Fixing the behavior of others..

[Stan]

Wonder why so many try that? Especially from a confrontation view?

I remember one situation, where someone gave their opinion on members of the opposite sex, I think his name was Sam, or old Abe, not sure which. People from here actually called his pastor to have him removed as elder, or deacon.

WHY would people do that? Just like GWB, "those women wear things over their face" " we must bomb them until they become like us", well that is an overstatement, but you get the point.

[Woody]

Makes one wonder how anyone could feel free to give an opinion here unless they have maintained strict confidentiality.

What a shame. From Redwood ... (Which is not my real name in case you wondered.)

[CyberGuy]

It does give weight to NEVER give to many facts about oneself on this or any other Internet Forum.

NEVER tell people your full name

NEVER tell people where you live

NEVER tell people where you work.

To many people try to take their revenge out on the person in his real life world. Violating the unwritten rule of What is said and done on this forum STAYS on this forum.

I used to be very open about who I am and where I work and live. No longer. If one is open they cannot be very controversal on this forum or risk retailiation in his or her real life in his or her job or church. That is a sad commentary on this and any internet forum.

[Woody]

I understand what you are saying. But I would just say it is a symptom of the world we live in.

It's called ... believe as I do or pay.

[CyberGuy]

In 1995 when the womens ordination was defeated some churches went and ordained their women pastors anyway. Many people spoke in favor of that and there was some who were pastors who approved of what was done. Some people tried to get those men fired. One even tried to get GC Presidential who was Folkenburg our GC president at the time to dis fellowship the entire church.

This forum was made for the free discussion of ideas within the church. It turned into a place to brawl and dirty fighting and namecalling and people threatening each other both in their real lives and threatening them with eternal damnation etc. As if they had any say in that matter. LOL

Anyway the church closed down the compuserve forum and the internet forum as a result of the infighting.

Sad to say things have not changed. People offering vague threats against ones job is happening far to often. Even a suggestion that ones employor may not like it for posting on company time is an implied threat. Good Grief who is to say the person is on vacation or worked different hours than during the day or is self employed.

One person even had a person phone his pastor and demanded that the person be disfellowshiped for what they said on the adventist forum. GOOD GRIEF. As if the pastor would even take that kind of demand seriously.

[Woody]

Quote:

One even tried to get GC Presidential who was Folkenburg our GC president at the time to dis fellowship the entire church.

Now that is the most unique plan yet. Get all them there heathens out of the way so that the church can be pure with the Historically Holy Humans from the outside.

Actually ... I heard that the ordaining of women has not been blessed by ANY conference. I understand that the California conference did not have the conference officials present when the ordaination happened and thus did not sanction it. Not sure ... but that is what I heard.

If we can't accept that we all see things differently ... then God help us. This church does not have all the answers. We have to keep growing yes ... but in the end ... we will have to unlearn far more than what we actually know.

In the mean time ... we can try ... just try ... to love each other. That will cover a multitude of sins.

This is why I don't claim to have the TRUTH. I want to avoid the billy clubs. But it is true. None of us have the TRUTH. So, stop pretending.

[olger]

My name is Gerry Wagoner and I don't care who knows it.

I have a cousin Terry Wagoner and he reminds me of Redwood but I don't think Terry is Redwood because Terry isn't afraid to tell people who he is. I like that about Terry. Now back to our regular programming.

gcw

[Dr. Shane]

I will quote from the textbook Alcoholics Anonymous and see if anyone can relate to some old, ex-drunks.

The first requirement is that we be convinced that any life run on self-will can hardly be a success. On that basis we are almost always in collision with something or somebody, even though our motives are good. Most people try to live by self-propulsion. Each person is like an actor who wants to run the whole show, is forever trying to arrange the lights, the ballet, the scenery and the rest of the players in his own way. If his arrangements would only stay put, if only people would do as he wished, the show would be great. Everybody, including himself, would be pleased. Life would be wonderful. In trying to make these arrangements our actor may sometimes be quite virtuous. He may be kind, considerate, patient, generous; even modest and self-sacrificing. On the other hand, he may be mean, egotistical, selfish and dishonest. But, as with most humans, he is more likely to have varied traits.

What usually happens? The show doesn't come off very well. He begins to think life doesn't treat him right. He decides to exert himself more. He becomes, on the next occasion, still more demanding or gracious, as the case may be. Still the play does not suit him. Admitting he may be somewhat at fault, he is sure that other people are more to blame. He becomes angry, indignant, self-pitying. What is his basic trouble? Is he not really a self-seeker even when trying to be kind? Is he not a victim of the delusion that he can wrest satisfaction and happiness out of this world if he only manages well? Is it not evident to all the rest of the players that these are the things he wants? And do not his actions make each of them wish to retaliate, snatching all they can get out of the show? Is he not, even in his best moments, a producer of confusion rather than harmony? (p. 60, 61)

[Dr. Shane]

Just like GWB, "those women wear things over their face" " we must bomb them until they become like us", well that is an overstatement, but you get the point.

That's a knee-slapper, Stan. Thanks for the big belly roll.

[Woody]

My name is Gerry Wagoner and I don't care who knows it.

I have a cousin Terry Wagoner and he reminds me of Redwood but I don't think Terry is Redwood because Terry isn't afraid to tell people who he is. I like that about Terry. Now back to our regular programming.

gcw

Thank you Gerry.

[CyberGuy]

Quote:

Actually ... I heard that the ordaining of women has not been blessed by ANY conference. I understand that the California conference did not have the conference officials present when the ordaination happened and thus did not sanction it. Not sure ... but that is what I heard.

True the conference personal did not attend the ordination but the conference president did protect the pastors of those churches from being fired even when other pastors demanded it.

So in a way the conference president did not officially sanction the ordination but did privately applaud it by his protecting those pastors from termination.

[Woody]

Quote:

So in a way the conference president did not officially sanction the ordination but did privately applaud it by his protecting those pastors from termination.

If the ordination was not sanctioned then what they did was not official and is of no value. The Pastors who did it did so without any authority. So, it did not happen as far as the church is concerned.

Is there a rule in the GC that if a Pastor does something that is not in accordance with policy that he/she immediately is terminated? A first offense would seem to need some kind of warning or forgiveness. But maybe the church operates differently from Matt.18

[CyberGuy]

The GC does not have the authority to order a conference to fire pastors. Only the conference has that power. Remember the money flows up to the GC from the conferences not the other way around.

Remember the Golden Rule. He who makes the gold makes the rules.

[olger]

Originally Posted By: olger

My name is Gerry Wagoner and I don't care who knows it.

I have a cousin Terry Wagoner and he reminds me of Redwood but I don't think Terry is Redwood because Terry isn't afraid to tell people who he is. I like that about Terry. Now back to our regular programming.

gcw

Thank you Gerry.

You're welcome Bob.

[olger]

There was some talk (1995) of disfellowshipping the NAD but nobody has the courage to do that. There should have been recriminations of some sort to keep accountability alive - an absolutely essential component of the Bride of Christ.

[Woody]

This all just makes me think that I should be a Christian.

[Neil D]

This all just makes me think that I should be a Christian.

What? You are not now?????

[Woody]

There are certain members here who have clearly answered that question Neil. Haven't you been listening?

[Neil D]

There are certain members here who have clearly answered that question Neil. Haven't you been listening?

Awww who cares what they think!

Bedsides, I deaf in one ear and can't hear out of the other....

What do YOU say?

[Woody]

I can't HEAR you.

[Lil Star]

We should never, never try to fix the behavior of another.. I have found this does not work. In any type of relationship with friends or even relatives.

We should only try to influence all those that are watching by showing them if someone doesn't like what you say and has the audacity to say so we are allowed to peck,peck, mock and mock.

I think Redwood should write the rulebook. Have a small chapter on how to develop pecking and mocking skills so they are found acceptable and entertaining.

[CyberGuy]

We should never, never try to fix the behavior of another.. I have found this does not work. In any type of relationship with friends or even relatives.

We should only try to influence all those that are watching by showing them if someone doesn't like what you say and has the audacity to say so we are allowed to peck,peck, mock and mock.

I think Redwood should write the rulebook. Have a small chapter on how to develop pecking and mocking skills so they are found acceptable and entertaining.

Good Point. We cannot fix the behavoir of others.

I saw a humourous sign that said

"I'm Always polite to People who disagree with me. After all, They have a right to their Stupid Opinions."

[Lil Star]

Originally Posted By: Lil Star

We should never, never try to fix the behavior of another.. I have found this does not work. In any type of relationship with friends or even relatives.

We should only try to influence all those that are watching by showing them if someone doesn't like what you say and has the audacity to say so we are allowed to peck,peck, mock and mock.

I think Redwood should write the rulebook. Have a small chapter on how to develop pecking and mocking skills so they are found acceptable and entertaining.

Good Point. We cannot fix the behavoir of others.

I saw a humourous sign that said

"I'm Always polite to People who disagree with me. After all, They have a right to their Stupid Opinions."

Are you saying my opinions are stupid?

[Woody]

Originally Posted By: CyberGuy

Good Point. We cannot fix the behavoir of others.

I saw a humourous sign that said

"I'm Always polite to People who disagree with me. After all, They have a right to their Stupid Opinions."

[/quote']

Are you saying my opinions are stupid?

Now Now ... it is always best to assume the best in people.

[Lil Star]

I am just asking. I have assumed the best in people before only to be dumped on and pecked and pecked. I just want clarification