Members rudywoofs (Pam) Posted June 22, 2014 Members Posted June 22, 2014 Has anyone read this book? "Seeking a Sanctuary: Seventh-day Adventism and the American Dream" I just came across it today. The author is a professor at England's Oxford University, and not an Adventist. the book Quote Pam Meddle Not In the Affairs of Dragons; for You Are Crunchy and Taste Good with Ketchup. If we all sang the same note in the choir, there'd never be any harmony. Funny, isn't it, how we accept Grace for ourselves and demand justice for others?
Moderators Gregory Matthews Posted June 22, 2014 Moderators Posted June 22, 2014 SEEKING A SANCTUARY: SEVENTH-DAY ADVENTISM AND THE AMERICAN DREAM; The 2nd Edition has 499 pages. 1) The 1st edition was published by harper & Row in 1989. 2) The 2nd edition, which is greatly expanded from the 1st, was published in 2007, by Indiana University Press. 3) Both editions were authored by two people: Keith Lockhart: A baptized SDA, who received a BA from Newbold College and a MA in religion from Andrews. He later taught at Newbold. He is a journalist based in London. Malcom Bull: He was raised in a SDA family, but never joined the denomination. He attended Newbold for one year. He is a professor at Oxford University. 4) This book was written with major cooperation from the SDA Church which has included: The Ellen G. White Estate, The General Conference Archives, Andrews University, Loma Linda University, and literally dozens of well-known scholars and leaders in the SDA Church. It has also had help from people in the Advent Christian church, the Church of God-Seventh Day, the Worldwide Church of God, Baylor University and many more. Quote Gregory
Moderators Gregory Matthews Posted June 22, 2014 Moderators Posted June 22, 2014 In the same line as this book there are two books that should be mentioned that related to Ellen White: Denis Fortin & Jerry Moon, Editors. THE ELLEN G. W HITE ENCYCLOPEDIA, 2013, 1465 pages. NOTE: Without doing an exact count, so I may be wrong, there are probably 90 - 100 individual authors of sections of this book. There is a 2nd book expected to be published this year (2014). It will be focused on the impact that EGW had on American religious life. It is a major scholarly work, which will be published by a non-SDA university and with input from both SDA and non-SDA scholars. NOSTE: I am writing by memory without reviewing the information that has been published about this book. Quote Gregory
Administrators Gail Posted June 22, 2014 Administrators Posted June 22, 2014 Greg, are you talking about, Ellen White- American Prophet, published by the Oxford University Press? I have a pre-release copy. Quote Isaiah 32:17 And the work of righteousness shall be peace; and the effect of righteousness quietness and assurance for ever.
Moderators Gregory Matthews Posted June 22, 2014 Moderators Posted June 22, 2014 Gail, I believe that is the book I am talking about. Quote Gregory
Moderators Gregory Matthews Posted June 22, 2014 Moderators Posted June 22, 2014 Yes, that is the book. Amazon has it currently on sale for $34.58--shipped directly to my home. I have ordered it and expect to have it delivered on or before Thursday. Thanks Gail. Quote Gregory
Johann Posted June 22, 2014 Posted June 22, 2014 In the same line as this book there are two books that should be mentioned that related to Ellen White: Denis Fortin & Jerry Moon, Editors. THE ELLEN G. W HITE ENCYCLOPEDIA, 2013, 1465 pages. NOTE: Without doing an exact count, so I may be wrong, there are probably 90 - 100 individual authors of sections of this book. This is a great book. Had it for a couple of weeks. Quote
Gerry Chudleigh Posted June 23, 2014 Posted June 23, 2014 In my opinion, seeking a sanctuary is one of the best books ever written about Seventh-day Adventists. I much prefer the 320-page first edition, though it is very difficult to find. The second edition, with help from Monte Sahlin, includes many more facts, but it is more difficult to read, and the broad themes seem to get lost in the details. I also read an early copy of Ellen Harmon White: American Prophet, a couple weeks ago. I consider it must reading for any Adventist serious about understanding Ellen White and her contribution both to the Adventist church and to American culture. I am looking forward to reading the Encyclopedia soon. Quote
Members rudywoofs (Pam) Posted June 27, 2014 Author Members Posted June 27, 2014 I have the book "Ellen Harmon White: American Prophet." I haven't read it all, but to me, it's a rather dry, cumbersome read. It *does* have very interesting points, but it seems like one must wade through a lot of verbiage to get to it. Maybe it gets better further into the book... Quote Pam Meddle Not In the Affairs of Dragons; for You Are Crunchy and Taste Good with Ketchup. If we all sang the same note in the choir, there'd never be any harmony. Funny, isn't it, how we accept Grace for ourselves and demand justice for others?
Administrators Gail Posted June 27, 2014 Administrators Posted June 27, 2014 Pam, I only got to page 80 then gave up. It carries a negative tone, our Conference wouldn't have it so I abandoned reading it. It is a slow read compared to others. Quote Isaiah 32:17 And the work of righteousness shall be peace; and the effect of righteousness quietness and assurance for ever.
Members rudywoofs (Pam) Posted June 27, 2014 Author Members Posted June 27, 2014 Glad you mentioned it, too, Gail. I was wondering if maybe I was missing something... I'd like to get the "Seeking a Sanctuary" book sometime, and see if it's any better.. Quote Pam Meddle Not In the Affairs of Dragons; for You Are Crunchy and Taste Good with Ketchup. If we all sang the same note in the choir, there'd never be any harmony. Funny, isn't it, how we accept Grace for ourselves and demand justice for others?
Members rudywoofs (Pam) Posted July 1, 2014 Author Members Posted July 1, 2014 I've continued reading more in the "Ellen Harmon White, American Prophet" book in the evenings. The more I read, the more it seems like the Ellen Harmon being depicted in the book was totally different than how the Adventist church depicts her, and even more startling is how much different in actuality she was (if one can believe the book authors) than even Ellen herself wrote about her early days. Apparently, Ellen Harmon was not the only person having visions early on. There were a number of women who had visions in the same meetings where Ellen was. They were part of the Methodist line that was very "into" shouting, hand-raising, being "slain in the spirit" (i.e., falling on the floor) and otherwise very physically demonstrative during religious services. Supposed visions at that time by all the women were very similar, talking of angels, the New Jerusalem, and Jesus' physical appearance. Those were the topics du jour of those times. Really, it's a bit of an embarrassment to read the book... my regard for Ellen White has been somewhat dampened by the information contained therein. Probably is a good book for those who wish to load up ammunition against the founding of the church, and Ellen Harmon White, in particular... (I'm going to keep reading, but solely for informational purposes - I don't intend to drag down the SDA church or EGW...) Quote Pam Meddle Not In the Affairs of Dragons; for You Are Crunchy and Taste Good with Ketchup. If we all sang the same note in the choir, there'd never be any harmony. Funny, isn't it, how we accept Grace for ourselves and demand justice for others?
Administrators Gail Posted July 2, 2014 Administrators Posted July 2, 2014 Really, it's a bit of an embarrassment to read the book... my regard for Ellen White has been somewhat dampened by the information contained therein. Probably is a good book for those who wish to load up ammunition against the founding of the church, and Ellen Harmon White, in particular... (I'm going to keep reading, but solely for informational purposes - I don't intend to drag down the SDA church or EGW...) You have hit the nail on the head there. The chapters that turned off our Conf Admin were the ones regarding the medical work and something else, can't remember off-hand. I understand a bit about the history as George Knight has presented it so wasn't too surprised when reading about the times she emerged from. But you are correct, it does seem like the authors really don't want you to like Ellen White, especially those who are no longer SDA. I was told by one of our leading scholars right now (who is one of the authors) that the book was a fair treatment of her. I am inclined to disagree. I think it was fair to a point then exceeded that line. Quote Isaiah 32:17 And the work of righteousness shall be peace; and the effect of righteousness quietness and assurance for ever.
Moderators Gregory Matthews Posted July 2, 2014 Moderators Posted July 2, 2014 Re: ELLEN HARMON WHITE:AMERICAN PROPHET. I have not read the entire book. However, I am more favorable toward it than several of you seem to be. My reaction: 1) The majority of what I have read has been well known in our denomination and is not new. 2) As a scholarly book, we need to know what is being said about us and EGW, whether we like it or not. 3)It is not just facts that are important, what one does with those facts is just as important. In general, I find the authors to be restrained in this regard. 4)It does present EGW as a human being, as opposed to a sanctified person who existed on a plane above that of us mere mortals. 5) I think that will help to place EGW in her proper role in denominational life on some level. 6) Yes, I do not agree with everything that is said about her in this book. 7) I encourage people to purchase and read it. Quote Gregory
Members rudywoofs (Pam) Posted July 2, 2014 Author Members Posted July 2, 2014 the Israel Dammon case is discussed in the EGW American Prophet book... Quote Pam Meddle Not In the Affairs of Dragons; for You Are Crunchy and Taste Good with Ketchup. If we all sang the same note in the choir, there'd never be any harmony. Funny, isn't it, how we accept Grace for ourselves and demand justice for others?
JoeMo Posted July 2, 2014 Posted July 2, 2014 I have read stuff about EGW in other non-denominational books - mostly in books by charismatics and Pentecostals, believe it or not. Most of them hold her in very high esteem in the company of people like Smith Wigglesworth and Kathryn Kuhlman. However, they do decry how the SDA denomination has portrayed her; and criticize their perception that a religious cult was built around her. (For the record, I'm not saying the Adventism is a cult; I'm saying many non-Adventists and former Adventists perceive it to be one after meeting some of the more ardent members of the EGW fan club). Quote
Members rudywoofs (Pam) Posted July 3, 2014 Author Members Posted July 3, 2014 comparing EGW to Kaaatherrrinnnne Kuuuuuuhlman? That's pretty funny! (I never see her name without remembering her old radio and TV programs and how she pronounced her name). Quote Pam Meddle Not In the Affairs of Dragons; for You Are Crunchy and Taste Good with Ketchup. If we all sang the same note in the choir, there'd never be any harmony. Funny, isn't it, how we accept Grace for ourselves and demand justice for others?
Administrators Tom Wetmore Posted July 3, 2014 Administrators Posted July 3, 2014 Oh yessss! I remember hearing Katherine Kulman on the radio when I was a kid! Quote "Absurdity reigns and confusion makes it look good." "Sinless perfection is such a shallow goal." "I love God only as much as the person I love the least." *Forgiveness is always good news. And that is the gospel truth. (And finally, the ideas expressed above are solely my person views and not that of any organization with which I am associated.)
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