Stan Posted December 2, 2007 Posted December 2, 2007 A general answer to some PM's Forcing someone to apologizes or suspend their membership is not something from the heart..... is it? suspend Sounds like something parents/teachers did when we were kids... :) Quote If you receive benefit to being here please help out with expenses. https://www.paypal.me/clubadventist Administrator of a few websites like https://adventistdating.com
cricket Posted December 3, 2007 Posted December 3, 2007 ?? *wonders what prompted this question* Quote
Clio Posted December 3, 2007 Posted December 3, 2007 A general answer to some PM's Forcing someone to apologizes or suspend thier membership is not something from the heart..... is it? suspend Sounds like something parents/teachers did when we were kids... Forced apologies tend toward meaninglessness anyway. Quote A heart where He alone has first place.
Woody Posted December 3, 2007 Posted December 3, 2007 I would take it a step further ... apologizes in general are worthless unless they are followed up by a genuine change in behavior, attitude, and heart. This is accomplished by gaining an understanding and respect of each other. Apologizes CAN be a first and necessary START. But it Must come from the heart. Once an apology is given ... it should start a dialogue on the issue so that a sound understanding can be established. This would prevent a further occurance from happening. Too often I see that people want to just make these worthless apologizes without really understanding each other. What happens then is that nothing changes and the incident re-occurs. And bad feelings are solidly formed due to a lack of real understanding and acceptance of each other. Perhaps instead of forced apologizes ... I might suggest that Admin facilitate with volunteers agreed upon ... a dialogue between those offended. I will volunteer my time for anyone who wants me. I know that Admin does not have the time. But perhaps we can make a list of volunteers who would be willing to facilitate such a dialogue. Any volunteers? I have to believe that there are others who have been trained as I have in this area. Come Forth .......... Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology.
Members rudywoofs (Pam) Posted December 3, 2007 Members Posted December 3, 2007 Maybe some biblical scribes who were writing down the scripture got the word wrong. Instead of becoming more like God, we are to become more like dogs. They never require an apology. They love you no matter what you do or say. Quote Pam Meddle Not In the Affairs of Dragons; for You Are Crunchy and Taste Good with Ketchup. If we all sang the same note in the choir, there'd never be any harmony. Funny, isn't it, how we accept Grace for ourselves and demand justice for others?
Woody Posted December 3, 2007 Posted December 3, 2007 Maybe you have something Pam. God in the mirror is Dog. My loving dog and god never force me to apologize. Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology.
Administrators Tom Wetmore Posted December 4, 2007 Administrators Posted December 4, 2007 :smilewink: Yep, and I have often suggested that based on the usual perfectionist theology of perfect obedience many dogs measure up since they don't lie cheat steal, etc. Quote "Absurdity reigns and confusion makes it look good." "Sinless perfection is such a shallow goal." "I love God only as much as the person I love the least." *Forgiveness is always good news. And that is the gospel truth. (And finally, the ideas expressed above are solely my person views and not that of any organization with which I am associated.)
Woody Posted December 4, 2007 Posted December 4, 2007 Good one Tom. My dog is more like god than I knew. He would probably make a better SDA than me. Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology.
olger Posted December 4, 2007 Posted December 4, 2007 Originally Posted By: Stan Jensen A general answer to some PM's Forcing someone to apologizes or suspend thier membership is not something from the heart..... is it? suspend Sounds like something parents/teachers did when we were kids... Forced apologies tend toward meaninglessness anyway. I agree, Sister. Quote "Please don't feed the drama queens.."
CyberGuy Posted December 4, 2007 Posted December 4, 2007 If people have a problem with someone they should just them Quote Riverside CA
David Koot Posted December 4, 2007 Posted December 4, 2007 I have been quite busy elsewhere, and am out of the loop, so not sure what the issue is that Stan is talking about. However, generally speaking, I would think that 'apologies' may necessarily involve communication and possibly mediation. Issues certainly do arise between individuals which, alone, may need to be resolved. But WAY beyond that level, is a situation where others choose sides, and thus you have a state of war. But I don't think God is in that. Satan loves to divide and conquer. The very process of choosing sides plays right into his plan to destroy. Thus, as far as individuals who may have issues with someone else or others, yes, such issues need to be addressed equitably and even-handedly, which can be helped, as Redwood mentioned, by the involvement of a mediator. As far as others outside those individuals, one would think they would do well to stay out of it, and not take sides. It is intriguing to observe situations where it does take place, however. I notice that often, the choosing of sides is based on more than the immediate issue. Far better is Paul the apostle's counsel to seek those things that bring peace and unity, and be careful not to pass judgment on someone else. Dave Quote
Stan Posted December 4, 2007 Author Posted December 4, 2007 If people have a problem with someone they should just them Seems so simple..... HOWEVER... Quote If you receive benefit to being here please help out with expenses. https://www.paypal.me/clubadventist Administrator of a few websites like https://adventistdating.com
Moderators lazarus Posted December 4, 2007 Moderators Posted December 4, 2007 I think, Stan, (I guess you already do this) you should encourage individuals to communicate directly with the "problem" individual. This often makes the person demanding the apology back off because very often folks are not really concerned with reconciliation but with being right. Its should be bad form to complain about an individual to Admin without talking to the individual first. When someone complains to you, your first response should be "have you spoken to "fred" about it?" It will save lot of time and foolishness. Quote Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence. Einstein
Neil D Posted December 4, 2007 Posted December 4, 2007 Ok, Ok, I'm sorry I kicked the dog this morning...I didn't mean to. But he was right there laying at my feet and I kinda kicked him before I tripped over him...I'm sorry, OK??? Signed Neil [who is laiden with guilt] Quote Democracy is a device that ensures we shall be governed no better than we deserve. George Bernard Shaw
Guest charis Posted December 4, 2007 Posted December 4, 2007 aww..lt's okay Neil. Just talk to Fred, as Laz suggested... Quote
Woody Posted December 4, 2007 Posted December 4, 2007 Quote: Its should be bad form to complain about an individual to Admin without talking to the individual first. This is actually a sin against God. And we know from other threads that this can get your kicked out of the church. So, it should also get you kicked out of the CA fellowship. Blessings ........... Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology.
Guest charis Posted December 4, 2007 Posted December 4, 2007 maybe we should have a forum Sheriff Quote
Woody Posted December 4, 2007 Posted December 4, 2007 I volunteer Charis. She is one good gun posting Sheriff. Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology.
David Koot Posted December 4, 2007 Posted December 4, 2007 Redwood, my good friend, I would simply suggest that whomever you nominate to be 'forum sheriff,' make sure that s/he sets a good example of interacting with others, and makes any apologies which s/he may need to make, before beginning that duty. A 'forum sheriff' should be the first to apologize and welcome mediation if s/he has wronged others. I would nominate you for the position. You have set a good example on that score. Dave Quote
Woody Posted December 5, 2007 Posted December 5, 2007 Thanks Dave. I think there are many here who would qualify. But I also see that some are very resistive to following Matt.18 yet they preach the loudest about how we need to follow the Bible and particularly Ellen G. White. According to the Bible we are to do all we can ... to do our part with Matt.18 ... but if someone persists in rejecting the Biblical injunctions ... then we have to go on our way and treat them as a Heathen . Unfortunately ... there are some who qualify here at CA. I can personally testify to that. I am sure you can also. But I guess all we can do is pray for these people. The Bible may seem harsh but this IS what the Bible tells us to do. These are not my words ... they are scripture. There must be a reason for this. Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology.
David Koot Posted December 5, 2007 Posted December 5, 2007 Good question, Redwood. What to do? What if a person refuses? Well, Mt. 18 mentions the next step as bringing along one or two others, and then, if that does not help, to take it to the church or group. Seems to me like those steps should be followed. And, Jesus did say, "If your brother offend you, rebuke him. If he repents, forgive him." The picture I see here is one of being assertive in a Christian way. I recently sent a nine-page letter to the president of a Union Conference, asking for mediation with a Conference officer. I followed up with several telephone conversations. He was supposed to talk to the man, and get back to me in a few days. That was a couple of weeks ago. Still haven't heard back. I am now mulling over my next step. I don't think it would be good to just let it be. There needs to be a remedy. Not sure what it is yet, though. I will probably seek counsel on that one. Whatever the group or organization, Redwood, by all means, I would say, be assertive in the way Jesus prescribed, and make an effort to deal with the issues. I'm sure there comes a time when a person has done all he or she can do, and then needs to leave things be. No doubt that may be different for each situation. It can be truly frustrating to not get resolution and reconciliation. It needs to happen. If I can ever be of service, let me know. Dave Quote
Guest charis Posted December 5, 2007 Posted December 5, 2007 So...let's have a game called "Who's the Heathen?" Those who say they preach the gospel that Jesus taught can be the panel members. Among the contestants will be *heathens* chosen by those who seem to be able to discern such disgusting humans. **cough** The rest of the forum can be the audience. The prize can be chosen from Door #1, Door #2, or Door #3. The prizes will vary from a set of EGW books, listening to a sermon by your favorite preacher, or a short course in heathenology. **snorts and walks away** Quote
David Koot Posted December 5, 2007 Posted December 5, 2007 Oh, by the way, Redwood, I forgot to respond to one other thing you brought up. 'Treat them as a heathen.' To a devout Jew, I believe that would mean having nothing to do with them. Interesting thought. So, Jesus says first try to make things right. If a person refuses to make things right, and won't listen to others as well about it, then treat him or her as a heathen. Not that God has given up on the person, but some act of accountability apparently needs to be done. Dave Quote
LifeHiscost Posted December 5, 2007 Posted December 5, 2007 Blessings ........... Are you positive, Redwood? Quote Lift Jesus up!!
LifeHiscost Posted December 5, 2007 Posted December 5, 2007 then treat him or her as a heathen. Dave Seems there is more than one way to treat a person as a heathen, one being, "But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;" Matthew 5:44 KJV Regards! Quote Lift Jesus up!!
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