Is Bible thumping really necessary?

[rudywoofs (Pam)]

I don't know how to explain my question without it sounding like I'm *anti-Bible* or having some other label stuck on me for asking.

Sometimes it seems that when asked questions regarding nearly ANYTHING, some people come back at me with a text from the Bible. Repeatedly. That's okay...sorta. I don't mind reading a text that someone gives me. But that text does not necessarily give me guidance or a solution. I'll read the text, see the context, and see it has absolutely nothing to do with *my* situtation or problem.

Is is really so hard to try and come up with a *human* perspective on a problem? And PLEASE, don't tell me *that's* only 2nd best to God's perspective....I KNOW God's way is best. But God's way is NOT always apparent. Not to me, anyways. Perhaps it *is* to others.

But eventually Bible thumping does become annoying. Saying something louder or longer is not going to make anything clearer.

Just like I know this post probably seems clear as mud...

[Tom Wetmore]

No Pam, you are quite clear to me. But that may be because I am on the same wave length on this point. I share your frustration when seeking for some intellectual engagement, honest and in-depth discussion, I am met with a rote recital of Scripture with no original thoughts offered. (Even worse, dare I say, is the EGW recital response... :: )And it's not that I am anti-Bible, by any stretch of the imagination. But too often it comes across as passive pablum of placating platitudes. (Ya' got to love a good alliteration once in awhile!) It sometimes seems as meaningfully engaging as cliché greeting/response "Hi, how are you?" "Fine." Such things are done without disturbing a single brain cell. And too often I perceive it to be done for the same dismissive, if not a little condescending, let's-not-talk-about-it-end-of-discussion purpose.

And yes, I do know that most who do this probably mean well and find comfort and guidance in Scripture. I do too. But I can and have read it myself. The point of the forum is not to simply serve as a concordance of comfort or a Scripture recital hall, but as a place for interpersonal engagement, intellectual stimulation and in depth discussion/testimony/experience about life.

OK brace yourself...

Tom

[Norman Byers, N.D.]

Hi Pam,

I am learning to do less of this. With some people my BT comes naturally. With others I use the Bible and SOP to help them see my point. I have been hard on some folks though and I think at times that's ok.

When you read the Bible Jesus was always explaining things to the Disciples but speaking in parables to others. I remember reading through John one time and thinking, "Man Jesus is always on the Pharisees" It's like He didn't let up on them.

I have learned that with some people that is the only way to talk to them because if you do otherwise they think you're agreeing or approving what they say, or are doing.

That is not good for them they need to hear the truth, no matter how much it grates them.

All said, there is a time and a season for everything that is under the sun. I just need to be in tune with people and the Spirit to know when when to plant and when to pluck, when to embrace and when to refrain.

Norman

[Nan]

Sometimes especially when comfort or hope is needed, the Bible verses are most helpful. But I agree that trying to stifle all discussion with a tersely quoted verse (I can rhyme even if not alliteratively!!) is a distinct turn off to further conversation or study.

[Clio]

That's why you never find texts in my posts. It's all Bible based and I can back it up... but there's no point in thumping the Bible.

[Robert]

That's why you never find texts in my posts. It's all Bible based and I can back it up... but there's no point in thumping the Bible.

To all:

If one says his/her view of things is Bible based, but quote no Bible...then what's the point? The Bible should be quoted or else we can make it say anything we like! After all this is a Christian forum.

[Bravus]

The Bible is a love letter, not a hammer. Quotes can be used either way... as we would share a treasured phrase from a love letter with our closest friend, or as the hammer we use to smash opposition to our own position. To me, it's the way the Bible is used that determines whether it feels like a communion or an assault.

[rudywoofs (Pam)]

Quote:

Tom Wetmore said

passive pablum of placating platitudes

I love a good alliteration! Especially when it is true.

Thanks all, for your comments. My own *take* is that if someone asks me a question, spiritual or no, I try to give an answer that I feel is *given* to me. I am not a theologian (obviously) and do not know where to find Bible texts on the spot - which may or may not be applicable.

It is just very frustrating to me to ask a question and be spiritually silenced by biblical buckshot.

I SO appreciate it when somebody takes the trouble to answer *from the heart* - in human terms - in understandable terms - in relatable terms... That is so very helpful. Makes a big difference when it seems like someone understands.

[Neil D]

Originally Posted By: Clio

That's why you never find texts in my posts. It's all Bible based and I can back it up... but there's no point in thumping the Bible.

To all:

If one says his/her view of things is Bible based, but quote no Bible...then what's the point? The Bible should be quoted or else we can make it say anything we like! After all this is a Christian forum.

Robert....

Let me put in my $0.02 worth of wisdom....

Most of the questions that come to us are from the human heart...not a biblical heart. If we wanted a biblical answer, we would search the bible and recieve an answer.... But most of the human heart questions are asking questions of relationship, or to explain/confuse this better, human experience needing guidance from another human who has the bible guiding them and desiring human words to explain the human experience...not biblical words to explain human experience. While there are human experiences in the bible, David's psalms comes to mind, many of the most popular are already known...

Ok, I've probably been vague enough, and thuroughly confusing...I need to quit...

[David Koot]

Most of the questions that come to us are from the human heart...not a biblical heart . . . But most of the human heart questions are asking questions of relationship, or to explain/confuse this better, human experience needing guidance from another human who has the bible guiding them and desiring human words to explain the human experience

I think that is absolutely correct. It certainly is true in my line of work. In many cases, the 'proof-text' approach does not meet the need. There are often pressing, personal issues people have, and they are looking for hope and encouragement. Ministry, IMO, is, or should be more concerned and involved with such things. The Bible is often distant for people. I think they need someone to show personal interest and care about them. In the process, one may point them to Jesus, and to such Scriptural promises and principles as may be helpful.

Dave

[Norman Byers, N.D.]

Hi David,

as I'm sure someone may have already mentioned, I believe that both are needed. It's not an either or situation at all times. Sometimes it's good and right to just talk and share or listen. Sometimes it's good and right to share scripture and SOP if the person is willing. Sometimes both are needed, but in all cases the communication should come from the heart or from a principle that will be seen and experienced as caring, and sometimes that may not be pleasant.

Norman

[D. Allan]

Just tacking on here: I like the way CoAspen put it.

Quote:

Personal experience, not proof texts, are the best method of helping others. By that, I mean our experienceing of the relationship with God. What ever way you choose to study the Bible and learn will be assisted by the HS. I have come to rely less on what is said by others and more by what they do. SDA's love to disect texts, split hairs, expound on theology, etc. We have studied the Jews so much that our approach to God is often much like the theologians of Christ day.

If we allow the Bible to have any authority over our lives then a study or discussion as Dave K. and I had about Col. 2 is useful. Other wise our study is more like a game of chess. How to beat your opponant in the fewest moves. Or a boxing match. Thump! Thump!

Well, I learned from Col. (the entire book) that Jesus is much more important than any Sabbath, wheather a yearly one, a monthly one, or weekly ones! It really sets me free! (waiting for a few thumps now)

~d.allan

[Clio]

Originally Posted By: Clio

That's why you never find texts in my posts. It's all Bible based and I can back it up... but there's no point in thumping the Bible.

To all:

If one says his/her view of things is Bible based, but quote no Bible...then what's the point? The Bible should be quoted or else we can make it say anything we like! After all this is a Christian forum.

And why would you choose a love-letter like the Bible to, in effect, beat someone about the head and shoulders with a pious, mealy-mouthed attitude, instead of answering from a heart of compassion in accordance with what the Bible teaches?

If someone wants to know the exact texts one can always supply them... at least I can.

Without beating them up with the Bible.

[olger]

Just quoting scripture to someone in pain will not help them, but showing a person how to apply the truth of God's word to their heart will change us dramatically. Too many Adventists have an intellectual locked heart. I used to be one...

On the other hand, if a person desires conversation devoid of Biblical references, one wonders why.

This is olger signing off.

[Robert]

And why would you choose a love-letter like the Bible to, in effect, beat someone about the head and shoulders with a pious, mealy-mouthed attitude, instead of answering from a heart of compassion in accordance with what the Bible teaches?

Love letter?

Deuteronomy 3:3 So the LORD our God also gave into our hands Og king of Bashan and all his army. We struck them down, leaving no survivors. 4 At that time we took all his cities...6 We completely destroyed them, as we had done with Sihon king of Heshbon, destroying every city—men, women and children. 7 But all the livestock and the plunder from their cities we carried off for ourselves.

Like I said...talk is cheap. Better to understand the Word.....

[olger]

hmmm

[Clio]

Originally Posted By: Clio

And why would you choose a love-letter like the Bible to, in effect, beat someone about the head and shoulders with a pious, mealy-mouthed attitude, instead of answering from a heart of compassion in accordance with what the Bible teaches?

Love letter?

Like I said...talk is cheap. Better to understand the Word.....

Sure proof text me... it's a perfect example. Now take the Bible as a whole.

From Genesis to Revelation, the entire compendium of that book is the total, self-less love of our Creator for His Created ones. It records our failures, His Sorrowing over them, and the punishments meted out, but it also records consistently, throughout it's pages, His tremendous Love for each of us, if we will only listen and do it His way.

The Book is a love letter to the fallen race of Humanity, telling each and every human of Abba's love for us, His desires and plans to bring us good and not evil if we will only choose Him, the Source of all Life.

If you cannot see the Bible as a love-letter, You have missed the most important theme of the entire compendium of books.

[Neil D]

Quote:

From Genesis to Revelation, the entire compendium of that book is the total, self-less love of our Creator for His Created ones. It records our failures, His Sorrowing over them, and the punishments meted out, but it also records consistently, throughout it's pages, His tremendous Love for each of us, if we will only listen and do it His way.

The Book is a love letter to the fallen race of Humanity, telling each and every human of Abba's love for us, His desires and plans to bring us good and not evil if we will only choose Him, the Source of all Life.

Works for me! :tu :tu

Me too!