclusions as to what God can accomplish in us, if we will surrender ourselves to Him and not frustrate His grace.

[ClubV12]

Perfection and righteousness by faith go hand in hand. It's easy to write, talk about or preach righteousness by faith, but at some point, you have to experience it personally.

Spiritual things are spiritually understood. Luther understood it, his attempts at "perfection" failed miserably. And yet, the moment Luther understood it, He was reckoned perfect by the Father! And the next morning, he had to start all over again. It's a daily, even a moment by moment pursuit. Sanctification is the work of a lifetime.

When Luther understood righteousness by faith, he went straight to work! :)

[joeb]

Perfection and righteousness by faith go hand in hand. It's easy to write, talk about or preach righteousness by faith, but at some point, you have to experience it personally.

Spiritual things are spiritually understood. Luther understood it, his attempts at "perfection" failed miserably. And yet, the moment Luther understood it, He was reckoned perfect by the Father! And the next morning, he had to start all over again. It's a daily, even a moment by moment pursuit. Sanctification is the work of a lifetime.

When Luther understood righteousness by faith, he went straight to work!

What is this work? I'll answer my own question. It's the surrendering of everything that the Holy Spirit brings to our attention as standing between us and God.

Here's an example from my recent life. I have a mother-in-law that I purely cannot stand. She's a passive-aggressive control freak. She also has about zero empathy or compassion within her. She treats her grown children, none of them are less than 50, as if they are about 8 years old and unable to think for themselves. Even worse, she's psychologically abusive to all of them. Here's an example of her arrogance, conceit, and cruelty towards one of her children. The way she treats the rest of them is no less objectionable.

Her middle child is incapable of taking care of himself. He has a birth defect that is causing his brain to literally disintegrate. He can't walk, has a hard time speaking, can hardly read because his eyes won't focus anymore, and a long list of other physical ailments related to this.

This woman will bring him out of his bedroom, take his pants down and shove his penis in, I can't think of the word right now, but you're given one in the hospital to urinate in, so he can urinate in their kitchen. She won't cover him with anything. In fact, when I've gone and gotten a towel or small blanket to cover him with she's removed it. And she will do this to him in a house full of people.

I've objected to this very vehemently because I grew up with psychological abuse and seeing an abuser at work really pushes my buttons. I absolutely hate cruelty.

When I objected to her face her response was that I should just go die because she was going to do things the way she wanted to do them. Moreover, she insisted that her son could care less about she did to him. She didn't even deign to ask him whether he liked it or not either.

I've been being convicted that I shouldn't be holding such hard feelings against her. Now let me tell you I cannot generate forgiveness for her on my own. It's impossible. What I have been doing is surrendering this to God every time I feel the anger building towards her. I keep this matter as a subject of prayer and ask God to change my heart as I know I can't get rid of self. I also claim God's promises that He will change us in these prayers.

In less than two weeks of doing this I can carry on a conversation with my mother-in-law. And, more importantly, it's the change in my heart that is changing my behavior.

I could grit my teeth and try to force myself to be nice to her, but that wouldn't get at the root of the problem. And that root is self. It's something I can't do a thing about, but God can, and is. That's His job and loves to do it for us. That's why Christ came, lived, and died for us.

This is the process of sanctification. We overcome by surrendering our every unlikeness of Christ, to Christ. We keep on surrendering it every time it pops up and keep on asking for God to change our hearts. God then changes our hearts because we have allowed Him to do it. He roots out the "heart" of the matter. That's His job. Ours is just to keep on surrendering everything that would separate us from Him to Him.

[Gibs]

Where is your faith if you don't believe Christ in you is all power in you to overcome the Devil?

How much do we really love Him we must ask ourselves.

It is faith that works by love.

Heb 11:6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.

Ro 13:10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.

"There is nothing so offensive to God as sin. Instead of making void the law of God by continuing in sin, every truly converted soul will be walking in the path of humble obedience to all of God's commandments. They will search the Scriptures that they might know the truth. Who hath bewitched the impenitent, the transgressor, that sin is chosen rather than obedience? It is the power of Satan that came to Adam and Eve in Eden, the deceiving, bewitching power of the fallen angel. . . . {UL 209.5}

How few talk about this great sacrifice of the life of Jesus to save the guilty sinner! If we appreciated this love manifested by God for our souls we would be elevated by taking hold of the merits of Jesus Christ, for without the righteousness of Christ man could not give to God perfect obedience. . . . {UL 209.6}

He condescended to this great sacrifice, not that sin in man should become a virtue, not that sin might be made righteousness. He took the steps that man is required to take in conversion. He went forward in baptism, and when He came up out of the water He kneeled down and offered up such a prayer to His Father as Heaven had never heard before." --Manuscript 25, July 14, 1887, "A Peculiar People." {UL 209.7}

Sin is no small matter as made by too many.

Remember,

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.