Who Is the Little Horn/Anti-Christ?

[John317]

Here are 17 Identifying marks that the Scriptures give us in order to know positively who the little-horn/antichrist is. Keep in mind that the real Antichrist/little horn will fulfill ALL (NOT just some) of the identifying marks, or characteristics. There is no question that God wants us to know who these verses refer to. By God's help, let's all study God's word together and see if we can come to a consensus about its identity. Here, then, is the question that we are trying to answer: who fulfills the prophetic specifications? Are there many who fulfill them, or is there only one power in all of history that fulfills these prophecies?

1) It was to arise out of the fourth beast-- that is, out of the ten divisions of the Roman Empire (Daniel 7: 7, . (cf Daniel 2: 40; 08: 20; 6: 12, 15).

2) It was to arise "among the ten horns" (Daniel 7: .

3) It would arise "after" the ten horns (Daniel 7: 24).

4) It would be different from the other horns (Daniel 7: 24).

5) It would have a look more stout than his fellows (Daniel 7: 20).

6) It would uproot, or destroy, three of the ten kingdoms (Daniel 7: 08, 20, 24).

7) It would speak great words against the Most High (Daniel 7: 25; Rev 13: 7).

It would wear out the saints of the Most High (Daniel 7: 25; Rev 13: 7).

9) It would be guilty of blasphemy (Rev. 13: 6; Daniel 7: 25).

10) It would intend change the times and the law (Daniel 7: 25).

11) It would exercise its power over all kindreds and tongues and nations (Rev 13: 7).

12) The dragon would give his power, his seat, and his great authority to this beast (Rev. 13: 2).

13) It was to continue in world domination for a period of 1260 years (Rev. 13: 5; Daniel 7: 25).

14) It would receive a mortal wound (Rev 13: 3).

15) It would amaze the whole world, because its deadly wound would be healed (Rev 13: 3)

16) It (the man of sin, another title for the little horn power) would take its seat in the temple of God (2 Thess 2: 4; 1 Cor. 3: 17).

17) It (the "wicked one") shall be consumed and destroyed when Christ returns (2 Thess 2: 08; cf. Rev. 19: 14-20; 14: 14-20; 2 Thess 1: 7-9).

[Gibs]

Hardly John, as this beast rises up out of the sea, the sea or peoples. The Papacy is but one head of this beast.

Re 13:1 ¶ And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.

In the following verse, note that but ONE head is wounded, the beast has six others plus 10 horns now after 1798 have the king power, crowned!

Then note also the whole world wonders after the BEAST and not the wounded head!!

Re 13:3 And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast.

Before 1798 the heads carried the crowns, Re 12:3

Re 12:3 And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads.

To get it straight we must be taking up each word of the scripture, it isn't a surface read.

1Jo 4:5 They are of the world: therefore speak they of the world, and the world heareth them.

1Jo 4:6 We are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us; he that is not of God heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth, and the spirit of error.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[Kevin H]

John, good to see you back, I've really missed you!!!

While I know and to a large extent agree where you are going, have you ever noticed how those points apply to the Flavian family as emporers? They raised after 10 emperors and destroyed the last three emperors of the Julian party, and was the first emperors who were not of that party. Titus destroyed the temple, and his brother exiled John to Patmos while letting John see his beloved Christians being persecuted and killed. He had the image to walk by and bow down towards, and Jews debated if it was acceptable to adjust their sandal infront of his image. (Either bowing in worship, getting the mark of the beast in their forehead, or bowing to fix their sandal, having the mark of the beast in their right hands).

As we look at these historical possibilities, in both the Flavians and the Pope and others, we will have a clearer understanding of what we will face.

[Kevin H]

The beast is any organized group that replaces Jesus in our lives. The 7 heads are: Babylon, Medio-Persia, Greece, Rome, the Holy Roman Empiror (which includes Papal supremicy, and to the reformers this was Pressent truth for them and thus the focus of their study. But we have to be careful not to make their pressent truth OUR pressent truth, although the Pope we are told WILL play a role, sadly we expect a return to the 5th head instead of moving to the 7th head). The 6th head is the deadly wound: the crown are on the horns, individual independent nations. then the 7th head is described in Revelation 18 as very connected to the merchants of the earth, the corporations. The Pope will be their moral voice. I am quite impressed by the current dali lama, however, I do not believe in re-incarnation. The next one will NOT be the same man as they have now. While I am open to the possibility that the current one is open to the Holy Spirit, I fear one in the future who is open to a different spirit, and since his followers; both traditional and modern, will believe that it is the same man as we have now, they will be very much hurt by him and encouraged to join the system.

The 7th head is not a return to the 5th head, however the Papacy will be the moral voice of the 7th head, but will also work with other religious leaders in uniting the world under the 7th head and the lamblike beast as it speaks like a dragon.

[Samie]

I think there is ONE (1) important identifying mark that has to be considered. The little horn is a KING (Aramaic 'melek'), v24; NOT a kingdom (Aramaic 'malkuw'):

Quote:

NIV Daniel 7:24 The ten horns are ten kings who will come from this kingdom. After them another king will arise, different from the earlier ones; he will subdue three kings.

[Stewart (SDA)]

Is the little horn of Daniel 7:24 the Seleucid king, Antiouchus Epiphanes? If he is the "little horn", which 3 kings did Antiochus subdue?

[Samie]

Is the little horn of Daniel 7:24 the Seleucid king, Antiouchus Epiphanes? If he is the "little horn", which 3 kings did Antiochus subdue?

[Gibs]

All anyone has to do is read the interpretation of the vision the angel gave to Daniel and then have read and understand Re 13: correctly this is easily seen now and the culmination now is very close.

Preconceived ideas will hold you stymied!

1Jo 4:5 They are of the world: therefore speak they of the world, and the world heareth them.

1Jo 4:6 We are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us; he that is not of God heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth, and the spirit of error.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[Kevin H]

Is the little horn of Daniel 7:24 the Seleucid king, Antiouchus Epiphanes? If he is the "little horn", which 3 kings did Antiochus subdue?

As I understand the Bible, there are three correct ways of using the text: First is it's original context, what it meant to the writer and/or editors and original listeners. Then there are analogies drawn, and other times it is using the words to make a point that the words fit but which is not necessary the context or the application.

In the original context the little horn was what COULD have happened if the Hebrews were faithful in what they were to do when returning from the exile. The temple would have been built, Zerubbabel,, would have set up the house of David and it would have been an analogy of Deuteronomy 4. Jesus would have come as king, been accepted, kind of, but yet killed by his friends, but raise to establish the messianic kingdom. And yes the little horn would have been a KING, as Sammie correctly pointed out.

However, since this was not done, and yet it is the living word of God, we draw analogies. In the Analogies, we find in Daniel that it is alright to not limit to just one king, but to also allow application to kingdoms and systems. The rise of the Roman empire makes a good analogy. As I pointed out above the rise of the Flavain Emperors is an excellent analogy. As the church has pointed out the rise of the Papacy and the change from the Roman Empire to the Holy Roman Empire and (No, sadly we are wrong, the Papacy did not fall in 1798, but the events surrounding the arrest of the pope did lead to the fall of the Holy Roman Empire) makes an excellent analogy, and these will prepare us for what will happen.

An exegesis of Daniel 2 is based on the exegesis of Deuteronomy 4 where the exile COULD have been THE LAST DAYS! The 70 years could have been a return home in a second glorious exodus lead by the Messiah. There would have been 4 major kings, and Daniel names 4 kings. The last king should have had his kingdom divide and an attempt to reunite that ends in chaos and the Messiah would have been the next king. Since this was not done, Daniel made analogies to the future for the Hebrews returning to the land in a lackluster return, but a reapplication of what could happen, and as he changed from his exegesis of 4 kings he turned to four kingdoms.

Now, while Antiochus was seen as an analogy during the time of the Maccabees, he is not that good an analogy. If you study the linguistics of the text the little horn comes from one of the four winds (it says "Out of one of them" and we have wondered if the "them" was one of the horns or one of the winds. But the horns are written in the masculine text, the wind in the feminine text, and the "them" is also the feminine not the masculine version of "them" thus it means from one of the four winds, not from one of the four horns) Antiochus came from one of the four horns. The little horn was to come from North-West of Jerusalem (and Rome is North West of Jerusalem-- so is the great American cities of NYC and Washington DC)Antiochus from the North East. The list as to how Antiochus does not fit the details goes on. He is not too bad for a using the words to make a point, and looking to the promises to give strength for what was happening.

While we can draw lessons from the Antiochus situation. But we should not study him the way we should study the true analogies of like the rise of Rome, the rise of the Flavian Emperors, the rise of the Holy Roman Empire and what we are seeing today in the rise of the globalists.

[Samie]

Perhaps, the only teacher who can give mistake-free instructions relative to the identity of the little horn in Daniel 7 is the Master Teacher Himself, our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. The only recorded reference made by Jesus to the book of prophet Daniel is about the abomination of desolation. Here are His instructions:

Quote:

Matthew 24:15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:)

As an aid to understanding what we read in Daniel, He went on to say that those in Judea should hastily flee to the mountains (vv16-20) because there will be by then a great tribulation (v21), an event likewise depicted in Dan 12:1, the occurrence of which had to be shortened otherwise no one will remain alive:

Quote:

NIV Matthew 24:22 If those days had not been cut short, no one would survive, but for the sake of the elect those days will be shortened.

During the great tribulation, false Christs and false prophets will appear to deceive many, even the very elect (vv23-24) proclaiming Christ had already come (vv25-28) but the great tribulation must first be over before He comes again:

Quote:

Matthew 24:29-30 29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: 30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

In unmistable language, the Master Teacher instructs us that the occurrence of the great tribulation and related events will be shortly before the 2nd Coming. A similar scenario is depicted in Daniel 12 where the great tribulation is described as the time of trouble:

Quote:

Daniel 12:1-2 1 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book. 2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

That this is 2nd Coming is beyond question. But what has this to do with the identity of the little horn?

In Christ,

Samie

(to be continued...)

[Samie]

The relationship of the great tribulation to the identity of the little horn:

In my previous post, we have established that the occurrence of the great tribulation or the time of trouble is shortly before the 2nd Coming. The occurrence of the great tribulation will have to be cut short otherwise nobody can survive. This implicitly tells us that the length of occurrence of the great tribulation cannot extend beyond the average human lifespan of 75 years, otherwise there is no need to cut it short.

Our Master Teacher also gave instructions that when the abomination of desolation (AoD) is set up in the holy place the great tribulation will occur. In the book of Daniel, the setting up of the AoD is preceded by the taking away of the 'daily':

Quote:

Daniel 11:31 And arms shall stand on his part, and they shall pollute the sanctuary of strength, and shall take away the daily sacrifice, and they shall place the abomination that maketh desolate

Daniel 12:11 And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days

Both the taking away of the 'daily' and the setting up of the AoD are acts of one single entity. He who sets up the AoD is also he who takes away the 'daily'. Who takes away the 'daily'?

Quote:

Daniel 8:9 And out of one of them came forth a little horn, which waxed exceeding great, toward the south, and toward the east, and toward the pleasant land. ... 11 Yea, he magnified himself even to the prince of the host, and by him the daily sacrifice was taken away, and the place of his sanctuary was cast down.

This little horn king of Daniel 8 who takes away the 'daily' is the same little horn king of Daniel 7 who will make war with the saints and shall prevail against them until Christ returns and the saints inherit and possess the kingdom (Dan 7:21,22; Matt 25:31,34).

Scriptures are clear. The little horn is a king who shall take away the 'daily' and shall set up the AoD. The setting up of the AoD will trigger the start of the great tribulation at the culmination of which Christ's coming is just around the bend.

The little horn is therefore a king who shall rise to power shortly before the 2nd Coming. Who is he? We shall know when he reigns. But first, the Pure Gospel has to be preached (Matt 24:14) before the AoD is set up (Matt 24:15). See how prophetic events in Daniel are tied up with the proclamation of the Pure Gospel?

In Christ,

Samie

[Gus Foster]

Well now--It seems or probably rather feels like I have had this discussion with Uriah Smith -- well almost that long ago. For me the larger issue would be how to we assimilate Dan 7:24, 25 with Dan 8:23, 24? I have watched all of us stumble over that since forever. Both characters are the same critter. I think one general of the four must have been involved in Rome and that translates in to both pagan and papal Rome.

I love the way many of our commentaries describe this as coming out of the 'wind,' using a deflection of languages to justify their conclusions.

We will have to ask the angel or Daniel soon, I think!

[Samie]

...

We will have to ask the angel or Daniel soon, I think!

Good suggestion there. How about asking our Master Teacher, and see His answers He had already given in Scriptures before we even ask?

I tried and it worked.

[Kevin H]

We all need to study this more. But too often we study with the mindset of the fundamentalists/dispensationalists gazing into the Bible like a psychic gazing into a crystal ball.

We need to build. First we should look at things such as the powerful article in the SDABC "The Role of Israel in Old Testament Prophecy" and look for events in histories focusing on events between Persia and Greece between the end of the exile to the end of Zerubbabel's life and the end of the hopes of the re-setting up the Davidic Kingdom, and soon there after. But also we need to study it in terms as to how the world could have ended had Jesus been accepted. This would have been based on what could have happened in Old Testament Eschatology.

From this we can turn to what we do know to play a role, the rise of Rome, the rise of the Flavian emperors, the rise of the Papacy and Holy Roman Empire, Mrs. White's description of the last days and we can get better understandings.

[Samie]

What is conspicuously missing is consult with what Our Lord, the Master Teacher, said about what are written in Daniel relative to His 2nd Coming (Matt 24:15).

Quote:

NKJ Proverbs 3:5-6 5 Trust in the LORD with all your heart, And lean not on your own understanding; 6 In all your ways acknowledge Him, And He shall direct your paths.

[Windsor]

Is there only one abomination of desolation?

[Samie]

Is there only one abomination of desolation?

Yes. Christ, our Master Teacher, spoke of only one: that which was spoken of by Daniel the prophet.

[John317]

..... this beast rises up out of the sea, the sea or peoples. The Papacy is but one head of this beast.

Re 13:1 ¶ And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.

To find out the identity of the little horn, we must start with one simple question about Daniel 7: 7: What is represented by the fourth beast?

[John317]

Hardly John, as this beast rises up out of the sea, the sea or peoples. The Papacy is but one head of this beast.

Re 13:1 ¶ And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.

In the following verse, note that but ONE head is wounded, the beast has six others plus 10 horns now after 1798 have the king power, crowned!

It seems to me we are getting way ahead of ourselves here in trying to determine the identity of the little horn power of Daniel 7. We're not yet ready to look at Rev. 13. Let's stick for now with the identifying marks that are provided in Daniel chapter 7. So before we can reasonably come to any kind of conclusion about its identity, we need concentrate on what Daniel 7 says about the little horn. Do you agree with this way of proceeding?

[John317]

Is the little horn of Daniel 7:24 the Seleucid king, Antiouchus Epiphanes? If he is the "little horn", which 3 kings did Antiochus subdue?

I don't think we are yet ready to draw any conclusions as to the identity of the little horn of Daniel 7. We have not even examined the evidence. What does Daniel 7 say about the little horn? What are its identifying marks? After we look at all of them, then we will be better prepared to come to some conclusions about who it is. As far as Antiochus Epiphanes IV is concerned, we would need to ask whether he fulfills all of the prophetic specifications of the little horn. If he does, than he must be the little horn. On the other hand, if he does not, then he cannot possibly be the little horn. Do you agree that the true "little horn" of Daniel 7 will fulfill ALL of the prophetic specifications that the Scriptures provide, including all of the identifying marks in Daniel chapter 7?

Let's begin by the first identifying mark. Daniel 7:7 shows that the little horn will come out of the fourth beast. Who, then, is this fourth beast?

[John317]

John, good to see you back, I've really missed you!!!

Thank you, Kevin. I've been kept very busy on some Face Book forums over the last year or so. One of them is called, "Catholic and Protestant Conversations." If you're ever on FB, please drop by and send us a request to become a member. https://www.facebook.com/groups/158165461035457/

Originally Posted By: Kevin H

While I know and to a large extent agree where you are going, have you ever noticed how those points apply to the Flavian family as emporers? They raised after 10 emperors and destroyed the last three emperors of the Julian party, and was the first emperors who were not of that party.

But weren't the Flavian family a part of the Roman empire?

Who do you believe is referred to as the fulfillment of the fourth beast of Daniel 7: 7?

What we want to look at first is all of the information that Daniel 7 gives us about the little horn.

[olger]

Little horn - Roman Catholicism.

[John317]

Little horn - Roman Catholicism.

The question is, who is the fourth beast of Daniel 7: 7?

Everyone wants to jump immediately to a conclusion before we really take a hard look at the identifying marks that Scripture gives.

That is a problem with both Catholic and Protestants. Catholics say the little horn is Antiochus IV, and most modern Protestants agree-- without even so much as examining the evidence. I'm trying to encourage people to look carefully at the evidence that the Bible gives us.

[Johann]

We all need to study this more. But too often we study with the mindset of the fundamentalists/dispensationalists gazing into the Bible like a psychic gazing into a crystal ball.

Let us beware!

[phkrause]

Originally Posted By: olger

Little horn - Roman Catholicism.

The question is, who is the fourth beast of Daniel 7: 7?

Everyone wants to jump immediately to a conclusion before we really take a hard look at the identifying marks that Scripture gives.

That is a problem with both Catholic and Protestants. Catholics say the little horn is Antiochus IV, and most modern Protestants agree-- without even so much as examining the evidence. I'm trying to encourage people to look carefully at the evidence that the Bible gives us.

I agree. From what I've read and studied, I say its Pagan Rome.