The Gospel of Luke

[Samie]

5 hours ago, Musicman1228 said:

Look it up. I don't know about you, but if the author of a book in the Bible disagrees with anything that Jesus spoke to His own eyewitness disciples, the even if that book is included in the Bible I will not trust it to be the very word of God.

In front of His disciples, Jesus referred to the HS as a HE. 

But you don't believe Christ's words and insists the HS is a SHE.  So, I don't blame you for not believing Paul and Peter. If you don't even believe Christ's words, why would you believe in the words of all the others?  I guess, you only believe your own words, don't you?

[Musicman1228]

8 hours ago, Samie said:

 

Jesus said that the HS is a HE. That is truth.

You said the HS is a SHE. That's a lie. And because of this you resort to circular reasoning or make up excuses when asked.

Again: "Was Jesus CORRECT when He addressed the Holy Spirit as a HE?"

Hope you won't make up excuses this time, will you?

As to your question you want answered for you, In Gen 3:15, the woman directly referred to is Eve.  In Rev 12:17, the woman directly referred to is Mary.  Now, who judges whether I answered correctly or not, you?

Samie, If the woman seen in Gen. 3:15 is Eve, then for the symbols to be consistent the offspring of the woman would be humans, and the offspring of the Serpent would have to be snakes. In Rev. 12 if the woman is Mary, then the Catholic church is correct in saying that Mary is not dead and in the grave but she is alive and in Heaven, and it is she that gives birth to the SPIRITUAL offspring of God, meaning that at some point God would have had to marry her, which would have made Joseph and God polygamists; two males sharing a single wife. Now if you want to believe that this is true you are welcome. It is my understanding that the Woman seen in Gen. 3:15 is the SAME Woman seen in Rev. 12. Both are a SYMBOL, because symbols must be consistent within a prophecy. If the SERPENT is a symbol for Satan, who is a SPIRITUAL identity, then the Woman must also represent (as a symbol) a SPIRITUAL identity. In both Rev. 12 and in Gen. 3:15 Satan's offspring are NOT snakes, they are people that have chosen the same spiritual identity as Satan. And the offspring of the Woman in Rev. 12:17 are SPIRITUAL beings that have chosen the same identity as the Woman that gave them birth. In John 3:3,5 Jesus told Nicademus that in order to be IN THE KINGDOM we must be BORN AGAIN. Who is it that gives birth, a man or a woman? If it is the Holy Spirit that give us birth then the symbol of the entity that accomplishes this process MUST be a WOMAN.

Joh 3:6  "That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

Joh 3:12  "If I told you earthly things and you do not believe, how will you believe if I tell you heavenly things?

 

[Musicman1228]

Mat 3:7  But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees coming for baptism, he said to them, "You brood of vipers, who warned you to flee from the wrath to come?

Samie,

John the baptist named the Pharisees and Sadducees  a "brood of vipers", recognizing that although they were human beings their spiritual nature was SERPENTS, just like their father, Satan. Are you going to tell John the Baptist that he is wrong in his application of symbols to reality?

[Musicman1228]

11 hours ago, Green Cochoa said:

Matthew 4:4, Luke 4:4, 2 Timothy 3:16, 2 Peter 1:21, Psalms 12:6, etc., but I probably should not list any more, because you may soon be rejecting all of those in order to maintain your unscriptural views. Already you've rejected some of those.

Green,

Mat 4:4  But He answered and said, "It is written, 'MAN SHALL NOT LIVE ON BREAD ALONE, BUT ON EVERY WORD THAT PROCEEDS OUT OF THE MOUTH OF GOD.'"

This is absolutely, positively TRUE. The question is whether you believe that any human being that simply says they are from God always speaks the truth. Well, none of us would believe that statement. Then the next question is "How do you tell who is speaking the very words of God, or not." The answer to that question is a little more complicated. There are MANY people that have said, "God has ordained me to preach a different message than what was taught to you before I came on the scene. You must believe me because the Holy Spirit has come upon me, and given me a message of truth that has changed from times past."

Jesus warned against believing these people.

Mat 24:4  And Jesus answered and said to them, "See to it that no one misleads you.

Mat 24:5  "For many will come in My name, saying, 'I am the Christ,' and will mislead many.

Mat 24:11  "Many false prophets will arise and will mislead many.

Mat 24:12  "Because lawlessness is increased, most people's love will grow cold.

Many Christians believe that God has established a book that contains only the truth, and that God has protected down through the ages, keeping it pure and holy, and that book is the Bible. Yet, if God did this then why on earth would He have told His own disciple that it was up to them to be aware that THEY could be deceived if God was going to keep them from the possibility from deception.

Now I can hear people say, "But that is why He gave us the Bible, so that we could either choose to believe it, or not." So this means that once you choose to believe everything in the Bible you are now safe from eternal death? 

The parable/prophecy of Jesus about the Wheat and the Weeds in Matt. 13:24-30 shows that Jesus was NOT going to protect people from deception, because He said that the Truth and also LIES would be found in the SAME place, and a decision would be required on the part of human beings to CHOOSE which they would believe. The location of the Truth about salvation, and also lies about salvation ARE found in exactly the same place; The Bible. The Truth is supplied by THE VERY WORDS OF GOD. Lies are supplied by apostles and prophets that SAY they are from God, that sound like they come from God, but they are not.

The reference to 2Tim.3:16 is often used to 'prove' that the entire Bible is the WORD OF GOD. Again, this is a manipulation of Satan in trying to convince those that WANT to believe it that it is true. NO ONE reads 2Tim.3:15, which says:

2Ti 3:15  and that from childhood you have known the sacred writings which are able to give you the wisdom that leads to salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.

Paul WAS NOT speaking of the Bible we have today, because IT DID NOT EXIST! Paul was speaking of what we now term The Old Testament, that which was already in use in Israel for a 1000 years.

And what Scripture did Jesus use in His defeat of the leadership of the Jews while He was here 'in the flesh' on earth?

Mat 5:17  "Do not think that I came to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I did not come to abolish but to fulfill.

Yet people will still say that the Holy Spirit has led them to 'new' truth that differs from what has already been given. But will the actual TRUE Holy Spirit do this?

Joh 16:13  "But when He, the Spirit of truth, comes, He will guide you into all the truth; for He will not speak on His own initiative, but whatever He hears, He will speak; and He will disclose to you what is to come.

From whom does the Holy Spirit get her/his information? The Holy Spirit does not get ANY information from ANY human source, although there are those that would have you believe this. The Holy Spirit of God receives information about salvation (or anything) ONLY from the mouth of God. So if someone says that the Holy Spirit has given them DIFFERENT information that what was given from God in the past, THEY ARE LYING! 

Therefore, ANYONE that speaks a DIFFERENT gospel other than the Gospel of the Kingdom as taught by the Son of God, Jesus Christ, to His own eyewitness disciples is speaking a lie. There is a self appointed apostle that is included in the Bible that has done this very thing. Paul has changed the Gospel of the Kingdom into the gospel of God, and by his own mouth calls it a 'different' gospel. And then says that anyone that teaches a gospel different from his gospel, even if they are an angel from Heaven, they should be cursed (Gal.1:8-9). Wow! Paul is saying that the Holy Spirit, and indeed Jesus himself, gave him this 'NEW' information that is completely different from what Jesus taught while on earth. Yet Jesus said that The Holy Spirit cannot do this.

So you be the judge, you decide if this is true. But for me it is very simple; I am going to use ONLY the WORDS of God in the Old Testament, and the WORDS of Jesus that He gave to His own eyewitness disciples WHILE HE WAS HERE ON EARTH IN THE FLESH!. This is the FAIL SAFE that will protect you from deception. By comparing the words of Jesus to the words of EVERYONE else, will show you if these others are actually speaking for God, or not. If they are, their words must be the EXACT same words as God Themselves used to bring truth to the world.

Jesus answered, "You say correctly that I am a king. For this I have been born, and for this I have come into the world, to testify to the truth. Everyone who is of the truth hears My voice."

 

[Samie]

You only want your question answered but you deliberately refuse to answer what is asked of you, Musicman?

Again: "Was Jesus CORRECT when He addressed the Holy Spirit as a HE?"

You said you're a teacher, so why can't you answer? Because you know you're teaching a lie, or were shown to be lying?  What if any of your students come to read of this thread?  Address the issue like a good teacher must. If you don't know the answer, say so, or better yet, accept you're wrong in calling the HS as a SHE.

[Samie]

43 minutes ago, Musicman1228 said:

So you be the judge, you decide if this is true. But for me it is very simple; I am going to use ONLY the WORDS of God in the Old Testament, and the WORDS of Jesus that He gave to His own eyewitness disciples WHILE HE WAS HERE ON EARTH IN THE FLESH!. This is the FAIL SAFE that will protect you from deception. By comparing the words of Jesus to the words of EVERYONE else, will show you if these others are actually speaking for God, or not. If they are, their words must be the EXACT same words as God Themselves used to bring truth to the world.

Jesus answered, "You say correctly that I am a king. For this I have been born, and for this I have come into the world, to testify to the truth. Everyone who is of the truth hears My voice."

Did Jesus testify to the truth when He referred to the HS as a HE?

If so, why are you preaching that the HS is a SHE? 

You said: "And that is the foundation of self-delusion; to insist that you are right even when shown that you are wrong. So IF I am wrong please show me using the words of Jesus ONLY (not from Paul or Luke, et al) exactly where I am wrong."

Jesus referred to the HS as a HE but you keep on insisting the HS is a SHE. Aren't you, by your own words above-quoted, judging yourself to be self-deluded?

[Musicman1228]

1 hour ago, Samie said:

Did Jesus testify to the truth when He referred to the HS as a HE?

If so, why are you preaching that the HS is a SHE? 

You said: "And that is the foundation of self-delusion; to insist that you are right even when shown that you are wrong. So IF I am wrong please show me using the words of Jesus ONLY (not from Paul or Luke, et al) exactly where I am wrong."

Jesus referred to the HS as a HE but you keep on insisting the HS is a SHE. Aren't you, by your own words above-quoted, judging yourself to be self-deluded?

Samie,  you are mistaking what Jesus said with what the TRANSLATORS said He said. And it doesn't matter if Jesus used a 'he' pronoun of a 'she' pronoun. The FACT is that we are 'born again' by the Holy Spirit, and as everyone knows, the type of being that is capable of 'giving birth' can only be female. Now God is neither male or female, but They did create humanity IN THEIR IMAGE and AFTER THEIR LIKENESS, both male and female (Gen. 1:26-27). So it is REASONABLE to say that God has both 'masculine' and 'feminine' characteristics, that are defined as God the Father, God the Mother (Holy Spirit), God the Son - Jesus Christ. 

I do believe this; that arguing with you over this issue is counterproductive and futile. We will each believe what our God has called us to believe.

[Samie]

You still did not answer the question, teacher, in this post:

3 hours ago, Samie said:

You only want your question answered but you deliberately refuse to answer what is asked of you, Musicman?

Again: "Was Jesus CORRECT when He addressed the Holy Spirit as a HE?"

You said you're a teacher, so why can't you answer? Because you know you're teaching a lie, or were shown to be lying?  What if any of your students come to read of this thread?  Address the issue like a good teacher must. If you don't know the answer, say so, or better yet, accept you're wrong in calling the HS as a SHE.

 

[Samie]

1 hour ago, Musicman1228 said:

Samie,  you are mistaking what Jesus said with what the TRANSLATORS said He said.

Are you saying the NT was not originally written in Greek?  What TRANSLATORS are you referring to?

^BGT John 16:13 o[tan de. e;lqh| evkei/noj( to. pneu/ma th/j avlhqei,aj( o`dhgh,sei u`ma/j evn th/| avlhqei,a| pa,sh|\ ouv ga.r lalh,sei avfV e`autou/( avllV o[sa avkou,sei lalh,sei kai. ta. evrco,mena avnaggelei/ u`mi/nÅ

evkei/noj pronoun demonstrative nominative masculine singular from evkei/noj

e`autou/ pronoun reflexive genitive masculine singular from e`autou/

Was Jesus CORRECT when He referred to the HS as a HE?

[Musicman1228]

12 minutes ago, Samie said:

Are you saying the NT was not originally written in Greek?  What TRANSLATORS are you referring to?

^BGT John 16:13 o[tan de. e;lqh| evkei/noj( to. pneu/ma th/j avlhqei,aj( o`dhgh,sei u`ma/j evn th/| avlhqei,a| pa,sh|\ ouv ga.r lalh,sei avfV e`autou/( avllV o[sa avkou,sei lalh,sei kai. ta. evrco,mena avnaggelei/ u`mi/nÅ

evkei/noj pronoun demonstrative nominative masculine singular from evkei/noj

 

 

e`autou/ pronoun reflexive genitive masculine singular from e`autou/

 

 

Was Jesus CORRECT when He referred to the HS as a HE?

Jesus was not speaking in Greek when He lived on earth, He spoke in Aramaic. The translation errors of which I am speaking are from Aramaic to Greek, and then from Greek to Latin, and then Latin to EVERY OTHER LANGUAGE, including English. You are trying to make your point the hard way, and you are looking at ONE thing and trying to make a whole theology out of it. Look at the entire context of WHAT Jesus said, not just HOW (the mechanics) He said it. And as I stated before, Samie, I am done with this topic with you. Move on.