The New Jewish Publication Society Tanakh

[Humble Disciple]

On 1/15/2023 at 7:49 PM, GHansen said:

It appears that your connection is to a specific English translation of the Hebrew Bible. One doesn't get connected to the Hebrew Bible by reading an English translation. 

That is one of the most eletist statements I've ever read. Most people cannot read Biblical Hebrew, including many Jews in the English-speaking world, which is exactly why a team of scholars and rabbis, from all three major branches of Judaism, came together to translate the NJPS Tanakh.  

[GHansen]

8 hours ago, Humble Disciple said:

On 1/16/2023 at 11:49 AM, GHansen said:

 

That is one of the most eletist statements I've ever read.

Not sure what is elitist about it. My Hebrew level was about that of a bar mitzvah boy. The text I used in the beginning was actually a book for children. I would hardly claim elite status on that basis. When you say most people can not read Biblical Hebrew, that depends on where you are located. There are certain neighborhoods where many of the people can not only read Biblical Hebrew, they have much of the torah memorized in Hebrew. Many ultra orthodox Jews living in America, often on welfare, can barely understand English but they are quite familiar with Hebrew and Yiddish. Adventism's very own Clifford Goldstein [not on welfare] said he could read Hebrew fluently. Not sure what he meant by "fluently." Apparently, he was not raised as a "religious" Jew but he claims/ed fluency in Hebrew.

Anyway, what you are enamored of is an English translation of the Hebrew text, not the Hebrew text itself. That's fine, not a problem but it's an English translation, not the Hebrew text you are enjoying.

[Humble Disciple]

5 hours ago, GHansen said:

Anyway, what you are enamored of is an English translation of the Hebrew text, not the Hebrew text itself. That's fine, not a problem but it's an English translation, not the Hebrew text you are enjoying.

The term "Hebrew Bible," doesn't mean that it has to be in the original Hebrew. Instead, it's a more neutral term than saying "Old Testament." That's how the term "Hebrew Bible" is commonly used, as a more neutral term than "Old Testament." 

Obviously, the NJPS Tanakh is an English translation. The question is whether or not it's a reliable translation. 

[GHansen]

4 hours ago, Humble Disciple said:

The term "Hebrew Bible," doesn't mean that it has to be in the original Hebrew. Instead, it's a more neutral term than saying "Old Testament." That's how the term "Hebrew Bible" is commonly used, as a more neutral term than "Old Testament."

Sorry. I can't agree with you on that. Considering that the LXX was the OT frequently quoted in the NT, it's actually misleading to say Hebrew Bible instead of "Old Testament."

" The LXX, in Greek, is the OT as far as the NT writers were concerned. Note the following remark."8. Not the Old Testament only, but the Alexandrian version of the Old Testament, has left its mark on every part of the New Testament, even in chapters and books where it is not directly cited 849 . It is not too much to say that in its literary form and expression the New Testament would have been a widely different book had it been written by authors who knew the Old Testament only in the original, or who knew it in a Greek. version other than that of the LXX" (Swete, Intro to the OT in Greek p. 378).

[Humble Disciple]

51 minutes ago, GHansen said:

Sorry. I can't agree with you on that. 

You can use your own definitions, but it doesn't change how a term is commonly used, including by observant Jews in the English-speaking world. Here's just a few examples:

https://bibleproject.com/explore/video/old-testament-tanak/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hebrew_Bible

https://www.britannica.com/topic/Hebrew-Bible

https://www.chabad.org/library/bible_cdo/aid/63255/jewish/The-Bible-with-Rashi.htm

https://www.myjewishlearning.com/article/hebrew-bible/

https://www.sefaria.org/texts/Tanakh

[Humble Disciple]

49 minutes ago, GHansen said:

Sorry. I can't agree with you on that. Considering that the LXX was the OT frequently quoted in the NT, it's actually misleading to say Hebrew Bible instead of "Old Testament."

" The LXX, in Greek, is the OT as far as the NT writers were concerned. Note the following remark."8. Not the Old Testament only, but the Alexandrian version of the Old Testament, has left its mark on every part of the New Testament, even in chapters and books where it is not directly cited 849 . It is not too much to say that in its literary form and expression the New Testament would have been a widely different book had it been written by authors who knew the Old Testament only in the original, or who knew it in a Greek. version other than that of the LXX" (Swete, Intro to the OT in Greek p. 378).

This is what I think of your pseudo-scholarship and intellectual sophistry:

Like a Pharisee, you can say a lot of big words while missing the entire point of a conversation. If you cannot even comprehend the fact that the Old Testament is commonly referred to as the Hebrew Bible, even in English translation, as a more neutral term by both Jews and Christians, that's not my problem. 

[Humble Disciple]

In saying I feel a deeper connection to the Hebrew Bible than I've ever felt before, I am referring to the spirit and deeper meaning of the text, rather than simply the letter. 

2 Corinthians 3:6
Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.

There's also a slew of Bible verses, from both Testaments, that the law is to be written in our hearts, rather than simply on the printed page, no matter what language it happens to be. 

Reading the NJPS Tanakh, which was translated by a team of scholars and rabbis from all three major branches of Judaism, using the traditional Masoretic text, has been a great help to me in this regard. The Bible Project Youtube channel has been an immense help as well:

https://www.youtube.com/@bibleproject

 

[Humble Disciple]

40 minutes ago, Humble Disciple said:

In saying I feel a deeper connection to the Hebrew Bible than I've ever felt before, I am referring to the spirit and deeper meaning of the text, rather than simply the letter. 

2 Corinthians 3:6
Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.

There's also a slew of Bible verses, from both Testaments, that the law is to be written in our hearts, rather than simply on the printed page, no matter what language it happens to be. 

Reading the NJPS Tanakh, which was translated by a team of scholars and rabbis from all three major branches of Judaism, using the traditional Masoretic text, has been a great help to me in this regard. The Bible Project Youtube channel has been an immense help as well:

https://www.youtube.com/@bibleproject

 

In order to get to the deeper meaning, if one cannot read Biblical Hebrew, one has to begin with a dependable translation, and read it consistently until it changes one's heart. I'm more than halfway through reading the Hebrew Bible, and I'm amazed that God actually loves to pardon sinners, rather than simply doing so out of duty. I am learning things about God and myself that I could have never possibly imagined. 

[Humble Disciple]

On 1/15/2023 at 1:55 PM, phkrause said:

https://www.chabad.org/library/bible_cdo/aid/63255/jewish/The-Bible-with-Rashi.htm

That is the Judaica Press edition of the Tanack, translated and published by Orthodox Jews. I haven't read it, so I don't have much to say about it. One thing I like about the NJPS Tanack is that it was translated by a team of scholars and rabbis from all three major branches of Judaism. 

[Humble Disciple]

Please keep in mind that I am not a Biblical scholar. I am reading through the Old Testament or Hebrew Bible from beginning to end for the first time in my life, and I'm now on Zephaniah.

In searching for a translation that is both the most accurate and easy to read, I found the New Jewish Publication Society Tanakh, which happened to also be recommended to me by a local rabbi. 

If there happens to be a translation that is more dependable, please share it with me. At this time, I am only interested in reading a Jewish translation based on the traditional Masoretic text. 

[Humble Disciple]

Now that I am more than halfway done with the NJPS Tanakh, God is also more real to me than ever before.

Rather than an abstract concept, we worship a God who acts in history and never abandons His people. 

[phkrause]

On 1/19/2023 at 12:57 PM, Humble Disciple said:

If there happens to be a translation that is more dependable,

Not sure exactly what your after, but I've read the Bible thru a number of times, and each time with a different version. Each one has its uniqueness to it. From must of the theologians or pastors I know, pretty much all say that the King James is the closest to the original!! Whatever that means?? Personally I don't like the KJV! I do like the NKJV, the NASB, NIV, CJB, the Living Bible, the Clear Word, the New Living Translation, a few others which I don't recall at the moment. Right now I'm reading the New English Bible with the Apocrypha. I've never read the Message Bible. Obviously some are just paraphrase Bibles!! Oh yea there is one other Bible I've read thru, the Chronological Study Bible (NKJV). I really enjoyed that one!!

[Humble Disciple]

14 hours ago, phkrause said:

Not sure exactly what your after, but I've read the Bible thru a number of times, and each time with a different version. Each one has its uniqueness to it. From must of the theologians or pastors I know, pretty much all say that the King James is the closest to the original!! Whatever that means?? Personally I don't like the KJV! I do like the NKJV, the NASB, NIV, CJB, the Living Bible, the Clear Word, the New Living Translation, a few others which I don't recall at the moment. Right now I'm reading the New English Bible with the Apocrypha. I've never read the Message Bible. Obviously some are just paraphrase Bibles!! Oh yea there is one other Bible I've read thru, the Chronological Study Bible (NKJV). I really enjoyed that one!!

Thank you for your response. At this time of my life, I am only interested in reading a Jewish translation of the Hebrew Bible or Old Testament, though I have no interest in converting to Judaism. My reason for reading a Jewish translation is that it's based on the traditional Hebrew Masoretic text and it's free of Christian bias. Right now, I am on the Book of Zechariah. 

[Kevin H]

I love reading the JPS TANAK. I believe that all "Old Testaments" are based on the Masoretic text. But I do love the scholarly Biblical Theology insights by our Jewish brothers and sisters. They are a very useful voice in our study of the Bible; and the JPS is enjoyable to read. 

I wish I could read Hebrew. There is so much richness that we can get from the Hebrew that are only bits and pieces in both translations, commentary and even in the reading of those who are blessed enough to have a working knowledge of Hebrew. Things like rhythms, nuances,  poetic forms; probably many of these that have not yet come to our knowledge.  The JPS TANAK, especially in their study version helps to point out things. Everett Fox has tried to give to English some of the rhythms  and word patterns. Robert Alta gives amazing insights. The salvation message is there in all translations. But the richness is enough for us to study through out eternity. And starting this process on earth is a blessing!!!

As I mentioned before, I do not like the terms "Old" and "New" Testament. The "New" Testament is actually older than the "Old" since it is the writing of God's character of love, the law on our hearts. We find this in the promise of the seed who although was coming, was still there and while the woman's desire will be for her husband, despite the pain of childbirth, she (and her husband) was to be ruled over by this promised "He".  The "Old" Testament was how God had to work with ignorant slaves. Deuteronomy was the renewal of the "New Testament".  What I like to use, and hope becomes more recognizable is the term TANAKA or TANAKGA for of course Torah, Prophets, Writings, Apostolic (or Gospel, Apostolic)

Sadly, too much of Christianity has confused our religion with salvation. Being saved through Jesus is WHO HE IS, developing a relationship with God as personal friend. But too often we try to force the religion "Christianity" giving a history lesson on what Jesus did on earth on to others, especially our Jewish brothers and sisters, instead of encouraging them to understand the amazing truth that they already have and using that for developing the love relationship with God as their personal friend. Seventh-day Adventists sometimes double this mistake in how we preach the three angels message. Our pioneers came to realize that there is a deep richness if we study deeper and deeper into Revelation 14. However, instead of digging for the treasure, too often we have built over the text a temple to our church. Yet, there is a lot in our church which is so contrary to this temple: Our focus on religious liberty for example, and also in the 1800s and early 1900s our missionaries in Europe offered to the European Jewish communities a Jewish version of Seventh-day Adventism. I'd love to see us going back to this. 

Christianity has the advantage of knowing specifics about our wonderful friend; but it is that friendship that we are saved by, and the Bible from the get go starts teaching that relationship. The JPS TANAK does a wonderful job introducing the Holy One to us. And helps to teach us and encourage us into digging deeper into the text. Once we more fully embrace this digging deeper into the text, and understand the focus onto who the Holy One is, and thus in Christian language become more Christ centered seeing Christianity as a tool to share Him instead of worshiping the religion, and as we think more about our embrace of liberty of conscience. And as we apply these deeper things to dig into Revelation 14 we will see amazing things.   

[Humble Disciple]

If anyone is looking for a good source of commentary, aside from the writings of Ellen White, the Bible Project YouTube page is very good. It has commentary on every book of the Bible, on both Testaments. 

[phkrause]

Do you guys have a physical copy or read it on line??

[Humble Disciple]

15 hours ago, phkrause said:

Do you guys have a physical copy or read it on line??

I have a physical copy of the New Jewish Publication Society Tanakh. I found it on https://www.bookfinder.com/

It can be read online at https://www.sefaria.org/texts/Tanakh

[Humble Disciple]

I know I mentioned this before, but the NJPS Tanakh gives alternative readings from the Septuagint and the Syriac in the footnotes, whenever they differ from the Masoretic text. 

[phkrause]

On 1/23/2023 at 11:32 AM, Humble Disciple said:

I have a physical copy of the New Jewish Publication Society Tanakh. I found it on https://www.bookfinder.com/

Went to this website and got this message when searching for "New Jewish Publication Society Tanakh"

Sorry, we found no matching results at this time   Did you put a different search or use the name for this book??

Anyway, I did another search on Amazon and they had this Bible!!

[Humble Disciple]

1 hour ago, phkrause said:

Went to this website and got this message when searching for "New Jewish Publication Society Tanakh"

Sorry, we found no matching results at this time   Did you put a different search or use the name for this book??

Anyway, I did another search on Amazon and they had this Bible!!

https://www.bookfinder.com/search/?full=on&ac=sl&st=sl&ref=bf_s2_a1_t1_1&qi=k9ZI8BVozfiB1zh7Waxk1c39Wpo_1674591832_1:91:45

Under these search results, the correct title to purchase is Tanack: The Holy Scriptures, the JPS Tanakh or the Jewish Publication Society Tanakh. 

[phkrause]

On 1/24/2023 at 3:27 PM, Humble Disciple said:

Under these search results, the correct title to purchase is Tanack: The Holy Scriptures, the JPS Tanakh or the Jewish Publication Society Tanakh. 

Thanks