Do you have to pay tithe to get to heaven?

[Woody]

"where your is, so shall be your money"

I so appreciate those who provide financial support here.

Thank you all.

This thread is about tithe. Are you accepting tithe from us Stan?

[Gerr]

While listening to one official press this home from the pulpit, a pastor who had worked in another division testified that the church removed 10% from his paycheque before he saw it, and this was the accepted practice.

To me that doesn't like it is in accordance with these counsels:

1. Voluntary offerings and the tithe constitute the revenue of the gospel. Of the means which is entrusted to man, God claims a certain portion--a tithe; but He leaves all free to say how much the tithe is, and whether or not they will give more than this.

Testimonies for the Church, Volume 5. 1855; 2002 (149). Pacific Press Publishing Association.

2. As to the amount required, God has specified one tenth of the increase. This is left to the conscience and benevolence of men, whose judgment in this tithing system should have free play. And while it is left free to the conscience, a plan has been laid out definite enough for all. No compulsion is required. {3T 394.1}

Testimonies for the Church, Volume 3. 1855; 2002 (394). Pacific Press Publishing Association.

[Woody]

I think this plan had some real advantages:

Quote:

The early General Conference required tithe paying as follows:

Tithe was only for members ages 18 to 60 and it was 5 cents to 20 cents for men and 2 to 10 cents for women "according to the ability of the donor". And for those who owned property it was 1 to 5 cents for every $100 of its value.

It appeared the GC was concerned with age and ability to pay tithe. It wasn't until 1879 that the actual ten percent policy was adopted by the General Conference.

They seemed more concerned with the person's ability to pay then. I guess times have changed for the nation as well as the church.

Interesting that your quote Gerry was from 1855 as there was no SDA church then.

[Overaged]

quote=Overaged]Stan; do you know why they didn't mention 10% in this official statement? /quote]

[color:#FF0000]TITHE IS 10%!!!

If you want to read something that TO ME smacks of being coercive, read the article, "ALL FOR JESUS" in the March 24 issue of the The Adventist Review." Apparently, the GC recommendation is 10% of the GROSS income.

Are you angry about something in this topic? Is it something I said/am saying? I was just trying to have a discussion, and ask questions. I can just picture you yelling that out to new church members: TITHE IS 10%!!!

I was just asking if Stan or anyone else knew why the specific percentage was not mentioned in our officially stated fundamental belief. I believe it is a question very much worth looking into.

[Overaged]

Interesting Woody! But how would you adjust that plan to inflation?

[Woody]

Interesting Woody! But how would you adjust that plan to inflation?

Hey ... ask our founders. It's not my problem. I report U decide. <smile> <smile>

[Overaged]

LOL, Well; at any rate, this practice of old does show an important and Biblical principle of being practical, and being considerate of others not in our shoes.

[Gerr]

Hey, don't be so touchy, my friend. I apologize if that was offensive to you. I'm not angry with you or anyone. I just put it in capitals for you to see that while the document did not mention 10%, it did say tithe, which is 10%.

[Gerr]

Interesting that your quote Gerry was from 1855 as there was no SDA church then.

But was it inspired counsel?

[Gerr]

Come on Gerry. U can open up that mind of your's. Broaden your horizens.

"Broad is the way, and wide is the gate ......." :)

[Overaged]

Hey, don't be so touchy, my friend. I apologize if that was offensive to you. I'm not angry with you or anyone. I just put it in capitals for you to see that while the document did not mention 10%, it did say tithe, which is 10%.

I wasn't offended or any such thing - just checkin to see what was up with the internet yelling you were doing. I have learned to ask, rather than assume.

Also, my intentions were not to question 10% or debate it's validity or application to today. I am still interested to hear people's ideas/evidence as to why no percentage was/is mentioned in our officially stated fundamental belief.

[Woody]

Quote:

I am still interested to hear people's ideas/evidence as to why no percentage was/is mentioned in our officially stated fundamental belief.

Okay since you keep asking' -

The reason is that MONEY is a touchy issue. And for legal issues and particularly 501c3 issues of "nonprofit" issues ... I suspect they can't tell people they have to pay nor how much to pay.

You will notice that in the church manual you are allowed to steal from God in this manner but not from your fellow man. Stealing from man is against the laws of our land so our church is allowed to have this as a rule. But there is no such rule regarding stealing from God. So, no mention of that.

[miz3]

"Now if you obey me fully and keep my covenant, then out of all nations you will be my treasured possession. Although the whole earth is mine, 6 you will be for me a kingdom of priests and a holy nation.’ These are the words you are to speak to the Israelites." Exodus 19:5,6.

The phrase, "the whole earth is mine" means that nothing but nothing is owned by anyone of us. This includes our life and everything about us!!!! Everything we are everything we have belongs to God. Period!

If God desires that I give Him back a portion of what He already owns then what's the beef? Without God we do not even exist let alone have stuff. I have no problem giving God whatever portion He wants.

I am not accountable for religious extortionists, who do in fact exist, yes, even the SDA Church!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I am accountable for the way in which I oversee all of God's property which includes my very person!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Gerr]

I personally did not pay tithe on the non-taxed (at the time it was set aside) money that was set aside for retirement. I did not even know that that is what the church wanted at the time. Now that I am withdrawing from that account, of course, it is taxed & I am also paying tithe on it.

[nuff sed]

[color:#000099]" I have no problem giving God whatever portion He wants

Kind of reminds me of the fellow who puts all his money onto a plate, throws the money up in the air and then tells God to "take whatever he wants"....

God is very specific.... it is all His. All he asks is that we return to him Tithe (10%) and offerings..... So that He might pour us out a blessing..........

Let's face it...He also gives us Power of Choice.. also called 'A Will'... then he says "Give it back to me' and let me control your life........nuff sed

[Overaged]

Our officially stated fundamental belief does agree with how you have approached this topic - it does not spell it out as strictly a tithing doctrine, but, rather, a doctrine regarding "stewardship."

Your defense of the 10% factor reflects that of others here; it looks like people still think I am somehow questioning that. I just find it very curious that our officially stated fundamental belief does not mention that. While the official belief does mention "tithe;" it does not seek to prove any percentage thereof. And why that happened is an important question.

Now I would also add (in accordance with the OP), that just because someone is tithing, even if it's exactly as the church believes; it does not follow that they will go to heaven. There is not a single verse in scripture that could prove otherwise

[Woody]

Overaged ... perhaps they figure people will look up to see what Webster has to say about the meaning of the word tithe as their proof.

tithe&#8194;

,noun, verb, tithed, tith·ing.

–noun

1. Sometimes, tithes. the tenth part of agricultural produce or personal income set apart as an offering to god or for works of mercy, or the same amount regarded as an obligation or tax for the support of the church, priesthood, or the like.

2. any tax, levy, or the like, especially of one-tenth.

3. a tenth part or any indefinitely small part of anything.

–verb (used with object)

4. to give or pay a tithe or tenth of (produce, money, etc.).

5. to give or pay tithes on (crops, income, etc.).

6. to exact a tithe from (a person, community, parish, etc.).

7. to levy a tithe on (crops, income, etc.).

[miz3]

The word tithe does mean "10%". Just fact.

The church states things in ambiguous ways when it is to their advantage and states those same things unambiguously when it is also to their advantage. It depends on the price the Church will pay for being one way or the other.

Consistency is not a "hallmark" of the SDA Church organization!

To nuff sed:

Your characterization of my statements is way out of line and you know it. You exaggerated what I did say. Because I did not use the expression you wanted (probably 10% or the word tithe) you leaped to a conclusion that is stupid and unwarranted!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[nuff sed]

It is interesting to note that in spite of your not knowing what expressions I did or did not expect you to use you immediately jumped to an unwarranted conclusion of what I thought. nuff sed....

[Woody]

It is interesting to note that in spite of your not knowing what expressions I did or did not expect you to use you immediately jumped to an unwarranted conclusion of what I thought. nuff sed....

Communications between humans is almost impossible. But communications between man and woman IS impossible.

( and I don't mean to take any sides here)

[Overaged]

[Overaged]

The word tithe does mean "10%". Just fact.

The church states things in ambiguous ways when it is to their advantage and states those same things unambiguously when it is also to their advantage. It depends on the price the Church will pay for being one way or the other.

Consistency is not a "hallmark" of the SDA Church organization!

I find it interesting that the word "tithe" actually means 10% in the dictionary. I didn't know that. But as for the rest of your post; are you sure you are not trying to hold the church to a standard that you yourself would not reach up to?

[John317]

The phrase, "the whole earth is mine" means that nothing but nothing is owned by anyone of us. This includes our life and everything about us!!!! Everything we are everything we have belongs to God. Period!

If God desires that I give Him back a portion of what He already owns then what's the beef? Without God we do not even exist let alone have stuff. I have no problem giving God whatever portion He wants.

I am not accountable for religious extortionists, who do in fact exist, yes, even the SDA Church!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I am accountable for the way in which I oversee all of God's property which includes my very person!!!!!!!!!!!!

The SDA Church is a "religious extortionist"?

The Dictionary on the meaning of "tithe":

Quote:

Word History:

A tithe is a tenth, etymologically speaking; in fact, tithe is the old ordinal numeral in English. Sound changes in the prehistory of English are responsible for its looking so different from the word ten. Tithe goes back to a prehistoric West Germanic form *tehuntha-, formed from the cardinal numeral *tehun, "ten," and the same ordinal suffix that survives in Modern English as -th. The n disappeared before the th in the West Germanic dialect area that gave rise to English, and eventually yielded the Old English form tothe, "tenth," still not too different from the cardinal numeral ten. But over time, as the former became tithe and the latter ten, and as tithe developed the specialized meaning "a tenth part paid as a tax," it grew harder to perceive a relationship between the two. The result was that speakers of English created a new word for the ordinal, tenth, built with the cardinal numeral ten on the pattern of the other regularly-formed ordinal numerals like sixth or seventh.

[Woody]

Quote:

The Dictionary on the meaning of "tithe

John. My experience has shown that on this forum ... there is always someone how doesn't acknowledge the dictionary. I learned this early on in my stay here.

[Overaged]

John. My experience has shown that on this forum ... there is always someone how doesn't acknowledge the dictionary. I learned this early on in my stay here.

Woody, thats because often the dictionary current meaning of a word is not always the same as the Bible's meaning and intended use of the same word.