Moderators lazarus Posted February 19, 2015 Moderators Posted February 19, 2015 Is there a conservative on this board that is willing and able to outline a strategy for dealing with Isis that is significantly different from the current administration's strategy? It can take the form of several bullet points to keep it simple. RobertoDamp, WelchGary, Charlessr and 1 other 4 Quote Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence. Einstein
Moderators lazarus Posted February 19, 2015 Author Moderators Posted February 19, 2015 What is US Armed Services for? They are already involved. Quote Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence. Einstein
Members rudywoofs (Pam) Posted February 19, 2015 Members Posted February 19, 2015 I would feel uneasy if the President's entire strategy is really publicly known... Aliensanctuary 1 Quote Pam Meddle Not In the Affairs of Dragons; for You Are Crunchy and Taste Good with Ketchup. If we all sang the same note in the choir, there'd never be any harmony. Funny, isn't it, how we accept Grace for ourselves and demand justice for others?
JoeMo Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 This has been a growing concern of mine for a while. ISIS will eventually undertake a devastating attack on a U.S interest, or Western European country. When they do, who do you think Muslims will side with - their faith (which calls for subjection or death to Christians or Jews), or the country in which they reside? No matter which way they go, the world is in for a rough ride. Do we, as believers in YHVH rather than Allah (they are not the same) rise up and fight, or do we trust in the Lord to fight for us? Those of you who are interested should look at eschatology with a point of view that Islam will bring in the Antichrist rather than the papacy. The typology is incredible. That being said, as subjects of the Messiah, we know how the story ends. We who overcome by the blood of the Lamb will live happily ever after. I am at a quandary at this point at what the Messiah would want us to do other than preach the Gospel and remain faithful to God as our witness to the world. LifeHiscost 1 Quote
LifeHiscost Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 This has been a growing concern of mine for a while. ISIS will eventually undertake a devastating attack on a U.S interest, or Western European country. When they do, who do you think Muslims will side with - their faith (which calls for subjection or death to Christians or Jews), or the country in which they reside? No matter which way they go, the world is in for a rough ride. Do we, as believers in YHVH rather than Allah (they are not the same) rise up and fight, or do we trust in the Lord to fight for us? Those of you who are interested should look at eschatology with a point of view that Islam will bring in the Antichrist rather than the papacy. The typology is incredible. That being said, as subjects of the Messiah, we know how the story ends. We who overcome by the blood of the Lamb will live happily ever after. I am at a quandary at this point at what the Messiah would want us to do other than preach the Gospel and remain faithful to God as our witness to the world. Although I think for the purpose of leading people astray, IS,ISIS and even the person of Joseph Koney of a false Christian movement of a couple of decades ago, are all distractions to sidetrack people from the need for personal repentance and yielding to the indwelling of the Holy Spirit, before Jesus reveals Himself in the clouds. 19When they say to you, "Consult the mediums and the spiritists who whisper and mutter," should not a people consult their God? Should they consult the dead on behalf of the living? 20To the law and to the testimony! If they do not speak according to this word, it is because they have no dawn. 21They will pass through the land hard-pressed and famished, and it will turn out that when they are hungry, they will be enraged and curse their king and their God as they face upward.…Isaiah 8 7Submit therefore to God. Resist the devil and he will flee from you. 8Draw near to God and He will draw near to you. Cleanse your hands, you sinners; and purify your hearts, you double-minded.…James 4 God is Love! Jesus saves! Quote Lift Jesus up!!
Lauralea Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 I agree we all need to be close to God and also wevwould not want the strategies to be known. I read they are seizing Bank assets in occupied territories. Making these assets systematically disappear might be appropriate. Quote Behold what manner of love the Father hath given unto us.
Aliensanctuary Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 Is there a conservative on this board (sic) that... I believe that "conservative" means a person who is for less government, lower taxes, less government waste, less government debt, more state's rights, freedom of religion and freedom to have religious convictions that do not harm others, secure borders, enforcement of the laws of the land, etc., then I'm probably in that camp. Nuclear annihilation Nuclear annihilation Nuclear annihilation I don't really believe in it, but even nuclear annihilation won't solve the problem, although nuclear war is likely the endgame. There is probably little we, as common citizens can do against forces like ISIS that are beyond our control. When Islam is permitted and promoted in the USA, sooner or later that policy will come back to haunt Christians and everyone else who are not the right brand of Islam. Those really in power must not want ISIS destroyed, otherwise it would already have been done and over with. In the last US war against Iraq, the utilities, fuel stations and depots, the bridges, the roads, and other infrastructure were destroyed, leaving the enemy without communication, transportation, and income. Perhaps ISIS and like-minded friends are destined to engulf the whole world, bringing their horrific brand of extreme persecution, torture, rape, and death to common, decent, hardworking families everywhere. Wherever ISIS's connections are to the Internet should be destroyed, preventing the infection of potential recruits from the large pool of the disaffected, those unhappy with their "unfulfilled" lives. Now, a life of real, bloody, crime using powerful weapons would be very attractive to some of those who think that they are victims of the system they are currently living in. It's a way for them to get even, to feel powerful by deciding who will live and who will die. Human life, to them of course, is not important, even the lives of little children. Many criminals will be freed by overwhelming assaults on prisons and penitentiaries. It's just a matter of time before ISIS rises up in America, fueled by new converts to radical Islam via prisons, mosques, public schools, corporations, and websites. That would mean blown up government offices and police stations, and uncontrolled rioters looting and burning down businesses, offices, churches, and residential districts. I suspect that many disaffected blacks, Hispanics, and others who view themselves as victims will be major partners in the revolution, an Islamic revolution supported by the current president who is himself controlled by his Islamic handlers. We should at this time study Christ's teachings and follow his lead. Get rid of our stuff by selling it and giving the money to the poor. Observe the 10 commandments plus the other two involving loving YHVH, our neighbors, and our enemies. We must, in a sense, leave our former lives in Babylon and no longer participate in its commandment-breaking pleasures. Sadly, persecution of Christians and Jews will skyrocket, as foretold by Christ, but this is part of our purification process. With everything taken away but our lives, our priorities will definitely change. With YHVH as our only Master, only then can we calmly face a horrific death, yet still forgive our tormentors, and in the end, receive the gift of Life. Ultimately, as far as the brutal Nazi-Communist-Radical-Barbarian-Muslims go, we know it does not end well for them, even though they almost win. Persecution and martyrdom are the processes we must all go through in the Last Days, though, to weed out the false from the true, the professors from the believers, and those who love the extreme selfishness of evil from those who would give their lives to save another person. Jesus did say that those who live must die, but those who die for his sake, will live, even though they die. Maybe America will have a new, non-Islamic president, but maybe the best candidate will be murdered before the elections. No matter what happens to this country, we know what we must do. Followers of YHVH are destined to serve others and help them to live better lives. Sojourner 1 Quote The Parable of the Lamb and the Pigpen https://www.createspace.com/3401451
Moderators lazarus Posted February 19, 2015 Author Moderators Posted February 19, 2015 I would feel uneasy if the President's entire strategy is really publicly known... I get that. I hear a lot of conservatives asking for a strategy but I have yet to hear one clearly articulated from their side. There is a lot of rhetoric but little substance. Alien took a stab with nuclear annihilation (something he doesn't believe in) "destroying their internet connections" Lauralea said Seizing funds/assets It's a start. Quote Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence. Einstein
JoeMo Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 The administration's current plan (at least their public plan) of "loving" terrorists into changing their ways by giving them jobs and money is a dumb plan. Nuking ISIS into the stone age is not a good plan, either. Most of them are already in the stone age. I don't know if there is an effective way to stop militaristic Islam. From my current point of view, militaristic Islam will be the source of the beast (Al-Sufyani), the false prophet (Prophet Jesus) and the antichrist (Al-Mahdi). Scripture tells the whole story in Daniel and Revelation for Christians (actually for everyone); and the Koran and various hadiths tell the story ( a lie) for Islam. Up until the end of the story, both sides will be convinced that their prophecies are correct. Both sides think that they have a divine mandate to spread the word of their God/god - one side by love and grace; and the other side by violence and intimidation. Don't believe for a second that ISIS is a bunch of secular thugs using religion as a cover. They are true Muslims seeking to bring enough chaos in the world to bring about the return of the 12th Imam (Al Mahdi) and his "Prohet Jesus", who are prophesied in Islam to return in a time of unprecedented global chaos. ISIS' goal is to hasten their coming. Can any strategy either side has (outside of God's strategy) stop them? Don't think that believers won't fight. Rev. 11 tells the story of how fire comes out of the mouth of the 2 witnesses to consume anyone who tries to harm them: "And I will appoint my two witnesses, and they will prophesy for 1,260 days, clothed in sackcloth.” 4 They are “the two olive trees” and the two lampstands, and “they stand before the Lord of the earth.”[a] 5 If anyone tries to harm them, fire comes from their mouths and devours their enemies. This is how anyone who wants to harm them must die. 6 They have power to shut up the heavens so that it will not rain during the time they are prophesying; and they have power to turn the waters into blood and to strike the earth with every kind of plague as often as they want." (Rev. 3-6) Could these witnesses actually be the ones who unleash some of the endtime woes and plagues described in Revelation? Sojourner 1 Quote
Moderators lazarus Posted February 19, 2015 Author Moderators Posted February 19, 2015 "The administration's current plan (at least their public plan) of "loving" terrorists into changing their ways by giving them jobs and money is a dumb plan. " You think there actually aren't any US military forces active in Syria, Iraq etc? The bombing in Syria and special forces in Iraq is not real? It's propoganda? I'm puzzled. phkrause 1 Quote Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence. Einstein
Lauralea Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 If all the cell phone and internet communication in occupied areas went away it would hinder their communications and put lag time in their propaganda. Quote Behold what manner of love the Father hath given unto us.
JoeMo Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 Laz asks: "You think there actually aren't any US military forces active in Syria, Iraq etc? The bombing in Syria and special forces in Iraq is not real? It's propoganda? I'm puzzled." I fully believe that US forces are active in the Middle East; and they would love to do whatever is necessary to stop the ISIS carnage. But their Commander in Chief has so limited what they can and cannot do that I wonder what effect it's actually having. It sure doesn't look like the shock and awe that occurred at the beginning of the war with Iraq. Either what we are doing is VERY limited, or the media is choosing (or being ordered) not to report on it. ISIS will eventually take over a NATO country (Turkey? Italy?), beheading and torching non-believers all along the way. Do you think ISIS is going to pussy-foot around loving people into accepting them? The rest rest of NATO (including the U.S.) will be obligated to defend any other country attacked by ISIS. We'll find out then how committed the West is to defeating militant Islam. As far as the current administration recommending that we "love" terrorists into submission, see http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2015/02/19/obama-says-world-should-address-grievances-that-terrorists-exploit-defends-jobs/. We've tried "helping" militant Islam (mujahadeen, Al Qaida, Iraq, etc.) in the past - only to have it backfire. Isn't doing the same thing over and over again, expecting different results, one of the symptoms of insanity? ISIS already seems pretty well funded; but they will take any money and jobs and procrastination that we give them - and use it against us. Doesn't sound like they need jobs - they'r busy beheading and torching people while we throw an occasional bomb or bullet their way. Quote
CoAspen Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 Don't believe for a second that ISIS is a bunch of secular thugs using religion as a cover. They are true Muslims seeking to bring enough chaos in the world...... Hmmmm, being a Muslim is not an ethenicity, nationality,etc, correct? It is a religious system, correct? So are you suggesting that ISIS are the only true Muslims, but those who don't are......what? What is the diffinition of a "true Muslim"? Is that like tryig to define a "true Christian"? phkrause 1 Quote
JoeMo Posted February 20, 2015 Posted February 20, 2015 Hmmmm, being a Muslim is not an ethenicity, nationality,etc, correct? It is a religious system, correct? So are you suggesting that ISIS are the only true Muslims, but those who don't are......what? What is the diffinition of a "true Muslim"? Is that like tryig to define a "true Christian"? Sorry I wasn't more clear. I'm saying that ISIS may not be merely a bunch of crooks; but that they may be following what they think the Koran instructs them to do - to bring about the appearance of the Al Mahdi and Prophet Jesus. Furthermore, Islam is more than a religion - it is a way of life, a defined culture, and a form of government (Sharia law). Many Muslims are much more devoted (fanatical?) than most Christians. Like Christianity; I'm confident that the fervency of Muslims runs the spectrum of mental assent only to "living" every aspect of their faith 24/7. I barely know what a true Christian looks like much less what a true Muslim looks like. I have been all over the Christian spectrum; all the time thinking I am being true to the Word. Thing is, my understanding changes as time goes on. All I know is that, from what I have been learning about Islam lately, it is not unreasonable to think that ISIS is indeed following the precepts of some twisted interpretation of the Koran and hadiths. I also know God has as much of a heart for Muslims as He has for Christians - we are all His kids. Don't you think that there are misguided "Christans" out there who would love to nail a few Muslims in the name of Jesus? CoAspen and phkrause 2 Quote
Moderators lazarus Posted February 22, 2015 Author Moderators Posted February 22, 2015 I haven't heard a conservative articulate anything more than what amounts to a call for more confrontational language. In the absence of a strategy attack Obama. Quote Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence. Einstein
TheCodeMonk Posted February 22, 2015 Posted February 22, 2015 I don't know if there is a good strategy. Talking will never work with extremists. Turning the area into glass is a sure fire way to turn the entire world against us. The previous point of cutting off funding can only be done to a degree... They will find ways. I'll be clear about our end thing, I don't like the job Obama has done. However, he's doing what he safely can here. They should not be publishing their strategies nor opinions on what steps they are going to take. That's like geraldo showing the world how the Marines were going to storm the beaches of Iraq during the Gulf War in the 90s. Dumb. Unmanned drones are good. With really big missiles. Quote
Members phkrause Posted February 22, 2015 Members Posted February 22, 2015 I agree TCM, its a really difficult situation, no matter who's in the Oval office, be it the Repubs or the Dems. Quote phkrause When the righteous are in authority, the people rejoice; But when a wicked man rules, the people groan. Proverbs 29;2
Moderators lazarus Posted February 23, 2015 Author Moderators Posted February 23, 2015 I don't know if there is a good strategy. Talking will never work with extremists. Governments talk to extremists all the time. In the end there is almost always a negotiated settlement. Terrorism works as a tactic that's why governments ends up talking. Quote Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence. Einstein
JoeMo Posted February 23, 2015 Posted February 23, 2015 Laz, The "alternative" ISIS strategy will come into play as soon as ISIS attacks a NATO country - my guess would be Turkey, Italy, or Spain. Alternatively, it could come as a result of an ISIS sleeper cell action within the U.S. When that happens, all other NATO signatories are obligated to defend that country. Do not be misled. ISIS is doing the things that the Koran and many hadiths say they are supposed to do. THC has a good point. There may not be a good strategy against ISIS other than what was ultimately used against the Nazis in WWII. IMO the western world is in denial of the danger ISIS presents. Quote
joeb Posted February 27, 2015 Posted February 27, 2015 OK, here goes... 1, Stop telling the enemy what we will and will not do. 2. Stop the political correctness and name the enemy. 3. Bring in the Army, Navy, Air Force, and Marine leadership. Ask them what it takes to defeat the enemy and then do it. IOWs stop ignoring the people who actually know how to win a war. 4. Secure our borders. This should be #1 on the list of actions taken. 5. Stop denying our allies the help they need and request. This includes the Egyptians, Kurds, Jordanians, Qataris, Israelis, etc.... This is not a comprehensive list, but it is at least a common sense start. Quote Liberty cannot be established without morality, nor morality without faith.Alexis de Tocqueville
Lauralea Posted February 28, 2015 Posted February 28, 2015 This is a war of communications. Their evil deeds should not be eagerly disseminated. Instead all video footage should only be used by security forces to locate them. Electronic communications should be scrambled monitored or destroyed. Remember how the tower of Babel was not built. All intermet service in occupied areas could be suspended and telecommunications as well. They use technology to propagandize and recruit. Use it to break down their communications stymy recruitment efforts and find them. Get all web hosts to agree to boycott all their posts or be shut down. Freeze the assets of any bank in territory they occupy. Those with legitimate funds can get them once they leave. Isis needs to be contained but Syria is becoming another Somalia. Without a more stable government there is only so much that can be done. It would be good but not feasible to keep others from flying in and going to their holdings by having checkpoints on the roads. Quote Behold what manner of love the Father hath given unto us.
JoeMo Posted March 1, 2015 Posted March 1, 2015 This is a war of communications. Their evil deeds should not be eagerly disseminated. Instead all video footage should only be used by security forces to locate them. Electronic communications should be scrambled monitored or destroyed. Remember how the tower of Babel was not built. All intermet service in occupied areas could be suspended and telecommunications as well. They use technology to propagandize and recruit. Use it to break down their communications stymy recruitment efforts and find them. Get all web hosts to agree to boycott all their posts or be shut down. Freeze the assets of any bank in territory they occupy. Those with legitimate funds can get them once they leave. Isis needs to be contained but Syria is becoming another Somalia. Without a more stable government there is only so much that can be done. It would be good but not feasible to keep others from flying in and going to their holdings by having checkpoints on the roads. This sounds really good on the surface. But, if this were to be implemented, what would prevent this from being used as a precedent at some future time to cut off others' access to the telecom ant the internet - say like Christians? Quote
Administrators Tom Wetmore Posted March 1, 2015 Administrators Posted March 1, 2015 For the want of safety and security people are willing to sacrifice their most cherished freedoms. Quote "Absurdity reigns and confusion makes it look good." "Sinless perfection is such a shallow goal." "I love God only as much as the person I love the least." *Forgiveness is always good news. And that is the gospel truth. (And finally, the ideas expressed above are solely my person views and not that of any organization with which I am associated.)
Moderators lazarus Posted March 5, 2015 Author Moderators Posted March 5, 2015 OK, here goes... 1, Stop telling the enemy what we will and will not do. 2. Stop the political correctness and name the enemy. 3. Bring in the Army, Navy, Air Force, and Marine leadership. Ask them what it takes to defeat the enemy and then do it. IOWs stop ignoring the people who actually know how to win a war. 4. Secure our borders. This should be #1 on the list of actions taken. 5. Stop denying our allies the help they need and request. This includes the Egyptians, Kurds, Jordanians, Qataris, Israelis, etc.... This is not a comprehensive list, but it is at least a common sense start. Thanks for taking a stab. 1. Ralph Peters, Obama critic says: “None of us want an enduring, large troop presence on the ground in the Middle East.” “But,” he adds, “You don’t tell your enemy what you’re not going to do. And this is, it sounds like a contract negotiation in Hollywood, he’s got all of these stipulations and caveats.” Didn't he just tell the enemy that we don't want "an enduring, large troop presence". LOL. Remember shock and awe? http://www.cbsnews.com/news/iraq-faces-massive-us-missile-barrage/ US officials were very clear about what Iraqis would face. 2. I think ISIS would like the rhetoric to heat up. Radical Islam has more of a ring to it than just Islam. Islamist/ Jehadist/ Islamofacist....meh. If It make makes you feel better but may also make ISIS recruitment easier. 3. Have your heard of the Joint chiefs? http://www.jcs.mil/. This afternoon, President Obama traveled to Joint Base Andrews, just outside of Washington, D.C., to attend a meeting with military leaders from more than 20 partner nations in the coalition to degrade and destroy ISIL. At the meeting, hosted by Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Gen. Martin Dempsey, leaders discussed the progress in the coalition's efforts to date. The President reiterated that: The U.S. will take action against targets in both Iraq and Syria, so ISIL cannot find safe haven anywhere. The U.S. will act as part of a broad international coalition, because this is not our fight alone. Flying sorties (combat missions by individual aircraft) in support of coalition airstrikes -- nine countries have flown sorties so far, including five Arab partners in Syria Sending arms and assistance to Iraqi security forces and the Syrian opposition and sharing intelligence Providing billions of dollars in humanitarian aid for the victims of conflict in the region http://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/2014/10/14/president-obama-joins-international-military-leaders-discuss-coalition-efforts-again 4. Are your sure this is the 1st thing that should be done???? ISIS is not in Mexico or Canada. 5. Now you're talking. Israel gets millions each day though. They may need a cut in their welfare check. Quote Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence. Einstein
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