Hebrews 9: 24 and 1844

[John317]

Originally Posted By: John317

From the wikipedia, especially note the lines in red--

Quote:

Hebrews was written to a specific audience facing very specific circumstances.....

Some had stopped assembling together, and this was possibly due to persecution (10:25).

In Hebrews 10:25 where the author tells believers to not forsake meeting together, the Greek word is episynagogen. If the author was at all concerned about believers attending the Jewish synagogues, don't you think he might have said something different than "do not forsake synagoging"? Or at least he might have added a word of clarification as to what type of synagoging was good and which was not good.

I don't think there's any doubt that the early Christians often worshipped in the synagogue along with the Jews on the Sabbath. They also met together in private homes.

Merely attending the synagogue along with other Christian believers was not the problem. The problem was that these believers were second-guessing their faith in Christ.

[Ron Amnsn]

Originally Posted By: Ron Amnsn

Yes, and what part of that supports your statement?

Hebrews 6: 4-8; 10: 26-31; and 13: 14-19 are good verses to start with. These are clear warnings against apostasy.

Okay, the first two passages have warnings against apostasy. (The third seems to be admonitions of a more general nature.) But what indication do you see in those warnings that the apostasy involved "falling back into Judaism"?

Apostasy comes in many forms. Within Judaism some sects considered other sects to be in apostasy (i.e. the Qumran sect and the Sadducees). Hellenized Jews apostasized from Judaism by adopting Greek culture with it's inherent paganism. Adopting any of the sinful or pagan practices of the prevalent culture would be considered apostasy. In New Testament times it would have been considered apostasy for a Jewish Christian to leave Judaism. (Remember, the Jerusalem Council's commonly misinterpreted decision in Acts 15 applied only to Gentiles.)

Yes, it is possible that some Jewish believers who had accepted Jesus as the Jewish Messiah may have been influenced to reject Jesus as the Jewish Messiah, but that form of apostasy could not legitimately be described as "falling back into Judaism". The Jewish believers were always within Judaism -- both before they accepted Jesus and after they accepted Jesus.

There were some man-made traditional teachings of the Pharisees and Sadducees that were contrary to the Gospel. Those teachings were also contrary to the Old Testament. Jesus and Paul both spoke strongly against those man-made teachings. A believer who resumed those man-made traditions might be considered to be falling into apostasy, but even then it could not be correctly described as "falling back into Judaism".

Today Judaism has been redefined by rabbinical Jews (and many Christians) so that Judaism excludes anyone who believes in Jesus as the Messiah, but to apply today's definition of Judaism to New Testament times is anachronistic. Jesus was within Judaism and Paul was within Judaism. The Jewish followers of Jesus and Paul could not possibly fall "back into Judaism" because they had never separated from Judaism.

[Ron Amnsn]

The following is just some of the evidence that supports the truth of the statement made by the wikipedia--

Quote:

Purpose for writing

Most scholars today believe the document [Hebrews] was written to prevent apostasy.

Take a look at the Introduction to the book of Hebrews in the New Jerusalem Bible. Among other things, it says, "The letter was written to them to try to prevent this [reverting to Judaism] from happening."

Also see Jamieson, Fausset & Brown's Commentary on Hebrews 6: 4-6 and 10: 24-34.

Unger's Bible Dictionary (p. 465) says that one of the purposes of the writing of Hebrews was "to warn those who accepted Christ of the dangers of apostasy. In view of the antiquated nature of Judaism the writer also exhorts his readers to make a complete break with it (12: 18- 13: 17). To accomplish this purpose the writer in closely knit argument establishess the superiority of Christ over angels, over Moses and Joshua and over O.T. priesthood and ritual."

See the Seventh-day Adventist Bible Commentary, vol. 7, Introduction To Hebrews, Historical Setting.

The Harper Study Bible, edited by Harold Lindsell, in the introduction to Hebrews, says, "The readers seem to have been Jewish Christians who were in danger of abandoning their faith and lapsing back into Judaism; thus they were running the risk of apostasy..."

The Concordia Self-Study Bible, in the Introduction to Hebrews, says, "The letter was addressed primarily to Jewish converts who were... being tempted to revert to Judaism or to Judaize the gospel."

The Nelson Study Bible, in the introduction to Hebrews, says, "The Book of Hebrews was written to address the doubts of those who were second-guessing their conversion to Christianity.... 'Do not go back on the steps you have taken.'"

The Oxford Annotated Bible, in the Introduction to Hebrews, says, "The recipients of the letter were on the point of giving up their Christian faith and returning to the Jewish beliefs and practices of their ancestors. To win them back to a firm adherence to Christianity the author emphasizes three main points....." etc.

In Encountering the New Testament, A Historical and Theological Survey (p. 349), it says, "If Hebrews was written to Jewish Christians, do we know why the author wrote it? It seems that he wrote to warn his readers not to turn back to Judaism and to encourage them to stay true to faith in Jesus Christ."

In the Life Application Bible (NIV), the introduction to Hebrews says, "To Whom Written: Hebrew Christians (perhaps second-generation Christians, see 2:3) who may have been considering a return to Judaism, perhaps because of immaturity, stemming from a lack of understanding of Biblical truths... "

Scoffield's Study Bible, in the introduction to Hebrews, says, "... the hortatory passages show that the writer had in view the danger ever present to Jewish professed believers of either lapsing back into Judaism, or of pausing short of true faith in Jesus Christ."

In the Confraternity Version of the Holy Bible, the Introduction to Hebrews says, "... [Hebrews] was destined for Jewish Christians of Palestine, who under the stress of trials were in danger of relapsing into Judaism."

In the Introduction to Hebrews in the Good News Bible, it says, "The Letter to the Hebrews was written to a group of Christians who, faced with increasing opposition, were in danger of abandoning the Christian faith."

In the Introduction to Hebrews in the Amplified Bible, it says, "Very likely this letter was addressed to Jewish Christians in Palestine or in Rome who were being tempted to revert to Judaism or to Judaize the Gospel." (Zondervan, 1987)

You can add to that list the The NIV Study Bible which says, "The letter was addressed primarily to Jewish converts who were familiar with the OT and who were being tempted to revert to Judaism or to Judaize the gospel...."

You have done a good job of showing that there are many "scholars" who espouse opinions that they have been taught, even though those opinions are contrary to the historical and scriptural record. Many errors are popular, but popularity doesn't change fiction to truth. Some of those same "scholars" would tell you that Sunday is the Christian Sabbath and that the Church will be raptured before the tribulation.

Now, where is the historical evidence that these "scholars" would use to show that Jewish Christians had left Judaism so that it might be possible to "fall back into" Judaism?

If the "scholars" are correct about the reason Hebrews was supposedly written, then we should find in Hebrews many passages that deal directly and convincingly with the dangers of Judaism. But when we actually read Hebrews we find there are no such passages in Hebrews at all. The author of Hebrews did a remarkably pathetic job of doing what the "scholars" claim he set out to do. The book of Hebrews may convince a Protestant to avoid Judaism (simply because Protestants have no inclination toward Judaism). But there is not one passage in Hebrews that would even begin to convince a Jewish believer that there was any problem with following the teachings of the Old Testament. Knowing that religious Jews are not easily persuaded to turn away from Judaism, the author of Hebrews would have taken a much more direct and persuasive approach, if the purpose of the book was actually what the "scholars" assert.

Which passages in Hebrews do you find that would convince a Hebrew Christian to not "fall back into Judaism"?

[Ron Amnsn]

Please carefully study the following--

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Hebrews 10:19-39 (New International Version)

19 Therefore, brothers, since we have confidence to enter the Most Holy Place by the blood of Jesus, 20 by a new and living way opened for us through the curtain, that is, his body, 21 and since we have a great priest over the house of God, 22 let us draw near to God with a sincere heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled to cleanse us from a guilty conscience and having our bodies washed with pure water. 23 Let us hold unswervingly to the hope we profess, for he who promised is faithful. 24 And let us consider how we may spur one another on toward love and good deeds. 25 Let us not give up meeting together, as some are in the habit of doing, but let us encourage one another—and all the more as you see the Day approaching.

26 If we deliberately keep on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the truth, no sacrifice for sins is left, 27 but only a fearful expectation of judgment and of raging fire that will consume the enemies of God. 28 Anyone who rejected the law of Moses died without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses. 29 How much more severely do you think a man deserves to be punished who has trampled the Son of God under foot, who has treated as an unholy thing the blood of the covenant that sanctified him, and who has insulted the Spirit of grace? 30 For we know him who said, "It is mine to avenge; I will repay," and again, "The Lord will judge his people." 31 It is a dreadful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

32 Remember those earlier days after you had received the light, when you stood your ground in a great contest in the face of suffering. 33 Sometimes you were publicly exposed to insult and persecution; at other times you stood side by side with those who were so treated. 34 You sympathized with those in prison and joyfully accepted the confiscation of your property, because you knew that you yourselves had better and lasting possessions.

35 So do not throw away your confidence; it will be richly rewarded. 36You need to persevere so that when you have done the will of God, you will receive what he has promised. 37 For in just a very little while,

"He who is coming will come and will not delay.

38 But my righteous one will live by faith.

And if he shrinks back,

I will not be pleased with him." 39 But we are not of those who shrink back and are destroyed, but of those who believe and are saved.

If you imagine that Hebrews was written to persuade Hebrew Christians to avoid falling back into Judaism, then you will interpret this passage as being written for that purpose (even though such an interpretation is historically untenable).

There is nothing in this passage that would even start to dissuade a Hebrew Christian from continuing to practice Judaism. Because the author of Hebrews wrote as one who believed that the Old Testament and the Old Covenant were still valid, it does not conflict at all with the beliefs of Hebrew Christians who combined that belief with belief in Jesus as the Messiah.

[John317]

Do you have access to The Epistle To the Hebrews, The Greek Text With Notes and Essays, by Brooke Foss Westcott? If you do, check out the Introduction, li- lxxix. He goes into a great deal of historical and linguistic/ textual evidence.

I think you may be misunderstanding what is meant by "falling back into Judaisim." Essentially it was a rejection of Christ as the fulfillment of the Old Testament types and shadows (8:5). As the writer of Hebrews put it, to reject Christ was itself a "falling away" (Hebrews 6: 6).

[Ron Amnsn]

I think you may be misunderstanding what is meant by "falling back into Judaisim." Essentially it was a rejection of Christ as the fulfillment of the Old Testament types and shadows (8:5). As the writer of Hebrews put it, to reject Christ was itself a "falling away" (Hebrews 6: 6).

You're using a definition of Judaism that didn't develop until long after Hebrews was written, as a result of antisemitism within the gentile Church. Your definition of Judaism evidently excludes Hebrew people who follow Jesus as the Messiah. When Hebrews was written Judaism included the followers of the Jewish Messiah, Jesus of Nazareth. First-century Judaism contained many different sects -- Pharisees, Sadducees, Essenes, Nazarenes, Zealots, etc. The Nazarenes were were the followers of Jesus. Today, Messianic Judaism includes the followers of Jesus who still practice Torah as Jesus and Paul and the original apostles did. Because at the time the book of Hebrews was written the Hebrew Christians were living well within the boundaries of Judaism, it is historically bogus to say that the book of Hebrews was written in order to prevent the Hebrew Christians from falling back into Judaism.

Please explain how a person can possibly be in danger of "falling back into" something they have always lived carefully within.