Israel cannot be regathered more than twice.

[Sojourner]

I thought this was an interesting article, Isaiah prophecies in Isaiah 11 11-12 that God will regather Israel for a second time. It is suggested that this regathering is both final and permanent, suggesting that what we are seeing in modern Israel today is the fulfilment of this promise. 

 

I found it interesting to hear that Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and others have placed a bill into the Knesset in Israel proclaiming the nation of Israel first and foremost as a "Jewish State". It led me back to thinking about this prophecy in Isaiah and if this regathering is in fact the last regathering. 

 

This article does a better job of explaining it than I can though. - http://www.chosenpeople.com/main/prophecy/261-is-modern-israel-a-fulfillment-of-prophecy

[8thdaypriest]

I do NOT believe that the present state of Israel is the fulfillment of the return prophecies. 

 

    I believe that Satan will use the current nation of Israel as the focal point of his grand deception.  Many believe that the present nation of Israel is the fulfillment of the promised return.  They see Israel as “dry bones” brought back to life (Jer. 16:14-21, Jer. 23:3-8, Ezek. Chapter 37) - but the present nation of Israel does not fulfill the prophecies of Jeremiah and Ezekiel.  

    The “return” of Jews to the land which became the modern nation of Israel following WWII, was not an event brought about by miracles which rivaled those of the first “exodus” from Egypt.  We saw no plagues, no opening of a “red sea,” no water brought from a rock, no manna from heaven.  We saw only a persecuted, war weary people fighting their way into a portion of the ancient homeland of their ancestors.  The throne has not been restored to the Son of David.  The lion does not lie down with the lamb.  No.  We must look to the future for a full and forever deliverance and return of the “whole house of Israel.” Up to this point, those Jews who admit to belief in Christ as Messiah are actually denied immigration.  And what of the dead? Daniel was to receive his inheritance (Dan.12:13) but there has been no resurrection.  

    Those who believe that Messiah will reign on earth, during the approaching 7th millennium -
        those who believe that Messiah will rule the nations who survive the last plagues -
            those who believe that the faithful today should go up to the (third)Temple at Jerusalem to worship or to offer animal sacrifices - ARE BEING SET UP!  

    The LORD is not there.  He will not return to His Temple until it is fully consecrated at The 8th Day.

    Please know that I do believe that Jews deserve to have a homeland.  They have been persecuted and despised for almost two thousand years.  It is right and appropriate that they be given at least some portion of their ancestral home.  

    I also know that most Jews living in Israel today are secular (non-believers).  This has left them open to being used of Satan for his purpose of deception.  His deception will be so perfect that ONLY those whose names are “written in the Lamb’s Book of Life,” who are illumined by the Spirit of Christ, will see through the deception and refuse to worship the Beast or to take his mark (Revelation 13:7-8, 16).  

    Many will die for the truth.

 

I have several studies concerning this topic at my website. 

There is a study titled "Israel - The People of God".  I explain that those who refuse to believe in Christ will be "cut off from Israel", while Gentiles who come to belief will be "grafted in" to Israel.  Israel redeemed will be the forever people of God.  Every gate into the Holy City is named for a tribe of Israel.  There is no gate titled "Gentiles Enter Here". 

 

Isaiah 11:11-16 “In that day the LORD shall set His hand again the second time to recover the remnant of His people who are left . . .”  He “will assemble the outcasts of Israel,” and “gather together the dispersed of Judah from the four corners of the earth.” . . .  “There will be a highway for the remnant of His people who will be left from Assyria, as it was for Israel in the day that he came up from the land of Egypt.”

    NOTE: In the days of Ezra and Nehemiah, the LORD brought back a very small remnant of His people from Babylonian captivity. This was the type.  At the Second Coming, Messiah will slay the wicked (something not seen in the days of Ezra).  He will recover all of His faithful Israel - from the four corners of the earth. He will return them to “the land.”
    
    Isaiah 35:1-10  Notice the context. The healing and return of the “ransomed”(v. 10) follows the general destruction of the earth and the nations.  THEN “the strangers” will be joined with them.  

Additional references:  Isaiah 14:1-2; Isaiah 27:6; Isaiah 27:12-13;
Isaiah 31:35;  Isaiah 37:31-32;  Isaiah 43:1-7;  Isaiah 49:20-22;
Isaiah 54:1-10; Isaiah 56:1-8
 

Blessings,

Rachel Cory

Prophecy Viewpoint

[Ron Amnsn]

The article has many good points. It is true that the prophecies regarding Israel should be interpreted literally.

 

But I'm not convinced that the article has the correct meaning of "regathering". It says that the first regathering of Israel would be when the Jews returned from the Babylonian captivity.  But most of the Jews did not return from Babylon. Only a few of the Jews returned to the land at the end of the captivity.

 

The prophecy of the "second exodus" in Jeremiah 16:14-22 makes it sound like the Exodus from Egypt is probably the first "gathering" and that the second exodus will be so remarkable that the first exodus will be nearly forgotten.

 

 

          14       “Therefore behold, days are coming,” declares the LORD, “when it will no longer be said, ‘As the LORD lives, who brought up the sons of Israel out of the land of Egypt,’
          15       but, ‘As the LORD lives, who brought up the sons of Israel from the land of the north and from all the countries where He had banished them.’ For I will restore them to their own land which I gave to their fathers.
          16       “Behold, I am going to send for many fishermen,” declares the LORD, “and they will fish for them; and afterwards I will send for many hunters, and they will hunt them from every mountain and every hill and from the clefts of the rocks.
          17       “For My eyes are on all their ways; they are not hidden from My face, nor is their iniquity concealed from My eyes.
          18       “I will first doubly repay their iniquity and their sin, because they have polluted My land; they have filled My inheritance with the carcasses of their detestable idols and with their abominations.”
          19       O LORD, my strength and my stronghold,
         And my refuge in the day of distress,
         To You the nations will come
         From the ends of the earth and say,
         “Our fathers have inherited nothing but falsehood,
         Futility and things of no profit.”
               20       Can man make gods for himself?
         Yet they are not gods!

               21       “Therefore behold, I am going to make them know—
         This time I will make them know
         My power and My might;
         And they shall know that My name is the LORD.”  (NASB)
 

[Sojourner]

One of the issues that I have is that the Scripture in Isaiah and in other places goes to the point of saying "the four corners of the earth" or "the ends of the earth". I don't go along with the suggestion that this can only be the "known" world at the time. The same reasoning is used to suggest that the Flood that covered the earth only did so in the "known" world at the time. Yet the same descriptions are used to state that it covered the four corners of the earth. Another observation I have is that God wrote the Bible for all people and did so from a position of omnipresence knowing the existence of all people and writing it for all people at all times in future history, not just Anglo Saxon white people in 1611. I don't agree with King James Version Onlyism because I believe it perpetuates racism accordingly that one group of people were given the Scriptures because they were special and so forth. 

 

The other observation that I make is that if there was to be a third regathering then it would render the second as not having been completed or final as stated in Scripture. 

 

I think we need to try and be objective here, in that realising that whilst Judaism is fulfilled in Seventh-day Adventistism, the nation of Israel and the promises made around it are not necessarily the same thing as the promises made to Jews and to Jewish people. The fact that the Jews would be regathered in such a way does not suggest endorsement of Judaism. As we see today, the sheer hatred for Jewish people is mind blowing in a number of western communities. There are various places where you simply would not go as a Jew because of the fact that being recognised as that would likely get you beaten up or abused. The sad reality is that Israel is fast becoming one of the only places where you can go and be openly Jewish and not be in fear of doing so and can live in freedom. I would not be surprised if the reason this is the case is because of the promises made in the Old Testament that God would in fact not forsake them, even as they had forsaken Him. 

[Ron Amnsn]

whilst Judaism is fulfilled in Seventh-day Adventistism

 

Sojourner, how do you arrive at that?  After rejecting racism, why do you latch onto denominationalism?  And why do you choose a denomination that sets aside the Word of God by denying the enduring nature of God's promises and covenants for the descendants of Jacob? 

[FallingRock44]

whilst Judaism is fulfilled in Seventh-day Adventistism,

 Sojourner:

    Could you for the uninitiated please explain what you mean by the above statement??

[Sojourner]

The curtain in the temple was torn in two halves from top to bottom when Christ gave his life up on the cross. History goes on to show that the temple was destroyed and that the Levitical Priesthood system which was already derelict in the time of Christ came to a complete end. Hence the various Jewish festivals could no longer be performed in the way that Scripture commanded them. 

 

We know that after the Gospel was presented to the Jews it was then also presented to non Jews and went out across the world. Still at the same time over the centuries, compromises were made and the idea that Christianity was the branch and Judaism the trunk or root went out the window, largely because of anti semitic hatred within the church. 

 

God raised up the Seventh Day Baptist church and then the Seventh-day Adventist church and other Messianic leaders and groups to draw the Protestant church back to its Jewish root. The reason that I suggest that Seventh day Advenitistism is the fulfilment of Judaism is because it is God's plan and purpose for Jewish people to be born again into Christianity. The Seventh-day Adventist church does not place stumbling blocks in front of Jewish people such as the rejection of the Sabbath and unclean meat eating and so forth in order to receive Jesus Christ as their Lord and Saviour and is I feel God's plan and purpose for the Jewish people. The fact that the SDA is growing rapidly in Israel suggests to me that God is indeed blessing it and enabling it to bring Jews to Christ. 

[Aliensanctuary]

I think that the prophecies in Isaiah and elsewhere are referring to the Restored Kingdom of Israel rather than secular Israel. Secular Israel of today does not follow the LORD or obey his commands. Sooner or later, secular Israel will be wiped off the map, but from the survivors or their offspring, all descendants of Jacob, will arise the Restored Kingdom.

[8thdaypriest]

All those of faith ARE children of Abraham.  They are adopted by the LORD.  They are "grafted" into the tree - the root of which "is holy" and nourishes.  (Rom 11)

The ROOT is Christ, and the tree is Israel. 

 

Paul wrote, "And so all Israel will be saved"  (Romans 11:26).  

 

This only makes sense, if you realize that it's NOT about DNA.  It's about faith - the same kind that Abraham had. 

 

Believers are grafted IN to Israel, and unbelievers (in Christ) are "broken off" from Israel. 

Leaving the final "tree" with only believers. 

 

The Holy City is also for Israel.

There are 12 gates into the City.  There is no gate titled "Believing Gentiles Enter Here". 

There was no loaf "for Gentiles" in the Tabernacle.

The blood of the "LORD's goat" on Yom Kippur cleansed the Tabernacle of the sins of Israel (and the mixed multitude who participated) NOT the sins of "the nations".

 

Redeemed Israel - the People of God

 

She is "returned to the land" at the end of the 7th millennium.

She will be "a kingdom of priests and a holy nation".

It takes preparation before one can serve as a priest, to teach the Law.  Aaron and his sons BEGAN their ministry as priests AFTER 7 days of consecration. 

 

Rev. 20:6 says that everyone from the first resurrection will be "priests of God and of Christ".

There is NO NEED of a priesthood, if no one else needs instruction in "the ways of the LORD".

 

     Revelation 1:6, Revelation 5:9-10  The twenty four elders [presently in heaven] proclaim that Christ “has made us kings and priests to His God and Father.”

    You Jesus  “were slain”. . . “and have made us kings and priests to our God; and we shall reign on the earth.”

    NOTE: These “priests” are redeemed from “every tribe, tongue, people and nation.”   
    They are NOT all Hebrews, much less Levites ! (Rev. 5:9-10)

 

All of those "return" prophecies included "nations", "aliens", "Gentiles", who would be living around Israel "returned".

I DO NOT personally believe that those Gentiles will be raised to immediately be executed. 

I believe that "the rest of the dead" will be raised to "learn the ways of the LORD", and then to make informed choices to serve Him or to rebel. 

 

Rev. 2:26 says that the redeemed will reign/rule with Him - over the nations.  I believe we will reign with Him as priests!

 

    Isaiah 61:4-9  is definitely a RETURN prophecy.

 

“And they shall rebuild the old ruins.  They shall raise up the former desolations. And they shall repair the ruined cities, the desolations of many generations.  Strangers [non-Israelites] shall stand and feed your flocks, and the sons of the foreigner [non-Israelite] shall be your plowmen and your vine dressers.  But you shall be named the Priests of the LORD.  Men shall call you the Servants of our God.  You shall eat the riches of the Gentiles, and in their glory you shall boast.  Instead of your shame you shall have double honor, and instead of confusion they shall rejoice in their portion.  Therefore in their land they shall possess double [the inheritance of the firstborn].”  “Everlasting joy shall be theirs.  For I, the LORD, love justice; I hate robbery for burnt offering; I will direct their work in truth, and will make with them an everlasting covenant.  Their descendants shall be known among the Gentiles, and their offspring among the people.  All who see them shall acknowledge them, that they are the posterity whom the LORD has blessed.”

    NOTE:  The firstborn inherited a “double portion” (Deut. 22:17). Their inheritance included a “double portion”of the land, AND the “priesthood.”  Each firstborn son became the representative of the family unit before God.  God said, “Israel is my son, even My firstborn” (Exo. 4:22).  Therefore Israel (all of the redeemed) will inherit the priesthood.  (There will be no marriage, or sexual orientation at that time.)

    NOTE:  The Levites were given NO inheritance in the land.  Therefore the priesthood presented in this prophecy CANNOT be the Levite priesthood.   And non-Israelites are definitely described as living around and among this Israel returned. 

 

There is a study titled "A Kingdom of Priests" at my website, and another titled "The 8th Day".

 

Blessings,

Rachel Cory

Prophecy Viewpoint

[JoeMo]

8thday priest says: "those who believe that the faithful today should go up to the (third)Temple at Jerusalem to worship or to offer animal sacrifices - ARE BEING SET UP!"

 

I'm just a little confused.  I believe that you have stated in previous posts on other threads that the Jews would build a 3rd temple prior to the 2nd Coming.  Did you change your mind, or are you saying that this 3rd temple will be a "false" temple (or a temple occupied by a false god [i.e., antichrist or beast])?  I would probably consider the latter.

[Ted Oplinger]

I'm quite skeptical of any theory that holds a physical Jewish nation above the rest of the world in the years running up to Christ's return. Most of these theories have copious amounts of misapplication of Scriptures contained within. These are theories steeped in a deep misunderstandings of what it means to be "chosen of God", as well as the thrust of God's plan for the salvation of mankind. I view them this way

 

Genesis 3:15 - the original Promise of a Redeemer was made to all of the human race in the persons of Adam and Eve - long before there was ever a Jew. It comes to all human beings today, right alongside that legacy of sin we inherited from Adam. 

 

Genesis 12:3 - God declares to Abram (later to be Abraham) that in him ALL the families of the earth will be blessed - centuries before the Jews. This is God's declaring that Genesis 3:15 would come through a descendant of Abram/Abraham. At the time of 12:3, it didn't HAVE to be the Jews - all of Abram's children were yet future, and the Son of the Promise (Isaac) was not yet pronounced (this would not be until Genesis 15)

 

Yet the earthly Jewish nation - set up with the Sanctuary to teach the pre-Cross Gospel of God's grace and forgiveness of sins through the coming Redeemer, was established at the very crossroads of the world for the express purpose of exporting this Gospel to the rest of the world. Instead, they failed miserably - not once, but twice. The Jewish nation never learned that being chosen meant to serve the rest of the world by keeping the Gospel ever before it. They rather wanted to be exalted kings in the earth, to be served by the lesser nations they regarded as outside the Promise of God. They wanted the kingship without having to go through the sacrifice required in God's kingdom to get there (cf, Christ's third temptation in Matthew 4).

 

When in Romans 2:25-29 Paul laid out who God really considers Israel to be, this was not a new teaching. God designed Israel so that as the pre-Cross Gospel progressed in its work, non-natives would be assimilated into the nation of Israel - all the way up to tribes and nations. Paul then states later that now physical Jews have to be grafted into the True Vine, just like the Gentiles have to be; the post-Cross places Gentile and Jew on the same standing as far as needing to be grafted into the Vine.

 

There is but One King of Israel now, and He is still serving before Father in the heavenly sanctuary as our High Priest right now. He awaits patiently to be coronated before all the redeemed. He regards His capital to be New Jerusalem - currently in heaven, not on earth.

 

I'm certain that there exists a role for the Jews to play in the last events - it is, IMHO, simply not going to be as a regathered nation championing Judaism. I am convinced they do have a role, else God would never have preserved them through the past ~2000 years. Humanly speaking, the Jews should have been assimilated into the rest of the world centuries ago, just as every people/nation is when dispossessed of their homeland with no hope of being re-established (Rome's dealing with the earthly Jews from AD 150 and beyond).

 

I do believe the next re-gathering of Israel will be to New Jerusalem, from "all corners of the world". Every single member of the Redeemed Host absolutely must enter through one of 12 gates, each bearing the name of a Jewish tribe. "Israel" is to encompass all who have faith in God's promise in Genesis 3:15 (and every subsequent unfolding of that promise through the remainder of Scripture), pre- and post-Cross believers alike, just as the physical nation of Israel was supposed to have assimilated all people of true faith into it. The imperfect type failed; the perfect anti-type succeeds.

 

Blessings,

[8thdaypriest]

8thday priest says: "those who believe that the faithful today should go up to the (third)Temple at Jerusalem to worship or to offer animal sacrifices - ARE BEING SET UP!"

 

I'm just a little confused.  I believe that you have stated in previous posts on other threads that the Jews would build a 3rd temple prior to the 2nd Coming.  Did you change your mind, or are you saying that this 3rd temple will be a "false" temple (or a temple occupied by a false god [i.e., antichrist or beast])?  I would probably consider the latter.

 

I do believe that another Temple (to Yahweh) will be built on the Mount at Jerusalem BEFORE the return of Christ in glory. 

And yes - I believe that animal sacrifices will be restored at that Temple.

Jews and other Israelites will offer animal sacrifices. 

Hebrew Roots and Messianic believers in Yeshua Messiah will also go up there to offer sacrifice. 

They believe that NOTHING has been changed by the LORD concerning His Sinai Covenant with Israel.

I do not agree with them.

 

I read the prophecies, and it appears to me that the the "Son of Perdition" must sit as God in the temple of God.  Where else but on the Mount?

 

2Thessalonians 2:3-4  “Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.”

    NOTE: The only person who was allowed to sit in the Temple courtyard was the anointed  King - from the line of David.  This alone should tell you who the “son of perdition” is pretending to be.  Yes - Yeshua Messiah - the anointed King of Israel.  He will make fire come down from heaven (Rev. 13:13).  This was the sign of the LORD’s presence for ancient Israel (Lev. 9:24, Num. 16:35, I Ki. 18:38, 2Chron 7:1).  The “fire” consumed the sacrifice on the alter in the court of the Temple.  This scenario requires a Temple, and the restoration of animal sacrifices.

 

  PROPHECY POINTS TO ANOTHER TEMPLE

    Many of the prophets spoke of a future Temple - The House of the LORD.  

    Ezekiel 37:15-27  The LORD will gather the children of Israel.  (There's your regathering.)  Judah and Israel will be joined into one kingdom - never to be separated again, with one King - from the line of David (v.24). The Lord will then make an everlasting covenant of peace with those He has gathered (v.26).  “My tabernacle also shall be with them; . . . The nations also will know that I, the LORD, sanctify Israel, WHEN My sanctuary is in their midst forevermore.”

    Here we see Israel returned, and His Sanctuary restored in the midst of  “the nations,” who KNOW (who see - because of this) that the LORD has indeed chosen Israel.

    NOTE: In a vision, Ezekiel saw, the “whole house of Israel” resurrected,  gathered and returned to “the land” (Ezekiel 37:11). Then the prophet was shown “a city,” and “a temple.”  The Temple shown to Ezekiel has never been built.  Ezekiel’s Temple measures 210 feet high.  The technology for such high rise building did not exist in the day’s of the prophet.  Yet God’s word will be fulfilled (Isa. 55:11).  

    According to Ezekiel, “the glory of the LORD departed from” the Temple built by Solomon (Ezek. 10:18), and will not return  until the future Temple (shown to Ezekiel) is dedicated (Ezek. 43:1-7).  

 

Temples:

1.  Wilderness Tabernacle

2.  Built by Solomon

3.  Return Temple restored by Ezra/Nehemia, later enhanced by Herod the Great, Destroyed by Titus

4.  We are a Temple (2Cor 6:16)

5.  Another Temple before the Glorious Return of Messiah - tribulation Temple - where Antichrist will sit

GLORIOUS RETURN

6.  Ezekiel's Temple  (During the 1000 year reign.  A place where the Gentiles will come to learn of Yahweh)

7.  No Temple in the New Jerusalem

 

Most SDA commentaries say that Ezekiel's Temple is the one that WOULD HAVE been built IF Israel had truly repented and followed the LORD.   I don't see that.  Ezekiel's Temple is built AFTER a resurrection and gathering of the WHOLE HOUSE of Israel.  So it has to be AFTER the Second Coming. 

 

    Isaiah 2:1-4  “And it shall come to pass in the latter days, that the mountain of Jehovah's house shall be established on the top of the mountains [above all kingdoms], and shall be exalted above the hills; and all nations shall flow unto it. And many peoples shall go and say, ‘Come ye, and let us go up to the mountain of Jehovah, to the house of the God of Jacob; and he will teach us of his ways, and we will walk in his paths:’ for out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of Jehovah from Jerusalem. And he will judge between the nations, and will decide concerning many peoples; and they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruning-hooks; nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more.” (ASV) (Also see Micah 4:1-2.)

    NOTE: The involvement of “many peoples” is obvious.  “All nations” flow up to Jehovah’s house.  “He will judge between the nations.”  This is the millennial Kingdom of Messiah on earth.  The question I have raised, concerns the timing of Messiah’s reign on earth.   Will He reign during the 7th millennium, or the 8th millennium?  I believe Messiah will reign on the earth at the 8th millennium.

 

Here's one that most SDAs don't understand.

 

Early Writings pg 18-20  :  She is describing her "First Vision"

 

After describing the beauties of the place, and little children (one wonder's why they are still children on the earth AFTER 1000 years in heaven??)  and martyrs with red borders on their robes,

 

"Mount Zion was just before us, and on the mount was a glorious temple, and about it were seven other mountains, on which grew roses and ilies.  ... There were all kinds of trees around the temple to beautify the place: ... And as we were about to enter the holy temple, Jesus raised His lovely voice and said, 'Only the 144,000 enter this place', and we shouted 'Alleluia.'  This temple was supported by seven pillars, all of transparent gold, set with pearls most glorious.  ...  (In this Temple)  "I saw there tables of stone in which the names of the 144,000 were engraved in letters of gold.  (Then they went on to "the City".) 

 

So - what Temple is this??  It is outside of the Holy City New Jerusalem.  But it is on "the Mount". 

Of course the Holy City covers 345 miles on each side, and covers the entire land promised to Abraham, so it's difficult to see how this Temple for the 144,000 could be "outside" of the Holy City and still be on the Mount.  Unless of course, this Temple will stand during a different time period - like BEFORE - the Holy City comes down.  The 144,000 (whom I believe will be the redeemed from this age) will serve as priests for "the nations" who will be raised as "the rest of the dead". 

 

They (the nations) will be invited to come up to Jerusalem for the Feast of Tabernacles (Zechariah Cpt 14). 

 

There is a study at my website titled "Another Temple". 

 

Blessings

Rachel Cory

Prophecy Viewpoint