Early SDAs and theTrinity

[8thdaypriest]

    John 15:22-24 “ He who hates Me hates My Father also.  If I had not done among them the works which no one else did, they would have no sin; but now they have seen and also hated both Me and My Father.”

1John 2:22-23 “Who is a liar but he who denies that Jesus is the Christ?  He is antichrist who denies the Father and the Son.  Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father either; he who acknowledges the Son has the Father also.”  

1 John 2:24  Therefore let that abide in you which you heard from the beginning. If what you heard from the beginning abides in you, you also will abide in the Son and in the Father."

1 John 1:3 "And our fellowship is with the Father and with his Son, Jesus Christ."

John 14:23 “Jesus answered and said to him, ‘If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our home with him.’”

I see only TWO divine persons.

    Acts 2:33 “Exalted to the right hand of God, he has received from the Father the promised Holy Spirit and has poured out what you now see and hear.”

God the Father poured His spirit into His Son.  His Son then poured that spirit upon His disciples.  Because this spirit flows through Christ, we experience this spirit as the presence of Christ with us and in us.  "I am with you always." 

I see no third divine person/being here. 

I made a NT review, printing out every verse which mentions both Father and Son.  I found 173 verses. 

Here is the link:  https://www.prophecyviewpoint.com/htdocs/47j-TR-Part8-Father and Son-NT Review.htm

I printed out every verse which mentions the Spirit, or "the Holy Spirit".  I found 141 verses.

Here is the link:  https://www.prophecyviewpoint.com/htdocs/47m-HS-TheHolySpirit-ANTReview.htm

Some may find this read through the NT focused on just Father and Son, and focused on just Spirit, helpful.   It was helpful for me. 

[8thdaypriest]

        I have collected those verses which contain the word "Father" and the word "spirit".   There are not many - 15 in all.  None of them prove that "God" is a Trinity consisting of three divine persons.

Two are contested concerning their authenticity (Matthew 28:19 and 1John 5:7). 

Six identify the Father as the source of the Spirit. 

Five describe the Spirit as given to us by the Father (through Christ), or as “sent” to us from the Father (through Christ).

The effect of this “gift” is that both Christ and His Father dwell “with” or “in” the believer.  The believer is said to “have” both the Father and the Son.  

 

    Matthew 10:19-20 “But when they deliver you up, do not worry about how or what you should speak. For it will be given to you in that hour what you should speak;  for it is not you who speak, but the Spirit of your Father who speaks in you.”

[CONTESTED]    Matthew 28:19 “Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit”

        Many scholars reject the triune baptismal formula as a later addition to the text.  It is not found in the oldest manuscripts.  The disciples are never described as using it.  They baptized in the name of Jesus Christ.  

   Luke 11:13 “How much more will your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to those who ask Him.”

     John 4:23-24 "But the hour is coming, and now is, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth; for the Father is seeking such to worship Him.  God is Spirit, and those who worship Him must worship in spirit and truth."

        John 14:16-18 “And I will pray the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may abide with you forever-- 17 the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him; but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you. 18 "I will not leave you orphans; I will come to you.”

    John 15:26 “But when the Helper comes, whom I shall send to you from the Father, the Spirit of truth who proceeds from the Father, He will testify of Me.”

Acts 2:33 “Therefore being exalted to the right hand of God, and having received from the Father the promise of the Holy Spirit, He [Christ] poured out this which you now see and hear.”

 Romans 8:15 “For you did not receive the spirit of bondage again to fear, but you received the Spirit of adoption by whom we cry out, ‘Abba, Father.’”

  Galatians 4:6 “And because you are sons, God has sent forth the Spirit of His Son into your hearts, crying out, ‘Abba, Father!’”

  Ephesians 2:18 “For through Him [Christ] we both have access by one Spirit to the Father.”

    Ephesians 3:14-19 “For this reason I bow my knees to the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, 15 from whom the whole family in heaven and earth is named, 16 that He would grant you, according to the riches of His glory, to be strengthened with might through His Spirit in the inner man, 17 that Christ may dwell in your hearts through faith; that you, . . . 18 may be able to comprehend . . . the love of Christ which passes knowledge; that you may be filled with all the fullness of God.”

    Ephesians 4:4  “There is one body and one Spirit, just as you were called in one hope of your calling; 5 one Lord, one faith, one baptism; 6 one God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.”

    1 Peter 1:2 “elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, in sanctification of the Spirit, for obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace to you and peace be multiplied.”

 [CONTESTED]   1 John 5:7-8 “For there are three that bear witness in heaven: the Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit; and these three are one.”

        Most translations note that this verse was a later addition.  It is not found in the older manuscripts.  Almost all scholars reject use of this verse for any proof concerning God as Trinity.

 

[JoeMo]

6 hours ago, 8thdaypriest said:

1 John 5:7-8 “For there are three that bear witness in heaven: the Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit; and these three are one.”

What translation does this verse come from?  Almost every english translation a read says "the Spirit, and the water, and the blood".

[8thdaypriest]

14 hours ago, JoeMo said:

What translation does this verse come from?  Almost every english translation a read says "the Spirit, and the water, and the blood".

CJB  1 John 5:7 There are three witnesses-

KJV  1 John 5:7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.

NAS  1 John 5:8 For there are three that bear witness, the Spirit and the water and the blood; and the three are in agreement.

NET  1 John 5:7 For there are three that testify,

NIV  1 John 5:7 For there are three that testify: 8 the Spirit, the water and the blood; and the three are in agreement.

NKJ  1 John 5:7 For there are three that bear witness in heaven: the Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit; and these three are one.

 

Of the versions I have set up for myself, it looks like only King James and NKJV.

[JoeMo]

5 hours ago, 8thdaypriest said:

Of the versions I have set up for myself, it looks like only King James and NKJV.

DUH! I was looking at 1 John 5:8. My bad.