The Death Penalty

[Gregory Matthews]

The General Conference, BRI has issued document on the death penalty.  See:

https://atoday.org/adventist-denomination-takes-position-against-the-death-penalty/

 

[Gregory Matthews]

The belief is that some go to heaven and some go to hell, with the bad going directly to hell.

 

 

[rudywoofs (Pam)]

Quote

Adventists believe that violence and capital punishment have no place within the Church. In other words, it is not the task of the Church to take human life. 

well, yeah, the Adventist Church doesn't mandate the death of anyone ... but I really don't think it's the task of the Church to be telling its membership what they should or should not believe...

[JoeMo]

1 hour ago, rudywoofs (Pam) said:

I really don't think it's the task of the Church to be telling its membership what they should or should not believe...

Really?  I thought that was what denominations did - they tell people what to believe, how good they should be, and how much money they should contribute to their cause.

[B/W Photodude]

1 hour ago, rudywoofs (Pam) said:

well, yeah, the Adventist Church doesn't mandate the death of anyone ... 

But it seems to tolerate it, unless you can just redefine someone as non-human!

BTW:

I agree with the death penalty in theory.

I oppose the death penalty in practice.

[Gregory Matthews]

I think that what Photodude is saying is this:

"Society may have the moral right to take the life of a criminal, but, the questions are:  What does Society wish to accomplish by doing so and is that goal accomplished by doing so?

[Gregory Matthews]

In my personal opinion:  I think that BRI could have done a better job in issuing a statement on this subject.

 

[B/W Photodude]

1 hour ago, The Wanderer said:

Thats an interesting take I have never heard before Can you explain the "in practice" vs the "in theory?"

I believe some crimes to be so heinous that society has the right to permanently remove the guilty person from this world. That is theory.

However, the behavior of many in the justice system is also lacking in good morals. I have seen (by way of media) too many people get out of prison by new evidence that prosecutors vigorously fought to not allow to be considered. Their attitude seems to be that the person was convicted and there is no reason to consider anything else even if it provides reasonable certainty that the convicted person is indeed innocent. The behavior of such in law enforcement and the justice system then in my eyes becomes criminal in it's own right. In practice, people are too flawed to be just enough to put to death other human beings.

I recall several years ago an outgoing governor of the State of Illinois commuted to life every one (>160 inmates) on death row. I am certain some deserved death, but nevertheless, I was glad to see it occur. 

Do keep in mind that in the future, nearly 100 billion people and angels will be forever annihilated, however, their sentence will be just and even agreed on by the guilty individuals. However, there will be one thing that will help. They will be so annihilated that we (and I even believe God) will not remember them anymore. Now that is death.

[8thdaypriest]

1.  Humans make mistakes.  Some have been wrongly convicted.   Once executed - all opportunity for exoneration is gone. 

During the OT - especially in the wilderness - there were no jails, or other means of incarceration.   Serious crimes would therefore need to be dealt with quickly and efficiently.  The Stones of Judgment on Aaron's shoulders, would end all doubt as to the "verdict".

2.  It costs MORE to execute a convicted criminal, than it does to keep the criminal imprisoned for life.   This because of repeated appeals, and additional security, etc. etc.

3.  Imprisonment for life, is - in my opinion - actually more of a punishment.

on the other side -

1.  Criminals have rarely escaped, and then harmed others, and cost the state thousands to recapture.

2.  The cost of imprisonment may eventually exceed the cost to execute.  

3.  The law may eventually require that criminals (even the worst ones) be allowed to mix with others in the prison population, thus decreasing the "punishment" discomfort of solitary confinement.   [In my opinion - there should be a category of punishment for certain types of crimes, which requires life in solitary confinement.] 

US Law does not allow "cruel or unusual punishment" even if the criminal tortured his victim until she died.  This is not Biblical - which says "eye for eye" and "tooth for tooth".  I'm not personally advocating for execution by torture.  I'm just pointing out the pain allowed for in the OT.  Jesus of course, said "Forgive your enemies."   I don't think He had in mind, that rapists or arsonists be left free to repeat their crimes.

4.  If the criminal actually believes in a HELL of eternal torment, the anticipation of execution may serve as punishment for the crime. 

[B/W Photodude]

2 hours ago, 8thdaypriest said:

[In my opinion - there should be a category of punishment for certain types of crimes, which requires life in solitary confinement.]

Given the social nature of the human animal, life in solitary confinement is cruel beyond belief. Should not happen.

[pierrepaul]

On 12/12/2017 at 11:43 PM, The Wanderer said:

how can "death" as in the death penalty ever be an actual "penalty" if "the dead know not anything?" (Eccl 9:5)

Humans are funny creatures. Convicts on death row are put on "suicide watch" to ensure that they don't kill themselves. When a convicted offender on death row does commit suicide, some people feel that such offender "escaped punishment". On the contrary, it's the same punishment whether self inflicted or inflicted by the state. Similarly where an offender dies of natural causes before the sentence is carried out, there are those who feel that the person escaped punishment. This too is illogical.

[phkrause]

On 12/13/2017 at 7:54 PM, 8thdaypriest said:

Once executed - all opportunity for exoneration is gone. 

And if I'm not mistaken, a few have, after there death, been exonerated??