Global Warming in a few slides - thanks to Dr. John Christy.

[olger]

This was released on my birthday (coincidentally I'm sure).

http://www.globalwarming.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/ChristyJR_130530_McKinley-PDF-of-PPT.pdf

[Guest]

I knew there was something special about your birthday! ))

[olger]

The last slide was especially poignant to me, the one revealing the impact by 2050 if we reduced carbon output by fifty percent. Other slides about tornado and hurricane data were very significant to me as well.

Overall a fascinating presentation by a very skilled climate individual!

`G

[olger]

Here is a slide from Dr. Christy's presentation:

[Bravus]

Too busy to bite.

[Bravus]

It does rather fall into the trap our American brethren fall into sometimes, though, of mistaking the United States for the world. US records are not the same thing as global climate...

[Ted Oplinger]

This was released on my birthday (coincidentally I'm sure).

http://www.globalwarming.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/ChristyJR_130530_McKinley-PDF-of-PPT.pdf

While I agree with Bravus that the US is not the world, I do say that these charts are very indicative of what is going on in our part of the global climate...Just like what happened in Europe last winter was indicative of what is going on in their part of the global climate.

The most indicative slide in the link is not the charts of temperatures, tornados, and hurricanes. It is the last slide - specifically, the benefits of present energy availability. Each of those benefits listed in blue is what is really being targeted - the lifestyle and life span of those benefiting from both plentiful energy and economic success. At its very core, the environmental movement is not about proper stewardship of this planet - it is about eliminating man and his impact from this planet.

The global warming issue allows those indulging in false guilt about man's issues to take down both plentiful energy (by focusing on hydrocarbon consumption) and economic success (by crippling both the economy and the individual with needless taxes and regulations, all while offering alternatives which in no way can match energy production currently seen today). It is the thought it is unfair that some should have it better than others that rankles the political Left of this world. It is the thought that man haqs it better than the rest of the animal kingdom that rankles the environmentalist within the political Left.

I applaud true proper stewardship of our resources and our planet. I deplore the use of the subject to deconstruct the health, wealth, and well-being of my fellow man.

As I see it, CAGW falls into the latter category.

Food for thought,

[Hair]

Wait a minute... are you guys saying that you actually believe in global warming??... That the earth is not waxing old as a garment as a result of sin, that these calamities are not a sign of the end, but that our cars and factories are what cause it, not contribute, but cause it, and if we stop the carbon then the current earth can continue for eternity??

Like Ted said, I'm all for being a good steward of our world, and I know its possible, but do you really expect to still be here in 2050?

[Ted Oplinger]

Wait a minute... are you guys saying that you actually believe in global warming??... That the earth is not waxing old as a garment as a result of sin, that these calamities are not a sign of the end, but that our cars and factories are what cause it, not contribute, but cause it, and if we stop the carbon then the current earth can continue for eternity??

Like Ted said, I'm all for being a good steward of our world, and I know its possible, but do you really expect to still be here in 2050?

First, welcome to Club Adventist. Glad to have you here.

Second, yes, there are many here to do believe in that - and many here who do not.

I'd prefer that time would come to an end before 2020...

Blessings,

[debbym]

Quote:

Wait a minute... are you guys saying that you actually believe in global warming??... That the earth is not waxing old as a garment as a result of sin, that these calamities are not a sign of the end, but that our cars and factories are what cause it, not contribute, but cause it, and if we stop the carbon then the current earth can continue for eternity??

i had not thought that global warming is an explanation to avoid believing the earth is waxing old as a garment from sin...

what will rapidly finalize earth's destruction is that mighty earthquake when Jesus says "it is finished" and sets out from the sanctuary. the earth will be laid to rubble, mountain chains will sink, and islands disappear.

i believe the weather is cyclic, we have had more severe weather in the past like the flood, and major volcanoes, and then from the ice age. Cataclysmic weather is another opportunity for people to get serious with their maker whether it is global warming changes or tsunamis or hurricanes, whatever it is... Or life events that beg hope and faith in something greater then ourselves.

[Guest]

While I agree with Bravus that the US is not the world, I do say that these charts are very indicative of what is going on in our part of the global climate...Just like what happened in Europe last winter was indicative of what is going on in their part of the global climate.

The most indicative slide in the link is not the charts of temperatures, tornados, and hurricanes. It is the last slide - specifically, the benefits of present energy availability. Each of those benefits listed in blue is what is really being targeted - the lifestyle and life span of those benefiting from both plentiful energy and economic success. At its very core, the environmental movement is not about proper stewardship of this planet - it is about eliminating man and his impact from this planet.

The global warming issue allows those indulging in false guilt about man's issues to take down both plentiful energy (by focusing on hydrocarbon consumption) and economic success (by crippling both the economy and the individual with needless taxes and regulations, all while offering alternatives which in no way can match energy production currently seen today). It is the thought it is unfair that some should have it better than others that rankles the political Left of this world. It is the thought that man haqs it better than the rest of the animal kingdom that rankles the environmentalist within the political Left.

I applaud true proper stewardship of our resources and our planet. I deplore the use of the subject to deconstruct the health, wealth, and well-being of my fellow man.

As I see it, CAGW falls into the latter category.

Food for thought,

I believe you've nailed it Ted.

[Guest]

what will rapidly finalize earth's destruction is that mighty earthquake when Jesus says "it is finished" and sets out from the sanctuary. the earth will be laid to rubble, mountain chains will sink, and islands disappear.

i believe the weather is cyclic, we have had more severe weather in the past like the flood, and major volcanoes, and then from the ice age. Cataclysmic weather is another opportunity for people to get serious with their maker whether it is global warming changes or tsunamis or hurricanes, whatever it is... Or life events that beg hope and faith in something greater then ourselves.

Amen.

[olger]

Excellent post Ted.

`G

[M. T. Cross]

Wait a minute... are you guys saying that you actually believe in global warming??... That the earth is not waxing old as a garment as a result of sin, that these calamities are not a sign of the end, but that our cars and factories are what cause it, not contribute, but cause it, and if we stop the carbon then the current earth can continue for eternity??

Like Ted said, I'm all for being a good steward of our world, and I know its possible, but do you really expect to still be here in 2050?

Yup sure do, the only "sin' contributing the global issues is our lack of caring for the environment that we live in (please make sure you read that as "contributing" not the only cause or Olger). But also that we can make a big difference in the outcome. But in the end the planet goes in cycles and it will do what it will do until the sun explodes and it really does not matter anymore.

I surely do expect to be here in 2050, celebrating my 80th birthday with a nice long hike on a beach somewhere thanking my Gods for a nice long life.

Oh welcome to C/A. Apparently RLH needs to talk to you as he seems to be missing his Hair.

[Tom Wetmore]

...Like Ted said, I'm all for being a good steward of our world, and I know its possible, but do you really expect to still be here in 2050?

As I recall there was a particular group that didn't expect to still be here in 1845. The heirs of that disappointment are still here 168 years, more than 5 generations later. Each generation has sincerely believed they would be the last generation on earth, until the day their children put them in the ground.

Good stewardship means taking care of what we have leaving things as good or better for future generations. Living like there will be no tomorrow tends to go the other way.

[Bravus]

I'll be 86 in 2050... might still be here, might not. My kids will be in their 50s and 60s, grandkids maybe 20s and 30s. Might have a great grandkid or two.

I'd like to leave a better world for them, not a worse one.

(and, as Tom noted above, if you're waiting on the Second Coming as a 'get out of the consequences of your actions free' card - well, so were people in the first century. Not at all saying it won't happen, but the timing is God's... and he asked us to look after the place until he gets back. There are some parables about what happens to servants who don't...)

[Guest]

Yup sure do

If I believed that, I would shave my hairy head, and walk backwards.

Did you also believe it back in the 70's when these same people told us we were headed into another ice age?

[CoAspen]

One does wonder what the future may bring, 2050, hmmmm.... that would be awesome! Something to strive for!!

Heard a sermon recently that suggested it could be selfishness to wish for a quick end to every thing. Why? Because it means we are thinking only of ourselves, what about all of the those who have not had their chance at a decision for Christ? Perhaps we should seek to spread the Good News and let God 'worry' about the end! Not only will we be happier but also that choose to believe!

(By the way MT, I believe you will be seen in heaven as well)

[Hair]

We ALL recognize that we should take care of the earth. No one on here is saying that we should just live any way we want and destroy it.

"Global Warmers" seem to accuse people of being an Earth destroyer if we do not buy into the whole global warming thing.

We are just simply saying that we believe global warming is wrong, possibly just made-up for political reasons. Earth's climate cycles, and the ground changes, it always has and will continue to do so until God returns.

We all like trees and flowers and birds and bees and our grandchildren. We don't dump our oil on the ground, we don't litter, we don't waste water, fuel, electricity, we recycle, but there's a limit... we are not going to worship nature.

We don't wish for the world to end tomorrow. No one uses that for an excuse to do bad things. We simply are saying that with the way things look, it seems as if time is short and its not because of global warming. That's all.

[Ted Oplinger]

We ALL recognize that we should take care of the earth. No one on here is saying that we should just live any way we want and destroy it.

"Global Warmers" seem to accuse people of being an Earth destroyer if we do not buy into the whole global warming thing.

We are just simply saying that we believe global warming is wrong, possibly just made-up for political reasons. Earth's climate cycles, and the ground changes, it always has and will continue to do so until God returns.

We all like trees and flowers and birds and bees and our grandchildren. We don't dump our oil on the ground, we don't litter, we don't waste water, fuel, electricity, we recycle, but there's a limit... we are not going to worship nature.

We don't wish for the world to end tomorrow. No one uses that for an excuse to do bad things. We simply are saying that with the way things look, it seems as if time is short and its not because of global warming. That's all.

Very nice summary as to the stand and practice of the vast majority of global warming skeptics, Hair. It is sad one cannot convince the CAGW zealots this is true - one either accepts their view, or one is a Neanderthal polluter of the very worst kind...

I will take it a step further to say it IS a political endeavor designed to reduce and control significant portions of the earth's population - in particular, wherever the Westernized modern lifestyle may be found. The level of rhetoric aimed at those doubting CAGW easily leads a person to a conclusion there is something far deeper than mere good stewardship lurking in the background.

Blessings,

[Tom Wetmore]

We ALL recognize that we should take care of the earth. No one on here is saying that we should just live any way we want and destroy it.

"Global Warmers" seem to accuse people of being an Earth destroyer if we do not buy into the whole global warming thing.

We are just simply saying that we believe global warming is wrong, possibly just made-up for political reasons. ...

But what the common person that buys into the denials of global warming/climate change seem unwilling to acknowledge is that they are depending on distinctly politically motivated sources that happily use pseudo scientific "research" that is paid for by the various fossil fuel companies and other big business interests that finance those political agendas, spend billions to lobby the government aggressively and set up "media" networks, internet "news" services, etc., just to protect their industry and crazy high profits. The political motivation to make things up from the deniers are vastly greater than those that are environmentalists. Several right here on this forum are employed by or engaged in businesses that are greatly threatened by environmental regulations.

But the average person just listens to the political rhetoric of their political party bosses that are in the pocket of those industries. The misperception is that the "Get the government off our back" conservative rhetoric means the backs of common folk. But the reality is that almost everything that the politicians really seek to do is to get the government off the back of the big business interests that paid for their election to office. Even the no-more-taxes rhetoric of the tea party ends up benefiting big business interests much more than any of us working stiffs. We may get a few more dollars from lower taxes but where does it go? To pay for high priced gasoline for our cars thanks to the oil companies that have the government off their back so they can increase their profits at our expense. Business does not pass tax savings on to the consumer. It goes back into the business to increase profits to the shareholders.... and to pay the politicians for their help... and to set up pseudo scientific research and propaganda organizations with voter friendly sounding names to further enhance their wealth and power.

[phkrause]

Exactly Tom

[Neil D]

We are just simply saying that we believe global warming is wrong, possibly just made-up for political reasons. Earth's climate cycles, and the ground changes, it always has and will continue to do so until God returns.

[CoAspen]

Quote:

The level of rhetoric aimed at those doubting CAGW easily leads a person to a conclusion there is something far deeper than mere good stewardship lurking in the background.

Nope, not at all!! If people wish to contribute to the demise of their enviroment, so be it! But to simply say 'it ain't me' seems to be short sighted. To always associate it with 'politics' or it's 'anti West' or 'its about controling people'.....well....that has not been demonstrated by or part of those who do scientific research everyday. If one chooses to not believe, okay! I find it even more interesting to see some conspiracy behind all of this as if that disproves GW.

[Hair]

Nope, not at all!! If people wish to contribute to the demise of their enviroment, so be it!

If you don't believe the people who do these "scientific experiments everyday" then you are "contributing to the demise of our environment"

Exhibit A of my previous post.

None of us want to contribute to the "demise". Those people who do scientific experiments everyday are also of the same type that bring us the teaching of evolution... no proof for either, just scientific (man's) reckoning.