Love your Enemies!

[David_McQueen]

Ok then. How?

(practical examples/experiences. no theory please)

[Nicodema]

Disclaimer: answering this does NOT mean I esteem myself any better than I really am. I still have more hate than love for my "enemies" and am not consistent in doing anything I suggest. These are suggestions only because they have "worked" for me at various times.

OK having said that: if you find someone determined to oppose and vex you -- whether short term, such as the proverbial jerk on the road, or long term, such as the person who is ALWAYS trying to undermine you, sabotage you, put you down, get your goat, or whatever -- then instead of engaging them and engaging in your anger, separate yourself and pray for them. Lift them up to God, pray for their salvation, their well being, for them to be blessed -- whatever the Spirit puts in your heart. You cannot be actively engaged in hate and love at the same time so this will at least for the time being, alleviate the hate. It will also put you into a different mindset toward them. This may not be permanent -- I've done this and the next day I was right back to being my "old self" feeling hate and anger toward someone -- but it's usually good for a day or two at the least.

By "LOVING" your enemies I believe it means doing "loving" (good) things toward them. I do NOT believe it means you have to magically make the bad feelings THEY provoke in you by what THEY do go away. It means acting kind and considerate toward them in SPITE of those bad feelings. It is NOT an easy thing to do. For me, I have to be "in the zone" as they say. If I'm not, I'll just treat them like they deserve. But Christ treats us NOT like we deserve, and I think the point is to treat them as Christ has treated us.

Just some thoughts. Again, I'm NOT perfect at this NOR am I an expert. I have more thoughts to share in this regard -- things I have found to work WHEN I have done them -- but I have to get to work ... maybe later ...

[Norman Byers, N.D.]

Love God first and your enemies will not be enemies in your heart. It worked for me. When I find myself tempted to dislike someone, I know I am not right with God. For how can you love God whom you have not seen and say that you don't love someone whom you have seen?

It's really that simple, choosing to do this requires surrender. That was the only way I could ever have compassion for those who hated me. I could see that they did not have God in their life and I felt pity for them and a true sorrow for them.

This is not my doing but God's because I used to be a not so nice person. If you crossed me you'd find out about it. Now, I look back on that and see how ignorant I was of God's love and how that lack of experiencial knowledge guided me to do some horrible things.

Norman

[David_McQueen]

So are your enemies those who hate you?

Those who you hate?

Or a combo?

[Nicodema]

My enemies are those who cause me to hate them because of how they treat me. They, not I, determine the status of "enemy" for themselves. They could treat me with respect and kindness, but they choose not to. They could allow me the God-given right to define myself but they refuse and insist upon attempting to define me themselves and then shove their lies down my throat. They could own up when called on their "[censored]" but prefer to justify themselves and vilify me instead. Bo-ooo-ooo-rrrrr-rr-ing!!!

All my enemies act in precisely the same way toward me -- it has always been like that since I was a small child. Their pattern is unmistakable. It never changes. It's always the SAME tiresome lies, the SAME tiresome games, the SAME tiresome agenda, the SAME tiresome ploys. Those who make themselves enemies to me are very tiresome and unimaginative but boy, the way they go at their "business" of enmity, sheeesh! You'd think they imagine themselves to have invented it all brand new yesterday. (*eyeroll*) Seriously, it's almost as if there is a line of demons specifically assigned to clone their M.O. from one to the next.

I tend to drive out my enemies. I don't tolerate them in the same area as me for very long. If they hang around eventually they get themselves hoist by their own pitard. And that's always fun to watch.

In my heart, I actually love my enemies. I have a strange sort of fondness for them, a kind of sad fondness and vague pity. It must really suck to be them, to have a life so pathetic that they must resort to harrassing and harming me. I mean, come on, easy pickin's, it's like pulling wings off a fly. You have to be really hollow and disposable to get your kicks hurting someone who is easily hurt, and/or to NEED to do that to feel "in charge", "in control" or "like a man". The cowardice and insecurity they carry around must literally eat them alive on a daily basis, the poor dears.

[Gail]

It's really neat to see how God affects hearts in this aspect, not only for changing people's hearts towards their enemies but even that they can grasp the concept.

Thanks, Norman, for your testimony

[Clio]

I have very few enemies. I know it sounds weird, but I really don't. I've had to rather look about me, for some. But as I did so, I realized that there is one person for whom I MUST pray, no matter how contrary it is to conventional human wisdom.

My beloved husband is my first and only, but he was married once before. The divorce was horrible, and the circumstances that precipitated it worse. But for the last several months I have been praying for his ex-wife by name. Mostly, because knowing the background they shared in common, I worry that no one else is praying for her.

The other one you could, I suppose, call my enemy, but only because she's an annoyance, I also pray for daily.

I can think of no more loving thing to do for someone than to pray for them. Praying begets more love, which in turn begets more prayer on their behalf. How can a loving Abba, to Whom prayers are as incense fail to honor requests such as those?

[Pockey]

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David_McQueen said:

Ok then. How?

(practical examples/experiences. no theory please)

<hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

Not sure if this will fall under theory, but what I've found to be very helpful is EGW's Ministry of Healing Ch. 41 entitled "In Contact with Others."

Lots of great counsel in that chapter. Some exerpts:

[:"blue"]

We cannot afford to let our spirits chafe over any real or supposed wrong done to ourselves. Self is the enemy we most need to fear. No form of vice has a more baleful effect upon the character than has human passion not under the control of the Holy Spirit. No other victory we can gain will be so precious as the victory gained over self.

We should not allow our feelings to be easily wounded. We are to live, not to guard our feelings or our reputation, but to save souls. As we become interested in the salvation of souls we cease to mind the little differences that so often arise in our association with one another. Whatever others may think of us or do to us, it need not disturb our oneness with Christ, the fellowship of the Spirit. [:"green"]"What glory is it, if, when ye be buffeted for your faults, ye shall take it patiently? but if, when ye do well, and suffer for it, ye take it patiently, this is acceptable with God." 1 Peter 2:20.[:"blue"]

Do not retaliate. So far as you can do so, remove all cause

for misapprehension. Avoid the appearance of evil. Do all that lies in your power, without the sacrifice of principle, to conciliate others. [:"green"]"If thou bring thy gift to the altar, and there rememberest that thy brother hath aught against thee; leave there thy gift before the altar, and go thy way; first be reconciled to thy brother, and then come and offer thy gift." Matthew 5:23, 24.[:"blue"]

If impatient words are spoken to you, never reply in the same spirit. Remember that [:"green"]"a soft answer turneth away wrath." Proverbs 15:1. [:"blue"]And there is wonderful power in silence. Words spoken in reply to one who is angry sometimes serve only to exasperate. But anger met with silence, in a tender, forbearing spirit, quickly dies away.

Under a storm of stinging, faultfinding words, keep the mind stayed upon the word of God. Let mind and heart be stored with God's promises. If you are ill-treated or wrongfully accused, instead of returning an angry answer, repeat to yourself the precious promises:

[:"green"]

"Be not overcome of evil, but overcome evil with good." Romans 12:21.

"Commit thy way unto the Lord; trust also in Him; and He shall bring it to pass. And He shall bring forth thy righteousness as the light, and thy judgment as the noonday." Psalm 37:5, 6.

"There is nothing covered, that shall not be revealed; neither hid, that shall not be known." Luke 12:2.

"Thou hast caused men to ride over our heads; we went through fire and through water: but Thou broughtest us out into a wealthy place." Psalm 66:12.

[:"blue"]

We are prone to look to our fellow men for sympathy and uplifting, instead of looking to Jesus. In His mercy and faithfulness God often permits those in whom we place confidence to fail us, in order that we may learn the folly of trusting in man and making flesh our arm. Let us trust fully, humbly, unselfishly in God. He knows the sorrows

that we feel to the depths of our being, but which we cannot express. When all things seem dark and unexplainable, remember the words of Christ, [:"green"]"What I do thou knowest not now; but thou shalt know hereafter." John 13:7.

[Nicodema]

No offense Sid -- those are all good statements, and I'm sure very helpful to some, but for me, being told "WHAT" I am "supposed to do" -- without being told or shown "HOW" -- does NOT magickally convey the "HOW" to me. Instead, it just adds to the sense of guilt and self-recrimination I already carry for NOT being a person in whom this "WHAT" is what happens, while neither knowing nor being able to find "what button to push" to make it happen.

It's rather like reading a set of detailed instructions on how to operate a complicated piece of equipment I'm presumed to possess, but was never issued.

But that's my problem, not yours, and not EGW's, and I acknowledge it as such. It is not intended to denigrate any of the good words above nor your good intentions in sharing them, so please don't be hurt or offended by the fact that I'm something of a "freak of nature" here.

[Clio]

YOU ARE NOT A FREAK OF NATURE!!!!

Sorry for shouting. But you're not!!!!

I find that it's wonderful Sid chose to share those words, but find them singularly unhelpful without some paradigm within which to apply them.

*safe hugs Sis*

[Pockey]

I disagree as well that you are a freak of nature. You are not. You're human.

What's helped me from her passage is to reread it over and over, then sometimes her words and the verses come to mind when I'm in a situation where I'm assailed on all sides. I've found that to be helpful.

[Nicodema]

Sid, I understand. But what you describe you have found to be helpful, is precisely what I have found to be NOT helpful for me.

All those words presuppose two things: (1) a pre-existing knowledge of HOW to do the "WHAT" that she is saying we ought to do; (2) an ability to do that "WHAT" (which may or may not be the legacy conveyed by #1). In other words, the counsels you have shared from EGW above are really only helpful to those who already both (a) know how and ( are capable of carrying out those instructions but perhaps simply "forget" to do so or are in some other way distracted from doing so. For them they serve as reminders TO do so. But for me, they only serve as reminders of the frustration I feel at not having either the knowledge of the HOW or the ability to do the WHAT.

Again -- I fully realize this is not your problem and I'm not trying to make it be. It's just how things are for me, and how I am. I used to refer to it as "what button do I push?" (e.g., to make this happen?) but actually, it's not even a matter of simply not knowing which button. I've tried them all and NONE of them work -- so it must be that I simply don't have the corresponding "console" required to execute these instructions. I like to use the analogy it's like telling a paraplegic or a thalidomide baby born without legs to "just get up and walk" (without fixing whatever's missing to make him ABLE to walk) but that's a pretty poor analogy because honestly, I don't necessarily consider myself "crippled" or "less than" in this respect -- just DIFFERENT. It's the attitudes of others, the high value they place on this stuff and the disparaging, denigrating view they take toward me as a result thereof, that leave me feeling "crippled" or "less than" in the face of this "different-ness".

But now this is veering off into even more complex and complicated areas and I don't want to get into ALL THAT, so ... I'll just drop it for now.

What was this thread about again??? LOL ...

[LifeHiscost]

Quote:

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David_McQueen said:

Ok then. How?

(practical examples/experiences. no theory please)

---

[:"red"] "I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing." [/]

John 15:5 KJV

[:"red"] "And I will give them one heart, and put a new spirit within them And I will take the heart of stone out of their flesh and give them a heart of flesh..." [/] Ezekiel 11:19 NASB

Quite a number of years ago my language was saltier than the Dead Sea, especially after spending a stint in the Marine Corps. It was while in the Corps, God kept asking me the question, 'Is this what you really want your life to be like?'

Immediately I recognized what a sham my life was, always making effort to prove how tough I was, how much I could drink more than others, how little I practiced compassion for the plight of others.

It was during that time I made the first tentative efforts to invite Jesus into my heart, my life. Nothing happened instantaneously outwardly, but inwardly and gradually my desires began to change, my goals began to reach for better things.

Things happened too slow though, especially since I didn't recognize the truth of John 15:5, and one day I told our Father that if I was ever going to be what He wanted for me,

He was going to have to do it. I took the story of the martyrs that sang while they were burning at the stake, held it up to Him and told Him I wanted Him to do for me, what He was willing to do for them.

Again nothing seemed to happen instantaneously, but I knew He was working on a heart that was having a hard time accepting the hard knocks of life, and He fulfilled the promise to me,

[:"red"] "Come to Me, all who are weary and heavy-laden, and I will give you rest.

Take My yoke upon you and learn from Me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and YOU WILL FIND REST FOR YOUR SOULS.

"For My yoke is easy and My burden is light." " [/] Matthew 11:28-30 NASB capitals theirs LHC

He delivered my tongue from it's foul spewings.

He delivered me from drinking alcohol with nary a struggle.

He delivered me from smokes without any withdrawel.

And when I became an Adventist, He delivered me from a perverted appetite that also was instrumental in delivering me from pain and malady to this day, none instantaneously except that I was clean through the blood of Jesus and welcomed into the household of God permenently.

[:"red"] "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." [/] John 3:16 KJV

[:"red"] "He that hath the Son hath life" [/]

1 John 5:12 KJV

[:"red"] "But we know that there is only one God, the Father, who created everything, and we exist for him. And there is only one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom God made everything and through whom we have been given life" [/] 1 Corinthians 8:6 NLT

And He gave me love for those He loved, for those He came to earth to save, right along side of me. He helped me to love them for their potential, just as He was willing to see me for what He could make out of me, for what He was preparing.

[:"red"] ""Don't be troubled. You trust God, now trust in me. There are many rooms in my Father's home, and I am going to prepare a place for you. If this were not so, I would tell you plainly. When everything is ready, I will come and get you, so that you will always be with me where I am. " [/] John 14:1-3 NLT

And another thing I love about Him! He's fair.

[:"red"] "And Peter opened his mouth and said: Most certainly and thoroughly I now perceive and understand that God shows no partiality and is no respecter of persons,

" [/] Acts 10:34 AMP

What He has done for me, He will do for anybody, as He knows their needs.

Blessings!!

[Pockey]

Love your enemies

Bless those who curse you.

What a radical way of thinking. I realize it is only through the Father and His Son that this is possible. There is no other way. By focusing on the Father, I'm able to see my heart's defects, and figure out what wrongs I may have done to place myself in that situation. If it is my fault, then I have no one to blame but myself. I deserved what I got. I know what I need to do, what things to work on, what to ask the Father for help in. But, if after seeing the truth (via the Father), and it's not my fault, then I can rest assured, He does not blame me for anything. He'll protect me, provide for me. He tells me to be anxious for nothing, to let Him know what's bothering me, and ask Him how He can help. He'll take care of it.

[LifeHiscost]

Quote:

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Sid said:

Love your enemies

Bless those who curse you.

What a radical way of thinking. I realize it is only through the Father and His Son that this is possible. There is no other way. By focusing on the Father, I'm able to see my heart's defects, and figure out what wrongs I may have done to place myself in that situation.

>>If it is my fault<<,

then I have no one to blame but myself. I deserved what I got. I know what I need to do, what things to work on, what to ask the Father for help in. But, if after seeing the truth (via the Father), and it's not my fault, then I can rest assured, He does not blame me for anything. He'll protect me, provide for me. He tells me to be anxious for nothing, to let Him know what's bothering me, and ask Him how He can help. He'll take care of it.

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Re: >> <<

[:"red"] "My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:

" [/] 1 John 2:1 KJV

That's part of the reason for that peace that passes understanding.

[:"red"] "And the peace of God, which passeth all understanding, shall keep your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus." [/] Philippians 4:7 KJV

Keep the faith!!

[Raphael]

Hi David,

I certainly do agree with Nicodema on the time duration effects from prayers. For me it is not for a day or two, it may be for several hours due to the severity of unceased assailments. But somehow , just lately, I seem to have been able to pinpoint the source and the effects are somehow growing to daily measurements.

One thing I am sure about is that loving enemies or an enemy is absolutely not of human capacity. No ones ever endowed or capable with inbuilt abilities of such. There are those privilaged with no enemies but then there are those who simply for being different would ignite cosmic hailstorms.

I salute and admire Nicodema for being able to realize and feel the affects of a prayer and express it in such a way as to make it sound mathematical or scientific, in other words, one may soundly look forward to the results of a prayer even on a routine basis. Consciousness of this matter is seldom if not almost never discussed or shared clearly in SDA fellowships that I know.

I think that it is the true form of religion when one practices supernatural power and capably wields it powerfully and reliably. Not only during a once in a life time almost accident ... God saved my life ... or distant and or unfelt or impersonal Mission stories ...

I feel the power of prayer constantly and reliably though my life is far from stable tranquility. It seems to open my understanding on how being close to God doesn't guarantee anything ... take Lucifer, for example, closest to God among others except Christ. But as a consolation ... I read in some postings, sorry, forgot whose, that God intentionaly and willfully makes us grow through these furnaces.

God is love,

Raphael