Through the Bible: Genesis

[Nic Samojluk]

In any case, Nic, there's no relationship between these verses in Exodus and Matt. 28: 19.

[Nic Samojluk]

Yes, it would certainly be blasphemous to put Gabriel, a creature, on the same level with God the Father and God the Son and in the place of the Holy Spirit.

[Nic Samojluk]

I was not only baptized or buried in the name of Jesus, but in "the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit." My wife was baptized in the same name about 1991. About 14 years later, both of our children were also baptized in the same name.

[Nic Samojluk]

Both Ellen White and the Bible are clear that the Holy Spirit is not the angel Gabriel.

[Twilight]

I haven't had time to read the whole thread, but couple of quick points.

1. Gabriel is not omni-present, so cannot be the Holy Spirit communing with all of us at once.

2. The Holy Spirit dwells in each of us, once again removing Gabriel as a candidate, as Gabriel is a singular angel, not an omnipresent being and would have to dwell in every single one of us to fit all the texts.

Mark :-)

[John317]

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John3:17: In the biblical view, both statements in Exodus about Pharaoh are true.

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Nic Samojluk: There is no such thing as a biblical view.

When I speak of "the biblical view," I mean the same thing as is meant by the phrase, "the biblical view of death," "the biblical view of God," "the biblical view of the Sabbath," etc. You're not denying that there is a biblical view in relation to those things, are you? Is it necessary to speak only of the view of individual books or writers, such as Paul or the Apostle John, or it is legitimate to speak of the view of the Bible as a whole?

The Bible has God as it author, even though God used many different men over a long period of time to write the Scriptures. That is why we can justifiably say that the Bible is God's word. This is not denying that men were inspired to write the books in the Bible, but it is saying that those books did not originate with men but with the Holy Spirit, as it says in 2 Peter 1: 20, 21 and 2 Tim 3: 16, 17.

While the Bible is not inerrent, it is certainly infallible. "Inerrent" is generally understood to refer to the original documents being completely without any error whatsoever. On the other hand, "infallibe" refers to the fact that the Bible is God's word and contains no doctrinal errors, or mistakes that will lead honest and sincere students of Scripture into false beliefs.

I'm sure you've seen where Ellen White herself speaks of the Bible as being infallible, even though she did recognize that the Bible does contain some mistakes of a technical character; yet, as she explains, those mistakes are not of such a nature that people will be led into false doctrines by them. It is better to believe and accept a few insignificant mistakes and retain absolute confidence in the word of God than to lose confidence in it and distrust important teachings.

If people are led to believe that the Bible contains true contradictions and that we should expect to find these, they are likely to think every difficult passage is a contradiction or error and thus will fail to try to see how it harmonizes with all other Scripture. This also applies to the writings of Ellen White.

[John317]

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John3:17: Can you show evidence that when in heaven, Lucifer was holier than the other angels?

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Nic Samojluk: I can’t fathom what you are trying to suggest with this question. Lucifer evidently did occupy a higher position of responsibility in heaven.

No one is disputing the fact that Lucifer once held a higher position of responsibility in heaven than the other angels.

My point is simply this, Nic: In order for a single angel, say Gabriel or Lucifer, to be referred to under the title "THE Holy Spirit," it would mean that whatever angel is being referred is in some sense holier than other angels.

Any angel could be "holy spirit," right? But could any angel be called "THE holy Spirit," unless they were being specified as more holy than others?

This being true, it would mean that at one time Lucifer was somehow holier than all the other angels. Yet I have never seen any evidence that this was ever true of either Lucifer or Gabriel.

But here's the thing: even assuming that we could call any angel "a holy spirit"--- (which, however, neither the Bible nor the SOP does)--- would it be accurate and correct to refer to any angel as "THE holy spirit"? What are your thoughts, Nic?

Take, for instance, the following verses and passages, and tell if you believe either one is a reference to the angel Gabriel:

First the Bible:

"The Spirit who dwells in us yearns jealously" (James 4: 5)

Or: "Do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption" (Eph. 4: 30).

Or: "... they were being prevented by the Holy Spirit from speaking the word in Asia" (Acts 16: 6).

Or... " Why has Satan filled your heart to lie to the Holy Spirit...? You have not lied to men but to God" (Acts 5: 3, 4).

Are any of the above verses referring to the angel Gabriel? If not, is there more than one being who is "THE holy Spirit"?

Now the Spirit of Prophecy:

"The Godhead was stirred with pity for the race, and the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit gave themselves to the working out of the plan of redemption... From the beginning, God has been working by His Holy Spirit through human instrumentalities for the accomplishment of His purpose in behalf of the fallen race... Before this [Christ's death] the Spirit had been in the world; from the very beginning of the work of redemption He had been moving upon men's hearts."

Then Ellen White makes the statement that Christ sent the Holy Spirit because Christ cannot be in every place personally but He can be with everyone through the Holy Spirit. This means that the Holy Spirit can be with everyone at the same time. He is not limited to one location at a time like Jesus is. See God's Amazing Grace, pages 190, 191.

Does this show she is talking about the angel Gabriel?

[John317]

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John 7:17: Both Ellen White and the Bible are clear that the Holy Spirit is not the angel Gabriel.

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Nic Samojluk : What is clear to you is not so clear to me.

Read these verses and this passage by Ellen White and tell if it's unclear to you:

"... The Holy Spirit testifies in every city, saying that chains and tribulations await me" (Acts 20: 23).

"John bore witness, saying, 'I saw the Spirit descending from heaven like a dove, and He remained upon Him. I did not know Him, but He who sent me to baptize with water said to me, 'Upon whom you see the Spirit descending, and remaining on Him, this is He who baptizes with the Holy Spirit'" (John 1: 32, 33).

My question to you is, do you beleive this refers to the angel Gabriel? Do you believe believers are baptized with the angel Gabriel?

In your thinking, is there anything unclear about this?

Now Ellen White, and the same question:

"These brethren [disciples mentioned in Acts 19: 1] knew nothing of the mission of the Holy Spirit. When asked by Paul if they had received the Holy Ghost, they answered, 'We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost.' 'Unto what then were ye baptized?' Paul inquired, and they said, 'Unto John's baptism.'

"Then the apostle set before them the great truths that are the foundation of the Christian's hope. He told them of Christ's life on this earth and of His cruel death of shame. He told them how the Lord of life had broken the barriers of the tomb and risen triumphant over death. He repeated the Savior's commission to His disciples: 'All power is given unto Me in heaven and earth. Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost.' Matt. 28: 18, 19. He told them also of Christ's promise to send the Comforter, through whose power mighty signs and wonders would be wrought, and he described how gloriously this promise had been fulfilled on the Day of Pentecost." AA 282, 283. Please also study AA 52, 53.

Who is the Comforter?

Is it unclear to you whether these words were meant by Ellen White to refer to the angel Gabriel?

Notice Paul's question in Acts 19: 1-3: "Did you receive the Holy Spirit when you believed?"

Their answer was, no. Then notice Paul's next question: "Into what then were you baptized?"

This clearly assumes that believers were being baptized into "the name of the Father, of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit," just as Matt. 28: 19 and Ellen White's quote says.

Paul is saying if they didn't receive the Spirit, it must be because they weren't baptized into the Holy Spirit at the time they were submerged in water.

When they reply they were baptized only unto John the Baptizer's immersion, Paul completely understands, because John didn't baptize in the name of Jesus or the Holy Spirit. If they'd been baptized in the name of Jesus, Paul's question shows he's assuming they would have known about the Holy Spirit because they would also have been baptized in the Spirit's name.

Carefully compare John 1: 23 with Matt. 28: 19.

Being baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus is no denial of Matt. 28: 19. If someone asks me in whose name I was baptized, I won't repeat the baptismal formula and tell them "I was baptized in the name of the Father, of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit." Instead, I would say I was baptized in the name of Jesus. Why? Because I'm assuming all Christians and especially SDAs ought to know what the pastor says when we are baptized. I don't expect to have to repeat the formula word for word in order for people familiar with the Bible to understand my meaning.

[John317]

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John3:17:

When the word "eternal" is used in relationship to God, it means "endless." When it is used in regard to mortals, it means a limited amount of time. What "eternal" means, then, really depends on the subject.

God is immortal and not subject to death, and therefore "eternal" as far as God is concerned means "without end." For instance, when we speak of God's love being "eternal," we mean his love is infinite and endless, because God is by nature infinite and endless.

On the other hand, "eternal" obviously cannot have this meaning with respect to a created being, whether man or angel, because creatures by definition have a beginning.

What the Internet says is irrelevant because we're talking about the Bible's use of "eternal," not the way it's used commonly by people on the street.

So the question is, what is the Godhead?

And when we speak of the Godhead being "eternal," do we use "eternal" to mean a limited period of time? Is the Godhead limited as to the length or the time of its existence?

Do you beleive Lucifer was one of the persons of the Godhead?

Or is Gabriel the third person of the Godhead?

[John317]

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Nic Samojluk: I just checked the Internet and here is the definition of “Godhead” I found:

"state of being God or god: the nature or essence of being divine"

Notice that it says “God or god.”

The word "Godhead" in the Bible is translated from the Greek word, theotetos. See Col. 2: 9.

Again, we don't get our definiton of Bible words from the Internet or Webster's dictionary. We need to get them from the way the Bible uses those words.

"Godhead" is never used of anyone but the true, living, Eternal God of the Bible.

It is not referring to "a god" or to "gods."

It is often translated as "deity" in the Scriptures, and we know that no creature of any kind is "deity."

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Nic Samojluk: Jesus quoted the OT where the title of god is attributed to human beings. If that is the case, then why would you deprive the angel Gabriel of said divine attribute?

Because Jesus' use of "god" in John 10: 34 obviously is not a reference to the Godhead. And here we're talking about the Godhead.

Those humans referred to as "gods" were judges who were given the responsibility of doing God's work in the world, but at no time were people required to worship them, whereas the Father commands us and the angles to worship Christ. Heb. 1: 6.

"Godhead" is not merely a refernce to someone who is divine or heavenly, but a reference to the Supreme God of the universe. Neither Lucifer nor Gabriel were ever one of the persons of the eternal Godhead.

[John317]

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John 3:17: Why would you insist on holding onto the mere opinion of Eusebius, who supported the pagan Emperor Constantine, and reject the inspired Scriptures?

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Nic Samojluk: His opinion makes sense to me. The several NT texts which use the “in the name of Jesus” baptismal formula should have more weight than a single questionable text we find in Matthew 28:19.

Jesus said that everything should be confirmed by the testimony of two or more witnesses. We have the testimony of several texts which use the “in the name of Jesus” baptismal formula, but you have chosen to ignore their testimony in favor of a single text which was questioned by Eusebius.

But to take Eusebius' word for it is to put more confidence in him than in the prophet of God, Ellen White. Her testimony agrees with ALL of the ancient Greek manuscripts which contain the end of the book of Matthew.

When it comes to deciding whether to believe Ellen White or Eusebius, it's really no contest with me, and I believe most SDAs would say the same thing.

Ellen White wrote:

"Then the apostle set before them the great truths that are the foundation of the Christian's hope. He told them of Christ's life on this earth and of His cruel death of shame. He told them how the Lord of life had broken the barriers of the tomb and risen triumphant over death. He repeated the Savior's commission to His disciples: 'All power is given unto Me in heaven and earth. Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost.' Matt. 28: 18, 19. He told them also of Christ's promise to send the Comforter, through whose power mighty signs and wonders would be wrought, and he described how gloriously this promise had been fulfilled on the Day of Pentecost." AA 282, 283.

I believe the following is good evidence that the baptismal formula at Matt. 28: 19 is in harmony with the rest of the New Testament:

Notice Paul's question in Acts 19: 1-3: "Did you receive the Holy Spirit when you believed?"

Their answer was, no. Then notice Paul's next question: "Into what then were you baptized?"

This clearly assumes that believers were being baptized into "the name of the Father, of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit," just as Matt. 28: 19 and Ellen White's quote says.

Paul is saying if they didn't receive the Spirit, it must be because they weren't baptized into the Holy Spirit at the time they were submerged in water. If they had been, they would know what the Holy Spirit is.

When they reply they were baptized only unto John the Baptizer's immersion, Paul completely understands, because John didn't baptize in the name of the Holy Spirit. If they'd been baptized in the name of Jesus, Paul's question shows he's assuming they would have known about the Holy Spirit because they would also have been baptized in the Spirit's name.

If the only name all people were baptized into was that of the name of Jesus, it would be possible for a person to be baptized in Jesus' name and not know anything about the Holy Spirit. But Paul's question shows that isn't what happened, and the only way to explain it is to understand that when believers were baptized into Christ's name, they were also baptized into the name of the Holy Spirit.

[John317]

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John3: 17:

Is Eusebius now Scripture?

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Nic Samojluk: I believe that Eusebius quoted Scripture correctly. He had access to the original text which was written in the Hebrew/Aramaic language. This theory is supported by the testimony of other Patristic writers and their testimony makes sense to me because they were historically closer to the events recorded in the New Testament.

Here are what I see as problems with your reasoning:

1) You assume that Eusebius quoted Scripture fully in the sources where he doesn't quote the baptismal formula as we have in Matt. 28: 19, but you have no proof that this was his intention.

2) You ignore the evidence that Eusebius quoted the baptismal formula five times in his writings that have survived.

3) You admit that your view is a mere "theory," not a fact.

4) The fact is that Matt. 28: 19 is in all of the ancient NT texts containing chapter 28 of the Gospel of Matthew.

5) Finally your view requires you to jettison the writings of Ellen White on the subject and in their stead to hold on to your theory and to Eusebius' opinion.

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John3:17: Was Eusebius inspired?

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Nic Samojluk: He definitely was, in the sense described in Joel 2:28 where the promise is for men and women, for young and for old. Didn’t God promise this to all mankind?

By the same arugment, one could prove that the popes were inspired and doing God's will.

Not all people claiming to be Christians were inspired.

You are using "inspired" in a way that the Bible does not use the word. "Inspired" in the biblical sense means to be enabled by the Holy Spirit to write the words of God. This only happened to certain prophets and apostles.

If you believe Eusebius to have been inspired, you would be obligated to accept what he said concerning the pagan Emperor Constantine and Sunday.

Your statement would lead me to believe that you place more confidence in the inspiration of Eusebius (who was not a prophet) than in Ellen White, (who was).

Your thoughts?

[Nic Samojluk]

Daniel 4: 8, 18; 5:11, 14 all speak "the Spirit of the Holy God" that is in Daniel and enables Daniel to understand the kings dream. (See NKJV; Amplified; and the Septuagint.) This is possibly, if not probably, a reference to the Holy Spirit. (For sure it cannot be that Daniel has spirits of false gods in him which help him understand the future.)

[Nic Samojluk]

Do you believe the angel Gabriel-- a mere creature-- could be the third person of "the eternal Godhead"?

[Nic Samojluk]

It could very well be that Eusebius did not quote it exactly but rather was alluding to it, realizing that his readers were well acquainted with the exact words.

[Nic Samojluk]

Gabriel is not omni-present, so cannot be the Holy Spirit communing with all of us at once.

[John317]

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John 3:17: Daniel 4: 8, 18; 5:11, 14 all speak "the Spirit of the Holy God" that is in Daniel and enables Daniel to understand the kings dream. (See NKJV; Amplified; and the Septuagint.) This is possibly, if not probably, a reference to the Holy Spirit. (For sure it cannot be that Daniel has spirits of false gods in him which help him understand the future.)

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Nic Samojluk: You missed one important detail: the text actually makes reference not to Holy God but to holy gods. This pronouncement was made by a pagan king who believed in polytheism the existence of many gods. If we use these texts to establish a Christian doctrine, then we may end with the belief in the existence of many gods. Do you want a pagan king to rule about Christian dogma?

"the spirit of the holy gods is in thee." [Dan. 8:18]

The Aramaic in Daniel 4 exactly corresponds to the Hebrew expression, Elohim, which is also a masculine plural noun.

The Hebrrew equivalent is used in Joshua 24: 19 and reads literally "holy gods," but of course is a clear reference to the one true God.

Gen. 41: 38 is the same expression and is translated "in whom is the Spirit of God," although it also is plural (KJV; NKJV).

I have no problem with either translation, "the spirit of the holy gods," or "the Spirit of the Holy God." Both are grammatically correct, which is why you will find it translated both ways by excellent translators.

[John317]

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John: Here's the official beliefs of of our church as regards Ellen White's position and authority

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Nic Samojluk: Notice that it says that the Bible is the standard. For many years Adventists did make the writings of Ellen White the standard. This is no longer held by the official position of the church.

"They also make clear that the Bible is the standard by which all teaching and experience must be tested."

Yes, of course, the Bible is by all means our standard. I'm not suggesting that anyone make her writings the standard, but only that we understand what she believed and taught, particularly about the Holy Spirit since that's our subject of discussion here.

When was it ever the official position of the SDA church that Ellen White was the standard?

Your statement above, Nic, gives the impression that our official position changed. You say, "This is no longer held by the official position of the church," which can only be logically understood to mean there was a time when it was the official position of the church.

While it's true that there have been individuals in the church who made Ellen White's writings the standard, there has never been a time when the church as a whole made her writings the standard. In fact, from the very beginning of the SDA movement, James White made it clear that Ellen White was not the standard.

I believe your statement would have been correct if you had said, "For years, many or some Adventists did make the writings of Ellen White the standard." I could agree with that.

Our statement of beliefs also says, "As the Lord's messenger, her writings are a continuing and authoritative source of truth which provide for the church comfort, guidance, instruction, and correction."

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John 3:17: You have said she made statements that can be understood to mean that the angel Gabriel is the Holy Spirit.

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Nic Samojluk: Please give me the actual quotation within its proper context.

You said, "She did speak about three great powers of heaven and Three Persons in the Godhead, but these references to a "heavenly trio" can easily be interpreted to include God the Father, Jesus Christ, and the angel Gabriel."

My question to you is, do you believe Ellen White meant for us to understand the angel Gabriel is one of the "heavenly trio"?

How about when she said she calls upon the three great worthies in heaven? In this statement, she makes it plain that she is including the Holy Spirit. (See Sermons and Talks, Vol. 1, page 368)

So the question is, do you believe Ellen White intended for us to understand the angel Gabriel by the use of "three great worthies in heaven," and by "the Holy Spirit"?

I see no evidence or reason for believing so. What do you think?

[John317]

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John 3:17:

Is Isaiah 42: 1-- "I have put My Spirit upon Him [Christ]-- a reference to the angel Gabriel? See Jesus' application in Luke 4:18.

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Nic Samojluk: Ellen White has a statement attributing all the miracles performed by Jesus Christ to the ministry of God’s angels, who are his “ministering spirits.”

"All the miracles of Christ performed for the afflicted and suffering were, by the power of God, through the ministration of angels." {RH, January 21, 1873 par. 16}

OK, sure, God used angels, but that is not the question. The question is, when the Bible says God will put His Spirit upon Christ, is it referring to the angel Gabriel?

Is. 42: 1 and Luke 4: 18 both say, "My Spirit," not "My spirits."

Do you believe the angel Gabriel, or other angels, are being referred to as "My Spirit" in that particular context?

[John317]

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John3:17: That is why we do not pray to angels but we pray to God

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Nic Samojluk: We do not pray to the Holy Spirit, but to God in Jesus’ name. If the HS is a separate entity as described by Trinitarians then he is entitled to our worship. I don’t find any record in the Bible of worship directed at the HS. Do you?

Ellen White clearly prayed to the Holy Spirit as well as to Jesus and to the Father. She said that when she felt oppressed and didn't know how to relate herself to the work she was supposed to do, she "called upon the three great worthies in heaven," and this included the Holy Ghost. Elsewhere on page 367, she refers to Them as "the three holiest Beings in heaven." See Sermons & Talks, vol. 1, pages 363, 367, 368. (Ms. 95, 1906)

She also sang songs of worship and praise to the Holy Spirit, praising Him equally with the FAther and the Son, and she said all Seventh-day Adventists should sing the same song whenever possible.

The very fact that we are baptized in the name of the Holy Spirit shows that we can praise and worship Him just as we do the Father and the Son. We are not baptized in the name of anyone but God, certainly not an angel. That would be blasphemous, Nic.

As Jesus said in John 16: 13, 14, the Holy Spirit doesn't point to Himself or draw attention to Himself. He points everyone to Christ and to the Father. He doesn't glorify Himself but He glorifies the Son. The Holy Spirit takes what is Christ's and declares it to us for the glorification of the Father and the Son.

The Holy Spirit's work is to represent Christ to us. He is Christ's agent. A representative doesn't draw attention to himself but he draws attention to the person or company he represents. An ambassador doesn't glorify himself but he glorifies the country he represents and he serves the leader of the country. In much the same way the Spirit represents and serves the other persons of the Godhead.

That is the main reason the Bible doesn't teach us to worship or pray directly to the Holy Spirit. He does not speak on His own authority, nor does He draw attention to Himself. He draws our attention to Christ. He doesn't ask us for our worship, but He wants us to worship the Father and the Lord Jesus Christ, who gave His life for us.

See how completely humble and unselfish all three Persons of the Godhead are!!

[John317]

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Nic Samojluk:

Do a search of Ellen White writings with the term “indwelling” and you will discover that the indwelling includes God, the Creator, Christ, and the Holy Spirit. Of course God is both Spirit and Holy. So are all his angels.

The Father and Christ do not personally dwell in us or with us. They can't be with us personally since they are literally in the sanctuary in heaven, and they can't be everywhere at one time. God and Christ come to us through the Holy Spirit, who is the personal representative of Christ.

Christ is a glorified man, a male, the God-man. See Rev. 1: 13; 12: 5, 13; Acts 2: 22-36. He is the same as He was when He was resurrected and returned to heaven, as shown in Acts 1: 9-11. cf. Heb. 13: 8. He had a body of flesh and bones. He ate food and told them to touch his body in order to see that He was not a spirit but that He had a real, physical body. John 16: 7 tells us that this is the reason it was best for us that Jesus went to heaven and sent the Holy Spirit to take His place-- since Jesus was limited to a phyical body just as we are. The Holy Spirit isn't limited to a body and can therefore be everywhere at once.

Obviously angels can't be everywhere at once like the Holy Spirit can be.

The only angels who are in people are fallen, evil angels.

By contrast, God's angels are never described as being "in" human beings. But all three Persons of the Godhead are said to be "in" us and "with" us through the medium of the Holy Spirit, who is Christ's personal representative.

[Nic Samojluk]

You're not denying that there is a biblical view in relation to those things, are you?

[John317]

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John3:17: The Bible has God as it author

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Nic Samojluk: I prefer Ellen White's view on this. She stated that God is not revealed in the Bible as an author.

"The Bible is written by inspired men, but it is not God's mode of thought and expression. It is that of humanity. God, as a writer, is not represented. Men will often say such an expression is not like God. But God has not put Himself in words, in logic, in rhetoric, on trial in the Bible. The writers of the Bible were God's penmen, not His pen. Look at the different writers." {7BC 945.9}

The above is true, of course, but Ellen White also states several times that God is the true Author of the Scriptures.

Consider the following:

Another class Satan leads on still further, even to deny the existence of God. They can see no consistency in the character of the God of the Bible, if He will inflict horrible tortures upon a portion of the human family to all eternity. Therefore they deny the Bible and its Author, and regard death as an eternal sleep. {SR 390.1}

There is still another class who are fearful and timid. These Satan tempts to commit sin, and after they have sinned, he holds up before them that the wages of sin is not death but life in horrible torments, to be endured throughout the endless ages of eternity. By thus magnifying before their feeble minds the horrors of an endless hell, he takes possession of their minds, and they lose their reason. Then Satan and his angels exult, and the infidel and atheist join in casting reproach upon Christianity. They claim that these evils are the natural results of believing in the Bible and its Author, whereas they are the results of the reception of popular heresy. {SR 390.2}

It is evident that the Author of nature is the Author of the Bible. {BEcho, April 1, 1889 par. 2}

"The Bible points to God as its author; yet it was written by human hands; and in the varied style of its different books it presents the characteristics of the several writers. The truths revealed are all 'given by inspiration of God.'" GC, Introduction, page 7.

Brethren, cling to your Bible, as it reads, and stop your criticisms in regard to its validity, and obey the Word, and not one of you will be lost. The ingenuity of men has been exercised for ages to measure the Word of God by their finite minds and limited comprehension. If the Lord, the Author of the living oracles, would throw back the curtain and reveal His wisdom and His glory before them, they would shrink into nothingness and exclaim as did Isaiah, “I am a man of unclean lips, and I dwell in the midst of people of unclean lips” (Isaiah 6:5).

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John3:17: While the Bible is not inerrant, ...

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Nic Samojluk: This makes no sense to me, and I have read the Bible many times. Even Ellen White did admit that there were errors introduced into the Bible by copyists.

To say that the Bible is not inerrant is the same as saying the Bible contains some errors.

The statement "the Bible is not inerrant" means that the Bible is not without error.

But since it contains some errors, does it mean we don't place our complete confidence in it as God's inspired word?

Ellen White:

In His Word, God has committed to men the knowledge necessary for salvation. The Holy Scriptures are to be accepted as an authoritative, infallible revelation of His will. They are the standard of character, the revealer of doctrines, and the test of experience. (2 Tim. 3: 16, 17 in Revised Version quoted). Yet the fact that God has revealed His will to men through His Word, has not rendered needless the continued presence and guiding of the Holy Spirit. On the contrary, the Spirit was promised by our Saviour, to open the Word to His servants, to illuminate and apply its teachings. {AG 198.3}

We all need a guide through the many strait places in life as much as the sailor needs a pilot over the sandy bar or up the rocky river, and where is this guide to be found? We point you . . . to the Bible. Inspired of God, written by holy men, it points out with great clearness and precision the duties of both old and young. It elevates the mind, softens the heart, and imparts gladness and holy joy to the spirit. The Bible presents a perfect standard of character; it is an infallible guide under all circumstances, even to the end of the journey of life. Take it as the man of your counsel, the rule of your daily life. . . . {Mar 44.2}

Continued

[John317]

Continued

The following is taken from the first section of Selected Messages, Book I.

The Inspiration of the Word of God

This is a time when the question with all propriety may be asked, “When the Son of man cometh, shall he find faith on the earth?” (Luke 18:8).

Spiritual darkness has covered the earth and gross darkness the people. There are in many churches skepticism and infidelity in the interpretation of the Scriptures. Many, very many, are questioning the verity and truth of the Scriptures. Human reasoning and the imaginings of the human heart are undermining the inspiration of the Word of God, and that which should be received as granted, is surrounded with a cloud of mysticism. Nothing stands out in clear and distinct lines, upon rock bottom. This is one of the marked signs of the last days.

This Holy Book has withstood the assaults of Satan, who has united with evil men to make everything of divine character shrouded in clouds and darkness. But the Lord has preserved this Holy Book by His own miraculous power in its present shape—a chart or guidebook to the human family to show them the way to heaven.

But the oracles of God have been so manifestly neglected that there are but few in our world, even of those who profess to explain it to others, who have the divine knowledge of the Scriptures. There are learned men who have a college education, but these shepherds do not feed the flock of God. They do not consider that the excellencies of the Scriptures will be continually unfolding their hidden treasures as precious jewels are discovered by digging for them.

There are men who strive to be original, who are wise above what is written; therefore, their wisdom is foolishness. They discover wonderful things in advance, ideas which reveal that they are far behind in the comprehension of the divine will and purposes of God. In seeking to make plain or to unravel mysteries hid from ages from mortal man, they are like a man floundering about in the mud, unable to extricate himself and yet telling others how to get out of the muddy sea they themselves are in. This is a fit representation of the men who set themselves to correct the errors of the Bible. No man can improve the Bible by suggesting what the Lord meant to say or ought to have said.

Some look to us gravely and say, “Don’t you think there might have been some mistake in the copyist or in the translators?” This is all probable, and the mind that is so narrow that it will hesitate and stumble over this possibility or probability would be just as ready to stumble over the mysteries of the Inspired Word, because their feeble minds cannot see through the purposes of God. Yes, they would just as easily stumble over plain facts that the common mind will accept, and discern the Divine, and to which God’s utterance is plain and beautiful, full of marrow and fatness. All the mistakes will not cause trouble to one soul, or cause any feet to stumble, that would not manufacture difficulties from the plainest revealed truth.

God committed the preparation of His divinely inspired Word to finite man. This Word, arranged into books, the Old and New Testaments, is the guidebook to the inhabitants of a fallen world, bequeathed to them that, by studying and obeying the directions, not one soul would lose its way to heaven.

Those who think to make the supposed difficulties of Scripture plain, in measuring by their finite rule that which is inspired and that which is not inspired, had better cover their faces, as Elijah when the still small voice spoke to him; for they are in the presence of God and holy angels, who for ages have communicated to men light and knowledge, telling them what to do and what not to do, unfolding before them scenes of thrilling interest, waymark by waymark in symbols and signs and illustrations.

And He [God] has not, while presenting the perils clustering about the last days, qualified any finite man to unravel hidden mysteries or inspired one man or any class of men to pronounce judgment as to that which is inspired or is not. When men, in their finite judgment, find it necessary to go into an examination of scriptures to define that which is inspired and that which is not, they have stepped before Jesus to show Him a better way than He has led us.

I take the Bible just as it is, as the Inspired Word. I believe its utterances in an entire Bible. Men arise who think they find something to criticize in God’s Word. They lay it bare before others as evidence of superior wisdom. These men are, many of them, smart men, learned men, they have eloquence and talent, the whole lifework [of whom] is to unsettle minds in regard to the inspiration of the Scriptures. They influence many to see as they do. And the same work is passed on from one to another, just as Satan designed it should be, until we may see the full meaning of the words of Christ, “When the Son of man cometh, shall he find faith on the earth?” (Luke 18:8).

Brethren, let not a mind or hand be engaged in criticizing the Bible. It is a work that Satan delights to have any of you do, but it is not a work the Lord has pointed out for you to do.

Men should let God take care of His own Book, His living oracles, as He has done for ages. They begin to question some parts of revelation, and pick flaws in the apparent inconsistencies of this statement and that statement.

Beginning at Genesis, they give up that which they deem questionable, and their minds lead on, for Satan will lead to any length they may follow in their criticism, and they see something to doubt in the whole Scriptures. Their faculties of criticism become sharpened by exercise, and they can rest on nothing with a certainty. You try to reason with these men, but your time is lost. They will exercise their power of ridicule even upon the Bible. They even become mockers, and they would be astonished if you put it to them in that light.

Brethren, cling to your Bible, as it reads, and stop your criticisms in regard to its validity, and obey the Word, and not one of you will be lost. The ingenuity of men has been exercised for ages to measure the Word of God by their finite minds and limited comprehension. If the Lord, the Author of the living oracles, would throw back the curtain and reveal His wisdom and His glory before them, they would shrink into nothingness and exclaim as did Isaiah, “I am a man of unclean lips, and I dwell in the midst of people of unclean lips” (Isaiah 6:5).

Simplicity and plain utterance are comprehended by the illiterate, by the peasant, and the child as well as by the full-grown man or the giant in intellect. If the individual is possessed of large talents of mental powers, he will find in the oracles of God treasures of truth, beautiful and valuable, which he can appropriate. He will also find difficulties, and secrets and wonders which will give him the highest satisfaction to study during a long lifetime, and yet there is an infinity beyond.

Men of humble acquirements, possessing but limited capabilities and opportunities to become conversant in the Scriptures, find in the living oracles comfort, guidance, counsel, and the plan of salvation as clear as a sunbeam. No one need be lost for want of knowledge, unless he is willfully blind....

Human minds vary. The minds of different education and thought receive different impressions of the same words, and it is difficult for one mind to give to one of a different temperament, education, and habits of thought by language exactly the same idea as that which is clear and distinct in his own mind. Yet to honest men, right-minded men, he can be so simple and plain as to convey his meaning for all practical purposes. If the man he communicates with is not honest and will not want to see and understand the truth, he will turn his words and language in everything to suit his own purposes. He will misconstrue his words, play upon his imagination, wrest them from their true meaning, and then entrench himself in unbelief, claiming that the sentiments are all wrong.

This is the way my writings are treated by those who wish to misunderstand and pervert them. They turn the truth of God into a lie. In the very same way that they treat the writings in my published articles and in my books, so do skeptics and infidels treat the Bible. They read it according to their desire to pervert, to misapply, to willfully wrest the utterances from their true meaning. They declare that the Bible can prove anything and everything, that every sect proves their doctrines right, and that the most diverse doctrines are proved from the Bible.

The writers of the Bible had to express their ideas in human language. It was written by human men. These men were inspired of the Holy Spirit. Because of the imperfections of human understanding of language, or the perversity of the human mind, ingenious in evading truth, many read and understand the Bible to please themselves. It is not that the difficulty is in the Bible. Opposing politicians argue points of law in the statute book, and take opposite views in their application and in these laws.

The Scriptures were given to men, not in a continuous chain of unbroken utterances, but piece by piece through successive generations, as God in His providence saw a fitting opportunity to impress man at sundry times and

divers places. Men wrote as they were moved upon by the Holy Ghost. There is “first the bud, then the blossom, and next the fruit,” “first the blade, then the ear, after that the full corn in the ear.” This is exactly what the Bible utterances are to us.

There is not always perfect order or apparent unity in the Scriptures. The miracles of Christ are not given in exact order, but are given just as the circumstances occurred, which called for this divine revealing of the power of Christ. The truths of the Bible are as pearls hidden. They must be searched, dug out by painstaking effort. Those who take only a surface view of the Scriptures will, with their superficial knowledge, which they think is very deep, talk of the contradictions of the Bible, and question the authority of the Scriptures. But those whose hearts are in harmony with truth and duty will search the Scriptures with a heart prepared to receive divine impressions. The illuminated soul sees a spiritual unity, one grand golden thread running through the whole, but it requires patience, thought, and prayer to trace out the precious golden thread. Sharp contentions over the Bible have led to investigation and revealed the precious jewels of truth. Many tears have been shed, many prayers offered, that the Lord would open the understanding to His Word.

The Bible is not given to us in grand superhuman language. Jesus, in order to reach man where he is, took humanity. The Bible must be given in the language of men. Everything that is human is imperfect. Different meanings are expressed by the same word; there is not one word for each distinct idea. The Bible was given for practical purposes.

The stamps of minds are different. All do not understand expressions and statements alike. Some understand the statements of the Scriptures to suit their own particular minds and cases. Prepossessions, prejudices, and passions have a strong influence to darken the understanding and confuse the mind even in reading the words of Holy Writ.

The disciples traveling to Emmaus needed to be disentangled in their interpretation of the Scriptures. Jesus walked with them disguised, and as a man He talked with them. Beginning at Moses and the prophets He taught them in all things concerning Himself, that His life, His mission, His sufferings, His death were just as the Word of God had foretold. He opened their understanding that they might understand the Scriptures. How quickly He straightened out the tangled ends and showed the unity and divine verity of the Scriptures. How much men in these times need their understanding opened.

The Bible is written by inspired men, but it is not God’s mode of thought and expression. It is that of humanity. God, as a writer, is not represented. Men will often say such an expression is not like God. But God has not put Himself in words, in logic, in rhetoric, on trial in the Bible. The writers of the Bible were God’s penmen, not His pen. Look at the different writers.

It is not the words of the Bible that are inspired, but the men that were inspired. Inspiration acts not on the man’s words or his expressions but on the man himself, who, under the influence of the Holy Ghost, is imbued with thoughts. But the words receive the impress of the individual mind. The divine mind is diffused. The divine mind and will is combined with the human mind and will; thus the utterances of the man are the word of God.—Manuscript 24, 1886 (written in Europe in 1886).

Continued

[John317]

Continued

Unity in Diversity

There is variety in a tree, there are scarcely two leaves just alike. Yet this variety adds to the perfection of the tree as a whole.

In our Bible, we might ask, Why need Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John in the Gospels, why need the Acts of the Apostles, and the variety of writers in the Epistles, go over the same thing?

The Lord gave His word in just the way He wanted it to come. He gave it through different writers, each having his own individuality, though going over the same history. Their testimonies are brought together in one Book, and are like the testimonies in a social meeting. They do not represent things in just the same style. Each has an experience of his own, and this diversity broadens and deepens the knowledge that is brought out to meet the necessities of varied minds. The thoughts expressed have not a set uniformity, as if cast in an iron mold, making the very hearing monotonous. In such uniformity there would be a loss of grace and distinctive beauty....

The Creator of all ideas may impress different minds with the same thought, but each may express it in a different way, yet without contradiction. The fact that this difference exists should not perplex or confuse us. It is seldom that two persons will view and express truth in the very same way. Each dwells on particular points which his constitution and education have fitted him to appreciate. The sunlight falling upon the different objects gives those objects a different hue.

Through the inspiration of His Spirit the Lord gave His apostles truth, to be expressed according to the development of their minds by the Holy Spirit. But the mind is not cramped, as if forced into a certain mold.—Letter 53, 1900.

The Lord Speaks in Imperfect Speech

The Lord speaks to human beings in imperfect speech, in order that the degenerate senses, the dull, earthly perception, of earthly beings may comprehend His words. Thus is shown God’s condescension. He meets fallen human beings where they are. The Bible, perfect as it is in its simplicity, does not answer to the great ideas of God; for infinite ideas cannot be perfectly embodied in finite vehicles of thought. Instead of the expressions of the Bible being exaggerated, as many people suppose, the strong expressions break down before the magnificence of the thought, though the penman selected the most expressive language through which to convey the truths of higher education. Sinful beings can only bear to look upon a shadow of the brightness of heaven’s glory.—Letter 121, 1901.

No Man to Pronounce Judgment on God’s Word

Both in the [battle Creek] Tabernacle and in the college the subject of inspiration has been taught, and finite men have taken it upon themselves to say that some things in the Scriptures were inspired and some were not. I was shown that the Lord did not inspire the articles on inspiration published in the Review, [Reference here is to a series of articles the writer of which advocated that there were “Differences in Degrees” of inspiration. See The Review and Herald, January 15, 1884.—Compilers.] neither did He approve their endorsement before our youth in the college. When men venture to criticize the Word of God, they venture on sacred, holy ground, and had better fear and tremble and hide their wisdom as foolishness. God sets no man to pronounce judgment on His Word, selecting some things as inspired and discrediting others as uninspired. The testimonies have been treated in the same way; but God is not in this.—Letter 22, 1889.

....“The Bible points to God as its author; yet it was written by human hands; and in the varied style of its different books it presents the characteristics of the several writers. The truths revealed are all ‘given by inspiration of God’ (2 Timothy 3:16); yet they are expressed in the words of men. The Infinite One by His Holy Spirit has shed light into the minds and hearts of His servants. He has given dreams and visions, symbols and figures; and those to whom the truth was thus revealed, have themselves embodied the thought in human language.

“The Ten Commandments were spoken by God Himself, and were written by His own hand. They are of divine, and not human composition. But the Bible, with its God-given truths expressed in the language of men, presents a union of the divine and the human. Such a union existed in the nature of Christ, who was the Son of God and the Son of man. Thus it is true of the Bible, as it was of Christ, that ‘the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us’ (John 1:14).

“Written in different ages, by men who differed widely in rank and occupation, and in mental and spiritual endowments, the books of the Bible present a wide contrast in style, as well as a diversity in the nature of the subjects unfolded. Different forms of expression are employed by different writers; often the same truth is more strikingly presented by one than by another. And as several writers present a subject under varied aspects and relations, there may appear, to the superficial, careless, or prejudiced reader, to be discrepancy or contradiction, where the thoughtful, reverent student, with clearer insight, discerns the underlying harmony.

“As presented through different individuals, the truth is brought out in its varied aspects. One writer is more strongly impressed with one phase of the subject; he grasps those points that harmonize with his experience or with his power of perception and appreciation; another seizes upon a different phase; and each, under the guidance of the Holy Spirit, presents what is most forcibly impressed upon his own mind—a different aspect of the truth in each, but a perfect harmony through all. And the truths thus revealed unite to form a perfect whole, adapted to meet the wants of men in all the circumstances and experiences of life.

“God has been pleased to communicate His truth to the world by human agencies, and He Himself, by His Holy Spirit, qualified men and enabled them to do His work. He guided the mind in the selection of what to speak and what to write. The treasure was entrusted to earthen vessels, yet it is, none the less, from Heaven. The testimony is conveyed through the imperfect expression of human language, yet it is the testimony of God; and the obedient, believing child of God beholds in it the glory of a divine power, full of grace and truth.”

....Perils of Dissecting Inspired Messages

Some sit in judgment on the Scriptures, declaring that this or that passage is not inspired, because it does not strike their minds favorably. They cannot harmonize it with their ideas of philosophy and science, “falsely so called” (1 Timothy 6:20). Others for different reasons question portions of the Word of God. Thus many walk blindly where the enemy prepares the way. Now, it is not the province of any man to pronounce sentence upon the Scriptures, to judge or condemn any portion of God’s Word. When one presumes to do this, Satan will create an atmosphere for him to breathe which will dwarf spiritual growth. When a man feels so very wise that he dares to dissect God’s Word, his wisdom is, with God, counted foolishness. When he knows more, he will feel that he has everything to learn. And his very first lesson is to become teachable. “Learn of me,” says the Great Teacher; “for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls” (Matthew 11:29).

You who have been educating yourselves and others in a spirit of criticism and accusing, remember that you are imitating the example of Satan. When it suits your purpose, you treat the Testimonies as if you believed them, quoting from them to strengthen any statement you wish to have prevail. But how is it when light is given to correct your errors? Do you then accept the light? When the Testimonies speak contrary to your ideas, you treat them very lightly.

It does not become anyone to drop a word of doubt here and there that shall work like poison in other minds, shaking their confidence in the messages which God has given, which have aided in laying the foundation of this work, and have attended it to the present day, in reproofs, warnings, corrections, and encouragements. To all who have stood in the way of the Testimonies, I would say, God has given a message to His people, and His voice will be heard, whether you hear or forbear. Your opposition has not injured me; but you must give an account to the God of heaven, who has sent these warnings and instructions to keep His people in the right way. You will have to answer to Him for your blindness, for being a stumbling block in the way of sinners.

“To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them” (Isaiah 8:20). Even the work of the Holy Spirit upon the heart is to be tested by the Word of God. The Spirit which inspired the Scriptures, always leads to the Scriptures.—General Conference Daily Bulletin, April 13, 1891.

.....Searching the Testimonies for an Excuse

Some who are not willing to receive the light, but who prefer to walk in ways of their own choosing, will search the testimonies to find something in them to encourage the spirit of unbelief and disobedience. Thus a spirit of disunion will be brought in; for the spirit which leads them to criticize the testimonies will also lead them to watch their brethren to find in them something to condemn.—Manuscript 73, 1908.

The Last Deception of Satan

Satan is ... constantly pressing in the spurious—to lead away from the truth. The very last deception of Satan will be to make of none effect the testimony of the Spirit of God. “Where there is no vision, the people perish” (Proverbs 29:18). Satan will work ingeniously, in different ways and through different agencies, to unsettle the confidence of God’s remnant people in the true testimony.—Letter 12, 1890.

There will be a hatred kindled against the testimonies which is satanic. The workings of Satan will be to unsettle the faith of the churches in them, for this reason: Satan cannot have so clear a track to bring in his deceptions and bind up souls in his delusions if the warnings and reproofs and counsels of the Spirit of God are heeded.—Letter 40, 1890.

1 SM 21-43