Stan Posted April 4, 2009 Posted April 4, 2009 was it a - Everlasting Tormenting Hell Fire? b - Once Saved Always Saved? c - That Jesus came here to correct his error on giving the 10 Commandments? d - That you can BUY your way into heaven? Other? Quote If you receive benefit to being here please help out with expenses. https://www.paypal.me/clubadventist Administrator of a few websites like https://adventistdating.com
Woody Posted April 4, 2009 Posted April 4, 2009 Once Saved Always Saved? Depending upon what one means by this statement ... it can be very much in debate. See the thread on this topic. It is alive and vibrant. Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology.
Stan Posted April 4, 2009 Author Posted April 4, 2009 I have friends who are victims of that. Quote If you receive benefit to being here please help out with expenses. https://www.paypal.me/clubadventist Administrator of a few websites like https://adventistdating.com
Woody Posted April 4, 2009 Posted April 4, 2009 How are they victims? Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology.
Members phkrause Posted April 4, 2009 Members Posted April 4, 2009 That's a hard choice Stan. Each has merit as being ridiculous. pk Quote phkrause When the righteous are in authority, the people rejoice; But when a wicked man rules, the people groan. Proverbs 29;2
Stan Posted April 4, 2009 Author Posted April 4, 2009 They were 'saved' at a rally about 35 years ago, they have viewed that similar to a "get out of Jail free" card in monopoly. After the novelty wore off, and having a problem with their Church getting a female pastor, they walked away from Christianity. They miss the joy of abiding in Christ, and instead get comfort from things they used to get comfort from. They do not get joy from the fruits of the spirit. Taking the Lord's name in vain is the norm as are so many other things that are not the results of the Fruits of the Spirit. They are being robbed by this. AND I am NOT saying they are 'lost', I am saying they are missing out on the Joy of daily surrender to a loving savior. Quote If you receive benefit to being here please help out with expenses. https://www.paypal.me/clubadventist Administrator of a few websites like https://adventistdating.com
Members phkrause Posted April 4, 2009 Members Posted April 4, 2009 I believe this is the key to "once saved always saved". Daily surrender to our Lord and Savior. I can't see how anyone who decides to accept the Savior, gets baptist and says well I'm saved now, so I guess I can now go out and kill millions of people, because once saved always saved, and never surrender to God. This makes no sense to me. pk Quote phkrause When the righteous are in authority, the people rejoice; But when a wicked man rules, the people groan. Proverbs 29;2
Woody Posted April 4, 2009 Posted April 4, 2009 Quote: After the novelty wore off, and having a problem with their Church getting a female pastor, they walked away from Christianity. Don't get me started. Don't get me started. I refuse to say a word. Leaving now. Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology.
Woody Posted April 4, 2009 Posted April 4, 2009 I believe this is the key to "once saved always saved". Daily surrender to our Lord and Savior. I can't see how anyone who decides to accept the Savior, gets baptist and says well I'm saved now, so I guess I can now go out and kill millions of people, because once saved always saved, and never surrender to God. This makes no sense to me. pk It makes no sense ... because I believe it is a straw man for the most part. There are just not many people who really believe like this. Very few. I have a Baptist friend who believes in once saved always saved ... but he is one of the best Christians I know of. Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology.
Moderators John317 Posted April 4, 2009 Moderators Posted April 4, 2009 Originally Posted By: pkrause I believe this is the key to "once saved always saved". Daily surrender to our Lord and Savior. I can't see how anyone who decides to accept the Savior, gets baptist and says well I'm saved now, so I guess I can now go out and kill millions of people, because once saved always saved, and never surrender to God. This makes no sense to me. pk It makes no sense ... because I believe it is a straw man for the most part. There are just not many people who really believe like this. Very few. I have a Baptist friend who believes in once saved always saved ... but he is one of the best Christians I know of. Not all Baptists believe in "once saved, always saved," and naturally there are many genuine Christians among those who do believe in it. "The faith in Christ that saves the soul is not what it is represented to be by many. 'Believe, believe,' is their cry, 'only believe in Christ, and you will be saved. It is all you have to do.' While true faith trusts wholly in Christ for salvation, it will lead to perfect conformity to the law of God. Faith is manifest in works. And the apostle John declares, 'He that saith, I know Him, and keepeth not His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.' (1 John 2: 4). FW 52 Quote John 3:16-17 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. [17] For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him.
Woody Posted April 4, 2009 Posted April 4, 2009 Once you are 'saved' ... you are saved until you decide you no longer want the mercy of God. Through sin ... we grow away from Christ and a desire to be his disciples. Eventually we reject the Holy Spirit and hand back the gift of Salvation given to each of us at the Cross. Sad. But God believes in freedom of choice. BTW ... I should define obtaining the mercy of God. It is repenting of your sins. When you stop repenting and accepting God's mercy ... you are handing back the gift of Salvation. IMHO Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology.
Moderators John317 Posted April 4, 2009 Moderators Posted April 4, 2009 Once you are 'saved' ... you are saved until you decide you no longer want the mercy of God. Through sin ... we grow away from Christ ... This is true but the decision is rarely the kind where people say, "I don't want God's mercy any more." Our lives tell whether we want God in our lives or not. We may say we want God but our lives may betray our words and show that we are lying. It doesn't require a conscious, deliberate choice for us to turn away from God. People turn away from Him and often don't even know they've done it. It happens when people resist God's Spirit and stop walking in the light. They may think they're saved because of their acceptance of Christ years before, and they don't realize they're in a lost condition. That is what the letter to the church of Laodicea in Rev 3: 14-22 is telling us. Quote John 3:16-17 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. [17] For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him.
Woody Posted April 4, 2009 Posted April 4, 2009 The Key is Repentance. How do we obtain the mercy of Christ? Repentance. Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology.
Joe_in_RP Posted April 4, 2009 Posted April 4, 2009 My vote is A. It even drives many young people to become atheists. Quote
GreatLakesGramma Posted April 4, 2009 Posted April 4, 2009 I don't think the word "ridiculous" fits those doctrines - Quote: ridiculous - adjective causing or worthy of ridicule or derision; absurd; preposterous; laughable: a ridiculous plan. Synonyms: nonsensical, ludicrous, funny, droll, comical, farcical. See absurd. Antonyms: sensible. There is nothing funny about any of them. "Pernicious," "dangerous," "insidious," or "deadly" are more fitting adjectives. Any one of them can and will keep people from being saved. Quote Catherine God is the strength of my heart and my portion forever. Psalm 73:26. "To be a Christian means to forgive the inexcusable, because God has forgiven the inexcusable in you." -- C. S. Lewis
GreatLakesGramma Posted April 4, 2009 Posted April 4, 2009 Regarding "once saved always saved," my Pentecostal friend told me that if you turn your back on God once you've been saved, you don't lose your salvation, you just aren't walking in it. This is the same view held by a Baptist man who joined our church and later left it. Quote Catherine God is the strength of my heart and my portion forever. Psalm 73:26. "To be a Christian means to forgive the inexcusable, because God has forgiven the inexcusable in you." -- C. S. Lewis
carolaa Posted April 4, 2009 Posted April 4, 2009 The only one that sounds truly silly to me is C, that Jesus came to correct His error in giving the 10 Commandments. That one is really laughable, while I think the others fall more into the dangerous category. I mean, really, you think God went to all that trouble of preparing the Israelites to receive the Commandments, then giving them - once verbally and twice in stone - and it was all a mistake?! Like God even makes mistakes. Good grief. Quote
Woody Posted April 4, 2009 Posted April 4, 2009 TU Way to go CoA. Thanks for expaining it so clearly. There is no time limit on when we can come and accept the Grace of God and repent of our past sins. That saved status is always there until the day we die. Appreciate the way you put it all together even with the prodigal son. Thanks. Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology.
c freeland Posted April 4, 2009 Posted April 4, 2009 I want to add the Calvinistic view of Predestination, this view seams to be making a comeback. Quote
Woody Posted April 4, 2009 Posted April 4, 2009 Hey ... We haven't talked about predestination in awhile. Why don't you start a new thread on that? And BTW ... welcome. It has been awhile since I've seen you post. Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology.
missionlady Posted April 4, 2009 Posted April 4, 2009 I won't vote on which is the most rediculous--or whatever word one uses. Any false doctrine that distorts God's character is a tradegy. I have a real problem with the everlsting hell. It doesn't make sense for a loving God to punish people in that way. (Actually, I believe that God's punishment is letting us follow our own way and reaping the natural consequences.) But to torment people forever, for 70 or so years of sin, that just doesn't make sense. So with that belief, I understand why people don't believe in or trust God. That is very sad and a real tragedy. Quote
Robert Posted April 5, 2009 Posted April 5, 2009 It happens when people resist God's Spirit and stop walking in the light. They may think they're saved because of their acceptance of Christ years before, and they don't realize they're in a lost condition. No, untrue. This is backsliding and not premeditated apostasy. Quote
Robert Posted April 5, 2009 Posted April 5, 2009 (Actually, I believe that God's punishment is letting us follow our own way and reaping the natural consequences.) If I'm speeding and a traffic cop gives me a ticket that hurts my billfold. I can either learn from the punishment or I can run out of money. So punishment can be good, but what good comes from burning sinners for many days? That's what SDA teach. Yes, it's better than eternally burning hell, but.... I'm with you, God doesn't kill or murder. God is all about freewill. If you have Him you have life, if not you destroy yourself. Who said that? EGW! The quote goes something like, "God destroys no man, man destroys himself." Look at Romans 1:21 For although they [the Gentiles] knew God, they neither glorified him as God nor gave thanks to him, but their thinking became futile and their foolish hearts were darkened....[in other words they turned their backs on God] The results? 24 Therefore God gave them up in the sinful desires...Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion [sTD?]....28 Since they didn't bother to acknowledge God, God quit bothering them and let them run loose. 29 And then all hell broke loose: rampant evil, grabbing and grasping, vicious backstabbing. They made life hell on earth with their envy, wanton killing, bickering, and cheating. Look at them: mean-spirited, venomous, 30 fork-tongued God-bashers. Bullies, swaggerers, insufferable windbags! They keep inventing new ways of wrecking lives. They ditch their parents when they get in the way. 31 Stupid, slimy, cruel, cold-blooded. 32 And it's not as if they don't know better. They know perfectly well they're spitting in God's face. And they don't care - worse, they hand out prizes to those who do the worst things best! Quote
olger Posted April 5, 2009 Posted April 5, 2009 I'll say it, then. The prodigal son was lost. And I can prove it, `oG Quote "Please don't feed the drama queens.."
Woody Posted April 5, 2009 Posted April 5, 2009 Originally Posted By: John317 It happens when people resist God's Spirit and stop walking in the light. They may think they're saved because of their acceptance of Christ years before, and they don't realize they're in a lost condition. No, untrue. This is backsliding and not premeditated apostasy. Good Point Rob. And also ... God knows the end from the beginning. He knows the HEART. And He knows if we will return or not. Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology.
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