The Jerusalem Council

[Ron Amnsn]

10 hours ago, 8thdaypriest said:

The "man in my presence to offer burnt offerings, to burn grain offerings, and to make sacrifices forever" IS Jesus Christ.

When God spoke through Jeremiah he specified that the priest would be Levitical.  Hebrews 8:4 tells us that Jesus wasn't qualified to be a Levitical priest at the time that Hebrews was written.

[Gregory Matthews]

The Wanderer:  I post articles that Is believe might be of interest to some, articles with which I agree and articles with which I disagree and articles with which I have some agreement and some disagreement.  I often do that without talking a position on the article.

I will have to review it to see what I think.

I have reviewed the article:   My main reason for posting it was because I thought that it was quality writing that presented a view of the author.  I wanted people to be able to read an article of this high a quality of writing.  As to the extent to which it represented actual events today,  I considered that to be open to debate.

 

 

 

[Ron Amnsn]

11 hours ago, 8thdaypriest said:

I will need to do some study into priestly descendants of Aaron.  I believe the promise referred to in 1Sam 2:30  is the promise to Aaron.

It probably refers to what God told Moses regarding Aaron and also the covenant that God gave to Aaron's grandson Phinehas.

At the time Psalm 106:30-31 was written the covenant given to Phinehas and his descendants was still valid.

Ezra the priest traced his lineage back to Aaron through Phinehas.  (Ezra 7:1-5)   Ezra was written many generations after Eli's descendants lost their place as priests.

11 hours ago, 8thdaypriest said:

Just a curious question -- How would Israel today determine a descendant of Levi/Aaron.  Where would they get a pure DNA sample?  By the time of Jesus, the high priesthood was appointed by the Romans, and it was my understanding that the family of Caiaphas was NOT the true descendants.

I've heard that the high priesthood in New Testament times was a political appointment.  There were many other priests, though.  According to Luke 1:5ff there is no doubt that Zechariah the priest was a descendant of Aaron and that God approved of him serving as a priest.

A likely place to start looking for priestly DNA would be among the Jewish families with a last name of Cohen (and variations thereof), which is the Hebrew word for priest. 

Isaiah 66:21 may be related to the problem you mention. That is the verse immediately before "the new heaven and the new earth".  God says he will designate some of the returning Israelites as priests and as Levites.  God knows who the descendants of Aaron are.  It would be simple for him to accurately reveal who the heirs of the priesthood are.  Ezra proposed that same solution for the families who had lost the documentation of their lineage when they returned to Jerusalem after the exile. (Ezra 2:63)

[Ron Amnsn]

9 hours ago, The Wanderer said:

I get the sense that this text is important to you, but I am not quite sure why. I might be just having a slow morning, which does happen from time to time with me these days.Thanks, in advance, for your reply.:)

I don't understand what you're getting at.  I don't think the text you refer to is of any special interest to me.  It's part of the story of Eli and his sons.

I'm willing to reply, but I don't know what you want me to comment on.

[8thdaypriest]

15 hours ago, Ron Amnsn said:

Yes, I thought my posts were clear that I expect there to be some changes to God's Law of Moses after heaven and earth pass away.  That event marks the end of the time period that Jesus specified in his statement, "For truly, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass from the Law until all is accomplished."

The disciples understood "all" to have been fulfilled (concerning the Christ) when Jesus died. 

Luke 21:32 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass away, till all be fulfilled. (KJV)

IF the "all" had to "pass away" before that generation passed,  then the passing seems like something that would happen soon - within the lifespans of those disciples.

"Heaven and earth" would need to "pass away AND "all" would need to be "accomplished" (fulfilled).   Did this happen?   I believe it did. 

ALL FULFILLED

The disciples understood "all that was written concerning Him" to have been fulfilled.

John 19:28 After this, Jesus knowing that all things were now accomplished, that the scripture might be fulfilled, saith, I thirst. (KJV)

Acts 13:29 And when they had fulfilled all that was written of him, they took him down from the tree, and laid him in a sepulchre. (KJV)

HEAVEN and EARTH  PASSED

    King Herod had provided very rich materials for embellishment of the Temple.  The curtain at the entrance into the Temple proper, was said to be some 60 feet high, 30 feet wide, and 3 to 4 inches thick.  It would have been more like a carpet than a curtain.  On this curtain the “heavens and the earth” were depicted.  This veil was torn at the moment of Christ’s death.  It was never repaired.  A different veil was put up in its place.  It could be said that “heaven and earth” were “passed”, thus fulfilling Christ’s prophecy in Matthew 5:18.

    Any priest was expressly forbidden to tear his robe.  To do so was a death penalty offense against God.  To do so would bring the wrath of God upon the whole congregation (Leviticus 10:6; 21:10).  During the trial of Jesus, the High Priest Caiaphas tore his robe in a show of anger (Matt. 26:65, Mar. 14:63).  This man - along with the entire priesthood was immediately disqualified to serve, and more. He brought the wrath of God upon Israel.

    Question: If a high priest was disqualified by the intentional tearing of his robe, would not the Temple also be disqualified at the tearing of it’s “robe” - the covering veil?  I believe there were  “signs” that the Temple (with its priesthood) lost its standing as the place or means of atonement.

 

 

[8thdaypriest]

13 hours ago, Ron Amnsn said:

Isaiah 66:21 may be related to the problem you mention. That is the verse immediately before "the new heaven and the new earth".  God says he will designate some of the returning Israelites as priests and as Levites.  God knows who the descendants of Aaron are.  It would be simple for him to accurately reveal who the heirs of the priesthood are.  Ezra proposed that same solution for the families who had lost the documentation of their lineage when they returned to Jerusalem after the exile. (Ezra 2:63)

Sounds like you believe the Levite/Aaronic priesthood will continue - offering animal flesh and blood - AFTER Jesus creates a "the new heavens and the new earth".   But that would mean no "change" when the old one passes away.   I though you said you do believe the priesthood will be changed when that happens. 

[8thdaypriest]

16 hours ago, Ron Amnsn said:

Yes, I thought my posts were clear that I expect there to be some changes to God's Law of Moses after heaven and earth pass away.  That event marks the end of the time period that Jesus specified in his statement, "For truly, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass from the Law until all is accomplished."

 

[8thdaypriest]

Ron, 

It was you, who opened my understanding to the priesthood of the "firstborn"  You posted that if Christ had been born before the Golden Calf incident, then He could have been a priest, because He was a "firstborn".  THAT turned on a light for me.  I realized that God Himself "changed" His priesthood - after that incident.  No man did it.  God Himself "changed" the priesthood.   I realized there was absolutely nothing to prevent the LORD's changing it again - changing it BACK.  

IF - NOW - the legitimate God appointed priests, are "firstborn" priests - those who have become "firstborn" by being grafted into Christ - then those who deny Christ are NOT legitimate priests "of God and of Christ".  Even IF their DNA matches ancient Aaronic priests, they cannot minister before Yahweh while denying His begotten Son.  Their offerings would NOT be acceptable to God.  There is NO WAY that the nation of Israel will allow any man who professes belief in Jesus Christ as the Son of God, to minister as a priest at a rebuilt Temple in Jerusalem. 

So far - this go round - I've not heard any new arguments from you.   We've been re-posting all the same arguments. 

For anyone interested, here's a link to the studies on this topic at my website:

http://www.prophecyviewpoint.com/htdocs/39-The End of Sacrifices.htm

http://www.prophecyviewpoint.com/htdocs/21a-FIRSTBORN.htm

[Ron Amnsn]

8 hours ago, 8thdaypriest said:

I realized that God Himself "changed" His priesthood - after that incident.  No man did it.  God Himself "changed" the priesthood.   I realized there was absolutely nothing to prevent the LORD's changing it again - changing it BACK.

If the God were fickle, there would be nothing to prevent him from changing the priesthood back.  However, God is not fickle.  God keeps his word.  His promises and covenants are sure.

As far as I can find, for the priesthood of the firstborn God never made any promises or covenants stating that the firstborn would serve as priests throughout their generations nor did he promise the priesthood as a perpetual inheritance to the firstborn. So God was free to change the priesthood from the firstborn to the descendants of Aaron.

For the Levitical priesthood God did make promises and covenants and gave the priesthood as a perpetual inheritance to the descendants of Aaron.  At the resurrection, I expect one of the first things Aaron and Phinehas will do is verify that God was indeed faithful to his word (and then write new psalms extolling God's faithfulness).  This is not a trivial matter.  The faithfulness of God is at the core of the Bible.  Sure, if God were fickle, he could probably weasel out of his promises with some complicated theological explanation, or he could afflict everyone at the resurrection with selective amnesia, or distract everyone with perpetual sideshows to prevent people from checking to see if he kept his word through the ages.  The God of the Bible doesn't seem to operate that way.

God also made a big deal about that first transfer of priesthood-- counting each of the firstborn who were being replaced and comparing that count with the count of the Levites who replaced them, and then requiring payment for the extra people when the two counts came out different.  God didn't leave anyone in doubt about whether the priesthood was changed or when the priesthood was changed.  If God were to transfer the priesthood again, shouldn't we expect God to again be explicitly clear about the change? 

[Ron Amnsn]

9 hours ago, 8thdaypriest said:

I though you said you do believe the priesthood will be changed when that happens.

I don't think I said that the priesthood will be changed.   After heaven and earth pass away, God could make changes to the Law.  Some of those changes could involve the priesthood. Nevertheless, I expect that God will honor his promises and covenants with the descendants of Aaron throughout eternity.

[Ron Amnsn]

9 hours ago, 8thdaypriest said:

The disciples understood "all" to have been fulfilled (concerning the Christ) when Jesus died. 

Luke 21:32 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass away, till all be fulfilled. (KJV)

If you read the verses preceding the one you quoted, it seems evident that some of the things Jesus foretold were not fulfilled within the lifespan of the people then alive.  For instance, in verses 25-28 Jesus said, "And then they will see the Son of Man coming in a cloud with power and great glory,"  which I'm quite certain hasn't taken place yet so it was not fulfilled within the generation Jesus was talking to.

I've heard people explain that the word "generation" can also mean "race" (as in ethnic group).  Strongs seems to support that.  Although the Jews have survived until today,  I don't know if that's really a valid way to understand what Jesus said in verse 32, or if it's just someone grasping at straws to try to make sense of the prophecy of verse 32 that doesn't seem to have been fulfilled the way it was translated in our English Bibles.

A different speculative explanation of verse 32 is that some people from that generation were resurrected with Jesus and ascended with Jesus as "firstfruits" so the generation of which Jesus spoke did not pass away.

 

[Ron Amnsn]

9 hours ago, 8thdaypriest said:

HEAVEN and EARTH  PASSED

    King Herod had provided very rich materials for embellishment of the Temple.  The curtain at the entrance into the Temple proper, was said to be some 60 feet high, 30 feet wide, and 3 to 4 inches thick.  It would have been more like a carpet than a curtain.  On this curtain the “heavens and the earth” were depicted.  This veil was torn at the moment of Christ’s death.  It was never repaired.  A different veil was put up in its place.  It could be said that “heaven and earth” were “passed”, thus fulfilling Christ’s prophecy in Matthew 5:18.

I've heard this explanation from various sources.  It sounds speculative. None of the sources I've seen show any evidence of the usage of "heaven and earth" in Scripture to refer to the curtain in the Temple.  Scripture should interpret itself.

When we look at how "heaven and earth" was used in Scripture, we see that it never refers to something made by mere men.

In the covenant that God spoke from Mt. Sinai, the words "heaven and the earth" refer back to the story of God's creation told in Genesis 1. (Exodus 20:11)
In Genesis 14:19 Melchizedek used "heaven and earth" as part of the title of God: "Blessed be Abram of God Most High, Possessor of heaven and earth;"
In Exodus 31:17 the weekly Sabbath is a sign that God created "heaven and earth" in six days and rested on the seventh day.
In Deuteronomy 4:26, 30:19, and 31:28 Moses calls "heaven and earth" as witnesses to the warnings Moses was giving.  (Although the curtain in the tabernacle existed at that time, it wasn't the curtain commissioned by Herod that depicted heaven and earth.)
In Ezra 5:11 "heaven and earth" is again used as part of the title of God.
In Psalm 69:34 "heaven and earth" designate the major parts of creation that praise God.
In a number of other Psalms "heaven and earth" is used to identify the "God who made heaven and earth".
In Jeremiah 23:24 God asks, "Do I not fill heaven and earth?"
In Matthew 11:25 Jesus addresses the Father as "Lord of heaven and earth".

By contrast, in the speculative interpretation that you suggest, Jesus' use of "heaven and earth" in Matthew 5 are trivialized into a depiction made by Herod instead of by God, as if Herod's art work can somehow stand in for God's own handiwork that identifies him as creator.  It gets worse as we plug your definition of "heaven and earth" back into each of the Bible verses above.  For example, did Melchizedek really mean to say, "Blessed be Abram of God Most High, Possessor of the curtain to be commissioned by evil King Herod"?   Did Jesus really mean to address his Father as "Lord of the tapestry in the Temple" ?

Do you think Jesus and the people he was teaching were ignorant of how the words "heaven and earth" were used in Scripture?

If Jesus was referring to the curtain in the Temple when he said, "It is easier for heaven and earth to disappear than for the least stroke of a pen to drop out of the Law." (Luke 16:17), then Jesus picked something that could disappear rather easily and he made a rather weak comparison.  If Herod's curtain caught on fire accidentally or intentionally, the depiction of heaven and earth could disappear in an hour with almost no effort at all.  Somehow that doesn't seem to make any sense in the context that Jesus was speaking.

Your suggested speculative interpretation crumbles so easily and completely that it feels like I've probably wasted my time considering it.  However, if anyone still thinks it's a potentially valid interpretation, I could go on.

[Ron Amnsn]

11 hours ago, 8thdaypriest said:

The disciples understood "all" to have been fulfilled (concerning the Christ) when Jesus died. 

Luke 21:32 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass away, till all be fulfilled. (KJV)

I don't think your first statement above is accurate.  The prophets spoke of things the "son of David" would do that were not fulfilled by Jesus at his first coming.  Isaiah 9:6-7 for instance.

You are also trying to equate two things that are not equal.  In Matthew 5:18 when Jesus says, "till all be fulfilled" he is referring to the Law and the Prophets.  That encompasses far more than just the prophecies concerning the Christ.

For example, in what way did Jesus at his first coming fulfill the year of Jubilee?  Did he return the parcels of land to the Israelite family that originally received it as an inheritance?  The Bible does not record any year of Jubilee where the parcels of land were returned to the original families.  We don't know for sure whether the law of Jubilee was ever fulfilled by the Israelites.

[8thdaypriest]

13 hours ago, Ron Amnsn said:

If the God were fickle, there would be nothing to prevent him from changing the priesthood back.  However, God is not fickle.  God keeps his word.  His promises and covenants are sure.

As far as I can find, for the priesthood of the firstborn God never made any promises or covenants stating that the firstborn would serve as priests throughout their generations nor did he promise the priesthood as a perpetual inheritance to the firstborn. So God was free to change the priesthood from the firstborn to the descendants of Aaron.

For the Levitical priesthood God did make promises and covenants and gave the priesthood as a perpetual inheritance to the descendants of Aaron.  At the resurrection, I expect one of the first things Aaron and Phinehas will do is verify that God was indeed faithful to his word (and then write new psalms extolling God's faithfulness).  This is not a trivial matter.  The faithfulness of God is at the core of the Bible.  Sure, if God were fickle, he could probably weasel out of his promises with some complicated theological explanation, or he could afflict everyone at the resurrection with selective amnesia, or distract everyone with perpetual sideshows to prevent people from checking to see if he kept his word through the ages.  The God of the Bible doesn't seem to operate that way.

God also made a big deal about that first transfer of priesthood-- counting each of the firstborn who were being replaced and comparing that count with the count of the Levites who replaced them, and then requiring payment for the extra people when the two counts came out different.  God didn't leave anyone in doubt about whether the priesthood was changed or when the priesthood was changed.  If God were to transfer the priesthood again, shouldn't we expect God to again be explicitly clear about the change? 

Grief Ron!  God promised them a priesthood, not the exclusive priesthood.   There is nothing to prevent the LORD from adding to the priesthood, but like there was nothing to prevent Him from adding to Israel, those who came to believe in Jesus as LORD.  Those faithful men who were high priests, will no longer be high priests either.   Jesus will be High Priest - on the earth - just like Melchizedek.  

And the priests of the line of Zadok, is a symbol for faithful priests.  Zadok and his sons stood by King David, when Absalom rebelled and drove David from Jerusalem. 

None of this makes God seem fickle.   The faithful priests of Aaron, and Phinehas WILL BE PRIESTS, of the Order of Melchizedek. 

[8thdaypriest]

10 hours ago, Ron Amnsn said:

I don't think your first statement above is accurate.  The prophets spoke of things the "son of David" would do that were not fulfilled by Jesus at his first coming.  Isaiah 9:6-7 for instance.

You are also trying to equate two things that are not equal.  In Matthew 5:18 when Jesus says, "till all be fulfilled" he is referring to the Law and the Prophets.  That encompasses far more than just the prophecies concerning the Christ.

For example, in what way did Jesus at his first coming fulfill the year of Jubilee?  Did he return the parcels of land to the Israelite family that originally received it as an inheritance?  The Bible does not record any year of Jubilee where the parcels of land were returned to the original families.  We don't know for sure whether the law of Jubilee was ever fulfilled by the Israelites.

So far as the record we have, Israel never kept the Law concerning the Jubilee.  And the one time they set prisoners free, they went and recaptured them.   Why would the LORD be obligated to return their lands? 

The land will be returned to Christ Jesus.  He is "the seed of Abraham". 

And yes - I realize the Prophets spoke of things that would take place far into the future, after the "new heavens and new earth" are created.   I'm guessing that you believe animal sacrifices will continue until them.   I don't.   Today and forever, we who are priests of the order of Melchizedek will offer up spiritual sacrifices - NOT blood/flesh sacrifices. 

[8thdaypriest]

We will have to agree to disagree Ron.  

[Ron Amnsn]

3 hours ago, 8thdaypriest said:

Grief Ron!  God promised them a priesthood, not the exclusive priesthood.   There is nothing to prevent the LORD from adding to the priesthood, but like there was nothing to prevent Him from adding to Israel, those who came to believe in Jesus as LORD.  Those faithful men who were high priests, will no longer be high priests either.   Jesus will be High Priest - on the earth - just like Melchizedek.  

You are correct, God's promise and instructions to the Levitical priests does not say that it is an exclusive priesthood.  Apparently the Melchizedekian priesthood and the Levitical priesthood operated concurrently, without taking anything away from the Levitical priests.

Do you think Melchizedek was a firstborn?  Jesus was certainly the firstborn.

[Ron Amnsn]

3 hours ago, 8thdaypriest said:

So far as the record we have, Israel never kept the Law concerning the Jubilee.  And the one time they set prisoners free, they went and recaptured them.   Why would the LORD be obligated to return their lands? 

How could Jesus "fulfill all things" in the Law without fulfilling Jubilee?

[Ron Amnsn]

By the way,  The Bible does give the veil of the Temple that was torn a metaphorical identity with deep spiritual meaning, but it's not "heaven and earth".

According to Hebrews 10:20, the torn veil represents the flesh of Messiah.

 

[8thdaypriest]

On 11/30/2017 at 1:26 PM, Ron Amnsn said:

You are correct, God's promise and instructions to the Levitical priests does not say that it is an exclusive priesthood.  Apparently the Melchizedekian priesthood and the Levitical priesthood operated concurrently, without taking anything away from the Levitical priests.

Do you think Melchizedek was a firstborn?  Jesus was certainly the firstborn.

Yes - I believe the ORDER that Melchizedek belonged to, the ORDER that made him a king and priest, was the ORDER of the FIRSTBORN.   Jesus has become High Priest of THAT ORDER. 

HIS priesthood is "forever", which means that the ORDER of MELCHIZEDEK will go on forever.     Psalm 110:4  "Thou art a priest forever, after the order of Melchizedek."   That is a forever promise, concerning the ORDER of Melchizedek.  

Ephesians 1:15 calls Jesus, "the firstborn, over all creation".    Jesus is a firstborn - of his human mother, but He is also THE firstborn.   He is God's firstborn and "only begotten", and He was begotten from God His Father, before the world was created.   Which means that He was the original "firstborn".  

Hebrews says "the priesthood" has been "changed".   And therefore "the law" has also been changed.   The law has been changed where it concerns the priesthood.  

Revelation tells us that everyone redeemed at the first resurrection will become "priests of God and of Christ".  What order would they belong to except the Melchizedek type, firstborn ORDER?   They belong to that order, because they belong to Jesus Christ, and serve under Him.   That ORDER has nothing to do with their physical descent from a certain tribe.  

OK.   How does God keep His promise to Aaron and Phinehas and their FAITHFUL descendants (that they will serve as priests forever) while also "changing" the priesthood back to the ORDER of the FIRSTBORN?    

My answer would be to include Aaron and Phinehas and their faithful descendants in the ORDER of Melchizedek (the ORDER of the FIRSTBORN).   They will still get to minister as priests on the earth.   They will teach the law, and decide disputes, and offer up spiritual sacrifices.   They will still be Levites.  Their tribe won't change.  

 

[8thdaypriest]

Just now, 8thdaypriest said:

Quote from Ron:   Apparently the Melchizedekian priesthood and the Levitical priesthood operated concurrently, without taking anything away from the Levitical priests.

Here, I think you are trying to say that the Levite priests should rightly continue to sacrifice animals.  You believe their ministry at the Temple should continue concurrently with the Melchizedek priesthood.  Right? 

First:  There is presently no Temple, no alter, no Ark, at Jerusalem.   The Temple with it's courtyard has been gone for longer than it ever stood. 

Second:  If a Temple were to be erected on that site,  would the Spirit of the LORD enter the Most Holy Place of that Temple?  I have serious doubts.  I do believe a Temple will be erected there, but I believe the Antichrist will sit in that Temple, not Christ.  He will "sit in the Temple of God showing himself that he is God".  

Assuming men with the right DNA can be identified, and they begin to minister as priests at that Temple, these would be devout Levites who have totally rejected Jesus Christ as LORD.  What "spirit" then, would control such men?    

I will not go to that Temple.   The priests of the Aaronic order "serve only to purify the flesh".   Those sacrifices did NOTHING to purify the heart.    Why would I need purified flesh?   "Flesh and blood cannot enter the kingdom."   I will receive a new "spiritual body" when Jesus returns.   Why would I need to purify my flesh through animal sacrifices? 

At the glorious return of Christ, "the heavens will pass away with a great noise, and the elements will melt with fervent heat;  both the earth and the works that are in it will be burned up."  "All these things will be dissolved" (2Peter). 

Here - I think we could agree - jots and tittles could "pass from the law", because "heaven and earth pass away".  

YES - I believe that Jesus will fulfill the Jubilee when dominion of the earth is returned to Him at the judgment (described in Daniel 7).  I believe Jesus will return here to take possession of His inheritance.  

 

 

[8thdaypriest]

Has anyone read "Partings - How Judaism and Christianity Became Two"   edited by Hershel Shanks ?? 

Just wondered if it is worth the read.   The advertisement sounds interesting. 

[8thdaypriest]

On 11/28/2017 at 7:04 PM, Ron Amnsn said:

When God spoke through Jeremiah he specified that the priest would be Levitical.  Hebrews 8:4 tells us that Jesus wasn't qualified to be a Levitical priest at the time that Hebrews was written.

True.  Jesus was never a Levite, and will never be a Levite.   At the time the Letter to the Hebrews was written, Jesus had become High Priest of the ORDER of MELCHIZEDEK - a "forever" priesthood according to God's promise (Psalm 110:4).   Melchizedek was a king and a priest on the earth.   If Jesus is to be LIKE Melchizedek, then Jesus must also be a king and a priest on the earth. 

WHEN Jesus returns to reign as King AND priest on the earth, there will be no need for Aaronic priests to offer animal sacrifices which served only to purify the flesh.   Jesus will lead His priesthood, those of the Melchizedek order, who will reign as kings, and will teach the ways of the LORD, and will decide disputes, and will offer up spiritual sacrifices. 

1 Peter 2:5 you also, like living stones, are being built into a spiritual house to be a holy priesthood, offering spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ. (NIV)

Revelation 5:10 You have made them to be a kingdom and priests to serve our God, and they will reign on the earth." (NIV)

Revelation 20:6 Blessed and holy are those who share in the first resurrection. The second death has no power over them, but they will be priests of God and of Christ and will reign with him for a thousand years. (NIV)

[8thdaypriest]

On 11/30/2017 at 1:42 PM, Ron Amnsn said:

By the way,  The Bible does give the veil of the Temple that was torn a metaphorical identity with deep spiritual meaning, but it's not "heaven and earth".

According to Hebrews 10:20, the torn veil represents the flesh of Messiah.

 

I never said "the veil" did not have that metaphorical meaning.   Only said the physical representation of the heavens and the earth, on that veil, was "torn" at the same moment Jesus died.  The tearing of that veil (a symbol of God's mourning), along with the darkness over Jerusalem, and the earthquake at the moment of His death - all caused the hardened Roman soldiers to cry out, "Truly, this one was God's son!". 

[Ron Amnsn]

On 12/1/2017 at 8:55 PM, 8thdaypriest said:

Assuming men with the right DNA can be identified, and they begin to minister as priests at that Temple, these would be devout Levites who have totally rejected Jesus Christ as LORD.  What "spirit" then, would control such men?

The book of Acts tells us that many of the priests believed in Jesus, so I don't think you can justly assume that all the descendants of Aaron are not followers of Messiah.

Over the centuries, Jesus has been grossly misrepresented to the Jews as a profane sinner who hates Jews and wants to see them all killed and has taken away the priesthood from the Levites and given it to profane sinners.  The Jews have rejected that misrepresentation of Jesus.  In fact that misrepresentation is so opposite from the real Jesus that it could be considered a picture of an anti-Messiah.  It's no wonder the Jews have rejected what they've been told about the Christ of the Roman church and the daughter denominations of Rome.  The Jews  have been correct to reject the misrepresentation of Jesus as one who sets aside the Law of God.