Reincarnation

June 4, 2006

Many religions in the world are teaching reincarnation. Does the Bible teach about reincarnation, please explain if it does?

June 4, 2006

Indeed. The Bible teaches that man lives once, dies once, and then the judgment. Reincarnation, by contrast, is in direct violation of the Creation account, and of the State of the Dead, as well as being a 'works' based belief.

June 4, 2006

Reincarnation came from applying the ancent consept of cycles to the human life. A proper applicaiton is found in how we should use Bible Prophecy, which came from the same world, but the Biblical applicaiton to cycles when it comes to life is not the multi-returns, but life, death and resurection.

June 7, 2006

Actually, most Christians who believe in a resurrection believe in re-incarnation, in a sense.

When humans die, their old bodies are gone, forever.

In the First Resurrection, the purified memories of the Chosen are downloaded into completely new bodies, free of diseases or mutations. This, then, is true re-incarnation---one's memories...their consciousness, are inserted into a completely different body. This is what happened when Jesus was resurrected from the tomb, although I doubt any of his memories were deleted.

In the Second Resurrection, the stored, unaltered memories of those unfit for eternal life are downloaded into exact copies of their old, diseased and polluted bodies. This, I assume, would involve using a sample or record of their DNA. The Holy Spirit, the Creative/Healing/Life-Sustaining Force in the Universe, will assemble the body copies much in the same way that it assembled the First Life on Earth, using DNA codes, when it was created in the Beginning.

Like Jesus, who had a spirit which he gave up at the time of his earthly death, so we, too, have a spirit. This spirit is like an interface, allowing access to our minds by the Holy Spirit, and angels, both evil and good. This spirit within is also a storage medium which records our memories with extreme accuracy. After we die, this record of all of our thoughts, our life-record, is taken to the real temple on the real Mt. Zion, somewhere out in space, where it is stored.

In the earthly sense, re-incarnation probably doesn't occur like some think.

Evil messengers/angels, able to access the memories of the dead when they were alive, can recall this information and download it into some living subject via their spirit. Thus, this living subject will appear to the uninformed to be the re-incarnation of some particular dead person.

June 7, 2006

The fundamental reason for reincarnation, according to eastern religions, is that life is full of pain. And until we find a way to stop causeing pain to others, we are doomed to live and suffer again.

According to these teachings, every evil deed in this life causes us to suffer in the next. THis burden of evil becomes our fate, our "karma" in the next life. The more cruel and thoughtless in this life, the more lowly our station, the more suffering in the next.

The goal in these religions is to escape life-- to beome one with everything, and thus nothing. The name for this is Nirvana, where "the drop of water joins the shining sea." Of course, that's the end of the drop.

By contrast, the Bible teaches that life is a joyful gift of God, blighted by sin. During our life on this Earth, we have the opportunity to build a saving relationship with God, and live forever after He puts an end to sin; or we can reject God, cling to sin, and be destroyed with the sin we have chosen.

In a real sense, Eastern religions and Christianity are opposites. For the Easter religions, life is bad and death is good. Life is the last enemy to be avoided. For Christianity, life is good and death is the bad. Death is the last enemy to be destroyed.

June 8, 2006

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />

In the Second Resurrection, the stored, unaltered memories of those unfit for eternal life are downloaded into exact copies of their old, diseased and polluted bodies.

Bible verse reference please.

June 9, 2006

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />

Revelation 6:9

9. And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls (spirits) of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:

10. And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?

11. And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellow servants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.

Unless we believe God has magical powers and can resurrect humans just by speaking the proper words, we can look for a few clues that will give us another idea about resurrection/reincarnation in the Bible.

Either God must have an unimaginably powerful memory to remember what everyone who ever lived looked like and thought in order to properly resurrect both the good and evil humans, or, there must be some other mechanism used to record their characteristics and thoughts for future reference.

"Spirit" has several different meanings in both Hebrew and Greek. In verse 9 there are several possibilities, either "breath", "spirit" or "immortal soul", according to Strong's Dictionary.

Because the way "spirit" is used elsewhere, occasionally, we can make the assumption that it is the more or less permanent record of our lives, including our genetic make-up, and, every word and unspoken thought we've ever had.

This is the information needed to resurrect those long dead, disintegrated into dust, and scattered across the face of the Earth. (Our spirit is also like an interface, allowing access to our minds by the Holy Spirit and the angels, both good and evil.)

The verses above indicate that at least some human "spirits", or basically, life records, are stored in an altar in the real Sanctuary on the real Mt. Zion somewhere out in space. The earthly Sanctuary on the earthly Mt. Zion were mainly symbolic.

In this scene of the 5th Seal, the spirits/souls/life records are personified to illustrate some point, mainly, that there is a long wait, by human standards, before those who were martyred for God physically receive their eternal reward.

They will actually receive the gift of eternal life at the First Resurrection, along with the others from Earth chosen for their obedience to the commands of God.

Now when the evil humans not chosen to live forever, die, their memories and DNA codes must be stored somewhere in order for them to be resurrected in the Second Resurrection. Maybe their spirits are stored in the Altar of Sacrifice in the real Sanctuary, also, or maybe somewhere else. I don't know.

One possible mechanism for resurrecting the wicked dead would be for the Holy Spirit, the Creative/Healing/Life-Sustaining Force that enfolds our planet, to retrieve the dead human's spirit/life record, and with the genetic and memory information contained therein, regenerate that person. These individuals would in effect, be clones, or reincarnations, of their former selves, physically and mentally identical to what they were in their previous life.

No Bible verse states this concept specifically, unfortunately. The last author/letter-writer wrote over 2000 years ago. EGW gives us a little more information about this subject in the Great Controversy, near the end of the book, but some do not accept her writings. The Holy Spirit will give us, in dreams and visions and through study and meditation, new information needed by the beleivers when the proper times arrives.

June 10, 2006

While the wicked are resurrected/reincarnated back into their old selves, the Righteous will get new human-like bodies, minus the reproductive systems. They will probably all look alike, and there will be no races to distinguish one individual from another, hence, they must carry ID, the Little White Stone.

The Overcomers mentioned in Rev 3 are to become pillars with writing on them in the Temple of God. Maybe their spirits are inserted into an inanimate object, a pillar, or maybe they are to become part of the Temple Support Group, not actual pillars. Either way, they never leave the Temple Complex sitting atop Mt. Zion, unless, of course, the language is only figurative.

If the Chosen Ones are to eat food and fruit, what goes in must go out, unless there's a different waste elimination process used in their new bodies.

I suspect that whoever among the Chosen Ones have served their fellow man very little while on Earth will have the high honor of cleaning the public restrooms in the New Jerusalem. Those who have served others much while on Earth will have nicer work, maybe supervising the restroom cleaners.

So maybe John the Baptist, who preached and baptized for several years after living a solitary life in the wastelands, had few opportunities to serve others on a personal level. Maybe he'll have to clean restrooms while kind, humble people we've never heard of, who have continually ministered to others personally, forgetful of self, will have upper management positions in the next life.

In the Great Assemblies, where everyone gathers to hear God speak, he could very well send out "pleasure waves" (I don't know what else to call it). Then all of those present are overwhelmed with intense feelings of pleasure and they all fall down before God and worship him. This is the replacement for human sexuality, which caused a lot of problems on Earth.

June 10, 2006

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />

Aliensanctuary said:

This is the replacement for human sexuality, which caused a lot of problems on Earth.

No doubt God will be so pleased to get a second chance, to fix up any other kistakes He made the first time...

Graeme

June 11, 2006

Your stories are always so imaginative and interesting!! You have a gift of expressing Biblical concepts in a fashion that sparks the imagination and brings some of these scenes to life. <img src="/adventist/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif" alt="" />

I can agree with your assessment of probable re-creation. In fact, I like it a lot. But, I cannot agree with your concept of new bodies that all look alike and "are without reproductive organs". <img src="/adventist/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" /> I also am quite well aware that there are those here who do not ascribe to Ellen White's writings, I am not one of those. She states somewhere that in heaven we will RECOGNIZE each other. That flies in the face of "look alike" bodies.

God promises to RESTORE us, not change our species. <img src="/adventist/images/graemlins/23_30_104.gif" alt="" /> He originally created people as MAN and as WOMAN and pronounced his creation as VERY GOOD!!! <img src="/adventist/images/graemlins/thankyousign.gif" alt="" /> Restore, to me, means just that: RESTORE. Including ALL of our organs. I cannot ascribe to a Heaven in which I would be a eunich, I would not want to be in such a place. I don't and can't believe that is what God has in store for us. <img src="/adventist/images/graemlins/seenoevil.gif" alt="" />

We each have our own beliefs, so if that is what comforts you and makes you long for heaven, that is fine. But, that is NOT what comforts me in the least. My soul recoils from such a picture of heaven as that. <img src="/adventist/images/graemlins/yucky.gif" alt="" />

Keep up the writing, and may the Holy Spirit lead you into all truth as you write of heavenly scenes.

June 13, 2006

Don't cry, Morning Glory.

If you're really, really good here on Earth, you might get to be a librarian in New Jerusalem. Then, if you're a really, really good librarian for the first million years, you might get promoted to head librarian for the rest of eternity. There might be a lot of books there, maybe even billions and billions, that all need to be kept track of.

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />

"The last lingering traces of the curse of sin will be removed, and Christ's faithful ones will appear in "the beauty of the Lord our God," in mind and soul and body reflecting the perfect image of their Lord." Great Controversy, page 645

This is where we can find the idea that the Redeemed from Earth may very well be clones. They will probably have telepathic powers, via the Holy Spirit, just like Jesus did, and Adam and Eve also. That's how they will know each other, not visually, but mentally. Only the good memories of how they helped others will be retained. That's another way they will be able to recognize others from their previous life.

Recall how the disciples didn't recognize the resurrected Jesus until he said and did the very same things he did in his life before the crucifixion.

Do you remember where Jesus said there will not be marriage in the Kingdom, that instead, the Redeemed will be like the Messengers (angels)? Here we can assume that the Messengers do not marry and reproduce, and therefore, the Redeemed will not marry and reproduce either.

It's not that sexuality is so bad here on Earth, just that it is polluted with our own selfishness. You know the problems: divorces, ripped apart families, multiple partners, diseases, homosexuality, etc., all from not following God's instructions.

Actually, the Earth was planned and colonized with human life destined to replace Those Who Left with Satan, with humans. Ultimately, for some, despite the problems caused by the Forces of Evil, that's what will happen.

Unfortunately, we don't have very much information on what we will be like, or what we will be doing in the next life. Even if we are clones or servants, it will far surpass anything we have ever experienced, stuck on this crummy little planet, surrounded with disease, destruction, and death. The only ticket out of here is to love God, love others, and serve them both with everything we have.

Jesus said that we will be rewarded according to the works we have done, and that by our words we will be justified, and by our words we will be condemned. It's up to God to chose from among us those who will join his Kingdom.

We don't have to lie helpless in the mud, crying, unable to get up and leave the mudhole we fell into. We can stand up, wash off, and serve God and our fellow man with all of our hearts, and have a clear conscience. Then we can wake up to a pleasant surprise after we die. There will be gifts and honor and music and a great feast of welcome.

After the party's over, though, we get to learn new jobs.

June 14, 2006

Alien's statement about the form of bodies the "evil" people get when resurrected makes me wonder. Is this idea our sanitized form of hellfire? Like if I die of cancer in terrible pain (and I dont quite make the first ressurection) do you really think that I will wake up still in pain and with no hope and be forced to live in that condition for days or years while the old devil is getting his army together?

We go to some lengths to explain to people that God is too loving to burn people forever. One might ask if burning for a day or two would then be considered loving.

When a child I used to be haunted by those EGW statements about "one unconfessed sin" keeping me out of heaven. I could see no hope of ever remembering them all.

mel

June 14, 2006

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />

melvin mccarty said:

When a child I used to be haunted by those EGW statements about "one unconfessed sin" keeping me out of heaven. I could see no hope of ever remembering them all.

same here. <img src="/adventist/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

June 15, 2006

We only have the tiniest of clues in the Scriptures as to what is really out "there". The religious rulers of Jesus' time were looking for the Messiah, but the reality wasn't at all what they were expecting due to their preconceived ideas and misunderstanding of the Scriptures.

Like "burning in hell" forever, which is a puzzle for some of us, there may be something about it that we can't even imagine. For an example, if a person were to fall feet first into a black hole, so my astronomy textbook states, first that person would stretch out extremely long and thin due to the difference in gravitational strength between his feet and head. This molecular stretching process would also release a lot of heat energy. Finally, after passing through the event horizon, the point of no return, the person's image would remain on the surface of the black hole forever, or, until some other object was similarly absorbed afterwards.

What the Bible says about the doom of the wicked is probably true, but maybe in a way we just don't comprehend.

As far as one little sin remaining on our Life Record, the best we can do is ask the Holy Spirit to enable us to recall these incidents and repent of them. We just have to do our best in our walk down the Straight and Narrow Road, doing everything God asks us to do. It's up to him to decide who to save and who to destroy. What he wants are people who are willing to do everything he asks, and, who can respect and protect and get along with each other.

The destruction of the wicked with everlasting fire is really to protect the rest of the universe from the horrendous Virus of Evil, not an act of mean-spirited vengeance by God. Otherwise, the cycles of Death and Destruction would never end, and there would never be universal peace in the universe. Anyway, we don't have any idea what the composition of everlasting fire is.

Maybe this idea of an eternally burning hell with wicked humans writhing and screaming in pain is a medieval concept, conjured up to keep money flowing into the state church treasury. The weeping and wailing and gnashing of teeth occurs, I believe, when those who rejected Jesus are resurrected and see him in the skies over Earth, accompanied by those who sacrificed everything to follow him.

This is the worst moment in anyone's life, to realize that they really, really blew it and missed their only chance to live in Paradise. Now they have this incurable, highly contagious disease, which can only be destroyed by incineration, kind of like mad cow disease.

The Scriptures do not indicate that the weeping and wailing and gnashing of teeth is part of the incineration process. For all we know, it may be painless. Human flesh, of course, would last only an instant in fire hot enough to melt rocks. The Spirit/Memories of an individual probably last longer, according to the amount of evil present in that memory. Perhaps the evil present in Spirit/Memories can be quantified. Whether a burning Spirit/Memory experiences pain is unknown to us.

As far as Satan and his evil Messengers are concerned, we don't know what they're made of, or, how long their bodies would last in the blast furnace of a fiery lake. Their memories probably contain far more evil than any human's.

This fiery inferno spreading across the surface of the Earth is used to destroy every trace of man, and thus purify the Earth of all biological and ideological contamination. Man's tiny little spacecraft, I suppose, are rounded up and sent there to their doom, also.

Man, as he once was, will be remembered no more.

The humans appearing in the 2nd Resurrection may very well be returned to their prime strength. After all, there's an impending battle, so how could a war be fought with so many humans extremely ill or on their deathbeds?

Actually, after Satan unleashes his instruments of torture in order to control them, the wicked humans will long to die, but can't. Whether they like it or not, they are part of Gog and Magog, all the forces of evil that ever existed, soon to attack the New Jerusalem.

Don't worry too much about pain and suffering in the Lake of Fire. For humans, it will be over in an instant. It's their spirits, the record of their memories, i.e. their Life Records, that will take longer to incinerate. Then, with their memories gone forever, there is no longer any hope for them to be resurrected/reincarnated. They will be gone, forever, and so will the memory of them.

It will be a sad day when the wicked are destroyed, but it will also be a happy day because that will be the last sad day for the rest of eternity.

June 15, 2006

It is really great Alien that you are willing to reconsider some of the items from your first post on this thread. Congratulations!

Actually we as humans are unable to agree on the past let alone the future, :-)

mel

June 20, 2006

Yeah, the more we study it, the better we can understand the Bible. It's important that we submit ideas, then look closely at them to see if they work, just like EGW and her team did in the early days of their work.

Actually, I wonder how much time it will take for Satan to organize an attack force among the evil Messengers and the reincarnated wicked dead. If it takes weeks or months, there must be some sort of food source, for the humans, at least.

Maybe Satan passes around some slop salvaged from his wrecked fleet to keep everyone going until its all over. The surface of the Earth was destroyed from the impact of something very, very big, so they can't really grow anything or pick ripe fruit.

Satan does somehow energize the living dead, maybe even heals some of the sick ones, just enough to get them on their feet as a show of force to those watching from the City of God.

If God is a time-traveler, he could have gone into the future to see the destinies of all of the wicked humans. None of them would ever have chosen a different path, in spite of their recent weeping-wailing-gnashing-of-teeth show after realizing they ended up outside of the City, instead of inside.

Their unified goal is to kill everyone inside and take the City for themselves.

We don't have to be a part of Satan's invasion force, seeking to take the Holy City by force and rip God from the throne of the Universe. It sounds simple enough to join the right side---purify ourselves and serve God by serving others here on Earth. Only one small problem: our incredible selfishness. Not that it's impossible to overcome, but we will be much nicer people when we do. Love is Unselfishness.

June 20, 2006

Alien, when you look around do you see anybody that is that bad? I mean someone who is actually going to join satan's army. What right has anyone to claim to be part of a remnant who "keep" the commandments unless they have true love for all God's children?

mel

June 20, 2006

It is far beyond my, or any other human's, ability to determine who God will choose to save, and who he will reject. We could look around us, and we would, no doubt, make serious mistakes, lacking the information needed to make a just judgement. We can't read the thoughts and motives of others, or, scan their life record. God's judgement is just. I'm OK with that.

As far as joining Satan's army, probably most do not consciously decide to do that. A person on Earth dies, then wakes up to see a vast crowd encircling a city that came from space. There's a majestic, extraterrestrial being claiming the city was taken from him. Those who don't want to fight are all tortured or killed.

Jesus tells us what we should do to join him in his Kingdom. We just have to do the best we can to do what he tells us to do, including loving every other human being, even if they have harmed us.

Jesus was, in a sense, a recruiter who came to this world to enlist those who want to join his Kingdom. He has told us everything we need to know to become members of his Kingdom of the Stars. It's too bad today's religions have become somewhat corrupted, but they go through cycles of that. Maybe we'll live long enough to see a pure church.

Who are you saying is claiming to be part of the Remnant, and does not have true love for all of God's children?

Do any of us have true love for all of God's children? This is something we must continually ask God to give us, then practice it, because we can be so mean-spirited without it.

June 21, 2006

No I only meant should we claim to be THE REMNANT just because we go to church on Saturday? Does that prove that we are keeping the law of love? I think not. I believe that the way we treat other people is way more important than correct doctrine. The remnant will be those who hear the words "Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these........

mel

June 21, 2006

Yes,

There's much more to true religion than the Right Day.

See ya later.

June 25, 2006

Modern medical science can transplant many body parts such as kidney, liver, lung, heart, hand, eye, face etc. But all these transplants will not change that living person's self or soul(i.e. his mind, thought, memory and consciousness).

There was a medical science fiction story about Jack and Linda. They were lovers. They went up a hill. While they were half way up, there was a sudden earth quake and rocks started rolling down from the hill-top. One tiny piece of rock hit Jack on the head and fatally pierced into his brain. Big rocks crushed on Linda damaging her whole body except her brain. Meanwhile, there was a group of neuron surgeons happen to be nearby. They quickly transplanted Linda's brain to Jack. Jack was in a coma for a couple of months while Linda's body was buried. One day Jack suddenly opened his eyes and Jack's mother who was sitting next to his hospital bed asked Jack " How are you, Jack?" Jack was confused. After a while, Jack replied, " I am not Jack, I am Linda." Linda was living in Jack's body. Jack had donated his body to Linda. Jack had died although Linda's body was buried. Linda can be said to have reincarnated in Jack's body. Every action Linda did was very much depended on Jack's body ablity to perform, for example, when she had sex, she could only play the part of a male instead of a female.

The most important entity of a person is the software that is contained in his brain. That software is his self or soul (his mind, consciousness, thought and memory ). The soul must live in a body in order to be alived. Separated from the body, the soul is dead.

Quote Ed Dickereons:

"The fundamental reason for reincarnation, according to eastern religions, is that life is full of pain. And until we find a way to stop causeing pain to others, we are doomed to live and suffer again.

According to these teachings, every evil deed in this life causes us to suffer in the next. This burden of evil becomes our fate, our "karma" in the next life. The more cruel and thoughtless in this life, the more lowly our station, the more suffering in the next.

The goal in these religions is to escape life-- to become one with everything, and thus nothing. The name for this is Nirvana, where "the drop of water joins the shining sea." Of course, that's the end of the drop."

Yes, I agree with you Ed, that the paganisms are works based belief. They do not believe in a Creator God. They believe all living souls are gods in themselves, that all souls are self-existing. The souls have no beginning nor ending, neither can they be created nor destroyed, but can be transformed from one living form to another life form according to the law of cause and effect. The situation we are in to-day is very much depended on what we did in the previous life. The more cruel and thoughtless in this life, the more lowly and the more suffering in the next life. The more goodness and thoughtful in this life will earn us a better next life. So the cycles of life and death will continue throgh endless reincarnations.

Here are the fundamentals of the gospel:

1. God created all men in one man — i.e., in Adam [Acts 17:26].

2. Satan ruined all men in one man — i.e., in Adam [Romans 5:12, 18].

3. God redeemed all men in one man — i.e., in Christ [Titus 2:11; 1John 2:2].

Since Adam ate the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, some organic change had taken place in the cells of his body making it weak to resist temptation. That organic change is known as a disease called sin which stimulate the body and mind to being selfish, greedy and pleasure seeking.

But before Adam and Eve began the multiplication process (had any children) they sinned. Therefore, the life that Adam passed on to his children, his posterity, was a life that had already sinned. Since the life that you and I were born with is an extension of Adam’s life, it is a life that stands condemned, a life that must die.

Not only the life that you and I were born with is an extension of Adam’s life, but our individual body is also an extension of Adam's body, all the cells in our body are extensions of Adam's body cells. We are actually living in Adam's sinful body. As long as we live in Adam's sinful body, we shall continue sinning. That why God deprived mankind from eating the tree of life, as He did not want them to live forever as sinners.

Jesus came to incarnate in Adam's sinful flesh and by living a sinless life He was able to reverse sinful flesh to sinless flesh. How? By His sinless life, His body developed some sinless stem cells. He condemned sin in the sinful flesh by dying on the Cross. Since Jesus lived a sinless life in His 33 1/2 years in sinful flesh, death can only keep the sinful flesh of His body, but can not keep Him there. The sinless stem cells quickly developed a sinless human body for Him while He was still in the grave. So Jesus came back to life with a sinless flesh human body and not as a spirit. He said to his disciples after His resurrection "Behold My hands and My feet, that it is I Myself. Handle Me and see, for a spirit does not have flesh and bones as you see I have." Luke 24:39. This sinless flesh human body Jesus took to heaven to be presented to God for approval and then make copies for us.

When Christ returns, God will give each one of us an extension of Christ's resurrected body to live by. We are reincarnated in Christ extended body. We shall actually be living in Christ's sinless body. Only then we shall be able to live a sinless life like Him.

The sinless flesh of the Son of Man will not be subjected to accidental or diseased death any more but will need the tree of life for everlasting life. See Rev. 22:2. This sinless flesh in Jesus Christ is the gift of God to every one of us in the resurrection of the just and those just who will be transformed at His second coming. The just shall live by faith alone in Jesus Christ. We shall live in Christ's sinless flesh body or in Christ and thus worthy to eat the fruits and leaves of the tree of life and live for ever.

Unlike paganisms, Christianity believe that all individual human beings will reincarnate once. Those who accepted the gift of God will reincarnate in Christ's resurrected sinless flesh human body and will never die, and those who rejected the gift of God will reincarnate back in Adam's sinful flesh human body and will die the second death.

June 26, 2006

So what is the point of bringing people back to life just to torture and kill them again. Isn't that a bit sadistic?

mel

July 6, 2006

Proving/disproving negatives:

Jn 9:1 And as Jesus passed by, he saw a man which was blind from his birth. v2 And his disciples asked him, saying, Master, who did sin, this man, or his parents, that he was born blind? v3 Jesus answered, Neither hath this man sinned, nor his parents: but that the works of God should be made manifest in him.

/ How had Jesus' disciples come by this/their assumption of 'reincarnated man' (that is, individual and/or prior sins made manifest by his --having been born blind in/into his present state)?

/ 'Manifestations' aside, why does not Jesus disabuse such nonsense[?] -- as patently held by His disciples?

Speaking of "reincarnation"... It is obvious that Sophia has reincarnated as Ann Coulter <img src="/adventist/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

(oops! wrong board? <img src="/adventist/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />

:proofed

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