Headship doctrine where did it come from??

[Stan]

From a friend and a C/A member..

Quote:

Here is a short link to a what will certainly be a controversial paper I published today, demonstrating when, how and why Adventists adopted the "headship principle” from several Calvinist writers in the 1980s. I would be pleased to have you read it and pass the link along to anyone you think might be interested.]Here is a short link to a what will certainly be a controversial paper I published today, demonstrating when, how and why Adventists adopted the "headship principle” from several Calvinist writers in the 1980s. I would be pleased to have you read it and pass the link along to anyone you think might be interested.

https://www.smashwords.com/books/view/433232

[Naomi]

the link gives a "no longer available" message. Must have been too hot to handle. :)

[rudywoofs (Pam)]

I posted the link to Gerry Chudleigh's article last Monday under the Women's Ordination section.. I've known Gerry since the early 1960s.

Here's the link to the book:

THE LINK

[Stan]

I have emailed him for a new link.

[rudywoofs (Pam)]

Stan, your link didn't work because the publishing number didn't include the last number.

[Stan]

thanks Pam.

So sorry I did not see the other post, thanks for keeping on top of things..

I have been on the road for a number of days and have not checked in like I usually do.

[Stan]

Corrected link is

https://www.smashwords.com/books/view/433232

[Stan]

DID I mention this was FREE!?

[Gail]

That got MY attention!

[Dr. Waite]

Could the "headship doctrine" come from this verse?

1 Corinthians 11:3 "But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman [is] the man; and the head of Christ [is] God."

[R. G.]

I don't think so. This verse is about marriage, as an illustration of the relationship between Christ and His church. A text taken out of context is a pretext.

[Dr. Waite]

I don't think so. This verse is about marriage, as an illustration of the relationship between Christ and His church. A text taken out of context is a pretext.

So what is the relationship between Christ and His Church and God and Christ? Does this relationship relate to the "headship doctrine"?

[Stan]

For those commenting about the book. The question is, did you read the BOOK (it's a free download)

????

[Naomi]

Yes, read it.

[Kevin H]

Dr. Jim Fleming has pointed out in his series "Attitudes towards women in the Bible" that there are two different ways of interpreting the text that is used for male headship. One is the leadership such as the head of a company. But the other way simply means order of creation and origin as in a lake being the head of a river. He argues that the context and literary structure indicates that it is supposed to be understood the second way and that when we are applying it the first way we are taking the text out of context and misapplying it.

[Kevin H]

Powerful... The Calvinistic "Headship" view has done away the purpose and perpetuity of the Law of God and has placed us under the theology of the beast of Revelation 13.

How can I say this?

The law of God is self sacrificing love. In this view the trinity exists in a righteousness by faith relationship with each other based on each deferring to the other.

Revelation 12 and 13 are the aspects of the trinity, but rather than existing in a righteousness by faith relationship of self sacrificing love towards each other, they exist in a hierarchy and independence and cooperating for their own benefit to have "headship" and authority over the individuals of earth.

When you do away with the purpose and perpetuity of the law of God, you have spiritualism. Thus we are finding that the anti-ordination in the church, based on "headship" theology is a way that we have embraced spiritualism.

This, mixed with what I have learned from what Fleming taught in "Attitudes towards women in the Bible" which argues that the Bible, including Jesus and Paul, were advocates of women's ordination are things that we really need to take a serious look at, and how the anti-ordination camp is spreading the last deception of making of no effect the spirit of prophecy.

There are people in our church who want to be conservative, but there is a triple whammy in studying what Mrs. White says about God's law and the importance of following the Bible. Flemings pointing out arguments that the Bible actually supports women's ordination, and this article that shows how we have traded our truth on God's law of self sacrificing love for a view of following the chain of command and we end up rejecting the Bible's teaching.

We have sold the servant leadership role of the Bible for a leadership that Jesus warned us against. We are taking Satan's methods rather than God's methods. The Papal authority rather than the everyone submitting in self renouncing love. Having a God who does not live up to his own law but who does what Lucifer encourages us to do.

[Johann]

Could the "headship doctrine" come from this verse?

1 Corinthians 11:3 "But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman [is] the man; and the head of Christ [is] God."

You should remember that Paul never divided his letters into verses nor chapters. Go on and read chapter 13. . .

Also read what the author of this book has to say about this verse.

When I took Corinthians in college/graduate school back in the years between 1948 and 1958, none of our teachers gave us any hint this verse referred to headship. That did not enter into the SDA church until introduced by Dr. Samuelle Bacchiocchi with a doctorate and a gold medal from the Vatican and the pope himself. As a teacher at Andrews University he did not dare introduce or verify this doctrine as coming from the church of Rome, so he found some Calvinists in America who based this doctrine on the predestination of Calvin, which the SDA church has never sanctioned. Too many Adventists adopted the heresy presented by Bacchiocchi.

[Johann]

Powerful... The Calvinistic "Headship" view has done away the purpose and perpetuity of the Law of God and has placed us under the theology of the beast of Revelation 13.

. . .

We have sold the servant leadership role of the Bible for a leadership that Jesus warned us against. We are taking Satan's methods rather than God's methods. The Papal authority rather than the everyone submitting in self renouncing love. Having a God who does not live up to his own law but who does what Lucifer encourages us to do.

Excellent, Kevin.

This course, adapted by so many people who falsely call themselves conservative, will eventually lead to our rejection of the Spirit of Prophecy. This is the purpose of Satan.

[Johann]

From a friend and a C/A member..

Quote:

Here is a short link to a what will certainly be a controversial paper I published today, demonstrating when, how and why Adventists adopted the "headship principle” from several Calvinist writers in the 1980s. I would be pleased to have you read it and pass the link along to anyone you think might be interested.

https://www.smashwords.com/books/view/433232

Thank you, Stan. This book tells exactly what I have experienced while attending SDA schools. We never heard of this headship principle before it was introduced from certain Calvinists through Samuelle Bacchiocchi.

[Kevin H]

Ever notice that Adventists have a neurotic need to prove to the world that we are good Baptists?

[Kevin H]

Something else I've thought of with this paper on headship:

The Jews were expecting the Messiah to come with headship that they were expecting. They did not like that he came with a servant attitude. We are expecting Jesus to return with this Calvinistic headship, but the Bible says "This same Jesus... will come again" Are we preparing for that same Jesus or is Headship making us look for same kind of Messiah that when Jesus did not fit back then and preparing us to also reject him?

[Gail]

Something else I've thought of with this paper on headship:

The Jews were expecting the Messiah to come with headship that they were expecting. They did not like that he came with a servant attitude. We are expecting Jesus to return with this Calvinistic headship, but the Bible says "This same Jesus... will come again" Are we preparing for that same Jesus or is Headship making us look for same kind of Messiah that when Jesus did not fit back then and preparing us to also reject him?

Good question, Kevin! And all the while thinking that they are doing Godservice.

I did read the book, too, and still am undecided on the issue. I am still prepared to work with whatever we end up with in the way of leadership. A good leader is a good leader notwithstanding the gender. Deborah was an example of a woman who rose up when the job called for someone. Having a woman in a leadership role in the Bible is rare but not unheard of.

I have not read much of Calvin but what I do know about him so far makes me shudder. He was heavy into state and religion union. And even without the link between him and leadership thought I was already making the connection between the Roman system and this headship idea.

[en7]

chapter 4 was especially enlightening