OMEGA of Apostasy - what do you think it is?

[skyblue888]

When speaking on the subject of the "omega" of apostasy Mrs. White is warning us about teachings that would underminine the pillars of our faith, especially the Sanctuary doctrine, the nature of Christ in His humanity, the commmandments of God and the faith of Jesus, the non-immortality of the soul. These are the pillars of our faith but the sanctuary doctrine is the foundation and central pillar.

"The enemy has sought to bring in the supposition that a great reformation was to take place among Seventh-day Adventists, and that this reformation would consist in giving up the doctrines which stand as the pillars of our faith, and engaging in a process of reorganiation. Were this reformation to take place, what would result? The principles of truth that God in His wisdom has given to the remnant church, would be discarded. Our religion would be changed. The fundamental principles that have sustained the work for the last fifty years would be accounted as error. A new organization would be established. Books of a new order would be written. A system of intellectual philosophy would be introduced... The Sabbath would be lightly regarded. Nothing would be allowed to stand in the way of the new movement." 1 S.M.204,205.

Mrs. Whtie wrote this in 1904.

Since the compromises in the 1950s we can truly say that our religion has been changed and that a new organization has been established. While on the one hand a semblance of zeal for truth and for the advancement of the kingdom of God is maintained to reassure the church at large, on the other hand efforts are being made to conceal to the world the truths that had made us a peculiar people.

sky

[Twilight II]

When speaking on the subject of the "omega" of apostasy Mrs. White is warning us about teachings that would underminine the pillars of our faith.. ...the nature of Christ in His humanity,

sky

Objection!

Evidence that she referred to the Omega as containing the above please?

[skyblue888]

Notice how she is speaking of the fundamental principles which have sustained the work in the last 50 years. She wrote this in 1904. That would include the messages given by A.T. Jones and E.J. Waggoner at the 1888,1891,1893,1895,1897,1901, and 1903 General Conferences. Both spoke much on the subject of the nature of Christ in His humanity and all can read these messages online. If you are interested I can give you the link.

But if someone doesn't care about the messages that God sent to His people through these two men, these messages won't make any difference. But as for me I know that at the General Conference of 1895 the Lord through brother Jones shed much light on the nature of Christ in His humanity, things that had not been clearly understood before.

Mrs. White spoke of these messages as light from heaven.

The two main pillars that were discussed during the SDA/Evangelical secret Conferences between 1955 and 1957 and ended up being secretly repudiated were the atonement and the nature of Christ in His humanity.

sky

[Twilight II]

Notice how she is speaking of the fundamental principles which have sustained the work in the last 50 years. She wrote this in 1904. That would include the messages given by A.T. Jones and E.J. Waggoner at the 1888,1891,1893,1895,1897,1901, and 1903 General Conferences. Both spoke much on the subject of the nature of Christ in His humanity and all can read these messages online. If you are interested I can give you the link.

But if someone doesn't care about the messages that God sent to His people through these two men, these messages won't make any difference. But as for me I know that at the General Conference of 1895 the Lord through brother Jones shed much light on the nature of Christ in His humanity, things that had not been clearly understood before.

Mrs. White spoke of these messages as light from heaven.

The two main pillars that were discussed during the SDA/Evangelical secret Conferences between 1955 and 1957 and ended up being secretly repudiated were the atonement and the nature of Christ in His humanity.

sky

Are you trying to argue that everything ever written or presented by Jones and Waggoner is "infallible" because of the statement you posted earlier Sky?

[skyblue888]

Rethorical question?

What I am saying is that the truth is infallible, not any man, but since the Lord sent messages of truth through these two men, even most precious messages, it follows that whatever truth they presented ought to be received as such, infallible.

"The Lord in His great mercy sent a most precious message to His people through Elders Waggoner and Jones." T.M.91.

"If you reject God's delelgated messengers, you reject Christ." T.M.97.

"There are those who despise the men and the message they bore." T.M.97.

I do know that both spoke on the subject of the humanity of Christ between 1888 and 1903 and their message was from God.

sky

[Daryl]

Seems like others are also concerned about Spiritual Formation per the link below:

http://cicministry.org/commentary/issue91.htm

[skyblue888]

There is a counterfeit to every truth that the Lord has given us. When it comes to true "spiritual formation" here is what every true disciple of Christ will learn:

"How has it been with His disciples in all ages of the world? Why, they have learned of Jesus; they have been in His school; they have been His students, and have learned the lessons of Christ in regard to the living connection that the soul has with God. That living faith is essential for our salvation that we should lay hold upon the merits of the crucified and risen Saviour." E.G. White, Manuscript 1, May 11, 1889.

Are we students at the school of Christ? Are we sitting at His feet? In order to have a living connection with God we must lay hold by faith of the merits of the crucified and risen Saviour. This is our lifebusiness:

"Unless he makes it his lifebusiness to behold the uplifted Saviour and to accept the merits which it is his privilege to claim, the sinner can no more be saved than Peter could walk upon the water unless he kept his eyes fixed steadily upon Jesus." T.M.93.

No true spiritual formation or no sinner can be saved unless he makes it his lifebusiness to look to Christ, accept His merits, and claim them, and claim them he must if the Holy Spirit is to make him a partaker of Christ's nature and then "Christ's righteousness accomplishes everything" as it is "made manifest in obedience to all the commandments of God." F.W.27; T.M.92.

"Habitually dwelling upon Christ and His all-sufficient merits increases faith, quickens the power of spiritual discernment, strengthens the desire to be like Him, and brings an earnestness into prayer that makes it efficacious." E.G. White, Gospel Worker, p.166.

Now we should be able to better appreciate the following statement:

"The only faith that will benefit us is that which embraces Him as a personal Saviour: which appropriates His merits to ourselves." D.A.347.

And if we think that this is well understood by the professed people of God, we may want to reconsider in the light of this statement:

"Many have a nominal faith in Christ but they know nothing of that vital dependence upon Him which appropriates the merits of a crucified and risen Saviour." 1 S.M.389.

In fact, "There is not one in one hundred who understands for himself the Bible truth on this subject that is so necessary to our present and eternal welfare." 1 S.M.360.

These things were written more for us who have come to the end of the ages.

sky

[ClubV12]

Sister White refers to "Holiness People" in 1SM 361 as applying the great truth, righteouness by faith, as meaning; "Only believe in Christ, and be saved; but away with the law of God." This is not the teaching of the Word of God. There is no foundation for such a faith.

Here is where we so often loose our balance. We can do nothing in terms of works to merit salvation. At the same time, He will by no means "clear the guilty". And who are the guilty? The unrepentant soul, we can be deceived into thinking we ARE repentant. But when we understand the plan of salvation, for ourselves, the hidden gems, we see more clearly the hideous nature of sin and recoil from it. From a spirit of love, not "works". Works, misunderstood, is condemnation, thus the motivation is fear. Love is the only possible way. Righteouness by faith, therefore, leads to an embrace of the law, a love for the law.

[skyblue888]

Sister White refers to "Holiness People" in 1SM 361 as applying the great truth, righteouness by faith, as meaning; "Only believe in Christ, and be saved; but away with the law of God." This is not the teaching of the Word of God. There is no foundation for such a faith.

ClubV12

___________________

Was this meant to be a rebuttal to my last post?

sky

[ClubV12]

Not at all, my post was to enhance and build upon yours.

I think you are well balanced in your views on righteouness by faith. These "holiness people" must have been a particular group at her time doing away with the law. Such groups could easily exist today.

[ClubV12]

Are the "Spiritual Formation" folks "doing away with the law"? Is THIS group, as Sister White put it, a "holiness people"?

[skyblue888]

Most likely since, if I am not mistaken, this message originated from the churches that constitute Babylon.

But may I suggest that there is more than meets the eye here.

If there ever was anyone who obeyed the law of God it was Jesus and yet the Pharisees who prided themselves on their obedience to the law thought that Jesus was making light of the law.

"Jesus had not dwelt on the specifications of the law, but He did not leave His hearers to conclude that He had come to set aside its requirements." D.A.307.

Because He did not dwell upon the specifications of the law!

The 1888 message did not dwell on the specifications of the law and that is why many thought that that message was making light of the law.

"The Pharisees prided themselves on their obedience to the law; yet they knew so little of its principles through everyday practice that to them the Saviour's words sounded like heresy. As He swept away the rubbish under which the truth had been buried, they thought He was sweeping away the truth itself. They whispered to one another that He was making light of the law. He read their thoughts, and answered them, saying: 'Think not that I am come to destroy the law or the prophets. I am not come to destroy but to fulfill.'" D.A.307.

Now as to 1888:

"It is true, men will say, 'You are too excited; you are making too much of this matter, and you do not think enough of the law; now, you are to think more of the law; don't be all the time reaching for this righteousness of Christ (through faith in His merits), but build up the law.'"

Mrs. White replied, saying,

"Let the law take care of itself. We have been at work on the law until we get as dry as the hills of Gilboah, without dew or rain. Let us trust in the merits of Jesus Christ of Nazareth. May God help us that our eyes may be anointed with eyesalve that we may see." E.G. White, 1888 Materials, Vol.2, p.557.

So I would say that in these last days those who present the true message of righteousness by faith will most likely be misunderstood, just as Jesus was, due to the fact that they too will not dwell on the specifications of the law but on the necessity of trusting in the merits of a crucified and risen Saviour in order to bring Christ's righteousness into the life which righteousness is made manifest in obedience to the law.

Many will fail to discern the precious truth.

sky

[miz3]

Sister White refers to "Holiness People" in 1SM 361 as applying the great truth, righteouness by faith, as meaning; "Only believe in Christ, and be saved; but away with the law of God." This is not the teaching of the Word of God. There is no foundation for such a faith.

Here is where we so often loose our balance. We can do nothing in terms of works to merit salvation. At the same time, He will by no means "clear the guilty". And who are the guilty? The unrepentant soul, we can be deceived into thinking we ARE repentant. But when we understand the plan of salvation, for ourselves, the hidden gems, we see more clearly the hideous nature of sin and recoil from it. From a spirit of love, not "works". Works, misunderstood, is condemnation, thus the motivation is fear. Love is the only possible way. Righteouness by faith, therefore, leads to an embrace of the law, a love for the law.

Zeroing in on the underlined part above with the raised font size:

I find it interesting that humans "can do nothing in terms of works to merit salvation"

AND YET:

Humans must exercise FAITH (clearly a WORK) in order to receive Salvation (Justification)!

The "WORK" of "exercising faith" is needed to make a human JUSTIFIED (SAVED).

Strange?

[ClubV12]

Not strange at all, God calls us from afar. Looking back on my recent past, a few years, it's astonishing to me how He was working things out on my behalf. When I barely recognized who God was. Faith comes from the Holy Spirit, our "will" is what we must give to Him, our power of choice to accept His calling.

[miz3]

Not strange at all, God calls us from afar. Looking back on my recent past, a few years, it's astonishing to me how He was working things out on my behalf. When I barely recognized who God was. Faith comes from the Holy Spirit, our "will" is what we must give to Him, our power of choice to accept His calling.

[ClubV12]

MIZ3, JUST STOP RIGHT THERE.

SERIOUSLY, go find some other thread to spout your hate on it. It's getting to the point where Stan or John317 needs to seriously consider reigning you in.

Your NEGATIVE comments are black balls hurled at the Saints to stain their garments. Enough!!! Stop these evil attacks on Gods people and go do your dirty work somewhere else.

This thread is about persional issues within the Seventh-day Adventist church and you have nothing to add in that regard as you clearly reject that church. Your masquerade time is over.

[Guest]

I would like to second that...Well put Club. You're right about that.

[Windsor]

This thread has really gotten off topic. I believe the omega is theistic evolution which posits that it is God who was in the genome of all living things, guiding all the mutations from primordial soup to man, a sort of practical application of pantheism.

[miz3]

MIZ3, JUST STOP RIGHT THERE.

SERIOUSLY, go find some other thread to spout your hate on it. It's getting to the point where Stan or John317 needs to seriously consider reigning you in.

Your NEGATIVE comments are black balls hurled at the Saints to stain their garments. Enough!!! Stop these evil attacks on Gods people and go do your dirty work somewhere else.

This thread is about persional issues within the Seventh-day Adventist church and you have nothing to add in that regard as you clearly reject that church. Your masquerade time is over.

Stuck for an answer?

I can see where that would make you angry so that you now throw personal invectives and vinegar.

I have noticed when you are stuck for an answer you ramp up the "accuse the questioner of being hateful" tactic.

I did not spout hate. Looking at your post above it seems that you are the one spouting hate.

No evil attacks. I just want you to explain yourself because it appears to me that you are preaching a WORKS SALVATION while all the while trying to say it is not works.

[ClubV12]

I think were back on track with the dialog posted on the last couple of pages.

This "Spiritual Formation" thing, is it one of the forms of the Omega? Might be... Evolution, certainly a key player.

[BobRyan]

The OMEGA that is coming is much larger than the obscure impact of SF on Adventism.

Quote:

Child Guidance:

Prepare for an Overwhelming Surprise—

Transgression has almost reached its limit. Confusion fills the world, and a great terror is soon to come upon human beings. The end is very near. God’s people should be preparing for what is to break upon the world as an overwhelming surprise. {CG 555.2}

The "Great Terror" will be "sufficient" to drive the US Protestants to be the "lead" in stretching their hands across the gulf to embrace spiritualism.

The "great terror" will be "sufficient" to deceive if possible the very elect.

The "great terror" will be "sufficient" to lead to the most bizarre form of Sunday-legislation known to the US in over 120 years such that Sabbath keeping will be condemned to the point of civil penalties.

Nothing like any Sunday Law ever seen in the past 120 years.

in Christ,

Bob

[BobRyan]

This thread has really gotten off topic. I believe the omega is theistic evolution which posits that it is God who was in the genome of all living things, guiding all the mutations from primordial soup to man, a sort of practical application of pantheism.

I agree that inside the SDA church this is the "elephant" coming into the living room.

And in the world in general - it will be a key componant of the "Great terror" mentioned in CG 555.2.

In 3SG 90-91 we are told that Theistic evolutionism is the worst form of infidelty precisely because it is infidelity "in disguise"

in Christ,

Bob

[John317]

That's a fascinating quote from Ellen White. I wonder what the "great terror" will be. Does she offer any clues?

My idea is that it must be something that will appear to threaten the very existence of humanity and the world. This could take many forms, from natural catastrophies to nuclear war or wide-spread disease.

In any case, I don't think we have seen this "terror" yet that she speaks of. When it comes, it sounds like it will forever change the way people live and think.

[John317]

I believe the omega is theistic evolution which posits that it is God who was in the genome of all living things, guiding all the mutations from primordial soup to man, a sort of practical application of pantheism.

Interesting point. I think you're on to something worth seriously considering there.

[BobRyan]

That's a fascinating quote from Ellen White. I wonder what the "great terror" will be. Does she offer any clues?

My idea is that it must be something that will appear to threaten the very existence of humanity and the world. This could take many forms, from natural catastrophies to nuclear war or wide-spread disease.

In any case, I don't think we have seen this "terror" yet that she speaks of. When it comes, it sounds like it will forever change the way people live and think.