Another Look at the Sabbath

[Gregory Matthews]

Charles Scriven, writing in an article in SPECTRUM has proposed a new look at the observance of the Sabbath.  See:

https://spectrummagazine.org/views/2021/time-start-over-reconceiving-sabbath-new-case-seventh-day

NOTE:  The following quote is a small part of the article.

Quote

• The Sabbath is first of all a matter of grace. It is a blessing from God, offering rest, festivity, and contemplation against soul-crushing busyness and the deadening tyranny of things. Keeping it, as God asks us to do, is thus reception of a gift that sustains human betterment.

• Embracing the Sabbath does not require literalism with respect to the Genesis creation account. The story conveys a spiritual point, namely, that the God-made world is “very good” and that humans receive an honored place and role in that world.

• According to the Ten Commandments (Deuteronomy 5 as well as Exodus 20), Sabbath rest memorializes not only the goodness of creation but also the divine commitment to rescue from forced labor. Sabbath-keeping awakens passion and hope with respect to liberty from oppression and justice for all.

• The proper link between the Sabbath and apocalyptic prophecy is that the Sabbath strengthens the very posture apocalyptic prophecy encourages. Such prophecy has a meaning that, unlike mere prediction, is both moral and motivating. It opposes unchecked human power and affirms the ultimate victory of God. Both apocalyptic prophecy and the Sabbath experience stimulate resistance and renewal, not resignation and escape from responsibility.

• It is wrong to stigmatize all of Roman Catholicism for a tragic, early mistake. Without surrendering responsibility for theological critique (and for considering critique directed to us), the New Case for the Sabbath affirms the value of mutual respect and cooperation among the varying strands of Christian commitment.

***   ***   ***   ***

• Conventional Adventist teaching on the Sabbath evokes proud separation — from other Christians. The New Case for the Sabbath evokes humble solidarity — with those who constitute the “root” of Christian existence. Christians who (along with Jesus and Paul) celebrate the biblical Sabbath thus give indispensable witness not only to the wider world but also to other Christians. Just how witness to the Christian movement’s essential Jewishness could bear fruit may elude our full understanding. But suppose that, by God’s grace, it helped cleanse Christianity of disdain for others; or impede disastrous drift into “Christian nationalism”; or transform pious pessimism into active hope. Any of these would make such witness a blessing to all humanity.

The seventh-day Sabbath, properly conceived, thus opens one pathway — not a shortcut but still a pathway — to what in this skeptical age must be a singularly important goal: the redemption of Christian community and witness.

 

[Gustave]

I agreed with several points of that article but did question exactly what he meant when he said:

 "It is wrong to stigmatize all of Roman Catholicism for a tragic, early mistake."

I'd want to know the specific timing of the mistake and specifically what the mistake was given it was attributed that it was Catholicism that made a mistake. 

[Gregory Matthews]

Gustave:  Here is who Chuck is:  "Charles Scriven (born 1945, Prineville, Oregon) is a Seventh-day Adventist theologian who served as President of Kettering College from 2000 through 2013. He is a member of the Board of Directors of the Kettering foundation and Chair of the Board of Adventist Forums, publisher of Spectrum magazine. "

I could probably get you in touch with him, if you would like to converse with him.  If you would like to contact him, you can respond to me privately, as you know how to do that.

 

Gregory Matthews.

 

 

 

 

 

[Gustave]

I've read the complete article over a couple of times and am pretty sure I'm getting his point. The author obviously put more than a little thought into this and appears to be moving closer to the position of St. Gregory of Nyssa (Bishop of Nyssa in 372 A.D.) albeit there is still considerable distance from the current position to Gregory's on Sunday. 

Attributed to St. Gregory: 

"With what eyes do you regard the Lord's Day, you who have desecrated the Sabbath? Do you know that these two days are related, that if you wrong one of them, you will stumble against the other?" The Judaic Spirit of the Ethiopian Orthodox Church by John T. Pawlikowski 

As most who have looked at the Ethiopian Orthodox Church know they attend (with great vigor) Church on Saturday / Sabbath based on an ancient Tradition. 

"Be not careless of yourselves, neither deprive your Saviour of His own members, neither divide His body nor disperse His members, neither prefer the occasions of this life to the word of God; but assemble yourselves together every day, morning and evening, singing psalms and praying in the Lord’s house: in the morning saying the sixty-second Psalm, and in the evening the hundred and fortieth, but principally on the Sabbath-day. And on the day of our Lord’s resurrection, which is the Lord’s day, meet more diligently, sending praise to God that made the universe by Jesus, and sent Him to us, and condescended to let Him suffer, and raised Him from the dead."

02thelawofkings.pdf (ethiopianorthodox.org)

And the understanding of labor on Sabbath in the OO.

"Christians must not stop work on Saturday, as the Jews do, but as Christians they shall work on this day. If among the [Christian] people some are found to behave like Jews, they will be driven away from the face of Christ. [. . .] Servants shall work for five days, but on Sundays and Saturdays they shall go to church to instructed in the service of God, because the Lord rested on Saturday when He finished the creation of the creatures and He rose from death on Sunday. On all Saturdays, except the day of Fesh, and on all Sundays, you [i.e., priests] shall receive the Eucharist between you in the church and rejoice. In the chapter on fasting it is said that no one shall fast on Sundays and Saturdays, except the Saturday on which Our Lord Jesus Christ was buried in the tomb."  01thelawofkings.pdf (ethiopianorthodox.org)

It appears that Chuck acknowledges the tragic early mistakes that the SDA Church made and appeals to leadership that those who live in glass houses shouldn't throw rocks at others. While I would disagree that there was a mistake made by Catholicism about the Sabbath I can agree that there were a significant number of Christians in the Eastern part of the Church that continued to meet for worship on the Sabbath day, however, NONE of those situations involved Christians failing to observe Sunday as a the primary day of worship, they simply made it a point to go to Church on both Saturday and Sunday. 

 

[stinsonmarri]

On 2/24/2021 at 9:27 AM, Gregory Matthews said:

Charles Scriven, writing in an article in SPECTRUM has proposed a new look at the observance of the Sabbath.  See:

https://spectrummagazine.org/views/2021/time-start-over-reconceiving-sabbath-new-case-seventh-day

NOTE:  The following quote is a small part of the article.

The Sabbath was never a day of rest, it was a day of worship and celebration. Shaw-bath' is a verb and Sabbath is a noun. Shawbath mean to desist or to stop working. YAHWEH stated what stop and to do:

 Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth? declare, if thou hast understanding.  Who hath laid the measures thereof, if thou knowest? or who hath stretched the line upon it? Whereupon are the foundations thereof fastened? or who laid the cornerstone thereof;  When the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of ELOHIYM shouted for joy? Job 38:4-6

For as the new heavens and the New earth, which I will make, shall remain before ME, saith YAHWEH, so shall your seed and your name remain.   And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one Sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before ME, saith YAHWEH. Isa 66:22, 23 

The Bible makes it plain that the Sabbath is for celebration and Worship. Men changed the word sawbath to the word rested and it is not correct. THE ALMIGHTY ONES do not need to rest. Revelation says:

And the four beasts had each of them six wings about him; and they were full of eyes within: and they rest not day and night, saying, HOLY, HOLY, HOLY, YAHWEH EL SHADDAI, which WAS, and IS, and IS TO COME. Rev 4:8

My plea is to read your Bible!

Happy Sabbath!

[Gustave]

15 minutes ago, stinsonmarri said:

The Sabbath was never a day of rest, it was a day of worship and celebration. Shaw-bath' is a verb and Sabbath is a noun. Shawbath mean to desist or to stop working. YAHWEH stated what stop and to do:

 

Happy Sabbath!

Afraid you have that backwards. I'm wondering what you aren't an expert in? 

 

[Theophilus]

Marri. Look at the last line on all of these. More verses at the link

 

KJ21

but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord thy God: In it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, nor thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thine ox, nor thine ass, nor any of thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates, that thy manservant and thy maidservant may rest as well as thou.

ASV

but the seventh day is a sabbath unto Jehovah thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, nor thy man-servant, nor thy maid-servant, nor thine ox, nor thine ass, nor any of thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates; that thy man-servant and thy maid-servant may rest as well as thou.

AMP

but the seventh day is a Sabbath [a day of rest dedicated] to the Lord your God; on that day you shall not do any work, you or your son or your daughter or your male servant or your female servant or your ox or your donkey or any of your livestock or the stranger who stays inside your [city] gates, so that your male servant and your female servant may rest as well as you.

AMPC

But the seventh day is a Sabbath to the Lord your God; in it you shall not do any work, you or your son or your daughter, or your manservant or your maidservant, or your ox or your donkey or any of your livestock, or the stranger or sojourner who is within your gates, that your manservant and your maidservant may rest as well as you.

BRG

But the seventh day is the sabbath of the Lord thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, nor thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thine ox, nor thine ass, nor any of thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates; that thy manservant and thy maidservant may rest as well as thou.

CSB

but the seventh day is a Sabbath to the Lord your God. Do not do any work—you, your son or daughter, your male or female slave, your ox or donkey, any of your livestock, or the resident alien who lives within your city gates, so that your male and female slaves may rest as you do.

CEB

but the seventh day is a Sabbath to the Lord your God. Don’t do any work on it—not you, your sons or daughters, your male or female servants, your oxen or donkeys or any of your animals, or the immigrant who is living among you—so that your male and female servants can rest just like you.

 

 

 

https://www.biblegateway.com/verse/en/Deuteronomy 5:14

[stinsonmarri]

17 hours ago, Gustave said:

Afraid you have that backwards. I'm wondering what you aren't an expert in? 

 

Please do me a kind favor, stop telling what you think. Tell what the Bible says:

 Examine me, O Yahweh, and prove me; try my reins and my heart. Ps 26:2

Prove all things, hold fast that which is good. 1Th 5:21 WOY

 but prove all things, hold fast the right; 1Th 5:21 DARBY

rested H7673 -shâbath Verb (Heb) shaw-bath' (Phonetic Spelling)

Definition; to cease, desist, rest(Qal)

to cease

to rest, desist (from labour)

(Niphal) to cease

(Hiphil)

to cause to cease, put an end to

to exterminate, destroy

to cause to desist from

to remove

to cause to fail -  The Hebrew lexicon is Brown, Driver, Briggs, Gesenius Lexicon

Desist: stop, cease, quit, discontinue, to suspend or cause to suspend activity. Miriam Webster Dictionary

And the heavens and the earth were finished, and all their host.  And on the seventh day ELOHIYM completed HIS Work which HE had Made. And HE (stop, cease, quit to suspend) on the seventh day from all His work which He had made. Gen 2:1, 2

Repos (v.1) : "lie at rest," mid-15c., from Old French reposer, earlier repauser (10c.), from Late Latin repausare "cause to rest," from Latin re-, here probably an intensive prefix (see re-), +Late Latin pausare "to stop" (see pause (v.) Etymology Online Dictionary

The word Shabbath first introduce:

And it came about on the sixth day, they gathered double bread, two omers for one. And all the leaders of the congregation came and reported to Moses. And he said to them, That is what YAHWEH said, Tomorrow is a *(shabbâthôn which means a special Holy or Convocation A HOLY Sabbath to YAHWEH. What you will bake, bake. And boil what you will boil. And lay up for yourselves all that is left over, to keep it until the morning. Ex 16:22, 23

Before we can introduce the noun Shabbath, the Hebrew word shabbathon must first be discuss. This word is a noun, yet a false interpretation of the meaning has change and now is even hidden on the web browser. Strong tries to introduce as  From H7676; a sabbatism or special holiday: Brown-Driver-Briggs- rest, sabbath. noun masculine sabbath observance, sabbatism

The Jewish Society who continual publish revised versions. The two I have have various meanings:

1917 Version

And he said unto them: ‘This is  that  which  the  LORD   hath  spoken: To-morrow is a solemn rest, a holy sabbath   unto   the   LORD.  Bake   that which ye will bake, and seethe that which ye will seethe; and all that remaineth over lay up for you to be kept  until  the  morning.’ Ex 16:23

Six days shall work be done; but on the seventh day is a sabbath of solemn rest, a holy convocation; ye shall do no manner of work; it is a sabbath unto the LORD  in all your dwellings. Lev: 23:3

And the LORD spoke unto Moses, saying: Speak unto the children of Israel, saying: In the seventh month, in the first day of the month, shall be a solemn rest unto you, a *memorial proclaimed with the blast of horns, a holy convocation. Ye shall do no manner of servile work; and ye shall bring an offering made by fire unto the LORD. Lev23: 24-25

1985 Version

He said to  them, "This is what the LORD meant: Tomorrow is a day of rest, A HOLY Sabbath of  the LORD. Bake  what you would bake and boil  what you would boil;  and all that is left put aside to  be  kept  until  morning." Ex 16:23

You shall do no work; (Sabbathon is missing) it shall be a (HOLY is missing) Sabbath of the LORD throughout your settlements. Lev: 23:3

The LORD spoke to Moses, saying: Speak to the Israelite people thus: In the seventh month, on the  first day  of the month, you shall observe complete rest,  a sacred occasion  (Memorial is missing)commemorated with loud blasts. You shall not work at your occupations; and you  shall  bring an offering by fire to the LORD. 23: 24-25

It is amazing that the word Shabbathon is use when it come to the Shabbath to mean a "solemn rest." Now, what on earth does that mean? How can your rest be solemn, because I show would like someone to demonstrate that to me! Now check out the Seventh month here it is actually used corrected which does mean a special sacred (HOLY) occasion! Here how deception works, Shabbathon a noun miraculously comes from a verb in Hebrew!

 

 

Grammatical Tools: Hebrew uses nouns for other functions within the sentence. They can be used as adjectives, adverbs, prepositions, conjunctions, etc. The noun עקב sense of "what has been said" is on the "heel" of what is "about to be said."         

 Hebrew language is an action-oriented language rather than descriptive, it is prolific with verbs. When a Hebrew verb is conjugated in a sentence it identifies person, number, gender, tense, mood and voice. Understanding these different aspects of a verb, while not essential for proper Biblical interpretation, it is very helpful when learning how to translate the Hebrew text. The AHRC Website

The Shabbath was first introduce in Ex Chapter 16 and it was told to the IsraELites how to keep the Shabbath because it HOLY unto YAHWEH. Flesh Beings over the years have tried to transpose and transliterate words to fit in both the Greek and most of all the Latin. The languages were confound at Babel or Babylon but they still had a common tread nouns, verbs and vowels. The Phoenicians master the language by simplified the Egyptians Hieroglyphic into 22 letter symbols. Indo-Europeans today want to tell you how they want you to accept Phoenicians letters and meaning base on systematic racism. Many Afrikan Scholars starting in the early 50's moved away from the false teaching that was force on Afrikan slaves. No more, we can read and we can decipher better our own languages then the Europeans. No, you do like to hear this but truth and justice is alive and it will be heard! So, here you come playing the word expert, how ridiculous!

For years you hidden the fact that a black mathematicians women call compters who worked for NASA and one saved John Glenn's life by being able to land him safely back to earth.

Long before today’s technology was invented, Katherine Johnson was known as a computer. She calculated flight trajectories, by hand, for the United States space program.

Without the brilliance of a mind like Johnson’s, it’s uncertain whether John Glenn would have pioneered space missions and doubtful Neil Armstrong would have been the first human to step onto the surface of the moon. National Geographic

The difference between you and I beside my History Degree, I study the Bible to show myself approval. I female who need not be ashamed of people who show they do not study but talk what they don't know for themselves! SAD!

 

 

 

[Gregory Matthews]

Stinsonmarri:  I am responding to you telling Gustave that he should stick to the Bible and not state what he thinks.

*  You do exactly that.  You often tell us what you think.

*  You tell us what Strong thinks, which may not be what the Bible is stating.  You do not understand why people have been telling you that is wrong.  IOW, you do not understand the difference between Strong and a lexicon.

*  You cite English dictionaries when you reference a verse first written in Hebrew.

 

I am not wanting to embarrass you by going over a whole list.  But, you often accuse others of doing exactly what you regularly do.

You do post some good stuff that is worthy of consideration.  However, that is often lost in the manner in which you drive people away from thinking about what you have said.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Gustave]

7 hours ago, stinsonmarri said:

 

The difference between you and I beside my History Degree, I study the Bible to show myself approval. I female who need not be ashamed of people who show they do not study but talk what they don't know for themselves! SAD!

 

 

 

 

Well, I'm a 9th level Dwarf Fighter with +9 Battle Axe, Gauntlets of Ogre Power and -6 Armor Class.  Given your educational accomplishments why don't you apply some of that learnin and take a crack at those very straight-forward questions I now, asked you, - multiple times?