LifeHiscost Posted July 30, 2014 Posted July 30, 2014 Quote: you get past the "love the Lord and help the poor" into the rest of the story and that pretty much determines a legalist And that's a major reason why many misread the acceptance of Jesus as absolving themselves of all past sins coupled with no present responsibilities. What seems to be forgotten is that Jesus never did anything that wasn't legal, including keeping His Father's commandments. "For I have given you an example, that ye should do as I have done to you. Verily, verily, I say unto you, The servant is not greater than his lord; neither he that is sent greater than he that sent him. If ye know these things, happy are ye if ye do them." John 13:15-17 KJV God is Love! Jesus saves! Quote Lift Jesus up!!
hch Posted July 30, 2014 Posted July 30, 2014 Is the church to follow the popular trends? It looks like it is doing great in that department in Collegedale TN. The big church has 4 different worship services (different styles) to accommodate the trends. The academy has a "rock band" (that's what I call it) that nearly deafened me when I accepted a personal invitation to attend services there once. It fills the auditorium every week. Local congregations have formed: one to meet the needs of those "pioneers" in like mind and I was recently told that another was formed for the LGBT community. And I could mention other churches in the area that have sprung up to meet the needs of different trends. Where will it stop? If all that is happening in a little college town, what is happening in the big cities? (I don't really want to know) Come Lord Jesus (come quickly) Amen Quote His child Henry Bible student/Author https://www.loudcry101.com
Administrators Naomi Posted July 30, 2014 Administrators Posted July 30, 2014 ................................... If all that is happening in a little college town, what is happening in the big cities? (I don't really want to know) Come Lord Jesus (come quickly) Amen Amen Would the real Adventist please stand up Quote If your dreams are not big enough to scare you, they are not big enough for God
CoAspen Posted July 30, 2014 Posted July 30, 2014 Quote: It looks like it is doing great in that department in Collegedale TN. The big church has 4 different worship services (different styles) to accommodate the trends. Very cool! The academy has a "rock band" (that's what I call it) that nearly deafened me when I accepted a personal invitation to attend services there once. It fills the auditorium every week. So it may not be as you described as you are only stating a personal opinion! Local congregations have formed: one to meet the needs of those "pioneers" in like mind and[color I was recently told that another was formed for the LGBT community. Maybe you should find out for yourself, besides what would be wrong with doing so? And I could mention other churches in the area that have sprung up to meet the needs of different trends. Where will it stop? You use the word 'trends' as if it something bad, any support for that or just your opinion? If all that is happening in a little college town, what is happening in the big cities? (I don't really want to know) Hopefully they are doing the same type of things! Spread the message into all the world! By the way I am familiar with the church, having attended there and my family are regular members and help with their many 'out reaches'. I am always puzzled by people finding fault with different churches, SDA, doing their best to meet the needs of their community. It usually boils down to 'they don't do it my way or like a real SDA'. As if 'my way' is the same as 'Christ's way', and those in the 'know' really 'know' what a real SDA is. Quote
Members rudywoofs (Pam) Posted July 30, 2014 Members Posted July 30, 2014 I'd be interested to know what the sermon topics are in the various services... Certainly, the *way* the message is delivered is not as important as the message itself. That said, sometimes the method of delivery *can* interfere with receipt of the message by some... Some folks would like to have Pony Express... simple, quaint, and predictable. Others prefer FedEx, where one can track the progress of the message. Still others would want smoke signals, where they can see the message without actually being in touch with the messenger. And then there's the tom toms, where one really needs to know the "language" of the beat in order to understand the message.... As world culture stretches and bends, so, too, do methods of delivering a message. But it should always still be the same Message... Quote Pam Meddle Not In the Affairs of Dragons; for You Are Crunchy and Taste Good with Ketchup. If we all sang the same note in the choir, there'd never be any harmony. Funny, isn't it, how we accept Grace for ourselves and demand justice for others?
JoeMo Posted July 30, 2014 Posted July 30, 2014 I think the discussion here is great! As time marches forward, society becomes increasingly diversified; and it becomes more challenging to meet the diverse needs of that society. So the prudent thing to do is to branch out and attempt to meet their diverse needs. Trying to "undiversify" the perceived needs of society and become one uniform organiztion where everyone is as contented as Hindu cattle is about as feasible as unscrambling an egg. I don't know what a church that meets all those needs while holding up God's standards would like like; but I still think we need to have that vision. Is it possible that in the future when God pours out His Spirit on all men (and women and children) as prophesied in Joel, that God will infuse all people the info they need to know? Quote
bonnie Posted July 30, 2014 Author Posted July 30, 2014 Is it possible that in the future when God pours out His Spirit on all men (and women and children) as prophesied in Joel, that God will infuse all people the info they need to know? Do you think when that time comes "all men" will be running in many diverse directions? Special churches for "special people"? I always come back to this.... Matthew 7:13"Enter through the narrow gate; for the gate is wide and the way is broad that leads to destruction, and there are many who enter through it. 14"For the gate is small and the way is narrow that leads to life, and there are few who find it. This does not indicate we will be following trends and catering to demands. If you have a pastor that doesn't quite suit what you perceive as your needs,do you demand something different? One of our most memorable was a real "fire and brimstone" older pastor.I think he was favorite of my sons. You didn't dose off in his sermons and you never were left wondering what he meant or really believed.He was clear and concise. Of course not all felt that way. Do people think their struggles or "sins" are so unique they can only be met in a church service or message they design? Did Christ follow slavishly different trends and diversity. Quote Everything you do is based on the choices you make. It's not your parents, your past relationships, your job, the economy, the weather, an argument, or your age that is to blame. You and only you are responsible for every decision and choice you make, period ... ... Wish more people would realize this. Quotes by Susan Gottesman
CoAspen Posted July 30, 2014 Posted July 30, 2014 Quote: I'd be interested to know what the sermon topics are in the various services... 3 services, same pastor, same sermon. Does not use EGW quotes, just the Bible, some people have a problem with that. That area has more SDA churches that you can throw a stick at! Also Baptist, Methodist, Church of Christ, Pentecostal, etc, etc. You can drive far with out running into a church, some back country roads, literally!! The church has been there so long the road goes around them!! Quote
JoeMo Posted July 30, 2014 Posted July 30, 2014 Quote: Do you think when that time comes "all men" will be running in many diverse directions? No; I find it entirely feasible that there will be only believers and non-believers after the Spirit is poured out. Just my opinion - can't back it up with scripture. The fact that there are 35,000 different opinions on what "is" and what "is not" at the current time is an indication that the prophecy of Joel has not yet been fulfilled. Quote
bonnie Posted July 30, 2014 Author Posted July 30, 2014 I guess I find it as fact according to scripture. We should have some understanding of why there are 35,000 different opinions. Can there be 35,000 different opinions at that time and some from each group still practicing different opinions be saved? If we placate those that are only comfortable hearing certain things what do we tell them in the final days? There is a tendency here for many to try to grade sin "this is worse than that and I know many good people that.... "fill in the blanks' No one here has the right,knowledge,or authority to make those kinds of statements. Do we have special church for alcoholics,prostitutes,gays thieves so they only hear what makes them feel comfortable in their behavior? It might not be the way it is meant,but every time I read,"well,what about the gossip or whatever,isn't that worse" when certain topics are brought up says to me that those that do that are placing themselves in a position they do not have a right to. If one of my minor sons went to a pastor or church member for counsel on a problem they were struggling with and that was the response it would be the last time there was unsupervised contact. Is church/religious belief meant to make us comfortable where we are at? Quote Everything you do is based on the choices you make. It's not your parents, your past relationships, your job, the economy, the weather, an argument, or your age that is to blame. You and only you are responsible for every decision and choice you make, period ... ... Wish more people would realize this. Quotes by Susan Gottesman
JoeMo Posted July 30, 2014 Posted July 30, 2014 Quote: Do we have special church for alcoholics,prostitutes,gays thieves so they only hear what makes them feel comfortable in their behavior? No; of course not! We don't hold church to make people comfortable. We hold church to facilitate people having a more intimate realtionship with Jesus. As in any relationship, uncomfortable conflict will arise from time to time. By the same token, we should not imply passing judegement and condemnation on people with issues by ignoring their spiritual needs and . If people with issues show up at church, praise God! They may be admitting that they need a divine intervention. Some may say "Yeah, right! All they want is a handout". I would point them to the story of the prodigal son. Did he come home out of deep repentance for squandering his inheritance; and wanted to be back in the family? No - he came home because he was hungry and needed food. His father knew that and gave him a loving and enthusiastic welcome anyways; and met his son's needs. If this is an example to us, we should likewise accept people where they are if they come to us. Why would we turn anyone away who was seeking fellowship? This thread is supposed to be about meeting the needs of millennials in general; not people with substance abuse or sexual issues (although they have spiritual needs as well). Quote
bonnie Posted July 30, 2014 Author Posted July 30, 2014 No; of course not! We don't hold church to make people comfortable. We hold church to facilitate people having a more intimate realtionship with Jesus. As in any relationship, uncomfortable conflict will arise from time to time. Quote Everything you do is based on the choices you make. It's not your parents, your past relationships, your job, the economy, the weather, an argument, or your age that is to blame. You and only you are responsible for every decision and choice you make, period ... ... Wish more people would realize this. Quotes by Susan Gottesman
Moderators Gregory Matthews Posted July 31, 2014 Moderators Posted July 31, 2014 Quote: I'd be interested to know what the sermon topics are in the various services... The chosen sermon topic should be tailored to the audience. That is fundamental. A congregation composed of Adventists who have "been members for 50 years will have different needs from a congregation of people who have been Adventists for an average time of 18 months. A congregation of retired people will likely have different issues than a congregation primarily in their 20's, newly married, and getting settled into their first jobs. A congregation of people who have recently immigrated from the "old country" will have different needs from a congregation of senior executives. Each congregation must decide what their mission is in the community. An evangelistic congregation may chose to focus on a Sabbath service that introduces visitors to Christ and Adventism. When I evaluate a sermon, I always ask: Who is your audience? What did you intend to bring to them? How did the various elements of your sermon contribute to your goal and your understanding of your audience? Quote Gregory
Members rudywoofs (Pam) Posted July 31, 2014 Members Posted July 31, 2014 Quote: I'd be interested to know what the sermon topics are in the various services... The chosen sermon topic should be tailored to the audience. That is fundamental. A congregation composed of Adventists who have "been members for 50 years will have different needs from a congregation of people who have been Adventists for an average time of 18 months. A congregation of retired people will likely have different issues than a congregation primarily in their 20's, newly married, and getting settled into their first jobs. A congregation of people who have recently immigrated from the "old country" will have different needs from a congregation of senior executives. Each congregation must decide what their mission is in the community. An evangelistic congregation may chose to focus on a Sabbath service that introduces visitors to Christ and Adventism. When I evaluate a sermon, I always ask: Who is your audience? What did you intend to bring to them? How did the various elements of your sermon contribute to your goal and your understanding of your audience? that's what I was hoping all speakers would do... Quote Pam Meddle Not In the Affairs of Dragons; for You Are Crunchy and Taste Good with Ketchup. If we all sang the same note in the choir, there'd never be any harmony. Funny, isn't it, how we accept Grace for ourselves and demand justice for others?
Moderators Gregory Matthews Posted July 31, 2014 Moderators Posted July 31, 2014 Quote: And those needs are what? Do you think millennials are so unique that their needs are something that in one way or another has not been experienced by millions before them. That is not the issue at all. It is because their needs are part of the human condition that there is an answer that can be proclaimed. A pastor should know the congregation well enough to know what the needs are that the congregation is experiencing. The sermon, as well as overall ministry, should be tailored to the present needs that the congregation is experiencing. Sermons and ministry should not come out of the abstract, with no consideration given to what the congregation is experiencing in its life. Quote Gregory
bonnie Posted July 31, 2014 Author Posted July 31, 2014 That is not the issue at all. It is because their needs are part of the human condition that there is an answer that can be proclaimed. Quote Everything you do is based on the choices you make. It's not your parents, your past relationships, your job, the economy, the weather, an argument, or your age that is to blame. You and only you are responsible for every decision and choice you make, period ... ... Wish more people would realize this. Quotes by Susan Gottesman
CoAspen Posted July 31, 2014 Posted July 31, 2014 The article talked about being trendy, but with out a real definition. One gets the feeling that trendy means none substance. Who knows or attends such a church? Is this thread trying to suggest 'meeting the needs' is none substance? If not, then where is the argument? We are discussing an opinion without substantiation, it seems to me! Quote
LifeHiscost Posted July 31, 2014 Posted July 31, 2014 The strongest reason why we each need to study the Word for ourselves, all the while asking for the promise of the guidance of the Holy Spirit, as opposed to following a multitude and depending on our own understanding Quote: #704498 Come Lord Jesus (come quickly) Amen "Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding."Proverbs 3:5 KJV God is Love! Jesus saves! Quote Lift Jesus up!!
bonnie Posted July 31, 2014 Author Posted July 31, 2014 The article talked about being trendy, but with out a real definition. One gets the feeling that trendy means none substance. Who knows or attends such a church? Is this thread trying to suggest 'meeting the needs' is none substance? If not, then where is the argument? We are discussing an opinion without substantiation, it seems to me! Trends in general lack staying power,they can serve a perceived need in the short term. One "trend" the buzzword "Social Justice" sounds great to promote. Willow Creek was all the rage"trend' for awhile. Quote Everything you do is based on the choices you make. It's not your parents, your past relationships, your job, the economy, the weather, an argument, or your age that is to blame. You and only you are responsible for every decision and choice you make, period ... ... Wish more people would realize this. Quotes by Susan Gottesman
hch Posted August 3, 2014 Posted August 3, 2014 Trends in general lack staying power,they can serve a perceived need in the short term. One "trend" the buzzword "Social Justice" sounds great to promote. Willow Creek was all the rage"trend' for awhile. Don't Millennials find & go from one trend to the next rapidly? The hottest apple? The viral you tube video? And today's trend is yesterday's has been. Marriage was all the rage. Then living together without the burden of commitment. And since June 2013, marriage is back with a gay twist for those who want the social benefits. Obviously, all Millennials need to be churched. And if they don't want a "trendy church" how to reach those that do? Replacing the King James with the Queen James won't cut it when it comes to issues of eternal importance. So has it come to the point that the Millennials that don't want a trendy church get evangelized and those that go with the trends are unchurched or unevangelized? Quote His child Henry Bible student/Author https://www.loudcry101.com
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